Irish Government Conspiracy

Scarab80

Audiomad wrote: »

You just answered your own questions as you said they own share holdings 29% worth got it now!

So we sell of stake in Aer Lingus, get about 100 - 150 million at today's market prices. You are still short 19,850 million in funding the government deficit.

Audiomad wrote: »

Thats business!!! all was done was to have both prices or Aer Lingus and Ryan Air driven up for more money to be made nothing else. Ryan Air can go through the EU for a hearing on buying Aer Lingus if they really want it.

They did, they lost.

Audiomad wrote: »

There are a lot of people that will see what I am saying and the more you drag this thread out the more people will see the truth so thanks for that haha.

I don't think you even see what you are saying. It's a post of rambling inaccuracies, with no coherent theme and the final conclusion that the government is corrupt.

Audiomad

Scarab80 wrote: »

Where are you getting 56bn from? The current situation in the banking sector is as follows;

http://www.rte.ie/business/2009/0916/nama.html one example that was back in 2009 later it was increased to €56B

As many people have pointed out Anglo did not buy Arnotts, they have taken over the company to ensure repayment of loans made by them.

exactly but they bought the shop its self, a company that does not have the money to look after its self.

Audiomad wrote: »

The Government also bought 15% of Bank of Ireland using tax payers money we own part of all the banks in this country. Why are we paying the banks for our own money?

As pointed out above we are currently in profit on the investment into BOI and AIB, we own 34% of BOI by the way.

34% even more reason not to be paying our loans back to BOI as its our money.

Why are we putting money into the banks?

Good question look what happens when we don't we get charged 30 Million
http://uk.news.yahoo.com/22/20100725/tts-uk-ireland-coins-ca02f96.html



A

er Lingus was owned and built by the government, i.e. they owned 100% of Aer Lingus, in the same way as we own 100% of ESB, Bord Gais, Irish Rail, Dublin Bus etc etc. In 2006 it sold off 70% of it's holding for 260 million.

Exactly 29% the Government held onto!!!

Guinness is owned by Diageo Plc, RTE is independent and is funded by television licence fees, Independent Media is owned by Indpendent News and Media Plc, Tony O'Reilly is the major shareholder, The banks have been done. Yes Irish Rail is a semi-state company the same as the others I mentioned (Irish rail loses money every year)

All have investments from the Government using tax payers money to fund it!!!

Dividends received from Bord Gais, ESB, Bord na Mona, Dublin Airport and Dublin Port amounted to 145 million last year. The government spent about 60,000 million last year on public services.

Yet this year and last year the biggest cuts in Irish history!!!!!

You are aware that we had to borrow 20bn last year just to keep the country going. The biggest spending government departments by a country mile are health, education and social welfare, with a total spend last year of 32bn

According to who? The Government?

Irish Rail can't even pay it's own employees wages without government help, for them to fund dart underground is laughable.

Exactly why do the Irish people have to pay the price!?

2.5bn was spent by the department of transport last year, income from motor tax was 1bn. If you don't consider capital investment in the countrys infrastructure a good investment then that would be your own political opinion. A lot of people would disagree with you.

Because they where building up motorways, building tunnels, building tolls.

Paying for what companies to expand??

Dart, Luas, Dublin Airport!!!

the government supports companies with 110bn in exports, 136,000 employed directly, 100,000 employed indirectly, 7.1 billion in payroll costs and 2.8 billion in corporation tax.

Exactly so why do the Irish people need to pay the price because these companies can stand on their own feet!!!

I really don't understand what your point is? Where's the conspiracy? All you have done is churn out a pile of inaccuracies.....

How the Irish people are paying the price for companies who can look after them selfs, where the government runs the country like a business not for the dignity of the Irish people and for the better living standards for its citizens.

How the Government thinks of its own interests over its people. Do you not think the Government "Ministers, TD etc" have their own private shares and that how much investment in companies using tax payers money can make them money!!?

K-9

Audiomad wrote: »

exactly but they bought the shop its self, a company that does not have the money to look after its self.

No, when Arnotts took put the loan originally, they would have used the property as security. They knew that if they couldn't repay those loans, the bank could take over the business. That is what has happened, Anglo and Ulster Bank haven't bought anything.

You seem to be mixing up NAMA, Anglo and this Arnotts issue. Even if NAMA had not been set up and Anglo not bailed out, this still would have happened. Arnotts would still owe the money.

Audiomad

K-9 wrote: »

No, when Arnotts took put the loan originally, they would have used the property as security. They knew that if they couldn't repay those loans, the bank could take over the business. That is what has happened, Anglo and Ulster Bank haven't bought anything.

You seem to be mixing up NAMA, Anglo and this Arnotts issue. Even if NAMA had not been set up and Anglo bailed out, this still would have happened. Arnotts would still owe the money.

