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Sfdebris rips "Star Trek: Generations" to shreds

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  • 01-08-2010 12:58pm
    #1
    Amtmann
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,093 ✭✭✭


    In what is probably the definitive review of TNG's first big screen outing, Chuck Sonnenburg, AKA Youtube's Sfdebris, castigates every aspect of the film in a masterfully produced 37-minute video review.

    Enjoy!







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    #2
    nyarlothothep
    Registered Users Posts: 5,177 ✭✭✭nyarlothothep


    ah saw these yesterday, every point made is spot on, although I found the whole death of picards family and his one minute breakdown que Im alright again because there is a big planetoid thing on the viewscreen worthy of a more extended criticism. The uniforms point was really well made, its pretty ridiculous that they keep changing.


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    #3
    Jim
    Registered Users Posts: 14,181 ✭✭✭✭Jim


    Similar review, ripping into the little (and some big) things in the film. More comedy based.
    Pretty sure everyone has seen this at this stage, but for those who haven't...

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h06WKYFYdlo

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=azSh47-oRPI

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zqb9q3c1Pxo


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    #4
    Cookie_Monster
    Registered Users Posts: 24,493 ✭✭✭✭Cookie_Monster


    Pretentious American, talking mostly ****e


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    #5
    Myrddin
    Closed Accounts Posts: 33,733 ✭✭✭✭Myrddin


    Furet wrote: »
    In what is probably the definitive review of TNG's first big screen outing, Chuck Sonnenburg, AKA Youtube's Sfdebris, castigates every aspect of the film in a masterfully produced 37-minute video review.

    Enjoy!








    Stopped the first one @ 4:44. How anyone finds that idiot funny beggars belief. If he wants to practice being a comedian, it won't be on my time. I was actually really interested in seeing someone picking the film apart, but that false American "humour" is just painful.


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    #6
    Amtmann
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,093 ✭✭✭Amtmann


    EnterNow wrote: »
    Stopped the first one @ 4:44. How anyone finds that idiot funny beggars belief. If he wants to practice being a comedian, it won't be on my time. I was actually really interested in seeing someone picking the film apart, but that false American "humour" is just painful.

    You really stopped too soon. I suggest you grin and bear the humour, because if you really want to see the film picked apart, he does just that. Seriously.


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    #7
    Myrddin
    Closed Accounts Posts: 33,733 ✭✭✭✭Myrddin


    Furet wrote: »
    You really stopped too soon. I suggest you grin and bear the humour, because if you really want to see the film picked apart, he does just that. Seriously.

    Ok ok you've convinced me, I'll give it another roll :D Not just yet though


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    #8
    Cookie_Monster
    Registered Users Posts: 24,493 ✭✭✭✭Cookie_Monster


    EnterNow wrote: »
    Ok ok you've convinced me, I'll give it another roll :D Not just yet though

    don't bother its crap and full of badly made points about the most minor of things


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    #9
    Amtmann
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,093 ✭✭✭Amtmann


    Cookie_Monster wrote: »
    don't bother its crap and full of badly made points about the most minor of things

    Ah come one now Cookie_Monster! Why is it crap? Sfdebris at least explained for 37 minutes why he thinks Generations is rubbish. I agreed with him (though I didn't need to be persuaded). Do you actually think it was good?


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    #10
    Cookie_Monster
    Registered Users Posts: 24,493 ✭✭✭✭Cookie_Monster


    Furet wrote: »
    Ah come one now Cookie_Monster! Why is it crap? Sfdebris at least explained for 37 minutes why he thinks Generations is rubbish. I agreed with him (though I didn't need to be persuaded). Do you actually think it was good?

    I liked it, best after 6 and 2 IMO.

    Many of his arguements were pointless, I mean who cares about the uniforms, it happened before during the change over from TNG season 1 to 2 and in my mind was good. I like the red tops better. Some points are perfectly valid too though.


