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Unmarried fathers rights, custody and visitation.

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  • Registered Users Posts: 2,738 ✭✭✭Klingon Hamlet


    Thaedydal wrote: »

    This is just heartbreaking :(:(:(:(


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 9,376 ✭✭✭metrovelvet


    I would be very careful before touting out those statistics that start at 4:10. First of all, a lot of what is behind those stats, like the ones pointing to kids coming from single parent homes becoming criminals and rapists. Where are those stats coming from? Are they criminals because they dont see their dads or because they come from ghettos where the fathers are in prison.

    As a single mother, I find that excerpt highly offensive. It's exactly the same as Ann Coulter coming out and telling people if they are a victim of a crime they can blame single mothers.

    I also deeply resent the attempt by that video to trap my son into a destiny of likely suicide or a rape conviction. I'm disgusted at that propegandist crap.


  • Registered Users Posts: 43,311 ✭✭✭✭K-9


    I would be very careful before touting out those statistics that start at 4:10. First of all, a lot of what is behind those stats, like the ones pointing to kids coming from single parent homes becoming criminals and rapists. Where are those stats coming from? Are they criminals because they dont see their dads or because they come from ghettos where the fathers are in prison.

    As a single mother, I find that excerpt highly offensive. It's exactly the same as Ann Coulter coming out and telling people if they are a victim of a crime they can blame single mothers.

    I also deeply resent the attempt by that video to trap my son into a destiny of likely suicide or a rape conviction. I'm disgusted at that propegandist crap.

    IMO, it is more down to poverty than being a single parent family.

    Mad Men's Don Draper : What you call love was invented by guys like me, to sell nylons.



  • Closed Accounts Posts: 9,376 ✭✭✭metrovelvet


    K-9 wrote: »
    IMO, it is more down to poverty than being a single parent family.

    We can all have opinions on it and it may or may not be down to poverty or a correlation between one income and crime and education but that piece of sentimentalised propaganda touts unsubstantiated, decontextualised statistics which try to tell me that my son is likely to turn out a suicide victim or a rapist.

    **** that. Those producers need a good kick up the ass and if I knew swedish I certainly would give them one.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 43,045 ✭✭✭✭Nevyn


    I tought it was well out together and the point which struck me the most was that while women can have the choice to stay at home or work with swedens wonderful childcare options, that men still don't have the same freedom.


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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 9,376 ✭✭✭metrovelvet


    Thaedydal wrote: »
    I tought it was well out together and the point which struck me the most was that while women can have the choice to stay at home or work with swedens wonderful childcare options, that men still don't have the same freedom.

    That is not what it was about. It was a sentimentalised, superficial, unexamining, piece on single fathers who don't feel they have enough access or custody and feel alienated by a legal system. Ok fine. Im sure that does happen. Im sure it also happens that there are justified reasons for this and sometimes unjustified.

    They then tout statistics which are dangerous, insulting and entrapping to children of single parent homes and have NOTHING whatsoever to do with women or men getting to stay at home. Seriously, even if one of the parents are working, the child still has TWO parents at home, so I don't buy that. It mentions nothing about working and childcare. It's all about custody and parental alienation [which btw feminists in the US are campaigning against because despite not being in the dsm iv, is being used by abusive husbands, successful in courts to demonize the mother and get custody] and the defeatest, fatalistic, tragic, destinies of a fatherless home which tries to convince me and the world, and the people on this board, that my son, like other kids of single parents, have a likelihood of become a rapist or a suicide victim.

    They can take a big wagon of meatballs and shove them up their asses.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 43,045 ✭✭✭✭Nevyn


    Y'know I didn't think we needed a single Dad's forum but I have to say having seen some of the belgerent posts which can barage a non custodial Dad who posts looking to raise awareness or for help/info/support from certain female posters, I think I may be changing my mind.


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,738 ✭✭✭Klingon Hamlet


    That is not what it was about. It was a sentimentalised, superficial, unexamining, piece on single fathers who don't feel they have enough access or custody and feel alienated by a legal system. Ok fine. Im sure that does happen. Im sure it also happens that there are justified reasons for this and sometimes unjustified.