And that money comes from tax payers! because Anglo went bust the Government now owns it using tax payers money. Note 1 shop was bought while 250 million is owed from Arnotts not all the shops where reprocessed, where as people owe less money, who lost their jobs have their homes taken from them.

Anglo was pumped with money for over a decade it should never have been let survive to this point 22 Billion plus all the money over the years add it up!!!

K-9

Audiomad wrote: »

The EU also gives money to the Governments in the EU for infrastructure building.

That money is nowhere near the money we used to get. The vast chunk of the money we get from the EU now is Agricultural subsidies. Some money is given for environmental projects, sewerage works, stuff like that, but I don't think road/rail projects get that much any more, if any.

Rail projects might qualify for some aid though, considering how archaic our system is.

Audiomad

K-9 wrote: »

That money is nowhere near the money we used to get. The vast chunk of the money we get from the EU now is Agricultural subsidies. Some money is given for environmental projects, sewerage works, stuff like that, but I don't think road/rail projects get that much any more, if any.

Rail projects might qualify for some aid though, considering how archaic our system is.

I agree with you, but the under ground rail system is it really needed in a time where that money would be better spent on building up services for the people of the country?

There are a lot of people who are having a hard time paying bills and feeding their families shouldn't that money be going to helping them?

One way to help the people of this country is for the banks to pause small loans and mortgages until the country builds up again and businesses and contractors can pay off what they owe first, this would give people the ability to educate them selfs for future work and give people a chance to breath and not have the fear of losing their homes in a time where there are no jobs.

K-9

Audiomad wrote: »

And that money comes from tax payers! because Anglo went bust the Government now owns it using tax payers money. Note 1 shop was bought while 250 million is owed from Arnotts not all the shops where reprocessed, where as people owe less money, who lost their jobs have their homes taken from them.

Anglo was pumped with money for over a decade it should never have been let survive to this point 22 Billion plus all the money over the years add it up!!!

AFAIK, the problem was land they bought around the area, very expensive buildings.

I agree Anglo should never have got anywhere near the size it did. Complete madness having 90% of a bank dependent on property.

K-9

Audiomad wrote: »

I agree with you, but the under ground rail system is it really needed in a time where that money would be better spent on building up services for the people of the country?

There are a lot of people who are having a hard time paying bills and feeding their families shouldn't that money be going to helping them?

One way to help the people of this country is for the banks to pause small loans and mortgages until the country builds up again and businesses and contractors can pay off what they owe first, this would give people the ability to educate them selfs for future work and give people a chance to breath and not have the fear of losing their homes in a time where there are no jobs.

It wouldn't be my top priority, no, but I can see the benefit in it.

Problem is, near me, they are building a new A&E for the hospital, it's near completion. At the same time they are cutting staff in the existing building!

Anyway, this is more a political discussion than Conspiracy Theory territory.

Audiomad

K-9 wrote: »

It wouldn't be my top priority, no, but I can see the benefit in it.

Problem is, near me, they are building a new A&E for the hospital, it's near completion. At the same time they are cutting staff in the existing building!

Anyway, this is more a political discussion than Conspiracy Theory territory.

But this was after they closed hospitals its being used to try and make out the Government is doing a good job but they are not. Ennis for example a hospital where it servers all of Co. Clare and Clare is a very remote county from the most remote parts it would take over an hour to get to the next hospital which is Limerick.

The conspiracy part is where all the money has gone over the years how much we pay in taxes and profits from companies in which the Government own a stake in.

If you think about it the Government now owns a big stake in the banks and that means when a home gets taken away from someone the Government owns more land.

There has been for a long time arguments in the Government over how much say contractors have in the Government all parties have criticized each other over the years on this topic.

namloc1980

Audiomad wrote: »

I agree with you, but the under ground rail system is it really needed in a time where that money would be better spent on building up services for the people of the country?

Underground Dart is a service for the people. Anyone who has even been to any reasonably sized city in continental Europe or in the US will realise how pathetic Ireland's public transport is.

Audiomad wrote: »

There are a lot of people who are having a hard time paying bills and feeding their families shouldn't that money be going to helping them?

We already have a substantial social welfare system in this country

Audiomad wrote: »

One way to help the people of this country is for the banks to pause small loans and mortgages until the country builds up again and businesses and contractors can pay off what they owe first, this would give people the ability to educate them selfs for future work and give people a chance to breath and not have the fear of losing their homes in a time where there are no jobs.

Seriously.......small businesses are dying because they are starved by a lack of cash and you propose not lending anymore to them???? Holy crap.

Audiomad

Underground Dart is a service for the people. Anyone who has even been to any reasonably sized city in continental Europe or in the US will realise how pathetic Ireland's public transport is.

