Why Is Marijuana Illegal?

AgileMyth

TeddyTedson wrote: »

Legalization would be awful. The government would tax it like crazy.

I'd rather pay twice the price than fund the scum that brings it in at the minute.

Laisurg

yoyo wrote: »

What does it count as then, I doubt people smoke it just for the taste

Well it's hard to describe but the simplest way of saying it is that it makes things seem more fun and improves mood, it doesn't however make people do outrageous things when they've smoked a lot of it as opposed to alcohol which can completely change people after they've drank a lot.

Laisurg

HavingCrack wrote: »

I'm in favour of legalising cannabis myself but I'm still sceptical of this claim. Surely smoking marijuana daily would give you a significantly higher chance of contracting lung cancer than a non-smoker??

Well it would depend on the cannabis itself whether its tampered with or not, contaminated cannabis is normally what would cause lung problems but even then unless it's extremely bad grit like fiber glass i would say it wouldn't be as bad as cigerettes and remember that people don't smoke cannabis like cigerettes, some people smoke 20-40 cigerettes a day and remember that smoking cannabis is only one of the many ways of ingesting it, for instance you can eat it or cook with it which would reduce any chance of it contributing to lung cancer.

Laisurg

TeddyTedson wrote: »

Legalization would be awful. The government would tax it like crazy. It will never happen anyway. At least not until alot of the older generation die off. Look what happened with the head shops. I remember seeing the RTE program on it down the country somewhere, where old these oldies stood outside the headshop protesting against it every lunch time. FFS

It would still be cheaper than it is now, cannabis is more expensive in ireland than any other country in the world, near enough to twice the price it is in the uk and about 3 times the price it is in the US and most of the stuff here has been tampered with and everything, legalization would fix the contaminated cannabis problem mostly, i think it will be legalized some day, although the US will have to do it first before anyone else even considers it, who knows how long that's going to take after all the propaganda the bush administration shoved into peoples heads over there.

Headshops were a completely different deal, we didn't know what was in that stuff and it definitly wasn't cannabis and wasn't tested for problems i'd say, the headshops also sold a substitute for cocaine which was also used a substitute for heroin by some junkies.

medicman2009 wrote: »

Legal for medicinal purposes absolutely, otherwise no. Innocent little drug my ar$e, prolonged and regular use is a nice precursor to mental health problems down the road.

This theory was proved false and was originally started as propaganda by the americans in the 1930s and it just stuck, look up the study they did in canada in 2002. It had some of the best scientists from the US and canada.

Catacomb

HavingCrack wrote: »

I'm in favour of legalising cannabis myself but I'm still sceptical of this claim. Surely smoking marijuana daily would give you a significantly higher chance of contracting lung cancer than a non-smoker??

.....Common sense should tell you "Yes", the carcinogens in any smoke should cause lung problems and/or cancer.

.....But the ironic thing about Cannabis smoke is that tetrahydrocannabinol or simply THC --the most active and concentrated cannabinoid found in cannabis strains-- is believed to be anti-carcinogenic and therefore prevents cancer. It's one of the safest smoke there is, sure it has carcinogens as well but people forget to look at the bigger picture of the pharmaceutical properties of the plant.

.....What speaks for this is also the fact that no studies have ever proven that cannabis smoking is a primary factor in the development of lung cancer.

.....The government funded "propaganda" relies on the fact that certain --not all-- carcinogens are higher in concentration then tobacco smoke but are completely ignoring usage patterns of the drug, the fact that specific carcinogens are found in higher concentrations in tobacco and that cannabis has anti-carcinogens alongside carcinogens.

.....Of course if people would be properly educated about drugs instead of all the shallow "drugs are bad" slogans people would know about harm reduction and that cannabis can be absorbed into one's metabolism in a variety of safer ways including among others vaporising and ingestion.

medicman2009 wrote: »

Legal for medicinal purposes absolutely, otherwise no. Innocent little drug my ar$e, prolonged and regular use is a nice precursor to mental health problems down the road.

.....Cannabis abuse is a symptom not a cause of mental illnesses,

.....People with mental disorders have a higher tendency to abuse drugs (all drugs not just cannabis, tobacco being the main one) and if you have a need to regularly abuse drugs, especially if it's not physically addictive it's clearly in most cases either for self medication or derealization in order to escape reality.

