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If UPC bring in 100MB, will the...
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06-08-2010 8:52am#1
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there you go again making up 'facts' just to suit your own argument. :rolleyes:hightower1 wrote: »Like it or not the AVERAGE bb user in Ireland is what will always drive the decisions of ISP's and as it stands the AVERAGE user simply does not need additional caps. The joe soap downloader does not want higher caps but does want faster speeds and thats exactly what is being server by ISP's..... if the day ever comes when the majority actually wants higher caps then I am sure we will see it but if only 10%- 5% of their customer base ether receives warning letters on fup breach or actually asks for higher caps then there is absolutely no logical or financial reason for an ISP to increase their cap.
it would be great if you could...- show us a single piece of evidence that shows that your usage is in any way 'average' for a UPC 30mbps user.
- show us a single piece of evidence that shows that the AVERAGE user simply does not need additional caps.
- show us a single piece of evidence that shows that joe soap downloader is more interested in faster speeds and not higher caps.
- show us a single piece of evidence that shows that only 10%- 5% of their customer base ether receives warning letters on fup breach.
how exactly are faster speeds going to help me if I can't download MORE data when the speeds are increased to 5 times faster than they were when the 250gb FUP was introduced at the start of 2009?
i keep saying it, but people just don't listen. assuming that because YOU don't use your 30mbps connection for anything that actually utilises it's potential, it doesn't mean that nobody else does. going by the amount of poeple complaining on here about the FUP, there's plenty of people on here who DO use it up and who would like to have the FUP increased. at the very least, you opinion is certainly in the minority in the boards.ie broadband forum.
and since when did ANY company push the limits of their product to satisfy the needs of their 'average' customer? do Intel and AMD create their top end CPU's so that office workers can check their emails faster? do car manufacturers create their top of the line sports coupe's for mum's on a school run? no, they don't. they create them for the people who are going to use them. and the people who are going to use them are the people at the forefront of broadband usage who make the most of what they have now.
do you seriously expect anyone to believe that when we were all using 20mbps and UPC started out on the road to 120mbps, they decided to make their broadband 6 times faster for people who aren't even making the most of the broadband they have now? :rolleyes:
personally, I DO make the most of what I have now and for what I do currently online (streaming and/or HD video, downloading games & demo's on 3 consoles, patching multiple OS's, downloading ISO's of most new OS's as and when available to test, skype video calling, streaming and/or downloading HQ audio, file transfers, remote desktop), 30mbps is actually plenty fast enough and given the choice, I'd rather have a higher upload and an increased FUP than have a faster download rate and I'm sure I'm not alone.
faster speeds are meaningless if you can't use them and since even now there are only very rare circumstances where you can make the most of a 30mbps connection currently and if you did you'd have surpassed the current FUP in under 24 hours, 100mbps doesn't actually have any advantage for very many people at all.
in my experience you can't even download OS updates, games/demos, music, streaming video (inc. HD) at anything near 30mbps at this point in time. even pulling a single linux ISO from the HEAnet FTP servers is rarely going to top out your 30mbps connection, let alone a 100mbps one unless you are downloading multiple ISO's from different HEAnet FTP servers at the same time, but how often does that happen?
the only use for a 100mbps connection that you can't do with a 30mbps connection is several multi-source high bandwidth downloads at the same time. i'm talking about torrenting or RS + full HD video streaming + other uploads and/or downloads such as FTP and other file sharing services.
at that speed, even heavy duty web browsing, email, even rich content like youtube is only going to account for at most 1-5% of your bandwidth, so it's hardly even worth mentioning.
at 100mbps, (assuming you can even find anything to download that fast) your FUP for the month is gone in under 6 hours. what are you going to do with that 100mbps connection for the rest of the month? :rolleyes:
an example of something like this would be great, you're just making up stuff again and it's pointless.hightower1 wrote: »Speaking for myself I have never come across something to download and said ah I wont bother it'll be too large on my cap whereas I have said ah I wont bother it'll take ages.
please feel free to give us just one single example of something that you can't be bothered downloading because it'll take too long with a 30mbps connection and where you might find something like that to download at those speeds.