    They then tout statistics which are dangerous, insulting and entrapping to children of single parent homes and have NOTHING whatsoever to do with women or men getting to stay at home. Seriously, even if one of the parents are working, the child still has TWO parents at home, so I don't buy that. It mentions nothing about working and childcare. It's all about custody and parental alienation [which btw feminists in the US are campaigning against because despite not being in the dsm iv, is being used by abusive husbands, successful in courts to demonize the mother and get custody] and the defeatest, fatalistic, tragic, destinies of a fatherless home which tries to convince me and the world, and the people on this board, that my son, like other kids of single parents, have a likelihood of become a rapist or a suicide victim.

    They can take a big wagon of meatballs and shove them up their asses.

    I'm going to contact the makers of the video, ask them for their sources. Meantime, rewatch the video. it clearly says that the criminals are in the majority from single parent families...not the other way round...it's not saying that single parent families breed criminals...it's just saying children from that background without a male role model may have an inclination towards an unruly life...which, when in the situation where a dad wants to be in the child's life but can't...is tragic for both father and child.

    You seem to have taken this video quite personally Metro.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 9,376 ✭✭✭metrovelvet


    Thaedydal wrote: »
    Y'know I didn't think we needed a single Dad's forum but I have to say having seen some of the belgerent posts which can barage a non custodial Dad who posts looking to raise awareness or for help/info/support from certain female posters, I think I may be changing my mind.

    Im complaining about something you posted, not what a single dad posted. If you have a single dad forum then be gender equal and have a single mom forum too, unless you follow this line of thinking which falls in line with the propeganda you posted:

    http://www.parentdish.com/2009/01/07/ann-coulter-blames-single-moms-for-rape-murder/


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 43,045 ✭✭✭✭Nevyn


    I'm going to contact the makers of the video, ask them for their sources. Meantime, rewatch the video. it clearly says that the criminals are in the majority from single parent families...not the other way round...it's not saying that single parent families breed criminals...it's just saying children from that background without a male role model may have an inclination towards an unruly life...which, when in the situation where a dad wants to be in the child's life but can't...is tragic for both father and child.

    You seem to have taken this video quite personally Metro.

    When I think about the kids which cause trouble in the local secondary school, who are known to the police, who have the JLO visit them, those who are rude, disrespectful and obnoxious on the street most of them do not have their father in their lives. There are some that have both parents at home and clearly the parents don't care but the most wild don't have their fathers in their lives.

    Yes there are well behaved, well mannered children who are being raised by mother's on their own but like I said when I think about those who are the local tearaways the majority don't have their Dad in their lives or any positive adult male role model.


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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 9,376 ✭✭✭metrovelvet


    I'm going to contact the makers of the video, ask them for their sources. Meantime, rewatch the video. it clearly says that the criminals are in the majority from single parent families...not the other way round...it's not saying that single parent families breed criminals...it's just saying children from that background without a male role model may have an inclination towards an unruly life...which, when in the situation where a dad wants to be in the child's life but can't...is tragic for both father and child.

    You seem to have taken this video quite personally Metro.

    Good idea to find out where their statistics are from. I've done a fair bit of research myself on this and in the case of criminality a lot of the stats are drawn from the ghetto [at least in the American context]where the fathers are in prison themselves. Obviously in these areas and neighborhoods masculinity takes on a whole different significance and crime is a way of life.

    Yes I do take it personally because I am raising a child by myself and I do not want these paradigms imposed on me by Swedish propagandists.


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,738 ✭✭✭Klingon Hamlet


    Im complaining about something you posted, not what a single dad posted. If you have a single dad forum then be gender equal and have a single mom forum too, unless you follow this line of thinking which falls in line with the propeganda you posted:

    http://www.parentdish.com/2009/01/07/ann-coulter-blames-single-moms-for-rape-murder/

    Coulter is a conservative hack. And you're missing the point. It's not the mothers' fault if their children grow up and choose a life of crime.

