M11 - Arklow to Rathnew

spacetweek · 30-12-2011 1:12am

I always object to Burger King being described as a restaurant

Niles · 30-12-2011 7:32pm

spacetweek wrote: »

I always object to Burger King being described as a restaurant

It's going to be a Burger King? In that case I would use the term "restaurant" loosely myself, I suppose "fast food outlet" wouldn't sound as good. Though seeing as it's the one part of the M/N11 I rarely have reason to travel on (effectively bypasses me) I guess I've little need to worry about it.

Chris_5339762 · 30-12-2011 8:22pm

It'll be Burger King as far as I know, the same as the Enfield and M1 ones.

L1011 · 30-12-2011 8:35pm

Chris_5339762 wrote: »

It'll be Burger King as far as I know, the same as the Enfield and M1 ones.

That'd most likely be reliant on BAM/BOI issuing "their" concession to SuperStop, although that would be fairly logical.

spacetweek · 31-12-2011 11:04am

I still have nightmares about the BK I had in Enfield. I'd say I was their first customer in an hour - stodgefest.

In places like Germany and Belgium, the service area food is a good-quality buffet.

jd · 31-12-2011 12:32pm

I wonder how viable it will be given the Enniscorthy by-pass won't be happening for a good while

PseudoFamous · 31-12-2011 1:11pm

spacetweek wrote: »

I still have nightmares about the BK I had in Enfield. I'd say I was their first customer in an hour - stodgefest.

I suspect that a burger king would be a bit of a flop on the M11, that far south. At least the one on the M1 has commuters from Balbriggan, Drogheda and Dundalk.

It'd probably be better off building it in either Gorey or Arklow to begin with.. But of course, like everything in Ireland, someone will think "build it and they will come", and be surprised when no one does.

L1011 · 31-12-2011 5:32pm

jd wrote: »

I wonder how viable it will be given the Enniscorthy by-pass won't be happening for a good while

Even without that there won't be a station between Camolin and Kilmac (there already isn't a 24hr station between Ferns and Kilmac) once the new scheme is built. It'll certainly be viable as a petrol station at least.

Niles · 01-01-2012 6:43pm

jd wrote: »

I wonder how viable it will be given the Enniscorthy by-pass won't be happening for a good while

That's a good point. I suppose in for the immediate future it's really more of strategic value than anything else. I suppose there'll be some trade from lorries heading to Rosslare and the like, but can't imagine there being a huge amount of trade for the restaurant from casual motorists. The service station itself is probably viable enough though.

Jayuu · 01-01-2012 7:07pm

The advantage of any motorway stop is that people know they can pull in to one of them and get all they need in the one go. So you're more likely to pull in to this place because if you go a bit further, while you might find a petrol station, there's no guarantee that you're going to be able to get food/coffee at it.

On the M1 there were a lot of people who said that the Lusk stop was too close to Dublin for people to want to stop there yet anytime I have pulled in there its been relatively busy. However I realise there probably is more traffic on this stretch of road than on the N/M11.

Wild Bill · 01-01-2012 10:57pm

The new MSA (unofficial?) at the Monasterevin Junction (M7) is a hive of activity all day long - shows the need for these places.

Niles · 01-01-2012 11:23pm

Wild Bill wrote: »

The new MSA (unofficial?) at the Monasterevin Junction (M7) is a hive of activity all day long - shows the need for these places.

In fairness though Monasterevin is closer to Dublin that Inch/Ballyellen (Kilmacanogue is probably more of a counterpart in this regard). The thing about the M11 one is that it's after Arklow, and probably too close to Gorey to see much usage from there either, it's really only of benefit to those travelling south of Gorey (and even then it will only become critical if and when the motorway south of Clough is constructed). The one at Monasterevin serves traffic from a wider variety of locations too, considering that the M/N8 feeds into the M7.

Wild Bill · 01-01-2012 11:53pm

Niles wrote: »

In fairness though Monasterevin is closer to Dublin that Inch/Ballyellen (Kilmacanogue is probably more of a counterpart in this regard). The thing about the M11 one is that it's after Arklow, and probably too close to Gorey to see much usage from there either, it's really only of benefit to those travelling south of Gorey (and even then it will only become critical if and when the motorway south of Clough is constructed). The one at Monasterevin serves traffic from a wider variety of locations too, considering that the M/N8 feeds into the M7.

Actually Kilmac is a dangerous disaster ! :mad:

That apart, it is virtually in Dublin - you are inside the continuous street lighting zone.

I'd have thought Monastereven more akin to Gorey? (Though I think traffic on the M7 at that point may be heavier than on he M11 at Inch.

Anyone got any stats?