There are better things money can be spent on!

We already have a substantial social welfare system in this country

Which is not much when you think of the cost of living here!

Seriously.......small businesses are dying because they are starved by a lack of cash and you propose not lending anymore to them???? Holy crap.

Tell that to the Government when they cut the dole!, Pausing small loans and mortgages would give people more money to spend thus fixing a lot of problems.

namloc1980

Audiomad wrote: »

There are better things money can be spent on!

Such as?

Audiomad wrote: »

Which is not much when you think of the cost of living here!

So what do you propose?

Audiomad wrote: »

Tell that to the Government when they cut the dole!, Pausing small loans and mortgages would give people more money to spend thus fixing a lot of problems.

what do you mean 'pause loans'?

Audiomad

Such as?

Health care next budget is to cut massive amounts of spending

So what do you propose?

Put it back to its original mark.

what do you mean 'pause loans'?

Pause loans for one / two years, small loans and mortgages

You know what the word pause means don't you?

namloc1980

Audiomad wrote: »

Health care next budget is to cut massive amounts of spending



Put it back to its original mark.




Pause loans for one / two years, small loans and mortgages

You know what the word pause means don't you?

Do you mean people can just not bother paying back loans at all for a couple of years? How the hell would that help the country?

Audiomad

namloc1980 wrote: »

Do you mean people can just not bother paying back loans at all for a couple of years? How the hell would that help the country?

why are you asking the same questions?

namloc1980

Audiomad wrote: »

why are you asking the same questions?

Because what you propose is crazy....just crazy.

robtri

Audiomad wrote: »

Pause loans for one / two years, small loans and mortgages

You know what the word pause means don't you?

why should people not have to pay their debts they racked up... their own fault they in that situation

K-9

Audiomad wrote: »

Health care next budget is to cut massive amounts of spending



Put it back to its original mark.




Pause loans for one / two years, small loans and mortgages

You know what the word pause means don't you?

The problem is to put it simply:

Receipts of about 30 Billion and expenditure of 50, never mind the banks.

The problem with your bank solution is, the banks need capital atm.

Audiomad

Because what you propose is crazy....just crazy.

I stated a way for this country to fix its financial problems this idea has started to be realized by countries around the world.

Increasing consumer spending by lowering taxes not increasing them also helps.

why should people not have to pay their debts they racked up... their own fault they in that situation

No thats the Governments fault they where the ones who caused the problems, I never said they should never pay back the loans but just to pause the loans.

Are you happy people are ending up on the streets?

The problem is to put it simply:

Receipts of about 30 Billion and expenditure of 50, never mind the banks.

The problem with your bank solution is, the banks need capital atm.

The normal people of this country do not make up the majority of the money the banks say we own but the contractors and businesses from around the country and also businesses from outside the country.

People would put their money into their accounts, the dole stops that now because you need to collect it at the post office the banks never see any money only the money that is being paid off loans and people who have jobs.

robtri

Audiomad wrote: »

No thats the Governments fault they where the ones who caused the problems, I never said they should never pay back the loans but just to pause the loans.

Are you happy people are ending up on the streets?
.

course i not happy with people out on the streets, but u cant blame the government for people being greedy and spending more than they can afford and getting big car loans and massive 100% mortgages... no one but themselves to blame,

anyway pausing the loans will mean banks loose more money, therefore they need more money, which i dont want to give in more taxes

Audiomad

robtri wrote: »

course i not happy with people out on the streets, but u cant blame the government for people being greedy and spending more than they can afford and getting big car loans and massive 100% mortgages... no one but themselves to blame,

anyway pausing the loans will mean banks loose more money, therefore they need more money, which i dont want to give in more taxes

Brian Cowen blamed for financial problems :

http://www.irishcentral.com/business/Cowen-blamed-for-Irish-banking-crisis-in-two-devastating-reports-95949824.html

Another, the Government gives outside companies tax breaks to incurage them to come to Ireland but there are no set time lines on how long they should have to stay "No guarantees for the tax breaks" most companies have packed up and left Ireland this started the recession here the reason there are no jobs.

By lowing the dole this caused less spending less of a reason for people to by products from businesses here.

The banks won't make a profit to start with they will get money back then they will be able to give loans to businesses that have paid of their loans with the added spending pausing the loans caused thus increasing the banks revenue and increasing the revenue in the business sector.

Then when the loans start getting paid back by the normal people of the country the banks will be making massive profits.

The banks at the moment are relying on home repossessions to survive and the Nama bail out.

K-9

Audiomad wrote: »

Brian Cowen blamed for financial problems :

http://www.irishcentral.com/business/Cowen-blamed-for-Irish-banking-crisis-in-two-devastating-reports-95949824.html

Another, the Government gives outside companies tax breaks to incurage them to come to Ireland but there are no set time lines on how long they should have to stay "No guarantees for the tax breaks" most companies have packed up and left Ireland this started the recession here the reason there are no jobs.