    But it is the mothers' fault if they deliberately block access to a father.

    Just as much as it would be the father's fault (assuming he's the stay at home parent) for blocking a mother's access.

    However the second scenario is rare. In most cases the mother is the primary caregiver.

    Metro this video does not blame good mothers. So I don't see where you're coming from at all.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 9,376 ✭✭✭metrovelvet


    Thaedydal wrote: »
    When I think about the kids which cause trouble in the local secondary school, who are known to the police, who have the JLO visit them, those who are rude, disrespectful and obnoxious on the street most of them do not have their father in their lives. There are some that have both parents at home and clearly the parents don't care but the most wild don't have their fathers in their lives.

    Yes there are well behaved, well mannered children who are being raised by mother's on their own but like I said when I think about those who are the local tearaways the majority don't have their Dad in their lives or any positive adult male role model.

    The fathers in the video you posted were clearly present in their kids lives. These were not absent fathers. So why are they promoting these statistics about fatherless kids?

    As for the kids you knew who were unruly and wild, why wouldn't they be? They are walking around with a hole in their heart and a one parent doing two parents' jobs.

    I believe role models are crucial. I have taken care to try to compensate for this by making a point of pointing out good deeds that men do to my son. I do it everyday as much as I can. It's the only thing I can think of to do.

    Unruly and wild is a far cry from being a rapist or a suicide victim.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 9,376 ✭✭✭metrovelvet


    Some interesting news about Sweden to contextualise the clip:

    http://www.vdare.com/sailer/scandinavia.htm

    he heavyweight historian David Gress, author of the vastly learned 1998 book, From Plato to NATO: the Idea of the West and Its Opponents. His message explains the Scandinavian system better than anything I've ever read. He concentrates on the crucial question of the economics of having a family.

    - "Looking at welfare payments is too narrow. You have to go back to the late 1960s, when all Nordic countries introduced individual taxation and abolished any financial advantage of marriage. The principle of individual taxation is both individualist and collectivist. It's individualist because it assumes that each taxpayer is solely responsible for him or herself. Thus, it explicitly denies and delegitimates the role of breadwinner. In the new, individualist dispensation, a woman must not depend on a man for her support. It's collectivist, however, because it rests on a vast public sector offering employment to the many women who used to be dependent housewives. These women, who by now are grandmothers, traded their status of dependent on a husband to that of dependent on government…

    - "Individual taxation increased the cost of being a breadwinner by jacking high earning males into impossible brackets. Given the Nordic taxation burden, it is anyway impossible for the vast majority of people, using honest methods, to become high earning by U.S. standards. So, everyone, male and female, has jobs paying much the same (Denmark has the lowest Gini coefficient, i.e. highest equality, of any labor market in the world)…the absolute requirement is that both partners work full time (i.e., today, 37 hours).

    - “This makes women feel self-reliant, and, thanks to extensive day care, does not depress the birth rate as disastrously as it's fallen in Spain and Italy. However, it has dropped below replacement, and no one yet knows the long-term effects of having 90 per cent of young children in day care, as has been the case in Denmark since the mid-1980s.

    - "Single motherhood is economically attractive in Scandinavia, as it is not here. Evidence confirms the common assumption that separation is a recipe for disaster for most women in the U.S. In Scandinavia, they maintain their incomes, thanks to their government-sector jobs, child support, and, if income is low, housing subsidies. One may say, therefore, that Nordic women in many cases divorce or leave their husbands/boyfriends and marry the state instead.

    - "Therefore, though Scandinavians may be traditionally and genetically better equipped to resist the corrosive effect of statism than Africans, they are beginning to show many of the same traits. For example: children, especially boys, raised by single mothers, even where the father is around, suffer more pathologies than others…

    - "Given these incentives it's remarkable that any Nordics marry at all and stay married, just as it's remarkable, given a tax burden of over 60 per cent, that anyone bothers to work at all. One reason is no doubt the residual Lutheran work and family ethic. But how long will that last?"