.....The main evidence for this is that in many countries where cannabis consume has skyrocketed the mental disorders have not, thereby disproving a supposed correlation whereby cannabis use leads to mental disorders.

.....What is much more credible is the explanation that mentally unstable people with tendency to psychotic illnesses are at special risk of abusing drugs, including cannabis.

.....;) It's always easier to blame a drug or some external factor for problems.

ScumLord

Laisurg wrote: »

Well it would depend on the cannabis itself whether its tampered with or not, contaminated cannabis is normally what would cause lung problems but even then unless it's extremely bad grit like fiber glass i would say it wouldn't be as bad as cigerettes and remember that people don't smoke cannabis like cigerettes, some people smoke 20-40 cigerettes a day

Smoking cannabis can under no circumstances be considered healthy or medical.

Eating or vaporising cannabis is the only way someone can legitimately say they're using it for medical purposes. All the lung cancer arguments go out the window once you take smoking out of the picture.

bc dub

unfortunately the majority of stoners I know mix their weed with tobacco and then smoke it in unfiltered joints, a johnny blue joint, if you like...I'd be fearful of their lungs. at present I only use my one hitter a couple of times a day and I'm sure the tar intake isn't necessarily a good thing for my lungs, but at least it's not tobacco tar. I can't imagine inhaling smoke to be good but as long as your weed is clean, it's a simple inhalation of plant matter and none or very little chemicals.

imo, pesticide fruit and veg and cheap meat in multi chained supermarkets present more of a threat of cancer then clean weed.

Rented Mule

folan wrote: »

George Washington grew it on his plantation.

losthorizon wrote: »

He also had slaves.

He was also considered a terrorist and didn't want to pay his taxes. Sounds like someone who could have been considered a 'lowlife' in hindsight. No ?

cock robin

I_AmThe_Walrus wrote: »

I am not! Take that back!

The truth is that ALL propaganda, from THC making you loose your memory to being a gateway drug, everything, has been proven false. There are numerous reasons why it is illegal. Originally in the early 1900's it was because it was associated with other races, which is racist! Later in the Vietnam War, it was associated with peace and anti-war activists; therefore president Nixon promoted the, now failed, war on drugs. None of the reasons it is illegal make sense.

It was at one stage the most widely used crop in the world. Every part of the plant has a use and the plant itself is resilient to bugs and diseases that obliterate other crops. The oils were used for lighting, the seeds were used for animal feed, the fiber was used to make clothing and it makes one as happy as fcuk. An all rounder in oh so many ways. It eats carbon dioxide at levels far and above that which is used by other crops. So its good for the planet too. It's the bizz. Why it is illegal I dont know. Most people now grow their own and avoid the vast sums charged by crims. I have friends living in the Netherlands and from their experience of the system of legality in Holland it does not create any major social problems and use of the drug is actually below levels found in states where the stuff is banned which is odd. Holland by the way is not in a recession and has no banking crisis.

cock robin

Natalie Tender Bather wrote: »

It is illegal because it ruins peoples lives. People who have a spliff, even just one, will eventually end up on heroin and rob their own grandmother.

I have never heard such utter bull****e in all my life although I have robbed my granny or maybe it was someone elses, I dont know munch munch granny munch munch Zzz Zzz Zzz

cock robin

Natalie Tender Bather wrote: »

In case this was picked up wrong I was being sarcastic ; )

Fair enough.

desaparecidos

Only the weak and impressionable need to part take in drug taking.

Like tobacco and alcohol, no drug or mind altering substance has benefit.

mikom

desaparecidos wrote: »

Only the weak and impressionable need to part take in drug taking.

Like tobacco and alcohol, no drug or mind altering substance has benefit.

Drugs help with English composition, I hear

Catacomb

desaparecidos wrote: »

Only the weak and impressionable need to part take in drug taking.

Like tobacco and alcohol, no drug or mind altering substance has benefit.

What about morphine, codeine, oxycontin, marinol, Diazepam, barbiturates... basically the foundations of our whole western medical establishment are drugs, are you just going to ignore this fact? Many of them are mind altering as well.