By lowing the dole this caused less spending less of a reason for people to by products from businesses here.

The banks won't make a profit to start with they will get money back then they will be able to give loans to businesses that have paid of their loans with the added spending pausing the loans caused thus increasing the banks revenue and increasing the revenue in the business sector.

Then when the loans start getting paid back by the normal people of the country the banks will be making massive profits.

The banks at the moment are relying on home repossessions to survive and the Nama bail out.

Unfortunately they are in a catch 22. In times of reducing tax revenue, cuts have to be made. Social Welfare and Pay make up ≈ 75/80% of expenditure, forgetting bank bail outs, so....................

You could just borrow more, but unfortunately that was tried in the late 70's to mid 80's. Interest starts taking more and more of a chunk of taxes, ≈ €3/4 Billion this year. You end up cutting to just pay interest.

You could cut taxes, but Income Tax and PRSI is low here by European standards, so is Corporation tax. VAT is high though.

Our problem isn't taxes like that. The problem was a reliance on property taxes like Stamp Duty and the resultant increases in VAT receipts. Those receipts are gone but the expenditure, based on those receipts, is still there and very hard to remove.

Being realistic, default of some kind is inevitable.

Audiomad

K-9 wrote: »

Unfortunately they are in a catch 22. In times of reducing tax revenue, cuts have to be made. Social Welfare and Pay make up ≈ 75/80% of expenditure, forgetting bank bail outs, so....................

You could just borrow more, but unfortunately that was tried in the late 70's to mid 80's. Interest starts taking more and more of a chunk of taxes, ≈ €3/4 Billion this year. You end up cutting to just pay interest.

You could cut taxes, but Income Tax and PRSI is low here by European standards, so is Corporation tax. VAT is high though.

Our problem isn't taxes like that. The problem was a reliance on property taxes like Stamp Duty and the resultant increases in VAT receipts. Those receipts are gone but the expenditure, based on those receipts, is still there and very hard to remove.

Being realistic, default of some kind is inevitable.

The Government has a lot more revenue that they let on the reason this thread was started. They don't seem to have any problems with allowing for new motor ways to be built, even the underground rail system, but they do have a problem with free health care "supposed to be free we pay tax for it"

It all comes back to the Government and how greedy they are.

K-9

Audiomad wrote: »

The Government has a lot more revenue that they let on the reason this thread was started. They don't seem to have any problems with allowing for new motor ways to be built, even the underground rail system, but they do have a problem with free health care "supposed to be free we pay tax for it"

It all comes back to the Government and how greedy they are.

I'd agree with that to a degree. Eg. Building new A&E's but not assigning the money to staff them. What's the point? Keeping certain builders in work? Now there is a conspiracy!

Having said that, they do have to invest in infrastructure. Personally, I think an underground DART or whatever it is could wait, then I'm from Donegal! Major investment in sewerage and Water systems would be a better use of resources. They have earmarked extra funding for that, but I'd divert the DART money to speed up that.

Again, I'm sure somebody from Dublin would disagree. Similar thing happening in reverse atm, water from the Shannon being diverted to Dublin and people begrudging that! :eek:

CCCP

The OP has NO IDEA what he is talking about.

@OP, spend a few weeks in one of the former soviet republics, or in an African country, or maybe Rural China or another 3rd world or developing nation.

You will come back to Ireland and kiss the ground here, you will want to shake hands with Brian Cowen, you will thank god you live here !

you have no Idea how lucky you were to live in Ireland. You have no Idea what real corruption in government is, YOU NEED A GOOD SLAP OF REALITY.

If you spent 1 month in Ukraine you would never ever say a bad word about Ireland again . if you would even last a month.
Nice to have the internet to post such crap isn't it? Nice to be able to afford such luxuries as free speech and a broadband connection isn't it?
Nice to be able to eat everyday.... YOU DON'T KNOW CORRUPTION!!

It wasn't an Irish caused recession it was a world wide recession.
It WASN'T A RECESSION compared to what the older people here have experienced in the past in Ireland.
In a real recession you would be too busy worrying about where your next meal is coming from to be able to come up with such tripe and post it on the net.
If we really had a corrupt system here you would know all about it, CORRUPT GOVERNMENTS ARE OPENLY CORRUPT. and people living under corrupt regimes don't need geniuses like you pointing it out, its blindingly obvious!

WAKE UP! GROW UP!

phantom_lord

Audiomad wrote: »

The Government has a lot more revenue that they let on the reason this thread was started. They don't seem to have any problems with allowing for new motor ways to be built, even the underground rail system, but they do have a problem with free health care "supposed to be free we pay tax for it"

It all comes back to the Government and how greedy they are.

maybe you should ring them up and ask them what they did with the money?