  • Registered Users Posts: 43,311 ✭✭✭✭K-9


    Thaedydal wrote: »
    Y'know I didn't think we needed a single Dad's forum but I have to say having seen some of the belgerent posts which can barage a non custodial Dad who posts looking to raise awareness or for help/info/support from certain female posters, I think I may be changing my mind.

    There seems to have been a few threads recently that have been hijacked al right. These are Fathers just looking for advice and options, more personal problem type situations, yet they get turned into debates that go way of topic.

    Mad Men's Don Draper : What you call love was invented by guys like me, to sell nylons.



  • Registered Users Posts: 43,311 ✭✭✭✭K-9


    Some interesting news about Sweden to contextualise the clip:

    http://www.vdare.com/sailer/scandinavia.htm

    he heavyweight historian David Gress, author of the vastly learned 1998 book, From Plato to NATO: the Idea of the West and Its Opponents. His message explains the Scandinavian system better than anything I've ever read. He concentrates on the crucial question of the economics of having a family.

    - "Looking at welfare payments is too narrow. You have to go back to the late 1960s, when all Nordic countries introduced individual taxation and abolished any financial advantage of marriage. The principle of individual taxation is both individualist and collectivist. It's individualist because it assumes that each taxpayer is solely responsible for him or herself. Thus, it explicitly denies and delegitimates the role of breadwinner. In the new, individualist dispensation, a woman must not depend on a man for her support. It's collectivist, however, because it rests on a vast public sector offering employment to the many women who used to be dependent housewives. These women, who by now are grandmothers, traded their status of dependent on a husband to that of dependent on government…

    - "Individual taxation increased the cost of being a breadwinner by jacking high earning males into impossible brackets. Given the Nordic taxation burden, it is anyway impossible for the vast majority of people, using honest methods, to become high earning by U.S. standards. So, everyone, male and female, has jobs paying much the same (Denmark has the lowest Gini coefficient, i.e. highest equality, of any labor market in the world)…the absolute requirement is that both partners work full time (i.e., today, 37 hours).

    - “This makes women feel self-reliant, and, thanks to extensive day care, does not depress the birth rate as disastrously as it's fallen in Spain and Italy. However, it has dropped below replacement, and no one yet knows the long-term effects of having 90 per cent of young children in day care, as has been the case in Denmark since the mid-1980s.

    - "Single motherhood is economically attractive in Scandinavia, as it is not here. Evidence confirms the common assumption that separation is a recipe for disaster for most women in the U.S. In Scandinavia, they maintain their incomes, thanks to their government-sector jobs, child support, and, if income is low, housing subsidies. One may say, therefore, that Nordic women in many cases divorce or leave their husbands/boyfriends and marry the state instead.

    - "Therefore, though Scandinavians may be traditionally and genetically better equipped to resist the corrosive effect of statism than Africans, they are beginning to show many of the same traits. For example: children, especially boys, raised by single mothers, even where the father is around, suffer more pathologies than others…

    - "Given these incentives it's remarkable that any Nordics marry at all and stay married, just as it's remarkable, given a tax burden of over 60 per cent, that anyone bothers to work at all. One reason is no doubt the residual Lutheran work and family ethic. But how long will that last?"

    Wonder are there statistics comparing the US and Sweden on single parents and divorce rates?

    That seems a partly politically biased piece to me.

    Mad Men's Don Draper : What you call love was invented by guys like me, to sell nylons.



  • Closed Accounts Posts: 9,376 ✭✭✭metrovelvet


    I dont know. I was trying to look for more but I failed.

    Swedish crime rates are high - up there with the US. But I couldn't link any further comparisons with single parenthood and crime to correlate between the two countries. I understand the US state of play on all of this a lot better than I do the Swedes.

