Are teachers taking the p!ss?

Stark

*sigh* I wasn't talking to you.

Okay.

Slowy this time.

mat cauthon wrote:

And is that not how it should be? Should we genuinely crib because a Barrister in Dublin gets more money than a bin man in Donegal?
Silly argument.

My argument stated exactly that it was perfectly reasonable for people with more qualifications in jobs that required higher skills to be paid more. You twisted my argument and claimed I said the opposite.

mat cauthon wrote:

55 grand isnt all that much for the level of training and education that teachers put in - and as said, 18 years (not six as you said) would count for a hell of a lot more in a professional third level qualified position in private sector.

I never said 6 years. I said 10 years. And unless you can give a reason as to why a teacher with a reasonable level of qualification wouldn't get the qualification allowance they're entitled to, that's still the case.

mat cauthon wrote:

If you think its so great - go do the post grad. Or get a degree first and do it.
Stop whining.

I have both not that I see how that's relevant. I'm fine with a teacher with a masters and 10 years experience earning 55k, I'm just not prepared to accept people whining that it takes 21 years to get that far when that's not true.

Doc

Stark wrote: »

*sigh* I wasn't talking to you.

That was kind of my point.;)

Pippacoo

Teachers are not receiving increments.

#15

McNulty737 wrote: »

Excellent, glad you agree.

So lets move forward from this, and bring our teachers pay in line with their European counterparts. With the MASSIVE savings generated, we can reduce the teacher to pupil ratio by hiring unemployed graduate teachers aswell as providing funding for improved facilities for our students.

Can primary teachers look forward to working less if they are to be measured against their European counterparts?



Like you, I can acknowledge that primary teachers in Ireland are paid more than teachers in other OECD countries.

Unlike you, I'm aware that Irish primary teachers work longer than their counterparts in all but two other OECD countries.

bigbadbear

McNulty737 wrote: »

Excellent, glad you agree.

So lets move forward from this, and bring our teachers pay in line with their European counterparts. With the MASSIVE savings generated, we can reduce the teacher to pupil ratio by hiring unemployed graduate teachers aswell as providing funding for improved facilities for our students.

Incredible to think 75-80% of money spent on education goes on teachers salaries isnt it? :eek: Good old INTO....sure they must think the population are a bunch of ignorant gob****es

Why are you trying to hurt teachers so much? To bring anyone's pay in line with 'Our European counterparts' is ridiculous. What do you do for a living till i see what your 'European counterparts' are earning. (You'll most likely tell me now that you have some shíte job that doesn't pay very well)

rainbowtrout

Pippacoo wrote: »

Teachers are not receiving increments.

Since when? i'd say that's news to all the teachers on the Teaching and Lecturing forum, including myself

Stark

Pippacoo wrote: »

Teachers are not receiving increments.

Again, why the blatant mistruths?

If the general complaint was simply "we've had two paycuts in the space of a year and we feel demoralised" or "I'm a part time teacher and I've had my hours cut", I would be sympathetic. When there's loads of made up sob story nonsense to go with it like "25% greater paycut than the rest of the public service", "higher rate of tax than other PS and PAYE employees", "frozen increments", "non-payment of qualification allowance" etc. then that just pisses me off. It's counter productive to lie in order to garner sympathy.

bigbadbear

Stark wrote: »

Again, why the blatant mistruths?

If the general complaint was simply "we've had two paycuts in the space of a year and we feel demoralised" or "I'm a part time teacher and I've had my hours cut", I would be sympathetic. When there's loads of made up sob story nonsense to go with it like "25% greater paycut than the rest of the public service", "higher rate of tax than other PS and PAYE employees", "frozen increments", "non-payment of qualification allowance" etc. then that just pisses me off. It's counter productive to lie in order to garner sympathy.

In fairness I think everone is going to look at the following post and know it was wrong. Pippacoo is not a teacher so is not looking for sympathy

Originally Posted by Pippacoo
Teachers are not receiving increments.

But stark, I genuinely don't think most of the things you have in quotation marks have been said. I'm almost certain you're misinterpreting people's posts.

rainbowtrout

Stark wrote: »

Again, why the blatant mistruths?

If the general complaint was simply "we've had two paycuts in the space of a year and we feel demoralised" or "I'm a part time teacher and I've had my hours cut", I would be sympathetic. When there's loads of made up sob story nonsense to go with it like "25% greater paycut than the rest of the public service", "higher rate of tax than other PS and PAYE employees", "frozen increments", "non-payment of qualification allowance" etc. then that just pisses me off. It's counter productive to lie in order to garner sympathy.