Jayuu · 02-01-2012 12:24pm

Niles wrote: »

The thing about the M11 one is that it's after Arklow, and probably too close to Gorey to see much usage from there either, it's really only of benefit to those travelling south of Gorey (and even then it will only become critical if and when the motorway south of Clough is constructed).

We can't build temporary solutions. Just because the motorway ends beyond Gorey doesn't mean we should move the station back twenty miles. As you say the M11 will eventually go as far as Rosslare putting the stop almost in the middle. If its built further north then we'd probably need to build a second one around Enniscorthy at a later stage.

L1011 · 02-01-2012 1:38pm

Its not like there's a fantastic set of facilities on what is going to be bypassed by the Enniscorthy BP. Three stations in Camolin, none 24hr; one 24hr in Ferns, two in Enniscorthy with virtually no facilities.

Niles · 02-01-2012 5:50pm

Jayuu wrote: »

We can't build temporary solutions. Just because the motorway ends beyond Gorey doesn't mean we should move the station back twenty miles. As you say the M11 will eventually go as far as Rosslare putting the stop almost in the middle. If its built further north then we'd probably need to build a second one around Enniscorthy at a later stage.

Oh I agree. Basically I'm just saying that it will be a long time before its true potential is reached.

nordydan · 03-01-2012 5:51pm

Can anyone confirm whether the two access roads to the Arklow rugby club have been stopped up yet? The works were listed on the Wicklow CC website last year

Carawaystick · 03-01-2012 9:31pm

they weren't the day before Xmas Eve

PoolDude · 05-01-2012 8:28pm

Does anyone have a start date for this project?

@ 18 months looks like next Summer (2013) completion if it starts in Q1.

Niles · 05-01-2012 11:41pm

PoolDude wrote: »

Does anyone have a start date for this project?

@ 18 months looks like next Summer (2013) completion if it starts in Q1.

According to this the start date is now 1st June, with completion set for two years later.

Wild Bill · 06-01-2012 10:50am

21/12/2011
- Start Date updated to 01/06/2012
- Finish Date updated to 01/06/2014
- Construction work is expected to commence on the upgrading of the route to four lanes during 2012.

So, the diggers are go on 1st June

jd · 06-01-2012 10:55am

Niles wrote: »

According to this the start date is now 1st June, with completion set for two years later.

That's for all elements of the PPP. The M11 portion could be finished before then (as could Newlands X)

Niles · 06-01-2012 5:28pm

jd wrote: »

That's for all elements of the PPP. The M11 portion could be finished before then (as could Newlands X)

Hopefully. If the Ashford and Gorey ones are anything to go by it's probably quite possible.

veryangryman · 06-01-2012 5:30pm

Matter of interest....

Who are these people travelling from Rosslare to Dublin? If its truckers, then why are they not going towards the closest port via Ferry?

Just saying. Fair enough there are countless journeys on the intermediate parts of the route

tw0nk · 06-01-2012 5:33pm

I travel Enniscorthy to Dublin and back every day for work, a lot of commuters from Gorey and Arklow also, I guess this makes up most of the traffic. I reckon it will save me about 10 minutes each way per day, so 20 mins per day, I will be very glad for that.

L1011 · 06-01-2012 5:34pm

veryangryman wrote: »

Matter of interest....

Who are these people travelling from Rosslare to Dublin? If its truckers, then why are they not going towards the closest port via Ferry?

Just saying. Fair enough there are countless journeys on the intermediate parts of the route

France. The Port doesn't solely serve the Welsh routes

Also, you can be far closer to Pembroke/Fishguard over Holyhead on the UK side than the distance on our side.

Wild Bill · 06-01-2012 7:31pm

veryangryman wrote: »

Matter of interest....

Who are these people travelling from Rosslare to Dublin? If its truckers, then why are they not going towards the closest port via Ferry?

Just saying. Fair enough there are countless journeys on the intermediate parts of the route

Let's be honest - the N11 is a commuter road to Dublin, first and foremost. :cool:

iwo · 06-01-2012 8:38pm

veryangryman wrote: »

Matter of interest....

Who are these people travelling from Rosslare to Dublin? If its truckers, then why are they not going towards the closest port via Ferry?

Just saying. Fair enough there are countless journeys on the intermediate parts of the route

Tens of my friends and more other people from, go Enniscorty, gorey, arklow and other smaller places... From very early morning til late evening, and always busy, me and by wife travel for last 5 years to dublin... Rathnew-arklow connection will be a blessing! I will save about 10mins there... Happy days :-P

Niles · 06-01-2012 10:23pm

MYOB wrote: »

France. The Port doesn't solely serve the Welsh routes

Also, you can be far closer to Pembroke/Fishguard over Holyhead on the UK side than the distance on our side.