5mb mp3 = 1 second
175mb tv show = 50 seconds
350mb tv show = 1 minute 40 seconds
700mb divx movie = 3 minutes 20 seconds
1.4gb divx movie = 6 minutes 40 seconds
4gb dvd = 20 minutes
9gb dvd = 45 minutes
i'd keep going, but since by your own admission you don't use anywhere near the 250gb FUP as an 'average' user, there wouldn't be a lot of point. :rolleyes:0 - show us a single piece of evidence that shows that your usage is in any way 'average' for a UPC 30mbps user.
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there you go again making up 'facts' just to suit your own argument. :rolleyes:
it would be great if you could...- show us a single piece of evidence that shows that your usage is in any way 'average' for a UPC 30mbps user.
- show us a single piece of evidence that shows that the AVERAGE user simply does not need additional caps.
- show us a single piece of evidence that shows that joe soap downloader is more interested in faster speeds and not higher caps.
- show us a single piece of evidence that shows that only 10%- 5% of their customer base ether receives warning letters on fup breach.
Good point, can you show me evidence to the contrary? No? Thats cause unless you personally want to survey all their customers no one has "evidence" only personal experience here.
ISPs are here to make money.. you do that by answering demand of your customers... so your product range reflects their wants.... and as you said the cap has stayed static for the last year while speeds have gone up... what does that tell you?currently, on my 30mbps connection (assuming i could find somewhere to download FROM at those speeds) I can download 350mb in under 2 minutes, 700mb in less than 4 minutes and my full FUP of 250gb in a single day.
And what is this meant to prove? That you can breach a cap in a day? Would you rather be with Eircom and breach the cap at a slower speed in less time?how exactly are faster speeds going to help me if I can't download MORE data when the speeds are increased to 5 times faster than they were when the 250gb FUP was introduced at the start of 2009?
I think you answered your own question .... you can down load what your already happy downloading .....FASTER?!:rolleyes:
So if you won the lotto you wouldnt buy a super car simply cause you couldnt drive it on the roads at top speed all the time, otherwise whats the point I guess :rolleyes:i keep saying it, but people just don't listen. assuming that because YOU don't use your 30mbps connection for anything that actually utilises it's potential, it doesn't mean that nobody else does. going by the amount of poeple complaining on here about the FUP, there's plenty of people on here who DO use it up and who would like to have the FUP increased. at the very least, you opinion is certainly in the minority in the boards.ie broadband forum.
We all know that boards.ie forum is for the minority of Irish people who are tech savy. Like I said , upc are a very successful ISP as is, they do this by supplying what the majority of people ask for and look at whee we are now... static cap but faster speeds.... I wonder who asked for that??do car manufacturers create their top of the line sports coupe's for mum's on a school run? no, they don't. they create them for the people who are going to use them.
How wrong that is... take ferrari for example, only an idot would say they have EVER tried to market to school run moms, they know the majority of their customer base do not use their product for things like that but use them for high performance driving and quality. Ferrari do not cater to fords market they cater to their own and any good company caters to what its OWN customer base wants, not someone elses.do you seriously expect anyone to believe that when we were all using 20mbps and UPC started out on the road to 120mbps, they decided to make their broadband 6 times faster for people who aren't even making the most of the broadband they have now? :rolleyes:
What you believe doesn't matter, your not my ISP. They make it faster simply because when your looking at posters of isp product you look at 2 things... price and speed. Lower price and higher speed regardless of if you use it or not will get your attention to that ISP.personally, I DO make the most of what I have now and for what I do currently online (streaming and/or HD video, downloading games & demo's on 3 consoles, patching multiple OS's, downloading ISO's of most new OS's as and when available to test, skype video calling, streaming and/or downloading HQ audio, file transfers, remote desktop), 30mbps is actually plenty fast enough and given the choice, I'd rather have a higher upload and an increased FUP than have a faster download rate and I'm sure I'm not alone.
Surely your not alone... but your certainly not the majority of UPC customers otherwise a pack such as you describe would be in place or being introduced in the foreseeable future.faster speeds are meaningless if you can't use them and since even now there are only very rare circumstances where you can make the most of a 30mbps connection currently and if you did you'd have surpassed the current FUP in under 24 hours, 100mbps doesn't actually have any advantage for very many people at all.