Stark, while the post was not true I'd refer you to my post before yours. Not all teachers are quoting misinformation. I'm amazed at the amount of teachers that have posted stuff in this thread that is simply not true. I'm also amazed at the amount of non teachers who have done the same.

bigbadbear

Pippacoo wrote: »

Thanks for your honesty!!

Pippacoo wrote: »

I am very sorry to hear your story.. it's such a pity that you didn't get more support!

Who are these to?

I see your relatively new to posting on boards. If you use the 'quote' button in the corner of people's posts it shows who your talking to.

Pippacoo

Stark wrote: »

Again, why the blatant mistruths?

If the general complaint was simply "we've had two paycuts in the space of a year and we feel demoralised" or "I'm a part time teacher and I've had my hours cut", I would be sympathetic. When there's loads of made up sob story nonsense to go with it like "25% greater paycut than the rest of the public service", "higher rate of tax than other PS and PAYE employees", "frozen increments", "non-payment of qualification allowance" etc. then that just pisses me off. It's counter productive to lie in order to garner sympathy.

I honestly thought that all public sector pay was frozen and I am very surprised to hear that it is not. I spent a long time reading through this particular thread and I had some opinions’ I wanted to share.. But really your response was so sharp... I am very sorry for making a mistake and I will not be reading or responding to this thread again. There are some very mean and rude responses’ on this thread... Correcting people’s grammar and getting personal. And I am directing that to the teachers and non teachers. Such a shame that people can get so angry about people getting on with their jobs... again teaching or not teaching. Such a shame.

ejmaztec

Stark wrote: »

Also tomorrow's criminals and life long welfare recipients.

Musn't forget the hundreds of thousands of emigrants paying through taxation for the education of children in other countries.

In reality, Ireland only needs geography teachers, so's they can point out the airports and the docks on the Irish map, and English teachers so's the kids can ask directions if they get lost on the way to these departure points.

mvb

poodles wrote: »

The pay is crap?

Tell the truth - you havn't a clue what your talking about.

Okay so Poodles, if you have a clue what your talking about, please tell everybody a Teachers Wage. Break it down so people know how high the wage is? Tell people what a Teacher earns, and subtract the cost of living in Ireland.

poodles

mvb wrote: »

Okay so Poodles, if you have a clue what your talking about, please tell everybody a Teachers Wage. Break it down so people know how high the wage is? Tell people what a Teacher earns, and subtract the cost of living in Ireland.

Man I was bored of this thread last week.

Narim

bigbadbear wrote: »

Envious


Envious


Envious


Envious


Envious


Envious

BBAAAAAAAAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH

I see Bigbead the reason for no friends.. I think you are still soo kind.. go back to school instead of being so envious..

teacher30

pablo_escobar wrote: »

Majority of teachers in Ireland provide a mediocre standard of education and are grossly overpaid for it.

Their sincerity in teaching lacks credibility and it's really benefits and salary of the job which are of higher priority to them.

I'd put a reasonable offer on the table to each teacher in this country with the clear understanding if it wasn't satisfactory, feel free moving to another country.

bon voyage!

Where exactly are they going to go and get better T&C than here in Ireland?

Teachers have it extremely good and easy in Ireland.
They should continually remind themselves of how lucky they are.

I'm a teacher - and yes, i do agree that we have it easy compared to other countries, no doubt, but i do not agree that we provide a "mediocre" standard of education. Maybe you were unfortunate enough to attend a school with teachers providing such a poor standard of education - and that angers me because every child is entitled to the very best standard of education

Liam_Flag

teacher30 wrote: »

I'm a teacher - and yes, i do agree that we have it easy compared to other countries, no doubt, but i do not agree that we provide a "mediocre" standard of education. Maybe you were unfortunate enough to attend a school with teachers providing such a poor standard of education - and that angers me because every child is entitled to the very best standard of education

Yup, every child is entitled to the very best standard of education but where is there any accountability for a teachers performance?

I'm sure we've all come across teachers who were painfully bad in our times - but how do you go about firing a bad teacher?

byhookorbycrook

Liam_Flag wrote: »

Yup, every child is entitled to the very best standard of education but where is there any accountability for a teachers performance?

I'm sure we've all come across teachers who were painfully bad in our times - but how do you go about firing a bad teacher?

You contact the DES Inspectorate.

teacher30

Liam_Flag wrote: »

Yup, every child is entitled to the very best standard of education but where is there any accountability for a teachers performance?

I'm sure we've all come across teachers who were painfully bad in our times - but how do you go about firing a bad teacher?