Audiomad

CCCP wrote: »

The OP has NO IDEA what he is talking about.

Don't I did you investigate anything?

@OP, spend a few weeks in one of the former soviet republics, or in an African country, or maybe Rural China or another 3rd world or developing nation.

That has to do with what? Modern day capitalism is much worse than what you are told Communism was "The American way of life the reason we are told communism is all bad" A mixture of Communism and Capitalism is the way to go.

Cuba a communist country which is known for the best health care system in the world

You will come back to Ireland and kiss the ground here, you will want to shake hands with Brian Cowen, you will thank god you live here !

I'd smack Brian Cowen, thats something I will do when I see him on the street.

you have no Idea how lucky you were to live in Ireland. You have no Idea what real corruption in government is, YOU NEED A GOOD SLAP OF REALITY.

A country where its Government wants to make a little America the most curropt country in the world. You know America is said to owe $14 Triilion in debt! You need to wake up!!!!

If you spent 1 month in Ukraine you would never ever say a bad word about Ireland again . if you would even last a month.
Nice to have the internet to post such crap isn't it? Nice to be able to afford such luxuries as free speech and a broadband connection isn't it?
Nice to be able to eat everyday.... YOU DON'T KNOW CORRUPTION!!

Have you ever talked to anyone from these countries? I lived in Spain where I was living with Russia's at one time, Pakistanis, Spanish, Bolivians, Venezuelian.

All of these people told me how much they loved their countries that none of what the media tells us is true.

What you are trying to say is that its ok for our Government to be corrupt.

It wasn't an Irish caused recession it was a world wide recession.

Ok but the Irish recession started because Irish banks giving out more loans than they could afford to pay back, The Irish Government giving out tax breaks to foreign companies with no guarantees they would stay. "They packed up and left"

We are told by the media that the recession is over but thats not true is it!!

It WASN'T A RECESSION compared to what the older people here have experienced in the past in Ireland.

Its not over yet, sounds like you lapping up the media bull.

In a real recession you would be too busy worrying about where your next meal is coming from to be able to come up with such tripe and post it on the net.

Thats what is happening but you don't hear about it because of the media control, people are losing their homes and you can't even latch onto that!!!

People are getting paid half the money they used to trying to pay their bills so they don't lose their homes and trying to feed their kids!!!!

If we really had a corrupt system here you would know all about it, CORRUPT GOVERNMENTS ARE OPENLY CORRUPT. and people living under corrupt regimes don't need geniuses like you pointing it out, its blindingly obvious!

Ha ha ha ha corrupt Governments are openly Corrupt ha ha ha welcome to the world of capitalism.

You do know it was demned illegal by the EU that the price fixing on cigarettes here does not allow for the fluctuation of the price and that we pay the second highest price in Europe for them.

maybe you should ring the Government and ask where all that money is going! and while you are on the phone ask them are they getting a raise this year, ask them are they cutting health care, ask them who are the bond holders of Anglo, Ask them what companies they own shares in.

WAKE UP! GROW UP!

Exactly what you need to do. Welcome to little America!!!

Audiomad

free speech and a broadband connection

Just to clarify this for you. We don't have free speech do you know you have to ask for permission to protest!!? Do you know the Guards can charge you with disturbing the peace for talking on the streets.

Broadband don't you know China and Russia have broadband China being a communist country has the world largest population of internet users??

Censorship is happening all around you our own Government have started mesures to stop Child porn this I'm ok with having banned, but its now affecting other aspects of the Internet such as free speech sites!!! any site talking out against the Government can be shut down for so called spreading of hate!! and terrorism!!!

have a look at the so called free world has to offer.

http://www.indexoncensorship.org/

Yitzhak Rabin

Audiomad wrote: »

Broadband don't you know China and Russia have broadband China being a communist country has the world largest population of internet users??

Mate, if you think that China has better internet access than us, then you are talking out your @rse.

China's internet policy is absolutely insane. I lived there for six months, and the amount of stuff that is censored beggars belief. They won't allow people to operate there unless they play by the govt.'s rules. Thats why google pulled out, because it wasn't willing to hand over private users data.

Companies like Skype do comply. If you use certain key words like tianaman square, falun gong etc. your details are handed over to the government. Arrest and imprisonment without trial are rampant. The entire media is censored.

The types of sick torture that have been used against members who dissent against the government is repulsive. There have been cases where people are forced to ingest faeces, urine, battery acid. Have had cigarettes stubbed out in their faces. It is actually seriously disturbing. Take a minute to do a quick google search (see we can do that here in Ireland!) for Falun Gong Torture, read the testimonies and look at the images.

