Air traffic controller jobs

skitzyspider

Can someone please give us an honest account of what the dress code is...will jeans be alright of do you have to wear a shirt and slacks?

Dacian

skitzyspider wrote: »

Can someone please give us an honest account of what the dress code is...will jeans be alright of do you have to wear a shirt and slacks?

No dress code for aptitiude test. If you are comfortable in jeans then wear them. The aptitiude test is of your brain and problem solving not your appeareance. Obviously in the interview proper, more formal attire would be appropriate.

SeaFields

Dacian wrote: »

No dress code for aptitiude test.

At the bottom of the email it says "dress code is smart casual."

urajoke

skitzyspider wrote: »

Can someone please give us an honest account of what the dress code is...will jeans be alright of do you have to wear a shirt and slacks?

Why would you turn up to ANY recruitment process dressed in jeans ? You want the job so make the effort ! Remember these people will most likely be taking some notes which can and will be used. Believe me I'm still remembered years after my aptitude test for the right reasons.

Wear shirt and trousers no more no less.

John_Mc

urajoke wrote: »

Why would you turn up to ANY recruitment process dressed in jeans ? You want the job so make the effort ! Remember these people will most likely be taking some notes which can and will be used. Believe me I'm still remembered years after my aptitude test for the right reasons.

Wear shirt and trousers no more no less.

Nonsense - 4500+ people are sitting the first round of tests. Are you seriously suggesting that notes will be taken on what people are wearing? Jeans are fine for the first round, obviously if you make it through the rounds you'll need to make the effort to look sharp.

urajoke

John_Mc wrote: »

Nonsense - 4500+ people are sitting the first round of tests. Are you seriously suggesting that notes will be taken on what people are wearing? Jeans are fine for the first round, obviously if you make it through the rounds you'll need to make the effort to look sharp.

Yes, because I have spoken to the guys that have run this aptitude test and they say they do. Do you think the people from HR sit around twiddling there thumbs for the 2+ hours you're doing the test ? Remember they want people who can remain calm under pressure when stressed (the job is known as one of the most stressful jobs anywhere after all). So if someone is sweating bullets and is agitated whilst doing the test you think this won't be noted.

Your figures are wrong by the way. 4100 or so applied for the job they narrowed that down straight away to probably to less than 3000. Anyway its up to you to do whatever you see fit.

John_Mc

urajoke wrote: »

Yes, because I have spoken to the guys that have run this aptitude test and they say they do. Do you think the people from HR sit around twiddling there thumbs for the 2+ hours you're doing the test ? Remember they want people who can remain calm under pressure when stressed (the job is known as one of the most stressful jobs anywhere after all). So if someone is sweating bullets and is agitated whilst doing the test you think this won't be noted.

Your figures are wrong by the way. 4100 or so applied for the job they narrowed that down straight away to probably to less than 3000. Anyway its up to you to do whatever you see fit.

Whatever about my figures being wrong - thousands of people is still too many to be noticing if someone wears jeans or a shirt and tie. The point of the aptitude test is to base the decision at getting through solely on the mental capacity of the applicant - as opposed to the clothes they wear, their background, accent etc.

In the test, there was no requirement to leave identification on the table - so how are the HR staff identifying the person who's looking stressed etc? They aren't.

urajoke

Well like I said it's up to you what you think is appropriate.:cool:

michaelflynn61

skitzyspider wrote: »

Can someone please give us an honest account of what the dress code is...will jeans be alright of do you have to wear a shirt and slacks?

They say dress code is smart casual so in my opinion peope should take note of this and dress smart casual. In reality people were wearing whatever they wanted and nobody got turned away for not dressing "smart casual".

As to whether or not they could take notes. I don't see how they could take notes on whether people look stressed or not but it would be very easy to make a little note when everyone is registering to say whether they followed the dress code or not. They probably wouldnt exclude someone for not following it but lets say its very close and they need to decide between two people and one of them did follow the dress code and the other didn't, who would you choose? I think if people follow the dress code it shows they have read the instructions given to them, are following them and are taking them seriously. I would have thought this to be a very important part of the job.

testicle

John_Mc wrote: »

Whatever about my figures being wrong - thousands of people is still too many to be noticing if someone wears jeans or a shirt and tie.

11 test days, 3 tests a day, 2 test locations. I'm sure you can do the maths. Even if it was the full 4100, that's only 62 candidates a test, not the thousands you were on about.