    It used to be highly stigmatised to abandon a child in the Black communities. Now no one gives a ****. But at the same time the feminists have been shouting for thirty years how we dont need men, so there ya go. You get what you pray for.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 9,376 ✭✭✭metrovelvet


    K-9 wrote: »
    There seems to have been a few threads recently that have been hijacked al right. These are Fathers just looking for advice and options, more personal problem type situations, yet they get turned into debates that go way of topic.

    True. But just to point out, this thread wasnt one of them. If you look at the OP is a political/legal post.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 43,045 ✭✭✭✭Nevyn


    metrovelvet this thread is about raising awareness of the lack of rights unmarried fathers have and the difficulty fathers both married and unmarried can face when trying to get access to thier children.

    If you want to tear that clip apart you can do so in humanties.


  • Registered Users Posts: 43,311 ✭✭✭✭K-9


    I dont know. I was trying to look for more but I failed.

    Swedish crime rates are high - up there with the US. But I couldn't link any further comparisons with single parenthood and crime to correlate between the two countries. I understand the US state of play on all of this a lot better than I do the Swedes.

    It used to be highly stigmatised to abandon a child in the Black communities. Now no one gives a ****. But at the same time the feminists have been shouting for thirty years how we dont need men, so there ya go. You get what you pray for.

    Sweden also has excellent parental leave and more and more fathers are availing of it, which I'd imagine is a good thing.

    Mad Men's Don Draper : What you call love was invented by guys like me, to sell nylons.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 2,738 ✭✭✭Klingon Hamlet


    Article here:
    Fathers have no rights in relation to their children because the law has not kept up with the modern Irish family, campaigners say.

    Charity Families, Fathers and Friends have demanded an overhaul of legislation to make the registration of fathers' names on birth certificates compulsory.

    The organisation has also called for fathers to be made automatic guardians of their children from birth, as part of its proposed charter for family law.

    Sam Butt, lead counsellor with Families, Fathers and Friends, said the law needed to be changed to ensure protection for fathers and families.

    "The stark reality is that fathers, married or unmarried, have no rights under the Constitution or in legislation," he said.

    "Such rights can only be acquired through the consent of the mother or marriage to the mother of their children.

    "Recognition of fathers' rights is not the only neglected aspect of family law.

    "The system in itself is outdated, dysfunctional and fails in the services it was set up to provide."

    The campaigners are also calling for fathers' rights to be enshrined in the Constitution and transparency of family court proceedings through a relaxation of privacy rules for hearings.

    Equality minister Mary White said she was awaiting the publication of a Law Reform Commission report on the legal aspects of family relationships in the coming months and vowed to review legislation on guardianship, custody and access.

    Mr Butt neglected to mention the third option: court battles. But doubtless anyone reading this is aware of that option.

    This article really just repeats a lot of what has gone before. I just wanted to remind anyone who might've lost a bit of hope that things will get better for daddies. We can get our rights put in place with the help of the courts, but hopefully eventually we will be automatically seen as equal parents in the eyes of the State. Until then, keep the faith:)


  • Registered Users Posts: 6,124 ✭✭✭wolfpawnat


    Was reading a lot over the last few days with regards to Battered husbands (due to the recent Fair City storyline) I was delighted to see that the court awarded full custody to the dad, but only after a long and humiliating battle for the father.

    I am so glad I am the mom, because trying to be a dad these days makes labour look painless!


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,738 ✭✭✭Klingon Hamlet


    Article here
    Minister of State with responsibility for Equality, Mary White, T.D. today visited the Families, Fathers and Friends office, Galway, which provides counselling and various supports for men dealing with situations such as family breakdown and domestic violence.

    Commenting on her visit to the Centre, where she met with lead counsellor Sam Butt and volunteers as well as clients of the office, Minister White said:

    “My visit to the Families, Fathers and Friends centre today was insightful, and provided a valuable perspective on the lives of men who have been affected by domestic violence, family breakdowns and difficulties with access to their children.

    "In recent months I have been struck by the stories of many men who have experienced inequality of access to their children due to situations such as marital breakdown.

