Mature Med With No Education

Libertewhite

Hello guys.

I was hoping to get some advice about applying as a mature student for medicine in TCD or UCD. I've always had a passion to go into surgery. I was a late bloomer, maturity wise and dropped out of secondary school which I have always regretted and worked in various places since.

Anyway, what would be my best chance to get chance to get in? Would they look at my past history and decline me due to my foolishness and consider me incompetent?

Any advice would be appreciated, thanks in advance.

figs86

I can't imagine that you'd get into a highly coveted and competitive 3rd level course without at least a 2nd level education.

My advice would be to sit the Leaving Cert and/or look into the access to medicine courses provided in the UK.

Probably your first port of call should be the admissions office of any 3rd level institute you'd consider studying at.

Larianne

You definitely need to prove that you have the academic ability first and foremost. So you'll need to either have to sit the Leaving Certificate & HPAT or do an access course. UCD have an access to Science course which a lot of colleges seem to look favourably on. http://www.ucd.ie/adulted/courses/ex430.htm I think NUI Galway have something similar. There is still no guarantee you will get a place though.

After that you have to show your knowledge of the profession and what it involves. So lots of work/shadow experience. Volunteer work would also be helpful to your application.

I think due to the number of colleges in the UK that offer Medicine it is likely that it is easier to get a place on one of there programmes, especially if you do the Access to Medicine course with the same university. That's only if its an option for you.

Otherwise, it might take you two or three attempts to get a place as a mature student here in Ireland. There are many applying for places. The slightly good news is that RCSI now have a small numbers of places for mature students.

What it comes down to is you showing on your application (and interview if you progress that far) that you are able for the course, and know what you are getting yourself in for. Saying that you "really want to do Medicine" isn't going to cut it.

Start working on your application now. Contact the departments, admissions and mature student offices. Go to open days and speak to students, mature students preferably.

Libertewhite

Where is it possible to sit the LC in Dublin? south side preferably.
I was discussing the topic to my friend (she too, is keen on medicine) but she is 20years old and can't apply as a mature student as of yet. She asked if I could ask for her...What are her options? She hasn't done the LC either.

Sorry again to bother you, thanks again.

figs86

Libertewhite wrote: »

I was hoping to get some advice about applying as a mature student for medicine in TCD or UCD.

figs86 wrote: »

Probably your first port of call should be the admissions office of any 3rd level institute you'd consider studying at.

Larianne wrote: »

Contact the departments, admissions and mature student offices.

Hi Libertewhite,

I think the best thing you can do is to contact the admissions offices of TCD, UCD or anywhere else you would study. The leaving cert is almost 12 months away and it was just a suggestion, it may not be a requirement. You need to speak to those who really know about the requirements for admissions. Get the basic requirements and other appropriate info in before you decide to register for the leaving cert or any other course of action.

http://www.ucd.ie/registry/admissions/contactus/
http://www.tcd.ie/Admissions/undergraduate/contact-us/

MagicMarker

In your position as a mature student I would personally opt for an access course, the one Larianne linked to looks excellent. As mentioned if you were willing to travel to the UK you could probably find in a Uni that does provide access courses as well as a med degree too, probably giving a better chance to be accepted.

If you go back to do the leaving cert you'll be learning a load of crap that's pretty much useless to you AND you'll still have to work your bollocks off to get enough points to get into the likes of Trinity.

As for your friend, the only option she has for now is to do the leaving cert, or wait until she's old enough to be a mature student.

Larianne

Just to add, I did the Access to Science course in UCD and got offers for Physiotherapy from UCD and TCD (also from University of Ulster). Now I know Physio is different from Medicine but just to give you an idea of where the course can take you. No-one from my class applied for Medicine. It was mainly General Science and Engineering, one was Neuroscience. They all got places.

I wrote up some tips on applying as a mature student in this thread: http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2055676871 If might be of some use to you.

Prime Mover

Your best bet is the leaving cert I think. Once you get the points your background is irrelevant and you have a wider choice of colleges.

If you chose the access route you will have to score top marks anyway and then interview for a very small pool of places.

lonestargirl

Larianne wrote: »

The slightly good news is that RCSI now have a small numbers of places for mature students.

Did they not always offer places to mature students? Or did they stop it when they started GEP? My husband did medicine as a mature student in RCSI, he had a BSc + MSc in physiology and got in the 3rd year he interviewed. At that time there were 5 places per year (this has probably changed since GEP) and everyone had a degree. They only let in one person who wasn't a 'conventional' graduate, she didn't have a leaving cert but had gone back to college through an access program eventually graduating with a psychology degree. She then worked for a few years in residential care homes before applying for and getting into medicine. However, nowadays if you took that kind of path you would be eligible for the gradaute medicine program rather than as a mature student.

Larianne wrote: »

You definitely need to prove that you have the academic ability first and foremost. So you'll need to either have to sit the Leaving Certificate & HPAT or do an access course. UCD have an access to Science course which a lot of colleges seem to look favourably on. http://www.ucd.ie/adulted/courses/ex430.htm I think NUI Galway have something similar. There is still no guarantee you will get a place though.

After that you have to show your knowledge of the profession and what it involves. So lots of work/shadow experience. Volunteer work would also be helpful to your application.

I think due to the number of colleges in the UK that offer Medicine it is likely that it is easier to get a place on one of there programmes, especially if you do the Access to Medicine course with the same university. That's only if its an option for you.

Excellent advice Larianne

Libertewhite

Many thanks folks, especially Larianne. Any confusion in my mind has now gone!