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    #11
    Amtmann
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,093 ✭✭✭Amtmann


    Cookie_Monster wrote: »
    Some points are perfectly valid too though.

    Such as Kirk being an extra?
    Such as Lursa and Betor being pointless?
    Such as the destruction of the Fed Flagship, the Enterprise D, at the hands of a rickety old BoP?
    Such as the Enterprise technobabbling rather than shooting its way to a Pyrrhic victory?
    Such as Data's annoyingness?
    Such as the the whole-"going back to the mountaintop to stop Soran" decision?
    Such as the way in which the death of Kirk was dealt with?

    These were his main points, and I always thought they were very valid. In my view he makes them very well indeed.

    The uniforms didn't bother me, but if it turned out that the reason they couldn't be standard throughout the whole movie was because they blew a chunk of the budget on a wooden ship and ornate 18th-century naval attire that would only appear for ten minutes in what was a pretty pointless scene, then that just shows up poor decision-making on the part of the producers, and deserves to be mercilessly pointed out.


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    #12
    Cookie_Monster
    Registered Users Posts: 24,493 ✭✭✭✭Cookie_Monster


    Furet wrote: »
    Such as Kirk being an extra?
    Such as Lursa and Betor being pointless?
    Such as the destruction of the Fed Flagship, the Enterprise D, at the hands of a rickety old BoP?
    Such as the Enterprise technobabbling rather than shooting its way to a Pyrrhic victory?
    Such as Data's annoyingness?
    Such as the the whole-"going back to the mountaintop to stop Soran" decision?
    Such as the way in which the death of Kirk was dealt with?
    Except he's not really, kinda central to the whole thing
    Several disruptor blasts directly to the engineering sector with no shields seem reasonable to me.
    I'll givve you that one, a spread of 10 photons would have been easily do-able and done the job.
    He's not annoying, its interesting to see how he struggles with emotions.
    To have the minimum impact of the timeline thats already happened.
    I didn't get as far ass that bit so don't know what he said, but what exactly wass wrong with it? I presume the whole idea is for Picard to say nothing about it so as not to damage the time line or provoke interest in the time-travel abilities of the Nexus


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    #13
    nyarlothothep
    Registered Users Posts: 5,177 ✭✭✭nyarlothothep


    I think debris is one of the best reviewers on the web, certainly not pretentious american bs imo, I don't really see how his humour is specifically american. For that I would go to the nostalgia critic. But debris' reviews are generally intelligent and well thought out, many of his attacks on generations are justifiable in the context of maintaining the believabilty of the fictional universe (a point he makes in a voyager review iirc) and are otherwise just for fun. Randomly changing uniforms for instance does make the proceedings look a little ridiculous, not a major criticism but something which should have been ironed out nonethelesss.


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    #14
    Myrddin
    Closed Accounts Posts: 33,733 ✭✭✭✭Myrddin


    nyarlothothep wrote: »
    I think debris is one of the best reviewers on the web, certainly not pretentious american bs imo, I don't really see how his humour is specifically american. For that I would go to the nostalgia critic. But debris' reviews are generally intelligent and well thought out, many of his attacks on generations are justifiable in the context of maintaining the believabilty of the fictional universe (a point he makes in a voyager review iirc) and are otherwise just for fun. Randomly changing uniforms for instance does make the proceedings look a little ridiculous, not a major criticism but something which should have been ironed out nonethelesss.

    He is a very typical American reviewer, weak humour, bad puns, singing, the list goes on. Not worth the bandwidth tbh.


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    #15
    TheIrishGrover
    Registered Users Posts: 6,037 ✭✭✭TheIrishGrover


    Generations is crap? When's he doing his 2 hour documentary on how water is wet?


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    #16
    nyarlothothep
    Registered Users Posts: 5,177 ✭✭✭nyarlothothep


    EnterNow wrote: »
    He is a very typical American reviewer, weak humour, bad puns, singing, the list goes on. Not worth the bandwidth tbh.