So, frankly, to try and claim that China has a freer internet or press than us is offensive and fvcking ignorant.

Audiomad

yekahs wrote: »

Mate, if you think that China has better internet access than us, then you are talking out your @rse.

China's internet policy is absolutely insane. I lived there for six months, and the amount of stuff that is censored beggars belief. They won't allow people to operate there unless they play by the govt.'s rules. Thats why google pulled out, because it wasn't willing to hand over private users data.

Companies like Skype do comply. If you use certain key words like tianaman square, falun gong etc. your details are handed over to the government. Arrest and imprisonment without trial are rampant. The entire media is censored.

The types of sick torture that have been used against members who dissent against the government is repulsive. There have been cases where people are forced to ingest faeces, urine, battery acid. Have had cigarettes stubbed out in their faces. It is actually seriously disturbing. Take a minute to do a quick google search (see we can do that here in Ireland!) for Falun Gong Torture, read the testimonies and look at the images.

So, frankly, to try and claim that China has a freer internet or press than us is offensive and fvcking ignorant.

Go to Germany and say the holocast did not happen you get sent to prison! you can't do any search for it either, its censored in Germany.

http://eu.techcrunch.com/2010/05/31/the-mystery-of-the-disappearing-flotilla-on-twitter/
http://dowzocalypse.com/2010/05/31/flotilla-aid-murder-twitter-censorship/
http://opennet.net/blog/2010/06/flotilla-censored
http://www.allfacebook.com/2009/01/facebook-censoring-gaza-related-content/
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/erik-ose/why-did-the-bbc-censor-a_b_161987.html
http://www.itproportal.com/portal/news/article/2010/6/1/twitter-accused-censorhip-over-gaza-protest-hashtag/

welcome to censorship!

Do you realize that the pope knew about the child abuse but has had every attempt to have him arrested stopped in our so called democratic countries. In every free country it is illegal to prevent the course of justice!

Which part of China did you live in?

Yitzhak Rabin

Audiomad wrote: »

welcome to censorship!

I have no interest in a discussion with you. I'm sorry.

I only posted, because I wanted to call you out on your ignorance on what censorship and oppression is actually like.

You've shown an unwillingness to accept what people are telling you, despite them providing ample evidence. Your understanding of economics is deeply flawed, if not entirely absent. Your previous posts indicate you are not interested in a discussion. You are here to rant nonsensical diatribes against capitalism, the government, and basically anything "mainstream".

As I am at work, I don't have the time to enter into this type of conversation.

Which part of China did you live in?

Not that it is any of your business, but Beijing, Shanghai and Hong Kong.

The difference in censorship and oppression between the first two and the last is phenomenal

HavingCrack

Audiomad wrote: »

Cuba a communist country which is known for the best health care system in the world

If Communist Cuba is so fantastic why do so many Cubans attempt to escape from there to the United States every year.

This is the last time I'll post in this thread. You either believe what you're typing (in which case I pity you) or you're just deliberately trying to wind people up by sprouting rubbish. Either way I've lost interest-adios.

Audiomad

I have no interest in a discussion with you. I'm sorry.

I only posted, because I wanted to call you out on your ignorance on what censorship and oppression is actually like.

You've shown an unwillingness to accept what people are telling you, despite them providing ample evidence. Your understanding of economics is deeply flawed, if not entirely absent. Your previous posts indicate you are not interested in a discussion. You are here to rant nonsensical diatribes against capitalism, the government, and basically anything "mainstream".

As I am at work, I don't have the time to enter into this type of conversation.

I never mentioned oppression that is a word that has popped into your head and then saying I'm the one that is not giving any evidence.

What evidence has been supplied to me? I'm the one giving the evidence here.

You are here to rant nonsensical diatribes against capitalism, the government, and basically anything "mainstream".

Have a look around you and wake up to what the mainstream is Government funded propaganda.

If Communist Cuba is so fantastic why do so many Cubans attempt to escape from there to the United States every year.

This is the last time I'll post in this thread. You either believe what you're typing (in which case I pity you) or you're just deliberately trying to wind people up by sprouting rubbish. Either way I've lost interest-adios.

try reading people! Where did I say Cuba was so great? Their health care is the best and its free!!!

Most of you don't even read whats in front of you if thats the case I pitty you all as you must believe everything the Government tells you.

I've given everyone the evidence and you have the cheek to say I'm making up this stuff up and then you have the cheek to say I'm the one saying that communism is good!!

read people read!!! try investigating before criticizing me on media crap the Government are feeding you.

Audiomad

Not that it is any of your business, but Beijing, Shanghai and Hong Kong.

The difference in censorship and oppression between the first two and the last is phenomenal

You do know that Google Hong Kong and Google china are two different things? the main cities in China use Google Hong Kong as its controlled by the English because England was once owned Hong Kong.

