Fianna Fail voters "Always and Forever"

paddyland

scr123 wrote: »

Have spotted you before as someone with an undulterated hatred of FF so dismiss you entirely.

Just like your party so, dismiss the concerns of the vast majority of the country in order to cling to power just long enough to bail out their small coterie of buddies. Then to hell and high water with everyone else.

scr123 wrote: »

Ahern I greatly admire. Yes he immersed himself in politics as few people do and it seems his personal life and finances suffered as a result. However, despite his failings and as with Haughey I firmly believe they both worked tirelessly for the country. At this moment there is no evidence that Ahern gained huge amounts of money from politic connections as Haughey did.

Don't you realise that your beloved Bertie shafted almost the whole of the existing FF establishment in North Dublin in order to establish his own electoral machine, no matter what their party pedigree? He was one of the most divisive things to happen to FF besides Haughey, and that is BEFORE you even mention the disaster he perpetrated on the rest of us!

Bertie Ahern received HUNDREDS of THOUSANDS of pounds in unexplained CASH in a time when ordinary people were going through the previous FF-led recession. We are expected to believe it was all won on some unsubstantiated horse races, as all the while Bertie was stuffing the boards and committees with his friends and benefactors.

Bertie Ahern is probably the singular most fundamental reason your party's support is on the floor right now. And you ADMIRE him?

Keep posting, your every utterance makes an ass of you.

paddyland

If I was living in such humiliating poverty that my buddies had to rally round and buy a house for me, and then one day I won hundreds of thousands of pounds on a horse, I'm bloody sure I'd remember the name of that horse for the rest of my life. The first horse I ever won money on was a horse called Grundy in 1975, I was six years old and I won a few pence on a bet my father put on. Jesus I have a better memory than Bertie Ahern!

murphaph

Bertie Ahern also had his secretary put through the ringer in the tribunals because he wasn't man enough to face the music honestly.

Other parties have their toerags, but FF just take the biscuit. They HAVE to go.

Het-Field

scr123 wrote: »

Its very amusing to watch innocent children at play constantly starting threads on a little used section of a message board repeating the same drivel about FF. Who are you trying to impress ? When are you going to get the message that despite FF flaws the people of this country have only a shocking combination of extreme right and extreme left to turn to. In two years time when the election campaign starts in earnest FF are going to fight like never before and the famous party machine is going to tear apart the shallow empty little minds of those who dare to believe the Irish people as a whole are foolish enough to accept people of proven failure. The destruction of FF is wishful thinking for the simple reason the alternative scares the you know what out of intelligent people like me.
Have a nice day

Your post is lost on me when you deem yourself to be "intelligent".

First, you dont understand the basics of the Left-Right dichotomy, which is no longer relevant in Irish politics. If you want the extreme left and right, I suggest you read up on Franco's Spain, Hitler's Germany, Stalin's Russia, North Korea, Cuba, and the plethora of failed African states before tossing around the idea that Labour and Fine Gael are "far left and far right". It just makes you sound stupid. These extremes dont exist in Irish politics. In fact, FF have made a living out of swaying between the far right and the far left to suit their purpose in the name of populism.

Second, the destruction of FF wont happen. It is as spurious as claim, as the one which is commonly tossed around claiming that FG/Lab snatched defeat from the jaws of victory in 2007. The discrepancy in the number of seats between the government and the opposition was far to great for the proposition of a FG/Lab government to hold weight. However, FF will be given a pasting at the next election, and privately, most FFers have expressed a wish that this happen.

Third, Grassroots FF has almost deserted the party. Cummann's are rotten/inactive, family's run constituency organisations, and many branches are no longer meeting. Others are riven with the division which power brings. The responses which most people gave to FF canvassers was not positive in 2009, and no amount of "fighting" will see FF return.

aDeener

NickDrake wrote: »

Thanks for the insult. They are the Government. Does that not count for anything?? They are in charge of the Regulators.

I presume you are referring to the banks??

Not a FF supporter?? Why are you protecting them so much??

Did I say the solely are to blame? They certainly are the main ones to blame. They were in charge for years for god sake.

:rolleyes:

some man to be giving out at being insulted considering you called all FF voters idiots

Liam Byrne

aDeener wrote: »

:rolleyes:

some man to be giving out at being insulted considering you called all FF voters idiots

True - they probably aren't all idiots.

Those who are well-connected and have their vested interests protected by the corruption and dodgy goings-on and aren't worried about ethics and fairness are probably being very intelligent in voting for FF.

Anyone else has no excuse at this stage though.

Probably truer to say that all FF voters simply have no interest in ethics and fairness.

ingen

NickDrake wrote: »

I have created this thread just out of a matter of interest really.