    Puns are very English too, weak humour is universal, singing can feature in any type of comedy, I don't see how these attributes are inherently american. If you were to say The Big Bang theory or Friends is american humour then I would agree.


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    #17
    Myrddin
    Closed Accounts Posts: 33,733 ✭✭✭✭Myrddin


    nyarlothothep wrote: »
    I don't see how these attributes are inherently american

    They are if the review is supposed to be taken seriously.


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    #18
    nyarlothothep
    Registered Users Posts: 5,177 ✭✭✭nyarlothothep


    EnterNow wrote: »
    They are if the review is supposed to be taken seriously.

    What do you mean by that? If the review is to be taken seriously therefore its components, puns et al consequently render it american? I don't see how one follows from the other.


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    #19
    Myrddin
    Closed Accounts Posts: 33,733 ✭✭✭✭Myrddin


    nyarlothothep wrote: »
    What do you mean by that? If the review is to be taken seriously therefore its components, puns et al consequently render it american? I don't see how one follows from the other.

    Basically it means I dont find his American humour funny. How is it American humour? Well.....he's an American isn't he? Even most serious American reviews on this level incorporate some form of general stupidity I find.

    Puns english too - correct.
    Weak humour universal - correct.
    Singing in every comedy - correct, but I wasn't watching to be made laugh - I watched with general curiosity about filming/directorial criticism. If I wanted humour I'd still probably have steered clear of the review.

    All in all no harm done, I can appreciate some find him witty/amusing. I just think he's a gimp.


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    #20
    Amtmann
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,093 ✭✭✭Amtmann


    EnterNow wrote: »
    All in all no harm done, I can appreciate some find him witty/amusing. I just think he's a gimp.

    Not intending to be disrespectful to you at all, but I do wonder if some of the ire directed toward him in general is mainly the result of fanboys having their feelings hurt by him pointing out that much of Star Trek is just badly conceived, poorly written bilge, happily swallowed by people obsessed with such irrelevancies as the maximum speed of this or that type of ship, etc.

    If someone doesn't like his humour then that's another matter entirely of course.


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    #21
    Myrddin
    Closed Accounts Posts: 33,733 ✭✭✭✭Myrddin


    Furet wrote: »
    Not intending to be disrespectful to you at all, but I do wonder if some of the ire directed toward him in general is mainly the result of fanboys having their feelings hurt by him pointing out that much of Star Trek is just badly conceived, poorly written bilge, happily swallowed by people obsessed with such irrelevancies as the maximum speed of this or that type of ship, etc.

    If someone doesn't like his humour then that's another matter entirely of course.

    Quite possible, in fact, probable in a lot of cases. Not in this one however:
    EnterNow wrote: »
    Stopped the first one @ 4:44. How anyone finds that idiot funny beggars belief. If he wants to practice being a comedian, it won't be on my time. I was actually really interested in seeing someone picking the film apart, but that false American "humour" is just painful.

    Regards the humour, that's what made me not watch it. I didn't even make it to his critical points. Pity really. Anyone know of a serious tear down of the film, preferably with no songs?


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    #22
    nyarlothothep
    Registered Users Posts: 5,177 ✭✭✭nyarlothothep


    EnterNow wrote: »
    Basically it means I dont find his American humour funny. How is it American humour? Well.....he's an American isn't he? Even most serious American reviews on this level incorporate some form of general stupidity I find.

    Puns english too - correct.
    Weak humour universal - correct.
    Singing in every comedy - correct, but I wasn't watching to be made laugh - I watched with general curiosity about filming/directorial criticism. If I wanted humour I'd still probably have steered clear of the review.

    All in all no harm done, I can appreciate some find him witty/amusing. I just think he's a gimp.