Oppression again a word you decided to use!!!

_______________________________________

If you want to use the word Oppression I'l give you some examples :

Iraq : America
Afghanistan : America
Ireland : England

want more?

Yitzhak Rabin

Audiomad wrote: »

You do know that Google Hong Kong and Google china are two different things?

Eh....yes? Thats why I said

yekahs wrote: »

The difference in censorship and oppression between the first two and the last is phenomenal

want more?

No thanks...

yekahs wrote: »

I have no interest in a discussion with you. I'm sorry.

Audiomad

You know there is always more to what the eye can see!

Russia Today :
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pmM61kSMTR0
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z4UJRF0YM_M
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9wxIPccqWzU

The independent :
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/europe/what-are-the-bilderberg-group-really-doing-in-spain-1991021.html

http://www.independent.ie/opinion/letters/mystery-group-in-the-driving-seat-1733972.html

The Sovereign Independent
http://www.sovereignindependent.com/?p=4248

Bilderbergs in Dublin :
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2D5imvMAuLM

The Bilderbergs have links to our Government.

CCCP

Yes Ive been to Ukraine many times, and also to many other countrys,

This is my last post here, you obviosuly dont understand anything.
Good luck;)

Audiomad

CCCP wrote: »

Yes Ive been to Ukraine many times, and also to many other countrys,

Yet you have nothing to say on the matter!?

This is my last post here, you obviosuly dont understand anything.
Good luck;)

Nothing to say on the answers I gave you? realizing its the truth?

CCCP

Audiomad wrote: »

Yet you have nothing to say on the matter!?

I Already said something on the matter

Audiomad wrote: »

Nothing to say on the answers I gave you? realizing its the truth?

Realising your a troll and an impending ban is looming,

Goodbye,

Audiomad

CCCP wrote: »

I Already said something on the matter

No you didn't

Realising your a troll and an impending ban is looming,

Goodbye,

Why because I'm showing you and others the truth? backing up everything I've said with evidence!

CCCP

An interview on RT with a journalist/conspiracy writer is not evedence,
In my first post here I talked about Ukraine.

I am more suspiciuos of guys like you and your crusade then I am of government conspiracys. "Beware of those who try to hang a cross around your neck"

Your not here for debate, your here to spam this junk.

Your the only curruption here.

Get thee behind me.

to avoid this getting more personal dont bother responding to me, you will not get a reply next time.

Audiomad

CCCP wrote: »

An interview on RT with a journalist/conspiracy writer is not evedence,
In my first post here I talked about Ukraine.

I am more suspiciuos of guys like you and your crusade then I am of government conspiracys. "Beware of those who try to hang a cross around your neck"

Your not here for debate, your here to spam this junk.

Your the only curruption here.

Get thee behind me.

to avoid this getting more personal dont bother responding to me, you will not get a reply next time.

I think I will reply anyway.

This thread was not started as a debate but all Boards.ie seems to be is a giant debate!

Get thee behind me.

Not into that sort of thing! sorry

phantom_lord

Audiomad wrote: »

Why because I'm showing you and others the truth? backing up everything I've said with evidence!

yeah :rolleyes:

Audiomad

phantom_lord wrote: »

yeah :rolleyes:

prove me wrong!?

Yitzhak Rabin

Audiomad wrote: »

prove me wrong!?

Ok, I read over the first 3 pages of the thread (thats all I could take!)

You've made a number of claims which were lies.

Claim 1: Anglo bought Arnotts

Not true, at all. Arnotts got loans off Anglo. They are struggling to repay them, so standard procedure, the bank takes it over until it can.

Claim 2: Government bought a 29% stake in Aer Lingus and gets huge profits from it.

The government used to own 100% of Aer lingus. They sold it in 2006 and are now down to just over 28%. The don't get huge profits from it. Aer Lingus lost 130 million and doesn't pay dividends on shares.

Claim 3: Government owns Guinness, RTE

Untrue.

Claim 4: 56bn is 200,000 for every man woman and child in the country

200,000 x 4.5 million population = 900bn

Thats just the first three pages. Then there's your complete misunderstanding of a number of things such as;

You talk about things like how the government should have paid for Anglo and pay for Healthcare with their own money, not taxpayers....??? WTF the government gets its money from taxpayers

You think that the government shouldn't invest in infrastructure, and instead should just give money to people.

You think a good strategy for salvaging our banking strategy is to "pause" loans?

You thought that the government privatising Aer Lingus, meant it was done in secrecy! :D



So why exactly should anyone bother replying to you, when you maintain your arrogant know all attitude, when in fact, you know very little?

Why should anyone try and prove anything to you, when you'll just dismiss it regardless?

and finally.....What is the CT???