Fianna Fail supporters are well known for never backing down on supporting their party. The thing is come the next election will they get back down??

I have talked to a few friends who will still vote them even after they have ruined the country and destroyed a generation. They will still vote them, not because there is no alternative but simple because they will ALWAYS vote FF.

How many FF voters (idiots) on here would still vote them back in??

Are we to expected another FF Government in the next election??

As the JJ72 song goes "Always and Forever, my home"

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q_qgVn-Op7Q

skip on a bit to 1min 13sec.. we have to get those feckers out! FF out. im mad as hell.:D:D no to property tax, no to water rates

Wide Road

Liam Byrne wrote: »

True - they probably aren't all idiots.

Those who are well-connected and have their vested interests protected by the corruption and dodgy goings-on and aren't worried about ethics and fairness are probably being very intelligent in voting for FF.

Anyone else has no excuse at this stage though.

Probably truer to say that all FF voters simply have no interest in ethics and fairness.

Can you or anyone else around here give an alternative. I don't want to second guess you, but please don't give us the usual speeches like anyone would be better etc. It's better than that.

aDeener

Liam Byrne wrote: »

True - they probably aren't all idiots.

Those who are well-connected and have their vested interests protected by the corruption and dodgy goings-on and aren't worried about ethics and fairness are probably being very intelligent in voting for FF.

Anyone else has no excuse at this stage though.

Probably truer to say that all FF voters simply have no interest in ethics and fairness.

probably?

that's a joke of a comment in fairness. i don't know how many hundreds of thousands have voted FF, but the vast majority of them are not idiots

Mrmoe

Liam Byrne wrote: »

Probably truer to say that all FF voters simply have no interest in ethics and fairness.

So are you saying that a large proportion of the population are immoral and are cheats? I will probably be voting for a FF candidate , are you saying I have no interest in ethics or fairness?

PomBear

Mrmoe wrote: »

So are you saying that a large proportion of the population are immoral and are cheats? I will probably be voting for a FF candidate , are you saying I have no interest in ethics or fairness?

FF no longer have a large proportion of the population. Also, I believe you are voting for a party that has no interest in ethics or fairness, would you like examples? There's plenty out there

RayM

Mrmoe wrote: »

So are you saying that a large proportion of the population are immoral and are cheats? I will probably be voting for a FF candidate , are you saying I have no interest in ethics or fairness?

I think it would be fair to say that whatever proportion of the population decide to vote for Fianna Fail in the next election (and, in the privacy of the polling booth, it'll probably be a far higher number than were prepared to admit it over the phone to TNS/MRBI, Red C, etc) are - at the very least - quite happy to turn a blind eye to unfairness and unethical politics.

Just out of interest, which Fianna Fail candidate will you probably be voting for? And why?

Dubstar07

My local choices for FF include Ivor (if he still in politics then) and Sean 'The Legacy' Haughey. I seriously doubt I'll vote for either. It's a toss up between the FG/Lb/Ind then.

I don't think FF will get back into power after the next election but at the same time I would not be at all surprised if they did!

FG may do it but one wonders about the cabinet selection, considering the previous first choices were so easily replaced after the leadership challenge.

Lab still on the fence unfortunately, but aswell Gilmore is uninspiring.

Greens are complicit in the FF 'ethics' and behaviour and will suffer moreso than their partners.

bigbadbear

I think a contributing factor to FF onlyism is when people criticise FF for things which they are genuinely doing right. It frustrates me when I hear people saying It's brian cowen's fault that this that and the other happened when clearly (to people who follow politics) that it's not his fault.

I mean come on, FF have got some things right. it's not like every single policy they have or every decision they've made in the last few years has been wrong is it?? some people like to think so and I reckon these people only further the die hardness of these FF voters.

I personally think our economy would be worse if FG had been in for the last few years and way way worse if Labour were in.(Remember Kenny in the last debate saying we need to spend spend spend) thats off the point though.

It's the crony-ism and lack of real balls that wreck my head about them and the corruption factor I believe is the final nail in the FF coffin (Until the following election when FF get back of course:pac::rolleyes:)

Liam Byrne

Mrmoe wrote: »

So are you saying that a large proportion of the population are immoral and are cheats? I will probably be voting for a FF candidate , are you saying I have no interest in ethics or fairness?

Well you certainly aren't planning to vote as if it's important to you.

Laminations

Wide Road wrote: »

Can you or anyone else around here give an alternative. I don't want to second guess you, but please don't give us the usual speeches like anyone would be better etc. It's better than that.