Indeed. It was (not sure if it still is?) marketed as Ireland's only Europort. I'm no expert when it comes to shipping but I'm guessing its location makes it more convenient for continent-bound ferry traffic than Dublin.

Bullseye1 · 06-01-2012 10:27pm

Fantastic news on this project starting.

veryangryman · 07-01-2012 12:09am

MYOB wrote: »

veryangryman wrote: »

Matter of interest....

Who are these people travelling from Rosslare to Dublin? If its truckers, then why are they not going towards the closest port via Ferry?

Just saying. Fair enough there are countless journeys on the intermediate parts of the route

France. The Port doesn't solely serve the Welsh routes

Also, you can be far closer to Pembroke/Fishguard over Holyhead on the UK side than the distance on our side.

Keeping in mind the road from swansea to those ports is pretty dire I would say that quite a lot of the trucks do the motorway trek to holyhead and onto London. Even ignoring this point .. if we are looking for strategic routes it is possibly just as important to sort out the N24

Niles · 07-01-2012 2:01am

veryangryman wrote: »

Keeping in mind the road from swansea to those ports is pretty dire I would say that quite a lot of the trucks do the motorway trek to holyhead and onto London. Even ignoring this point .. if we are looking for strategic routes it is possibly just as important to sort out the N24

The thing is though (as others have pointed out) the road sees a lot of use from general commuter traffic. Not saying that N24 is undeserving, but as a major Dublin artery route the N11 would be pretty important. The Rathnew-Arklow bit has been the main "weak link" on the route since the Inch/Gorey bypass sections opened back in 2007.

L1011 · 07-01-2012 1:56pm

veryangryman wrote: »

Keeping in mind the road from swansea to those ports is pretty dire I would say that quite a lot of the trucks do the motorway trek to holyhead and onto London. Even ignoring this point .. if we are looking for strategic routes it is possibly just as important to sort out the N24

Swansea isn't in France

number_1 · 07-01-2012 3:39pm

There is a reason why the Revenue Commissioners base their VRT section in Rosslare. It is the primary point of entry into the country for most new cars. Perhaps 'veryangryman' would like to propose to Renault, Citroen, Volkswagen, et al to start importing their cars via the UK!

Good luck convincing them to increase their transport costs just because you don't want money to be spent on this route!

Wild Bill · 07-01-2012 4:47pm

MYOB wrote: »

Swansea isn't in France

Well spotted

!

marmurr1916 · 08-01-2012 6:53pm

veryangryman wrote: »

Keeping in mind the road from swansea to those ports is pretty dire I would say that quite a lot of the trucks do the motorway trek to holyhead and onto London. Even ignoring this point .. if we are looking for strategic routes it is possibly just as important to sort out the N24

The road from Swansea to Fishguard and Pembroke Dock splits at St. Clears.

From west of Swansea to St. Clears it's a dual-carriageway (part of A48 and A40) once the M4 terminates.

St. Clears to Fishguard is 35 miles, St. Clear's to Pembroke Dock is 32 miles.

Given that the A55/M6/M1 (or M40) routes to London are more congested than the alternative route across South Wales, it would hardly be worth anyone's while to go via Holyhead just to avoid 35 miles, or less, of single carriageway.

Although I suppose that doesn't stop people from doing just that.

Wild Bill · 08-01-2012 9:31pm

marmurr1916 wrote: »

it would hardly be worth anyone's while to go via Holyhead just to avoid 35 miles, or less, of single carriageway.

Although I suppose that doesn't stop people from doing just that.

Aren't people just plumb crazy? :rolleyes:

Sponge Bob · 08-01-2012 10:16pm

marmurr1916 wrote: »

The road from Swansea to Fishguard and Pembroke Dock splits at St. Clears.

From west of Swansea to St. Clears it's a dual-carriageway (part of A48 and A40) once the M4 terminates.

St. Clears to Fishguard is 35 miles, St. Clear's to Pembroke Dock is 32 miles.

Roadbridge are improving the St Clears to Pembroke Dock Road as it happens.

http://www.roadbridge.ie/pdf/projects/roads/A477_LR.pdf

bkehoe · 09-01-2012 2:03pm

Sponge Bob wrote: »

Roadbridge are improving the St Clears to Pembroke Dock Road as it happens.

http://www.roadbridge.ie/pdf/projects/roads/A477_LR.pdf

There has also been the recent construction of a new section of road bypassing some villages on the St Clears to Haverfordwest road which makes a significant difference.

Marcusm · 11-01-2012 12:35am

Niles wrote: »

Indeed. It was (not sure if it still is?) marketed as Ireland's only Europort. I'm no expert when it comes to shipping but I'm guessing its location makes it more convenient for continent-bound ferry traffic than Dublin.