    "I commend Sam Butt and all the volunteers at Families, Fathers and Friends for their tireless work and dedication to helping these men, whether it is counselling, listening, information, support or legal advice.”

    Minister White concluded:

    “As Minister for Equality, my vision is one of equality between the sexes in the eyes of the law.

    "Nobody has a monopoly on the right to equal treatment, be they parents in terms of access to their children, or children in terms of access to their parents.

    "I look forward to the publication of the Law Reform Commission’s report on the legal aspects of family relationships later this year, and to working with my Government colleagues on reviewing the law concerning custody, guardianship and access, as promised by the Government in the Renewed Programme for Government last year.”


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 43,045 ✭✭✭✭Nevyn


    From here on out the next person who wades in here dragging the thread off topic will be banned. There is good reason for this thread to exists and it is a helpful resource and I will not have it descend into rabble rousing and knee jerk reactions.


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,738 ✭✭✭Klingon Hamlet


    Article here
    Issued: 16 November 2010

    Statement by Mary White

    Spokesperson on Enterprise, Trade and Employment; Arts and Tourism; Community and Rural Affairs; Women’s Affairs

    Minister of state with responsibility for Equality, Integration and Human Rights.


    Green Party Minister of State for Integration, Equality and Human Rights Mary White has lent her support to a charity's call for better rights for dads. Attending a launch in Dublin this morning, she said:

    “I want to pay tribute today to the work done by Families, Fathers and Friends for fathers throughout the country who are seeking to participate fully in the lives of their children. When we hear the voices of these Dads we hear the absent voices of their children. Families, Fathers and Friends has highlighted many important issues of family law which need to be addressed.

    "The Government is committed to reviewing legislation in the areas of guardianship, custody and access. Today’s press conference is an important opportunity for these issues to be highlighted in advance of the Law Reform Commission’s report. In its work programme for 2008-2014 the Commission stated that one of the indicators of the success of its work is raising community awareness of a particular issue. Its consultation paper, published last year, and events like today have helped raise awareness. As Minister for Equality I look forward to working with the Minister for Justice on this area when the report is published.”

    Families, Fathers and Friends today launched its ‘Charter for Family Law’ and said many fathers would not have access to their children this Christmas, due to failures in Irish law.

    Sam Butt, Lead Counsellor at Families, Fathers and Friends said:

    “Christmas can be a particularly sad time for families who are separated. Every year we see hundreds of fathers who will not have access to their children over the holiday period. It is also the worst time for fathers who are routinely denied access to their children even where there are court orders in place. Irish Family Law has not caught up with the needs of the modern family. Our Charter sets out areas where the law can be changed to ensure protection for fathers and their families.”

    Among the proposed changes, Families, Fathers and Friends have called for:

    • Fathers to have automatic guardianship of their child from the birth of the child
    • The enactment of fathers’ rights to be enshrined in the Constitution
    • The Registration of fathers’ names on the birth certificates of their child
    • Transparency of family court proceedings through relaxation of In Camera rule
    • Recognition of prenuptial agreements

    “The stark reality is that fathers, married or unmarried, have no rights under the Constitution or in legislation. Such rights can only be acquired through the consent of the mother or marriage to the mother of their children,” said Mr Butt. “Recognition of fathers’ rights is not the only neglected aspect of family law. The system in itself is outdated, dysfunctional and fails in the services it was set up to provide.”

    The Law Reform Commission published its consultation paper in September 2009 and a Report on the Legal Aspects of Family Relationships is expected in the coming months.

    Families, Fathers and Friends provides a high quality professional service, by men for men, focused on mental health, matters of family law and communication skills. Currently based in Galway, two new offices are expected to open in Dublin and Carlow next year. The Charity is conducting expansive research on matters related to family law, its effects on the mental well being of men and fathers and the knock-on effect on the children who become emotionally and psychologically disenfranchised. For more information see www.fathers.ie


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,738 ✭✭✭Klingon Hamlet


    Article here
    By Noel Baker

    Wednesday, November 17, 2010

    A NEW fathers support group yesterday said current "shambolic" laws needed to be changed to grant "decent dads" greater access to their children.