Saying drugs have no benefits is disrespectful and ignorant to people with serious problems that are dependant on them for a livable and viable life. We should try an experiment whereby we let you live without health-care for the rest of your live. Sure maybe nothing serious will happen, but if it does you'll want western health-care instead of amputated limbs and the general butchering style health-care that many in the 3rd world have to still endure.

Furthermore even outside the area of direct medicinal purposes alcohol is used for disinfectant and cannabis use is great for many jobs that fall within the creative arts spectrum such as musicians or authors. Were creative "blocks" can be lifted.

But even just the enjoyment of using it should be cause enough to allow people to use it, in my opinion. It really shouldn't be any of your nor my morals that should govern somebody else within the sovereignty of their very own body. If you think it's immoral, just don't take drugs but there is no need to become a tyrant by imposing your own belief systems onto others.

Why don't you move to china if you love being a sheeple that's governed and controlled by some dictators morals?

ScumLord

desaparecidos wrote: »

Only the weak and impressionable need to part take in drug taking.

Like tobacco and alcohol, no drug or mind altering substance has benefit.

As long as you don't see art, science and technology as being beneficial.

bc dub

don't feed the trolls peoples

Laisurg

ScumLord wrote: »

Smoking cannabis can under no circumstances be considered healthy or medical.

Eating or vaporising cannabis is the only way someone can legitimately say they're using it for medical purposes. All the lung cancer arguments go out the window once you take smoking out of the picture.

Well in all honestly if you don't smoke cigerettes you wont contract lung cancer from cannabis simply because you don't smoke enough of it to contribute and there are even arguments that cannabis smoke can help the lungs, i'm not sure if this has been proven but i've never heard of anyone getting lung cancer from smoking weed.

Remember that all medications have side effects almost, find the statistics for how many people are killed by taking the right amount of prescribed drugs as they were told to by their doctors.

bc dub

here's a good doc on its history in america

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p6q2jolcEvA

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1z4D96AmTBs

ilovesleep

Definately needs to be legalized after this evening and all the IMF bad news. Would do the country the world of good.

desaparecidos

Catacomb wrote: »

What about morphine, codeine, oxycontin, marinol, Diazepam, barbiturates... basically the foundations of our whole western medical establishment are drugs, are you just going to ignore this fact? Many of them are mind altering as well.

Saying drugs have no benefits is disrespectful and ignorant to people with serious problems that are dependant on them for a livable and viable life. We should try an experiment whereby we let you live without health-care for the rest of your live. Sure maybe nothing serious will happen, but if it does you'll want western health-care instead of amputated limbs and the general butchering style health-care that many in the 3rd world have to still endure.

Furthermore even outside the area of direct medicinal purposes alcohol is used for disinfectant and cannabis use is great for many jobs that fall within the creative arts spectrum such as musicians or authors. Were creative "blocks" can be lifted.

But even just the enjoyment of using it should be cause enough to allow people to use it, in my opinion. It really shouldn't be any of your nor my morals that should govern somebody else within the sovereignty of their very own body. If you think it's immoral, just don't take drugs but there is no need to become a tyrant by imposing your own belief systems onto others.

Why don't you move to china if you love being a sheeple that's governed and controlled by some dictators morals?

Nobody's talking about valid medical drugs, what stupid argument.

What helps the creative arts is genuine talent in the first place. The concept that cannabis "expands your mind" or "opens your third eye" is a load of ****e.

The only reason people drink, smoke, use cannabis and other recreational drugs is to conform, to fit into a social grouping, to validate themselves. And you call me a "sheeple", HA!

It's interesting that boards allows open discussion on illegal substances, yet bans talk of topics like music, film and software piracy. Interesting indeed.

mikom

desaparecidos wrote: »

It's interesting that boards allows open discussion on illegal substances, yet bans talk of topics like music, film and software piracy. Interesting indeed.

Yep, maybe time you took a hint from that, Sean.

Catacomb

desaparecidos wrote: »

Nobody's talking about valid medical drugs, what stupid argument.

What helps the creative arts is genuine talent in the first place. The concept that cannabis "expands your mind" or "opens your third eye" is a load of ****e.

The only reason people drink, smoke, use cannabis and other recreational drugs is to conform, to fit into a social grouping, to validate themselves. And you call me a "sheeple", HA!