I hear what you're saying and understand your frustration. In my school, there are **** teachers too, it drives me insane!

The Dept of Education is the only place to go to complain, perhaps the Inspectorate section.

But don't forget the brilliant teachers out there either!!

SerialComplaint

byhookorbycrook wrote: »

You contact the DES Inspectorate.

Surely the Principal should be the first port of call, and then onto the Board of Management.

buck55

It seems so funny reading posts by people giving out about the teacher EPV days......so you have a gripe against teachers.... If you think the job is that wonderful then go and be a teacher, the job is open for everyone!!!!
Actually, It has never been easier with back ways into training to become a primary teacher... so if one didn't get the points to do it the straight degree route and you go back and do a post-grad you will even get paid more!!! Since an interest in IT then just to let you know you can even become a teacher by doing an online course now....so it's there for you if you want it!!!!!!

validusername1

poodles wrote: »

Primary school teachers are able to do a course during the summer which enables them to take an extra 3 days (atleast) personal annual leave. Have they not enough days off a year paid as it is?

Surely if these courses are worth putting on for our teachers then it's a good idea to make them compulsory during mid terms or the like?


Some of the online courses over on http://www.cpdcollege.com/site/summercourses.htm seem a bit 'simple'.



"EPV day is extra personal vacation, although they're usually called course days. If a teacher does a week's inservice course during the summer holidays s/he is entitled to 3 days off during the school year. If they do a 2 week course, they get 4 days and a 3 week course gives 5 days. No sub cover is provided for these days and so the children are usually divided up through the other classes."

No..
A lot of people give out about teachers getting paid during summer months when they're not even working, but it's not like that.. They have their set amount of pay for the work they do, but that is just spread over 12 months rather than the 9/10 school months 'cause otherwise they'd have no income for 3 months of the year.. Then most of the other days they get off are public holidays that most other employees get off too. As for the mid-terms, well, every job has it's perks.. Teachers deserve those course days if they do the courses, simple as. Primary teaching takes a lot more out of you than you'd think, paid days off come with most careers and most employees have good reasons to take them. Stop complaining..

kr7

super_furry wrote: »

Anyone that can stand up in front of a group of 30 screaming ****s, teaching them when they don't want to learn, deserves all the time off they can get.

If 30 screaming ****s as you call them aren't listening to you, your probably in the wrong job.

Boombastic

kr7 wrote: »

If 30 screaming ****s as you call them aren't listening to you, your probably in the wrong job.

Well said. It's always the incompetent teachers who have 30 screaming bad children.


Ample paid time off is given to teachers in the summer. It is nonsense to think that they can not complete a weeks course during this time without days off during the school year.

Terri26

in fairness the course days are normally used if a primary teacher has to take a day off for a wedding for example. I agree it should not be allowed to be used just to take a random day off just because you did the course but for weddings etc in seems fair. In secondary we can take personal days and colleagues cover classes for us but primary teachers obviously do not have that option.

Boombastic

Terri26 wrote: »

in fairness the course days are normally used if a primary teacher has to take a day off for a wedding for example. I agree it should not be allowed to be used just to take a random day off just because you did the course but for weddings etc in seems fair. In secondary we can take personal days and colleagues cover classes for us but primary teachers obviously do not have that option.

Yes because a teachers friends wedding is more important than the childrens education:pac:


How many personal days do the secondary teachers get?
Are these for weddings too?

retroactive

**Gets eaten by Zombies**

Terri26

Boombastic wrote: »

Yes because a teachers friends wedding is more important than the childrens education:pac:


How many personal days do the secondary teachers get?
Are these for weddings too?

they are specifically for weddings. And yes for some cases a siblings wedding would be more important that children missing one day with their teacher especially as said teacher has to leave work for them. Although do not blame you for being jealous! I am very lucky! Can't believe I have only 3 weeks left!

Boombastic

Terri26 wrote: »

they are specifically for weddings. And yes for some cases a siblings wedding would be more important that children missing one day with their teacher especially as said teacher has to leave work for them. Although do not blame you for being jealous! I am very lucky! Can't believe I have only 3 weeks left!

3 weeks left to brush up on your grammar and punctuation.

Jealous

crazy cabbage

retroactive wrote: »

**Gets eaten by Zombies**

Zombies are popping up all over AH lately. I am going to zombie survival board before i too get eaten like ^^^^ that poor unfortunate. We need defense against these undead :eek:


ps: why is zombie survival under receration. I dont class it as receration. Educational would be more like it :pac:

pps: wwwoooo teachers <---- just to keep my comment 'on topic'

Doom

super_furry wrote: »

Anyone that can stand up in front of a group of 30 screaming ****s, teaching them when they don't want to learn, deserves all the time off they can get.