I am sure an major ISP would not release a product that is completely useless and will not sell , thats ridiculous. By your logic sure why does any broadband connection run above 30mbps at all? Last I checked other isp's globally had MORE than 30mbps connections with 250gb or less caps but then again I guess they were just mad right?
(Here is just one very quick google search example, 50mbps with 250gb cap http://news.cnet.com/8301-17939_109-10073404-2.html )the only use for a 100mbps connection that you can't do with a 30mbps connection is several multi-source high bandwidth downloads at the same time. i'm talking about torrenting or RS + full HD video streaming + other uploads and/or downloads such as FTP and other file sharing services.
BUT yet you were asking why even bother have 100mbps earlier and now here you are giving reasons why??! Just because you are downloading from multiple sources means you have to download more? If anything I would prefer to spend less time in my day downloading and being able to run several at once, finish and be done with it quicker is very handy.at 100mbps, (assuming you can even find anything to download that fast) your FUP for the month is gone in under 6 hours. what are you going to do with that 100mbps connection for the rest of the month? :rolleyes:
So what you do now downloading wise you can ether do in a shorter space of time as you can run multiple downloads at once.... or in your world you can now do 6 times as much but spend the same amount if time doing it. I think you misunderstand the concept of faster speeds, ya know the whole point is you get what you want done faster / have time for an actual life and not start inventing more things would want and spend the same amount of time at your computer.please feel free to give us just one single example of something that you can't be bothered downloading because it'll take too long with a 30mbps connection and where you might find something like that to download at those speeds.
I believe I shall answer your question with your own answer form above...the only use for a 100mbps connection that you can't do with a 30mbps connection is several multi-source high bandwidth downloads at the same time. i'm talking about torrenting or RS + full HD video streaming + other uploads and/or downloads such as FTP and other file sharing services.
....;)
Like it or not, your priorities are not the same as the majority or broadband consumers in Ireland at the moment, like I said you can gauge what the majority want based upon what the people hoping to make money of said wants actually supply. Looking at trends the majority want faster speeds, dont care about caps and want cheaper prices. These are their wants and no matter how much you wish and hope and ISP will give you more of a cap and greater upload speeds... that is simply not financially viable to go against what the main body of consumers want to supply you with your wants.0 - show us a single piece of evidence that shows that your usage is in any way 'average' for a UPC 30mbps user.
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yet again, all you're doing is stating your opinion as fact to try and support an argument that is so paper thin it barely even registers and really isn't worth re-posting or replying to on the grounds that there simply isn't anything worth responding to.hightower1 wrote: »blah blah blah, waffle, waffle
oh, except this which is an absolute chestnut thanks
:hightower1 wrote: »(Here is just one very quick google search example, 50mbps with 250gb cap http://news.cnet.com/8301-17939_109-10073404-2.html )
sorry, who's point were you trying to make there, yours or mine?Cost aside, what may be the most controversial aspect of this speed bump is that subscribers of the residential plans will get no higher cap over the 250GB monthly limit which was instated earlier this October. Comcast's own release prides the new Extreme plan on letting customers "download a high-def movie (6 GB) in about 16 minutes, a standard-def movie (2 GB) in about 5 minutes and a standard-def TV show (300 MB) in a matter of seconds." Do the math and you'll see that an extreme subscriber could easily blow past the 250 GB cap in a matter of hours.
the difference between what I'm saying and what you're saying is that I'm laying out basic information which is easily verifiable by anyone here with a 30mbps connection, not plucking random bits of twaddle out of thin air in a desperate bid to try and support an argument that isn't actually there to argue.
you keep saying that 100mbps is going to make things 'faster' but have yet to provide any evidence that in real world terms it's going to make any difference to anyone currently on the 30mbps package.
and who mentioned ferrari? all the major car mfg's make high performance cars. ford, opel, bmw, mercedes, nissan & toyota etc. and none of them are made for school runs or their 'average' customer.