    Some estranged fathers may consider suicide this Christmas as they will not be able to see their children, a new campaign group warned yesterday, calling for changes in the law to allow better supports for "decent dads".

    Families, Friends and Fathers lead counsellor Sam Butt said last Christmas Day he was inundated with calls from other counsellors around the country, referring cases involving depressed fathers.

    In its charter published yesterday, Families, Fathers and Friends called for:

    • Fathers to have the right to automatic guardianship of their child from birth. The registration of fathers’ names on their child’s birth certificate.
    • Pre-nuptial agreements to be recognised in law.
    • A relaxation of the in camera rule to allow greater transparency in family court proceedings.
    • Dedicated family law courts and the implementation of the Law Reform Commission’s Consultation paper on Family Law.

    The group also said false accusations — including perjury — needed to be dealt with firmly in court, with those making the allegations held accountable.

    Last Christmas he said he spent hours dealing with calls from around the country, as many fathers became depressed as they were unable to see their children.

    "We have separated dads, decent guys, who will not make it past Christmas," he said, adding that people needed to seek help to ensure they got over the challenges at this time of year.

    Solicitor Ann Heneghan said another area of law which needed to be reviewed was that where grandparents had to apply twice — through applying to court for leave to apply to court — to see their grandchildren in some cases.

    Minister for Equality Mary White said she found the slow passage of legislation through the Oireachtas "depressing" but stressed her commitment to change in the law and added that she hoped a date would soon be announced for a referendum on children’s rights.

    * www.fathers.ie

    This story appeared in the printed version of the Irish Examiner Wednesday, November 17, 2010


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 19,777 ✭✭✭✭The Corinthian


    While I commend you for your enthusiasm, it's been repeatedly pointed out that outside of vague soundbites, there is little in terms of concrete policy from the minister, who has repeatedly sidestepped questions on the subject, who has cited the unfinished Law Reform Commission’s Consultation paper on family law as the reason for the ambiguity.

    Additionally, this is the same Law Reform Commission’s Consultation paper on Family Law that has been pointed out as having recommendations that actually worsen the situation for fathers, rather than improve it.

    All of which is moot now anyway, because she won't get to implement anything. By the time anything gets to the Dail, the minister in charge is almost certainly not going to be the present one.

    Indeed, it could well end up being Ivana Bacik. And what are the chances of fathers getting a better deal with her at the helm?


  • Registered Users Posts: 166,026 ✭✭✭✭LegacyUser


    This thread is a great source of info everyone, well done!

    Could somebody tell me what is likely to happen if:

    a) a mother repeatedly does not turn up for court proceedings for an access order ( I assume a bench warrant)

    b)if the mother fails to comply with an access order

    the help is much appreciated folks.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 19,777 ✭✭✭✭The Corinthian


    C_urious wrote: »
    Could somebody tell me what is likely to happen if:

    a) a mother repeatedly does not turn up for court proceedings for an access order ( I assume a bench warrant)

    b)if the mother fails to comply with an access order
    Nothing will happen, to the best of my knowledge.

    More correctly, a judge will likely treat such behaviour in a dark light and may rule against the mother in some manner or other, or may simply give her a dressing down in court, but a bench warrant will not be issued. I think there has only ever been one case of a bench warrant being issued for a mother in Ireland.


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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 9,376 ✭✭✭metrovelvet


    C_urious wrote: »
    This thread is a great source of info everyone, well done!

    Could somebody tell me what is likely to happen if:

    a) a mother repeatedly does not turn up for court proceedings for an access order ( I assume a bench warrant)

    b)if the mother fails to comply with an access order

    the help is much appreciated folks.

    Its very hard to say without accurate statistics and access to the cases.

    Courts offer solutions, they dont solve problems so if they arrest the custodial parent then they have created a whole set of other circumstances for the child which they cant provide a solution for. That is the problem with family court.


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