No they don't, you entered the job knowing this.

ShamoBuc

Doom wrote: »

No they don't, you entered the job knowing this.

Knowing about the time off? Yeah;)

Boombastic

ShamoBuc wrote: »

Knowing about the time off? Yeah;)

Enough time off to ensure maternity leave starts in September;)

wp_rathead

Is there like a quota of anti-public sector threads that need to be completed weekly on AH or something..?

Terri26

Boombastic wrote: »

3 weeks left to brush up on your grammar and punctuation.

Jealous

cute - wasn't aware the rule of correct grammar usage existed on After Hours - actually think pointing out grammar errors is against the spirit and rules of the forum.

sorry that should have been it's not specifically for holidays - not great typing on this.
Don't worry my 3 weeks will be used do destress go on a holiday and count down the days to midterm! whoooo

Boombastic

Terri26 wrote: »

cute - wasn't aware the rule of correct grammar usage existed on After Hours - actually think pointing out grammar errors is against the spirit and rules of the forum.

sorry that should have been it's not specifically for holidays - not great typing on this.
Don't worry my 3 weeks will be used do destress go on a holiday and count down the days to midterm! whoooo

It was the lack of capital letters and starting a sentence with 'and' but I won't drag the thread off topic

It's great to hear that some teacher love their jobs and care about the children and are not just in the profession for the holidays

Terri26

glad you approve! I was being purposely facetious and you do know that the rule that you must never start a sentence with and isn't an actual real grammar rule? There are certain cases where it is perfectly legit to use it.
I spent four weeks of my summer volunteering in a camp to help students who struggle with school work not that I need to justify myself to you. If I wished to spent my entire summer doing whatever I wanted I am entitled to.

Boombastic

Terri26 wrote: »

glad you approve! I was being purposely facetious and you do know that the rule that you must never start a sentence with and isn't an actual real grammar rule? There are certain cases where it is perfectly legit to use it.
I spent four weeks of my summer volunteering in a camp to help students who struggle with school work not that I need to justify myself to you. If I wished to spent my entire summer doing whatever I wanted I am entitled to.

I never said you couldn't spend them as you are entitled to


Keep counting the days to mid-term, that's what all the good teachers do.

ShamoBuc

Boombastic wrote: »

Enough time off to ensure maternity leave starts in September;)

As if 'biological clocks' were so obliging:rolleyes:

Boombastic

ShamoBuc wrote: »

As if 'biological clocks' were so obliging:rolleyes:

It's not you biological clock that determines when the baby is born:pac:

ShamoBuc

Boombastic wrote: »

It's not you biological clock that determines when the baby is born:pac:

9 months after the biological clock allowed it to be conceived it does;)

Boombastic

ShamoBuc wrote: »

9 months after the biological clock allowed it to be conceived it does;)

Yes and possible in most cases to time conception;)

pebbles21

poodles wrote: »

Do you go around looking for thanks with your sh!t jokes on these boards all day?

I logged in just to thank that!

gara

I find the amount of ill-informed venom directed at teachers on these boards absolutely sickening

ShamoBuc

Boombastic wrote: »

Yes and possible in most cases to time conception;)

lol, you really haven't a clue God love ya.

Boombastic

gara wrote: »

I find the amount of ill-informed venom directed at teachers on these boards absolutely sickening

Thanks for setting the record straight and highlighting the misinformation


Does it sicken you so much you'd have to take the day off (sorry I forgot it was the holidays) Can you claim post traumatic stress in September and go on the sick then?

Fluffycloud

Retrain, go back to college and you too can be a teacher. It's a great job if you enjoy dealing with teenagers and love your subject. I wanted to do nursing but at the last minute changed my mind. 25 years later I still love my job and I enjoy working with teenagers.

Fluffycloud

Retrain, go back to college and you too can be a teacher. It's a great job if you enjoy dealing with teenagers and love your subject. I wanted to do nursing but at the last minute i changed my mind. 25 years later I still love my job and I enjoy working with teenagers. Makes me sick at the constant moaning about teachers. In the days of the Celtic tiger people scoffed at our profession because of the pay. Now the tables have turned ..... Different story.

Boombastic

Fluffycloud wrote: »

Retrain, go back to college and you too can be a teacher. .

Not very good advice as there is a surplus of teachers and a lack of permanent jobs

Fluffycloud

Someone has a mega chip on their shoulder. Ouch!