Ah the old battered wife syndrome 'weep weep sure where would I find another man?' trying to justify to yourself why you don't leave. Are you not one of those FFers that say 'sure they are all the same', plenty of alternatives if that's your view. You choose not to acknowledge the alternatives. I'd recommend a look at FG and their policies. Even if you don't like FG I've heard plenty of FFers call for a delay in elections for 'stabilitys' sake, so I'm sure for 'stabilitys' sake they'll vote FG when an election comes as a vote for FF surely wouldn't give a stable government- my arse they will, stability magically will go out the window

Wide Road

Laminations wrote: »

Ah the old battered wife syndrome 'weep weep sure where would I find another man?' trying to justify to yourself why you don't leave. Are you not one of those FFers that say 'sure they are all the same', plenty of alternatives if that's your view. You choose not to acknowledge the alternatives. I'd recommend a look at FG and their policies. Even if you don't like FG I've heard plenty of FFers call for a delay in elections for 'stabilitys' sake, so I'm sure for 'stabilitys' sake they'll vote FG when an election comes as a vote for FF surely wouldn't give a stable government- my arse they will, stability magically will go out the window

Can you just answer the question.

Laminations

For next election I'll be voting FG (although I'm not a FGer). I'll judge them on their performance and their implementation of policy and assess their penchant for scandal and corruption. Then come next election I'll reassess. If the fvck up so bad in government to the point that the entire country want them gone, I'll not respect their mandate and call for an early election just like I'm doing now.

It must be difficult for you to understand I don't give my loyalty to a party and will only 'commit' for one term and reassess constantly. Political monogamy is backwards, maybe if you peel yourself away from the FF teet you might see alternatives to the sour milk you're guzzling down

paddyland

It's quite simple to me. Even if you think FF are the better party for putting the country right, and I don't, but even if some do, and that were the case, THE PRICE of sorting the country in return for keeping a party of proven thiefs, liars, charlatans, corruption and their apologists in power is too dear a price for me.

FIANNA FÁIL MUST GO.

Between the others, we will have to muster something, and if FG cannot get on with Labour, and FG are too soft on dealing with corruption, and Labour are too tied to the unions, and a whole host of other problems, well we as the electorate are going to have to find some way of letting them know what is acceptable and what is not. Are we living in a democracy, where we call the shots, or do we let political parties tell us what to do?

But either way, Fianna Fáil and their cronies have robbed and raped this country for too long now, and lied to the point where not a single utterance they make can be trusted. If Cowen and Lenihan magically made the recession disappear tomorrow, I STILL couldn't trust them, because I wouldn't know what worse horrors they were storing up in it's stead. I don't trust them, they robbed me personally, and they robbed the country, and I want them gone. I'll make the best of whatever is left.

Laminations

Mrmoe wrote: »

So are you saying that a large proportion of the population are immoral and are cheats? I will probably be voting for a FF candidate , are you saying I have no interest in ethics or fairness?

Can you please tell us the FFer that will get your vote? You are obviously overlooking the greater lack of ethics and fairness in the party, would you care to comment?

Wide Road

Laminations wrote: »

Can you please tell us the FFer that will get your vote? You are obviously overlooking the greater lack of ethics and fairness in the party, would you care to comment?

What FGer will get your vote?

jmayo

bigbadbear wrote: »

I think a contributing factor to FF onlyism is when people criticise FF for things which they are genuinely doing right. It frustrates me when I hear people saying It's brian cowen's fault that this that and the other happened when clearly (to people who follow politics) that it's not his fault.

Maybe you hear people saying it is cowen's fauilt because shock horror most of the problems facing the country were created whilst he has either been taoiseach or more particulaly minister of finance.

So a large chunk of our problems are down to him and if you can manage to see otherwise then I am sorry, but I believe it is you who is probably more fustrating to the rest of us who do follow politics. :rolleyes:

bigbadbear wrote: »

I mean come on, FF have got some things right. it's not like every single policy they have or every decision they've made in the last few years has been wrong is it?? some people like to think so and I reckon these people only further the die hardness of these FF voters.

But they have gotten all the real big policy decisions very wrong and they are the ones costing us a bloody fortune.
Or perhaps you believe pouring 20 odd billion, and climbing, into Anglo and INBS was a good decision ? :rolleyes:

bigbadbear wrote: »

I personally think our economy would be worse if FG had been in for the last few years and way way worse if Labour were in.(Remember Kenny in the last debate saying we need to spend spend spend) thats off the point though.