Audiomad

yekahs wrote: »

Ok, I read over the first 3 pages of the thread (thats all I could take!)

You've made a number of claims which were lies.

Claim 1: Anglo bought Arnotts

Not true, at all. Arnotts got loans off Anglo. They are struggling to repay them, so standard procedure, the bank takes it over until it can.

Never said that read it again also read the yahoo link!!

Claim 2: Government bought a 29% stake in Aer Lingus and gets huge profits from it.

The government used to own 100% of Aer lingus. They sold it in 2006 and are now down to just over 28%. The don't get huge profits from it. Aer Lingus lost 130 million and doesn't pay dividends on shares.

Again read again they own 29% never said they bought it!

Claim 3: Government owns Guinness, RTE

Untrue.

Again twisting words they own stakes in these!!!

Claim 4: 56bn is 200,000 for every man woman and child in the country

200,000 x 4.5 million population = 900bn

Add it up plus add the money from loans that have been taken from out side the country did you not watch the news 89Billion in loans where taken for the country and all the money to be taken over the next few years!!!

and actually the population is more near 6million

Thats just the first three pages. Then there's your complete misunderstanding of a number of things such as;

You talk about things like how the government should have paid for Anglo and pay for Healthcare with their own money, not taxpayers....??? WTF the government gets its money from taxpayers

No I said we never should have paid for Anglo!! we pay taxes for health care my point is that the Government is cutting spending when we already pay for it!!

You think that the government shouldn't invest in infrastructure, and instead should just give money to people.

Where did I say that?

You think a good strategy for salvaging our banking strategy is to "pause" loans?

Yes! if you had any sense you would see that!

You thought that the government privatising Aer Lingus, meant it was done in secrecy! :D

Did I say that did you not read my comment about how I new about the Government owning 29%? and about the minimum €10,000 buy in?

So why exactly should anyone bother replying to you, when you maintain your arrogant know all attitude, when in fact, you know very little?

Why should anyone try and prove anything to you, when you'll just dismiss it regardless?

and finally.....What is the CT???

There you go clarified everything for you. all you have done is twist words to make it look like you where right your a muppet!

Scarab80

yekahs wrote: »

Ok, I read over the first 3 pages of the thread (thats all I could take!)

You've made a number of claims which were lies.

Claim 1: Anglo bought Arnotts

Not true, at all. Arnotts got loans off Anglo. They are struggling to repay them, so standard procedure, the bank takes it over until it can.

Claim 2: Government bought a 29% stake in Aer Lingus and gets huge profits from it.

The government used to own 100% of Aer lingus. They sold it in 2006 and are now down to just over 28%. The don't get huge profits from it. Aer Lingus lost 130 million and doesn't pay dividends on shares.

Claim 3: Government owns Guinness, RTE

Untrue.

Claim 4: 56bn is 200,000 for every man woman and child in the country

200,000 x 4.5 million population = 900bn

Thats just the first three pages. Then there's your complete misunderstanding of a number of things such as;

You talk about things like how the government should have paid for Anglo and pay for Healthcare with their own money, not taxpayers....??? WTF the government gets its money from taxpayers

You think that the government shouldn't invest in infrastructure, and instead should just give money to people.

You think a good strategy for salvaging our banking strategy is to "pause" loans?

You thought that the government privatising Aer Lingus, meant it was done in secrecy! :D



So why exactly should anyone bother replying to you, when you maintain your arrogant know all attitude, when in fact, you know very little?

Why should anyone try and prove anything to you, when you'll just dismiss it regardless?

and finally.....What is the CT???

This, exactly.

Audiomad if you have any real interest in learning about how the government raise and spend their money (i imagine that you do not) I suggest you browse the 2010 estimate of receipts and expenditures based on the last budget. It also includes actual figures from last year.

http://www.budget.gov.ie/Budgets/2010/Documents/whitepaperfin2010.pdf

Audiomad

Scarab80 wrote: »

This, exactly.

Audiomad if you have any real interest in learning about how the government raise and spend their money (i imagine that you do not) I suggest you browse the 2010 estimate of receipts and expenditures based on the last budget. It also includes actual figures from last year.

http://www.budget.gov.ie/Budgets/2010/Documents/whitepaperfin2010.pdf

Government quotes not independent!! they also say we are out of the recession but thats not true tho is it!?

Yitzhak Rabin

Audiomad wrote: »

Government quotes not independent!! they also say we are out of the recession but thats not true tho is it!?

Recession is a technical term. The economy has stopped retracting, which technically means we are.

Audiomad

yekahs wrote: »

Recession is a technical term. The economy has stopped retracting, which technically means we are.

No the Government are still taking loans that means it is still retracting, we would not be having budget cuts if that was true!!!