It's interesting that boards allows open discussion on illegal substances, yet bans talk of topics like music, film and software piracy. Interesting indeed.

Yes, you were talking about legit medicinal drugs --including marijuana who's active compounds are used in various medications-- when you clearly stated:

...no drug or mind altering substance has benefit

You said what you said. It's embedded within the bandwidth of the Internet right here.

Never did I mentioned that it quote: "expands the mind" or "opens a third eye". It's just a vain attempt of silly rhetoric. I do not adhere to esoteric teachings and associated Humbug like Hindu and Buddhist chakras. Trying to imply that I do will fail because I will give you the scientific explanation to why cannabis causes a sudden influx of creativity for the user without needless esoteric explanations.

It influences a phenomenon known as "semantic priming". this is simply put the subconscious connection we have between specific ideas, thoughts etc... for example when I say "milk" many people may think of a "cow" in a tangential thought process, depending on individual experiences and cultural influences the resulting word may vary.

The stimulation of the cannabinoid receptors due to the intake of cannabis and the resulting frame of mind causes "hyper-priming" to occur. this is where a person associates a word with a more abstract word and faster then under usual sober circumstances. Of course this whole process holds true for more then just words. A musician could get inspiration for a melody through hyper priming that wouldn't have come about ordinarily, the same can be said for the twist in a storyline that could help constitute the perfect ending.

There are in fact whole publications dealing with this matter and it's no coincidence that many within creative arts are being drawn to the drug the jazz musicians and surrounding culture in America during the early 1900's being a prime example.

What is your evidence that the majority of people only use it to validate themselves? because This sounds like something you saw on a coronation street or EastEnders episode. I'm sorry if I happen to burst your small deluded suburban bubble, but soap operas are not reality! It's fictional with fictional characters and fictional plots. Then further claiming it's the only reason just takes your ludicrous idea to a new distorted level that only creationism could Trump. The way you try to round of your sentance with that "HA!" at the end is also very depressing to see, are you even mature? maybe you've just been watching to much simpsons latly. I heard they're a bad influence on young children, seems to be true.

Do you also believe everyone who drinks coffee does so in order to join some exquisite gourmet coffee club where they can sip away with like-minded drug addicts? give me a break. Most people do it for the enjoyment, taste or simply a slight stimulant reaction. It's the same with other soft drugs, bar in some cases tobacco which is highly addictive in a physical manner.

I would agree that a minute amount of people who suffer from poor self esteem might be influenced by peer pressure to consume drugs, in a bid to desperately find false friends. But your vast and sweeping generalisations and stereotyping about the people who smoke or otherwise intake cannabis is lacking realism and earth-bound logic, there is in fact a total void of it.

So you're hinting this should get banned as well, a fan of censorship I see. Like I said why are you in this country, china is the ideal place for you. You're attitude is the reason why the boards are censoring topics like the ones you mentioned, and you're trying to add to the list? We would be organising book burnings next if people keep up this kind of view. Let the people bath in ignorance so they can feel the bliss seems to be the general moral of people these days, sad really.

Laisurg

desaparecidos wrote: »

Nobody's talking about valid medical drugs, what stupid argument.

What helps the creative arts is genuine talent in the first place. The concept that cannabis "expands your mind" or "opens your third eye" is a load of ****e.

The only reason people drink, smoke, use cannabis and other recreational drugs is to conform, to fit into a social grouping, to validate themselves. And you call me a "sheeple", HA!

It's interesting that boards allows open discussion on illegal substances, yet bans talk of topics like music, film and software piracy. Interesting indeed.

Yeah... some of the so called 'valid medical drugs' kill people you know.
However just because cannabis is not seen as having any use as a medicine in Ireland does not mean that it is not used as a medicine in other countries, it is used in canada and a few states in america medically, as you didn't know this it's obvious that you have done zero research into this subject and your post is most likely something you heard on the Joe Duffy phone show, i wont rant anymore about this as most people will pick up straight away from your post that you're just ignorant to the subject.

ScumLord

Laisurg wrote: »

Well in all honestly if you don't smoke cigerettes you wont contract lung cancer from cannabis simply because you don't smoke enough of it to contribute and there are even arguments that cannabis smoke can help the lungs, i'm not sure if this has been proven but i've never heard of anyone getting lung cancer from smoking weed.