In many respects, that will depend on a number of factors including the nature of the cargo, the extent to which 40% of the Irish market for many imported goods is in greater Dublin airport, intermodal transferability in port, the overall route of the transporter (eg is it going to Liverpool, Glasgow anyway) etc etc.

For many UK manufacturers, the starting point is more likely to be the West Midlands rather than London. Equally, goods imported to the UK for onward transfer to Ireland are as likely to come into Felixstowe as "London".

All that being said, there are lots of curiosities, eg Astras for LHD markets are built at Ellesmere Port near Licerpool/Chester but in my experience are driven south on car carriers rather than shipped out if port. Likewise, Jags and Land Rovers and Minis all from midlands/west midlands.

marmurr1916 · 12-01-2012 12:06am

Sponge Bob wrote: »

Roadbridge are improving the St Clears to Pembroke Dock Road as it happens.

http://www.roadbridge.ie/pdf/projects/roads/A477_LR.pdf

Just checked the distance again, it's actually only 24 miles between St. Clears and Pembroke Dock, using the A477.

This scheme will improve 25% of the road between St. Clears and Pembroke Dock.

jd · 13-01-2012 9:49am

Is there a detailed map of this scheme available? Also I presume this is not being constructed under a motorway order, but will be re-designated as one post-construction

jd · 14-01-2012 8:50pm

While searching for a map I found thse
http://www.pleanala.ie/casenum/ER2032.htm
http://www.pleanala.ie/casenum/CH2145.htm

iwo · 15-01-2012 9:55am

jd wrote: »

While searching for a map I found thse
http://www.pleanala.ie/casenum/ER2032.htm
http://www.pleanala.ie/casenum/CH2145.htm

Sorry guys, is there any specific start-finish point for this project? The more I read the less I know :-D
Will they me redoing existing road or building new one? I'm asking from restrictions point of view.. Hoping to not see delays on this road during construction works.

Irish and Proud · 15-01-2012 6:44pm

iwo wrote: »

Sorry guys, is there any specific start-finish point for this project? The more I read the less I know :-D
Will they me redoing existing road or building new one? I'm asking from restrictions point of view.. Hoping to not see delays on this road during construction works.

The road will be built offline (new road) but will traverse the existing road a couple of times, so delays at certain locations along the way might result. Going South, the road will start at the Beehive and will finish at the rugby club North of Arklow. This scheme is due to start in May/June of this year and should be completed in 2014 by my estimation.

Regards!

Wild Bill · 15-01-2012 7:47pm

They had a map in Wicklow Co Co many moons ago - but no copy online. A nice man in the council gave me one (photocopy) which I can no longer find.

Can't see why there isn't a copy online somewhere by now

Carawaystick · 15-01-2012 9:53pm

Irish and Proud wrote: »

The road will be built offline (new road) but will traverse the existing road a couple of times, so delays at certain locations along the way might result. Going South, the road will start at the Beehive and will finish at the rugby club North of Arklow. This scheme is due to start in May/June of this year and should be completed in 2014 by my estimation.

Regards!

Strictly speaking, the northern end will be at the end of DC about a km north of the Beehive.

I saw the map before, and from the fencing on the ground, the Road starts west of the existing road with a junction at the beehive for the Wicklow/Deputy's pass roads; Then it crosses to the east near the Tap and runs east of the graveyard in Barndarrig; and crosses west again south of Barndarrig, before the long straight stretch to Jack Whites. There's another junction near Jack Whites for Brittas bay and Redcross.

The new road crosses east again south of plattenstown and I think it'll merge into the end of the Arklow bypass from the east, but at a gradual angle

All the crossings were fairly oblique, so there's going to be an amount of trafic disruption, but there is to be some parallel road in the latest scheme I saw, to allow the mainline be motorway, maybe if that was built early on traffic could use that.

There were two houses demolished a few years back for it, I dunno if any more need be done, and I'm not sure how the section at the northern end will be done, to allow local accesses.

nordydan · 16-01-2012 3:27pm

The road will almost certainly be motorway when opened, it'll have an alternative route for its entire length and they are closing off the LILO's at Arklow rugby club.

They only discrepancy is that it'll be narrow median, sandwiching two wide median schemes (Arklow Bypass & Ashford/Rathnew Bypass)

Niles · 16-01-2012 7:07pm

nordydan wrote: »

They only discrepancy is that it'll be narrow median, sandwiching two wide median schemes (Arklow Bypass & Ashford/Rathnew Bypass)

Any reasons for this? Cost?

Wild Bill · 16-01-2012 8:16pm

Niles wrote: »

Any reasons for this? Cost?

They don't reckon they'll ever need to widen it to six lanes past Wicklow Town.

M11 - Arklow to Rathnew

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