John_Mc

Without any I.D or name on the desks, they can't identify anyone to take notes about what they are wearing etc.

There was more than 62 in the test I sat.

bombs away

Seriously guys, I think your getting way to hung up on what you should be wearing :rolleyes:

As long as you don't come to the test's in a gimp suit I think you should be fine

urajoke

Taken from another forum first quote is from a fellow ATCO.

I hear that only the top 20% or so will get through phase one; due to the large number of applicants, so getting to stage two is worthy of a pat on the back but you'll still be a long way off an employment offer.

2nd is an applicant who asked for details.

Had mine in Dublin on Tuesday the 31st..... Over 4000 applied, IAA lady said that they are testing about 600 in Dublin over 5 days and the same in Limerick so already you are in the last 33% more or less. Out of the 120 people last Tuesday she said she got about 20 no shows - so lets say that happens every day well then that's another 200 gone which leaves about 1000. I would imagine only about 400 of these will go forward to the second stage which in theory would give a passing mark of 60%???(but who knows) from there I would say 150 go on to first interview and from there only about 80-90 people will go on to the final interview for a place as one of the lucky 24......

He should have said its a failure rate of 60%.

Just getting on to the course DOES NOT mean you have got the job. There still lies a lot of work ahead. A recent course had a failure rate of 40% out of the 10 that were sent to Dublin 2 failed the rating course and two failed the OJTI.

mgmt

This was written during the last recruitment drive (2007). I believe the first aptitude test was the computer test, not the pencil and paper test?

Done the interview. They said that 1400 people done the aptitude and the top 250 were called for interview. Next round is 70-80 people.

dibs101

Did it myself the other day and found it fair enough, its the least I would expect considering you are entrusted with guiding people safely through the air!

Was just wondering though, of the 25?! selected will there be any positions available in Dublin when the training is over?

I am a married man with 2 kids and although I could sacrafice the 2 years training in Limerick away from my family, if I thought i would be coming back to dublin after, it might be a bit much to expect to uproot them all, ask wife to pack in her job, friends, family etc.

Is there any provision made for the likes of this? Anyone any experience in this?

michaelflynn61

From everything that I have read it seems you should expect to be based in Shannon for a good few years after training. It seems maybe 5-7 years as their is a waiting list to transfer to DUB. This is only from pieces I have read so I stand to be corrected on that.

urajoke

michaelflynn61 wrote: »

From everything that I have read it seems you should expect to be based in Shannon for a good few years after training. It seems maybe 5-7 years as their is a waiting list to transfer to DUB. This is only from pieces I have read so I stand to be corrected on that.

I said it before.

There is a waiting/transfer list already in place. Unfortunately there are others with families and kids already in your situation and have been for many years. The likely timescale of any transfer is minimum 5-7 years after your training finishes, so 7-9 years from next year.

Any transfers are based on what requirements Dublin has for the future i.e. retirements, resignations, long term illnesses, future staffing requirements for second runway etc etc. The length you will have to wait is dependent on how many people want to transfer and numbers required.

I'm sorry if this brings bad news or a difficult decision. I suggest you continue with your application and see how far you get with it.

There is NO provision for your specific need other than the current FAIR transfer system which now prioritizes people based on when they applied.

irish atco

For futher clarification.
The newly licensed ATCO will spend 5 years on station before they can get a transfer. this is a laid down minumum.
It is possible that some may be sent to Dublin for their final training due to rating requirements (as mentioned by my colleague above). In that instance, those going will be determined by seniority within the group - which is based on results of all exams done (including the recruitment, i think!)

urajoke

Sorry to step on my colleagues toe's but for clarity.

Transfer listed people first, i.e. current rated ATCO's, will be given the option. Then it will be SCP's from this intake. This is too appease anyone who has been waiting patiently for a transfer for many years, which is logical and perfectly understandable.

There will be no direct deployment of SCP's to Dublin/Cork until the current transfer list is empty.

djmcr

urajoke wrote: »

Sorry to step on my colleagues toe's but for clarity.

Transfer listed people first, i.e. current rated ATCO's, will be given the option. Then it will be SCP's from this intake. This is too appease anyone who has been waiting patiently for a transfer for many years, which is logical and perfectly understandable.

There will be no direct deployment of SCP's to Dublin/Cork until the current transfer list is empty.