    Just because hes american doesn't make his humour american. I'm open to the possibility that this type of reviewing style is american so I may investigate other american reviews of sci fi episodes/films on the net. There is nothing wrong in mixing in humour in reviews, it can add to it, there is the idea that comedy is form of social critique. However I don't find his reviews to be stupid at all, quite the reverse in fact, he makes excellent points on the one dimensionality of Voyager with respect to a divergence of opinions baesd on issues and how this is reflected in Janeways authoritarianism.


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    #23
    Fremen
    Registered Users Posts: 2,481 ✭✭✭Fremen


    EnterNow wrote: »
    Regards the humour, that's what made me not watch it. I didn't even make it to his critical points. Pity really. Anyone know of a serious tear down of the film, preferably with no songs?

    The review in Jim's post on the previous page does a great job. He's covered most of the recent star trek movies.
    He has some crummy humour too- at the end of each ten minute clip, the camera pans out to the reviewer's basement and he makes some jokes under a serial-killer persona. Awful, unfunny stuff, but it happens at predictable intervals so can easily be skipped. It's a fantastic review other than that.


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    #24
    Myrddin
    Closed Accounts Posts: 33,733 ✭✭✭✭Myrddin


    nyarlothothep wrote: »
    There is nothing wrong in mixing in humour in reviews

    Oh I agree, I guess it just falls down to how one might define humour.


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    #25
    Sir Digby Chicken Caesar
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 23,556 ✭✭✭✭Sir Digby Chicken Caesar


    the sfdebris review was ok, it touched on a few interesting things but the humour was fairly weak

    the review jim posted in http://boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=67272830&postcount=3 is far far far far *far* superior

    it's still got a fair bit of stupid comedy, but it just rips the movie to absolute shreds. It's so thorough and just brutal.

    --edit

    http://sfdebris.com/videos/t142.asp

    the sfdebris review of 'q who' where we first meet the borg. Actually pretty damn great. The episode reviews are alot better than the movie reviews, probably because they're so much shorter.


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    #26
    Lantus
    Registered Users Posts: 3,027 ✭✭✭Lantus


    Guys please....as you all know there is only one really definitive (and really funny) AND good quality review (and funny) of the star trek movies and it's by....


    RED LETTER MEDIA.

    http://www.redlettermedia.com/generations.html

    try here for a review of generations.

    Also, if you have a spare hour it does tell you everything wrong about phantom menace elsewhere and it's all on yo tube in many parts.

    Before I get any stick I am a trekker and I can watch these movies but hedoes raise good points....and he's funny......

    pizza rolls.....

    who's f****n with my medicine.....


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    #27
    IvySlayer
    Registered Users Posts: 17,187 ✭✭✭✭IvySlayer


    Generations wasn't a very good film.

    The Enterprise D should've have gotten a proper farewall. Destroyed in a proper battle, ala the Defiant.


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    #28
    Cookie_Monster
    Registered Users Posts: 24,493 ✭✭✭✭Cookie_Monster


    Sir Digby Chicken Caesar wrote: »
    the sfdebris review was ok, it touched on a few interesting things but the humour was fairly weak

    the review jim posted in http://boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=67272830&postcount=3 is far far far far *far* superior
    .

    +1 much better review.


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    #29
    Stark
    Registered Users Posts: 20,975 ✭✭✭✭Stark


    I didn't think Generations was all *that* bad. It made a more fitting end to the TV series than "All good things" did in my opinion. The big problem was it was essentially a TV episode trying to be a movie.


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    #30
    Magic Eight Ball
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,420 ✭✭✭Magic Eight Ball


    Stark wrote: »
    I didn't think Generations was all *that* bad. It made a more fitting end to the TV series than "All good things" did in my opinion. The big problem was it was essentially a TV episode trying to be a movie.

    Picard - "I should have done this a long time ago."

    Perfect ending IMO.


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    #31
    Cookie_Monster
    Registered Users Posts: 24,493 ✭✭✭✭Cookie_Monster


    Magic Eight Ball wrote: »
    Picard - "I should have done this a long time ago."

    Perfect ending IMO.

    +1


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