at time of writing this, there are 2066 (557 registered) users online and only 19 of those are in the broadband forum with only 40 in total in all of the 'tech' parent forum (excluding the cable tv one). boards.ie has a great deal more to offer the world at large than just a broadband forum for a few tech savvy users and i'm pretty sure the opinions expressed here are far more diverse than you appear to believe. the diversity of the forums within the site as a whole and the numbers of people using it more than shows that.0 -
tbh i think FUP's should be illegal or calling a package "unlimited". each package should state the exact amount of usage allowed before they either throttle u or u receive further charges.
and with each speed u should be able to pay more for more bandwidth. so for instance the 30mb upc should start at its current monthly price for 250gb as it is currently and then there should be an option to pay extra for extra bandwidth. this would also cover the ppl who want the extra speed without the extra bandwidth when it gets to 120mb and also caters for the heavy downloaders who want the extra bandwidth with the speed!
tbh its fairly simple and would save all this bull**** and arguing.
But it is unlimited, with an AUP.
Lots of people here have mentioned downloading way of excess of 250, but certain posters here keep on ignoring them, cause it doesn't suit them or their arguments.
I'd guess(*) that less than 1,000 people have ever gotten a letter from UPC.
Out of over 170,000 customers that they have.
A good few people on this very site have stated that they regularly go way over 250 usage with no contact from UPC or no problem.
Could it be that UPC are giving you exactly what they say?!!:eek:
UPC say that you can use whatever you want, unless your usage is effecting other customers or effecting their network.
If they see slow speeds in an area, and then discover that 10 users out of 100 are downloading way more than everyone else, and slowing it down for the other 90, then it's UPC's job to protect the speeds for the other 90.
This is basic, simple, common sense.
(Also the reason why it's ignored here!:D)
If however you're downloading 600GB in a month, but happen to live in an area with no slow speeds, cause only 1 or 2 people out of 100 are high capacity users.
Then UPC let you off, cause the 98/99 other people are having no problems.
It really is that simple, but the tin foil hat brigade will just ignore this post as they always do.
Why?
I've no idea.
Maybe it makes them feel important to complain.
Just like they're complaining here about a "Cap" for a package that doesn't even exist yet!!!!!!!
They have no idea what limitations are going to be in place, but they are already complaining.
Proving the point that these people are just wanting to complain and put down UPC, even when they have no reason to do so.
(* I'm saying "guess" cause we don't know, and unlike some people here I try not to make things up.)0 -
Karmafaerie wrote: »But it is unlimited, with an AUP.
Lots of people here have mentioned downloading way of excess of 250, but certain posters here keep on ignoring them, cause it doesn't suit them or their arguments.
I'd guess(*) that less than 1,000 people have ever gotten a letter from UPC.
Out of over 170,000 customers that they have.
A good few people on this very site have stated that they regularly go way over 250 usage with no contact from UPC or no problem.
Could it be that UPC are giving you exactly what they say?!!:eek:
UPC say that you can use whatever you want, unless your usage is effecting other customers or effecting their network.
If they see slow speeds in an area, and then discover that 10 users out of 100 are downloading way more than everyone else, and slowing it down for the other 90, then it's UPC's job to protect the speeds for the other 90.
This is basic, simple, common sense.
(Also the reason why it's ignored here!:D)
If however you're downloading 600GB in a month, but happen to live in an area with no slow speeds, cause only 1 or 2 people out of 100 are high capacity users.
Then UPC let you off, cause the 98/99 other people are having no problems.
It really is that simple, but the tin foil hat brigade will just ignore this post as they always do.
Why?
I've no idea.
Maybe it makes them feel important to complain.
Just like they're complaining here about a "Cap" for a package that doesn't even exist yet!!!!!!!
They have no idea what limitations are going to be in place, but they are already complaining.
Proving the point that these people are just wanting to complain and put down UPC, even when they have no reason to do so.
(* I'm saying "guess" cause we don't know, and unlike some people here I try not to make things up.)
If something is unlimited it doesn't come with qualifications.
If something is unlimited it doesnt depend on where you live.
Should some customers supposedly on the same product be restricted more than others?
Why can't UPC simply be honest with what they are selling?
Then they would not need "blind" fanboys.:rolleyes:0 -
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