What about last SCP class where 10 got to go to Dublin ("A recent course had a failure rate of 40% out of the 10 that were sent to Dublin 2 failed the rating course and two failed the OJTI."), why would this SCP be different if the operational requirements were in Dublin at the time that they did their ratings

gerire

mgmt wrote: »

This was written during the last recruitment drive (2007). I believe the first aptitude test was the computer test, not the pencil and paper test?

Now my memory is a bit hazy, but i think we only had one aptitude test in 07 the computer test and then into the interview. That was as far as i got so cant clarify any further than this

urajoke

djmcr wrote: »

What about last SCP class where 10 got to go to Dublin ("A recent course had a failure rate of 40% out of the 10 that were sent to Dublin 2 failed the rating course and two failed the OJTI."), why would this SCP be different if the operational requirements were in Dublin at the time that they did their ratings

Previous to this current transfer policy.

Clearofcloud

I did the tests a week or two and here are my tips.
They're basically a test of some of your natural skills. There's no huge benefit to looking at other tests as its about natural abilities not learned knowledge.

If you want to prepare, get some puzzle books (of any sort), crosswords, do sums with out a calculator anything to exercise your "brain-muscles". That will get you ready for the experience of testing. If you have the skills they're looking for, you'll get through; if you don't have what they're looking for, you're possibly meant for something else.

Have a good breakfast and get plenty of sleep.

ClearofCloud

variety

Clearofcloud wrote: »

They're basically a test of some of your natural skills. There's no huge benefit to looking at other tests as its about natural abilities not learned knowledge.

Do you get scrap paper, or do any calculations need to be worked out in your head?

Clearofcloud

You're given rough-work paper - and I used it as I'm rusty, but it wouldn't take a super human to do the calculations in one's head. I'm sure back in my studenty days I might even have done them in my head.

Killinator

variety wrote: »

Do you get scrap paper, or do any calculations need to be worked out in your head?

You will get a rough work sheet, you may have to do a couple of calculations but its not that bad,

Did the test today and its really not something you could cram for the night before,
Best bet is relax and dont worry about it, you can do it or you cant, you wont finish it thinking "if only I had studied harder, etc..."

Clearofcloud

That's exactly it Killinator - best of luck.

Mc Love

Balls to good nights sleep - will be just coming off night shift (maybe a good thing, if nights are involved with ATC)

Outkast_IRE

was at the limerick one today , was a standard enough aptitude test really, maybe a bit more on the spatial side than usual but nothing much different about it .

andy_g

In order to have FAIR competition for these jobs from no on there will be no discussion of whats on the test. As these are tests looking for the right people the IAA do not want there testing methods discussed.

Also discussion of the said test leaves boards.ie ltd in a position that the IAA could bring forward legal action. Discussions of whats in/on the test will result in future bans/infractions.

By all means dicuss how you have gotten on but not in regards whats on the test.

HobNob

Did the test in Limerick this morning.

Think I got on Ok.

Just some info I learned from talking to the HR lady afterwards
700 to go through to the next round, result out roughly 8 working days
after sept 13th. I make that to be thursday 23rd sept.
next round will be in Dublin, probably, Gresham hotel and will be computer based
aptitude test, starting on Oct 11th for two weeks...

Just one thing did everyone answers all the questions ?

TPMP

HobNob wrote: »

Did the test in Limerick this morning.

Think I got on Ok.

Just some info I learned from talking to the HR lady afterwards
700 to go through to the next round, result out roughly 8 working days
after sept 13th. I make that to be thursday 23rd sept.
next round will be in Dublin, probably, Gresham hotel and will be computer based
aptitude test, starting on Oct 11th for two weeks...

Just one thing did everyone answers all the questions ?

Nope. The only section I was able to answer all the questions on was the mechanical reasoning.

A320

I answered all he maths and mechanical questions,other than that i did ok

mooman

HobNob wrote: »

Did the test in Limerick this morning.

Think I got on Ok.

Just some info I learned from talking to the HR lady afterwards
700 to go through to the next round, result out roughly 8 working days
after sept 13th. I make that to be thursday 23rd sept.
next round will be in Dublin, probably, Gresham hotel and will be computer based
aptitude test, starting on Oct 11th for two weeks...

Just one thing did everyone answers all the questions ?

I found myself twiddling my thumbs for at least 5 minutes at the end of each. I had 18 minutes left in mechanical reasoning. They gave too much time in my opinion. There was no pressure on to get finished like other tests I've sat.

testicle

mooman wrote: »

I found myself twiddling my thumbs for at least 5 minutes at the end of each. I had 18 minutes left in mechanical reasoning. They gave too much time in my opinion. There was no pressure on to get finished like other tests I've sat.