Remember that all medications have side effects almost, find the statistics for how many people are killed by taking the right amount of prescribed drugs as they were told to by their doctors.

It's not cannabis smoke that's been shown to be beneficial to combating cancer it's cannabis itself that's beneficial. They've shown that cannabis causes a different reaction in the lungs than smoking tobacco it's not as bad but it's not really at it's most beneficial either. Anyone trying to promote the health benefits of cannabis must drop the idea of smoking it from their argument completely, it should be taken as a medical substance which means vapour or paste. It acts much more like a medicine when ingested as well, it's effects are long lasting and less intense.

desaparecidos

Catacomb wrote: »

Yes, you were talking about legit medicinal drugs --including marijuana who's active compounds are used in various medications-- when you clearly stated:



You said what you said. It's embedded within the bandwidth of the Internet right here.

Never did I mentioned that it quote: "expands the mind" or "opens a third eye". It's just a vain attempt of silly rhetoric. I do not adhere to esoteric teachings and associated Humbug like Hindu and Buddhist chakras. Trying to imply that I do will fail because I will give you the scientific explanation to why cannabis causes a sudden influx of creativity for the user without needless esoteric explanations.

It influences a phenomenon known as "semantic priming". this is simply put the subconscious connection we have between specific ideas, thoughts etc... for example when I say "milk" many people may think of a "cow" in a tangential thought process, depending on individual experiences and cultural influences the resulting word may vary.

The stimulation of the cannabinoid receptors due to the intake of cannabis and the resulting frame of mind causes "hyper-priming" to occur. this is where a person associates a word with a more abstract word and faster then under usual sober circumstances. Of course this whole process holds true for more then just words. A musician could get inspiration for a melody through hyper priming that wouldn't have come about ordinarily, the same can be said for the twist in a storyline that could help constitute the perfect ending.

There are in fact whole publications dealing with this matter and it's no coincidence that many within creative arts are being drawn to the drug the jazz musicians and surrounding culture in America during the early 1900's being a prime example.

What is your evidence that the majority of people only use it to validate themselves? because This sounds like something you saw on a coronation street or EastEnders episode. I'm sorry if I happen to burst your small deluded suburban bubble, but soap operas are not reality! It's fictional with fictional characters and fictional plots. Then further claiming it's the only reason just takes your ludicrous idea to a new distorted level that only creationism could Trump. The way you try to round of your sentance with that "HA!" at the end is also very depressing to see, are you even mature? maybe you've just been watching to much simpsons latly. I heard they're a bad influence on young children, seems to be true.

Do you also believe everyone who drinks coffee does so in order to join some exquisite gourmet coffee club where they can sip away with like-minded drug addicts? give me a break. Most people do it for the enjoyment, taste or simply a slight stimulant reaction. It's the same with other soft drugs, bar in some cases tobacco which is highly addictive in a physical manner.

I would agree that a minute amount of people who suffer from poor self esteem might be influenced by peer pressure to consume drugs, in a bid to desperately find false friends. But your vast and sweeping generalisations and stereotyping about the people who smoke or otherwise intake cannabis is lacking realism and earth-bound logic, there is in fact a total void of it.

So you're hinting this should get banned as well, a fan of censorship I see. Like I said why are you in this country, china is the ideal place for you. You're attitude is the reason why the boards are censoring topics like the ones you mentioned, and you're trying to add to the list? We would be organising book burnings next if people keep up this kind of view. Let the people bath in ignorance so they can feel the bliss seems to be the general moral of people these days, sad really.

Why are you so racist against China?

Leave the Chinese alone, man.

Catacomb

desaparecidos wrote: »

Why are you so racist against China?

Leave the Chinese alone, man.

So this is the part were you say "you're a racist" because you have nothing intelligent to say...

I'm not racist against Chinese? and ironically you yourself have just undersigned my former statement with such a primitive post. You are once again using bloated rhetoric, are being immature, using distorted logic and are living within sweet deluded ignorance. But I most give credit where it's due, namely the fact that not many people can display so much utter feces with such ease and causality.