I'm going to try the access course and if it comes down to having to move to england for Med, let it be so

Larianne

lonestargirl wrote: »

Did they not always offer places to mature students? Or did they stop it when they started GEP? My husband did medicine as a mature student in RCSI, he had a BSc + MSc in physiology and got in the 3rd year he interviewed. At that time there were 5 places per year (this has probably changed since GEP) and everyone had a degree. They only let in one person who wasn't a 'conventional' graduate, she didn't have a leaving cert but had gone back to college through an access program eventually graduating with a psychology degree. She then worked for a few years in residential care homes before applying for and getting into medicine. However, nowadays if you took that kind of path you would be eligible for the gradaute medicine program rather than as a mature student.



Excellent advice Larianne

Your husband would have got into Medicine as a graduate entry as far as I know. As in you had to have a degree before they would even look at you, well that's how its been the past few years anyways. This year 2000/2010 is the first year they will have taken in mature students as well as graduate entry. And it's only for Medicine.

Excellent advice as I've been there, done that!!! Twice! I have to say it is possible but you have to work your ass off - meaning doing the access course and aiming for 80-90% + in exams and getting as much shadow experience/volunteer work/care work done in between.

Libertewhite, best of luck. The lady in charge of the access course in UCD is Thomond Coogan. She's a lovely lady. Give her a ring and she'll advise you on what to do. Her number is on the link I posted above. (I think I should be on some sort of commission from UCD at this stage! :pac: )

PM me if you need any more advice!

sillymoo

Larianne wrote: »

Your husband would have got into Medicine as a graduate entry as far as I know. As in you had to have a degree before they would even look at you, well that's how its been the past few years anyways. This year 2000/2010 is the first year they will have taken in mature students as well as graduate entry. And it's only for Medicine.

Nope im pretty sure RCSI has always taken mature students, even before they started GEM. I would know the mature students in my class pretty well and they in turn would have had friends who went trhough RCSI as mature students in years gone by.

jenga-jen

sillymoo wrote: »

Nope im pretty sure RCSI has always taken mature students, even before they started GEM. I would know the mature students in my class pretty well and they in turn would have had friends who went trhough RCSI as mature students in years gone by.

Sillymoo is right. With the introduction of graduate entry medicine, anyone holding an undergraduate in an unrelated discipline has to apply for graduate entry and is deemed ineligible for the mature student entry route.

On this basis, I'd assume they hold back mature student place (in the undergraduate) programs for individuals without an undergraduate.

lonestargirl

sillymoo wrote: »

Nope im pretty sure RCSI has always taken mature students, even before they started GEM. I would know the mature students in my class pretty well and they in turn would have had friends who went trhough RCSI as mature students in years gone by.

I've been thinking about this Sillymoo and I think Larianne is correct. Many of the people I know who did medicine as a second degree couldn't have been mature students as they weren't 23 when going in. I think the situation must have been that they took graduates in but they went into the 5/6 year program and now they have their own seperate GEP program.

Jessibelle

RCSI have a mature applicant programme, which is available for any candidate over 23 years of age that does not qualify for the GEP. So if you hold a 2:2 undergraduate degree you apply via that rather than the GEP. It's new enough and not exactly well advertised but I went through it (unsucessfully) this year, whereas two friends went through it quite sucessfully.
To the OP, one friend had no formal education but had proven and escalated in her career quite sucessfully. She also undertook sitting the sciences at Leaving Cert level to prove her commitment, but was sitting the exams the year she was called for interview. technically education levels don't matter, but (and there's always a but ) if you show you're commited to bringing yourself to their standards it's always good Drop me a pm if I can be of any help at all, I've been through the process this year and will be doing it again next year so anything I can do to help, let me know

Larianne

sillymoo wrote: »

Nope im pretty sure RCSI has always taken mature students, even before they started GEM. I would know the mature students in my class pretty well and they in turn would have had friends who went trhough RCSI as mature students in years gone by.

I stand corrected. It is not the case for Physiotherapy. I thought it was across the board.

jeanie123

jenga-jen wrote: »

Sillymoo is right. With the introduction of graduate entry medicine, anyone holding an undergraduate in an unrelated discipline has to apply for graduate entry and is deemed ineligible for the mature student entry route.

On this basis, I'd assume they hold back mature student place (in the undergraduate) programs for individuals without an undergraduate.

Just to note above is not correct and it is possible to apply to some colleges for undergrad med with a 2.1 degree, you need to ring the colleges directly on this one as each one is slightly different.

jenga-jen

jeanie123 wrote: »

Just to note above is not correct and it is possible to apply to some colleges for undergrad med with a 2.1 degree, you need to ring the colleges directly on this one as each one is slightly different.

Jeanie I'd be interested to know if these are colleges which offer a grad. med. programme or those that don't?

I had assumed NUIG, Trinity etc who do not run a graduate medicine programme would of course still accept graduates as mature students. My previous post was in relation to those colleges offering graduate programmes, not all colleges offering medicine.

However, from my contact with the admissions offices in a number of colleges at the time of the CAO applications, I was informed that, e.g., in UCD if you are a mature student over 23 and hold a 2.1 degree or above then you're not eligible to apply for the mature entry route but must apply for the graduate route. This seems fairer to the mature entry students who aren't competing against degree holders.

Jessibelle

NUIG don't accept mature students for medicine, that is to say they don't have a specific seperate application process for places, as a mature student you apply with the Leaving Cert students and are considered in line with all of them. TCD consider applications from mature students with qualifications up to PHD level, and consider your highest qualification, so a 2:1 degree isn't essential for application , as they place a lot of emphasis on work and personal experiences also.
UCD automatically requires graduates with a 2:1 or above to apply via the Grad Entry route, as does RCSI. I thought UCC was the same, but someone told me recently thats changed. I'm waiting to hear back from the Admissions for definite about that so I wouldn't be 100% on that one. Queens in Belfast require a minimum 2:1 degree fromeither mature students applying as an undergrad or grad entry students.