Yeah, but you got them all wrong!

zuutroy

mooman wrote: »

I found myself twiddling my thumbs for at least 5 minutes at the end of each. I had 18 minutes left in mechanical reasoning. They gave too much time in my opinion. There was no pressure on to get finished like other tests I've sat.

Yeah mechanical gave way too long. Finished abstract just on time and had re-checking time for the other two.

jwabh

i had loads of time on the mechanical reasoning aswell, the only section i was rushed in was spatial reasoning

Wetbench4

I found the numerical difficult and the rest were fairly handy and I was also finished the mec reasoning about 14 mins early. I used to be good at maths in school but that was over 10 years ago. Best of luck everyone

mooman

testicle wrote: »

Yeah, but you got them all wrong!

I never said they were right:p

the-dude

Anyone know will it be your total score or will there be a pass mark for each section?

derdider

Wetbench4 wrote: »

I found the numerical difficult and the rest were fairly handy and I was also finished the mec reasoning about 14 mins early. I used to be good at maths in school but that was over 10 years ago. Best of luck everyone

+1

I got an A1 in maths in the LC but that was 12 years ago. I was definitely surprised by some of the questions and couldnt remember how to do certain types of calculations (without a calculator ).

To the people saying you couldnt have studied for it - there is definitely a few things you could have brushed up on before the maths exam if you had known.... Especially for those of us a few years out of school who wouldnt have used them types of sums in a long time.

All in all though it wasnt too bad

wibs

Just finished my exam in limerick, the numerical was difficult as it is 10 years since i did the leaving cert and I haven't done an aptitude test in a while.

The only section I finshed in time was the mechanical reasoning, I think I did ok overall, not as good as the genius dudes on this thread with the physics phd's twiddling their thumbs with time to spare!! Fingers crossed I might scrape through to the next round.

Results out in 8 days after the last exam(monday 13th). There was definitely a wrong question in the spatial part of the test, oh well. It would be a big advantage to someone if they can talk to someone who already did the exam, I know it would have helped me!

Best of luck to everyone on Monday, I know this exam has helped me anyhow as I am doing a similar exam shortly for promotion in my current job and it won't be as hard as this exam.

To the guy above, mooman, how could you have 18 mins left at the end of mechanical? Wasn't that 20 or 25 mins? So you answered all the questions in 2 to 7 minutes. Whats wrong with you? lol do you do these kind of tests in the evenings just for kicks:pac:!!

zig

I wouldnt worry about people who got it done faster than others, often those people end up getting loads wrong cause theyre too confident and make obvious stupid mistakes.
I found it standard enough, not to say it was easy, spatial got me, the rest were ok but I did my best.

Gang of Gin

zig wrote: »

I wouldnt worry about people who got it done faster than others, often those people end up getting loads wrong cause theyre too confident and make obvious stupid mistakes.
I found it standard enough, not to say it was easy, spatial got me, the rest were ok but I did my best.

I'd have to concur with your latter comment. The first three went fine, but the space relations I found there wasn't enough time - it is something that you're either good at visualising or not imho.

Flyer1

Did it yesterday in limerick.

Mechanical was 30 mins. I did it with 18 mins to spare but I went back and re-checked and I found myself wrong on a few. Slow and steady wins the race.

Abstract one was the kick in the nutsack for me :mad:

dyl10

Yeh, it was the abstract that got me.

Binder

Is the last one on today?

I found the space relations the hardest, got kinda confused half way through, finished every section but mechanical was the only one I finished with spare time. Also maths would have been easier for someone who has just finished leaving very.

Hard test but it was a nice challenge even if I don't make it.

Schummi

Binder wrote: »

Is the last one on today?

Yeah, finished today. We'll know within 8 working days.
I'm not sure if they'll e-mail everyone at once though or if they'll let the unsuccessful people know first and then allocate dates & times to those that made it.

Feeder

Do ye think they might send the results with the emails ?

Nice to know how good/bad we got on, instead of just a "thanks but you didn't make it" type of email..........

Schummi

Feeder wrote: »

Do ye think they might send the results with the emails ?

Nice to know how good/bad we got on, instead of just a "thanks but you didn't make it" type of email..........

I doubt it. It would be even more time-consuming to include individual results as well as just e-mailing the good/bad news to the 4,134 applicants.