Fist and foremost never did I portray hatred towards the Chinese people I am --on a side note, while debunking your absurd posts-- criticising the Chinese government, for it's treatment of Chinese people. In fact I'm showing solidarity with people from china who have to live under oppression unlike your attitude of "leave them be" you actually just want to keep them in appalling conditions so they can work in sweat shops producing your Nike shoes. Simply put in lay-mans terms Criticising a government is NOT the same as criticising it's people and can even in theoretical terms never constitute as racism because a government doesn't fall within the category of race.

Secondly, I'm only saying you should live with them and see and --more importantly-- feel what tyranny catalysed by ignorance, non-working logic and childish behaviour like yours is like. It's funny that you see a form of racism towards dictators by me comparing you to them? most people would be vice versa in this respect.

You have much to learn about the world little grasshopper. Whoops, I didn't mean to be racist to any grasshoppers out there they really shouldn't be compared with someone like you. :rolleyes:

desaparecidos

Catacomb wrote: »

So this is the part were you say "you're a racist" because you have nothing intelligent to say...

I'm not racist against Chinese? and ironically you yourself have just undersigned my former statement with such a primitive post. You are once again using bloated rhetoric, are being immature, using distorted logic and are living within sweet deluded ignorance. But I most give credit where it's due, namely the fact that not many people can display so much utter feces with such ease and causality.

Fist and foremost never did I portray hatred towards the Chinese people I am --on a side note, while debunking your absurd posts-- criticising the Chinese government, for it's treatment of Chinese people. In fact I'm showing solidarity with people from china who have to live under oppression unlike your attitude of "leave them be" you actually just want to keep them in appalling conditions so they can work in sweat shops producing your Nike shoes. Simply put in lay-mans terms Criticising a government is NOT the same as criticising it's people and can even in theoretical terms never constitute as racism because a government doesn't fall within the category of race.

Secondly, I'm only saying you should live with them and see and --more importantly-- feel what tyranny catalysed by ignorance, non-working logic and childish behaviour like yours is like. It's funny that you see a form of racism towards dictators by me comparing you to them? most people would be vice versa in this respect.

You have much to learn about the world little grasshopper. Whoops, I didn't mean to be racist to any grasshoppers out there they really shouldn't be compared with someone like you. :rolleyes:

You seem to go off on wild tangents which have nothing to do with anything that has been said here, and make wild assumption about me. I think you need to lay off the weed.

My main opposition to cannabis is the slack jawed, mumbling, dopey eyed "dude" character that all cannabis users play to conform to a pre-defined stereotype because they crave inclusion onto this social grouping.

Cannabis users may thing they above "sheeple" and the "normal" person, but they are just about as conformist as one could get.

BTW I wasn't hinting a few post back that discussion on drugs should be banned, I was merely pointing out the hypocrisy of boards to allow discussion of clearly illegal activities (drug taking) while banning talk of other illegal activities (e.g. music piracy).

I suspect some of the mods participate in drug taking, thus they don't view the topic as something which should be censored.

Kurtosis

Laisurg wrote: »

Well in all honestly if you don't smoke cigerettes you wont contract lung cancer from cannabis simply because you don't smoke enough of it to contribute and there are even arguments that cannabis smoke can help the lungs, i'm not sure if this has been proven but i've never heard of anyone getting lung cancer from smoking weed.

I'm sorry, but this really is not correct. Inhaling burning plant material is going to irritate and damage the lungs. Also, to address your claim that cannabis is not smoked frequently enough to cause cancer, it is smoked in a different manner to cigarettes - the smoke is inhaled deeper and held in the lungs for longer and the common lack of a filter and loose packing of the cannabis will lead to more harmful particles being inhaled.

Laisurg

Back to the subject anyway, what progress is cannabis legalization making in other countries now? I know that not to long ago Mary Harney put her size 17 foot down and said that she has no intention of using cannabis medically or even setting up trials in ireland for it or doing any studys on it, purely because shes an ignorant pig but that's a rant for another day.

Pace2008

desaparecidos wrote: »

My main opposition to cannabis is the slack jawed, mumbling, dopey eyed "dude" character that all cannabis users play to conform to a pre-defined stereotype because they crave inclusion onto this social grouping.

This is quite possibly the most retarded post I've seen this year. Seriously, what the **** are you on about? Do you actually know what cannabis is?