Yeah FG and Labour would have bent over backwards to keep ff supporters out of debtors courts. :rolleyes:

That is just a maybe and debatable, whilst the fact we have massive current budget deficit and have poured 20 odd billion, and climbing, into failed banking institutions that were allowed go apesh** under minister of finance cowen's watch is not debatable.

bigbadbear wrote: »

It's the crony-ism and lack of real balls that wreck my head about them and the corruption factor I believe is the final nail in the FF coffin (Until the following election when FF get back of course:pac::rolleyes:)

So you don't see any incompetence at all :rolleyes:

Laminations

Wide Road wrote: »

What FGer will get your vote?

Well I've yet to see which FGer will stand but individual personalities only apply for me with independents, party members adhere to party policy and at the end of the day it's the party ethos and their national policy you are voting for. Tony Gregory got a vote from me when he was with us based on his personal convictions. Again when voting for a party candidate, personal convictions align with party priorities and I don't like FF priorities nor Bertie who was the FF choice in my constituency for too many years

Mrmoe suggested the FF candidate he's voting for has ethical standards and convictions at odds with the party, so I'd like to know what individual could make one overlook the party and the bigger picture. In my experience I've only become so myopic when I had a crush on a pretty lass

scr123

NickDrake wrote: »

I have created this thread just out of a matter of interest really.

Fianna Fail supporters are well known for never backing down on supporting their party. The thing is come the next election will they get back down??

I have talked to a few friends who will still vote them even after they have ruined the country and destroyed a generation. They will still vote them, not because there is no alternative but simple because they will ALWAYS vote FF.

How many FF voters (idiots) on here would still vote them back in??

Are we to expected another FF Government in the next election??

As the JJ72 song goes "Always and Forever, my home"

As a matter of interest really

You have called me an idiot because I vote FF always and forever

Now, who do you vote for and why ?

Now, tell me this, under FF 1m extra people joined the workforce which is a lot of people.

Now, this country needs to create say 300000 jobs, 30% of what FF did.

Please tell me as you are so clever how and where these jobs are going to come from when the brilliant people you vote for come to power

Remember you called me an idiot so I have got to expect you are much smarter

Mr.Applepie

RichardAnd wrote: »

The only thing I'm worried about is labour in power and the possibility of socialist governance.

I would take some governance or no governance anyday.

I really don't understand the mentality of people who will only ever vote for one party -
"My father voted for X, therefore I vote for X" This is the reason children aren't given a vote, because it's the same as giving the parents and extra vote. Surely at 18 you can make your own mind up as to who you think is the best candidate to represent you.
"X got the {insert local issue here} so I'm going to vote for him" Fine vote for him but vote them into the council. What he has just done is the work of your local government. Clearly that is where they are best suited!

My thinking behind who I vote for is a mix of two things:
1. What does this person represent on national issues. Economic leaning, National Infrastructure, Education, How to create jobs etc.
2. What party does this person represent and who is the leader of said party. The Taoiseach will come from the party with the most votes so the party has to come into play.

Het-Field

scr123 wrote: »

As a matter of interest really

You have called me an idiot because I vote FF always and forever

Now, who do you vote for and why ?

Now, tell me this, under FF 1m extra people joined the workforce which is a lot of people.

Now, this country needs to create say 300000 jobs, 30% of what FF did.

Please tell me as you are so clever how and where these jobs are going to come from when the brilliant people you vote for come to power

Remember you called me an idiot so I have got to expect you are much smarter

Can I field this one ?

1.The jobs created were an illusion. They were created on the back of an artifically inflated market, which was the product of cheap credit and reckless banking practices. They are not coming back. I can guarantee you that at least 150,000 people within the unemployment system are products of these unsustainable and false "jobs. Unless they retrain, the are on the dole for the long haul

2.Our blunt competitive edge, our third world broadband system, our PRSI mechanism, our land costs (artificially interfered with by Governmental forces) have scared foregin companies away. Hence we hear of constant closures, and lay offs. All the current show can offer is potential "high skilled jobs", which may or may not be rolled out over the next years. As long as these companies stay away, our dole ques will get larger.

It doesnt matter what the opposition "will do". As things stand we are where we are. But little or nothing has been done to rectify the chronic lack of jobs, joblesness, and welfare traps which have sprung up.

The vast majority of the 450,000 people (yes 450,000, not "300,000), are not going to be in a position to go back to work, as their skills are limited. Equally, there are a lot of professionals who have suffered greatly thanks to this.

Your smug attitude is an affront to the sufferings of those who are stuck at home today, and will be stuck at home, in a jobless rut for the future.

rightwingdub

I put up a thread a few months ago advocating a Fianna Fail-Fine Gael coalition, FF may have more than their fair share of crooks but I'd prefer a solid centre right coalition consisting of FF-FG than a divided FF-Labour or even a FG-Labour, I'm sick and tired of the outdated civil war politics and Its time that FF and FG decided to grow up and put the interests of the country first and kept that former communist Eamon Gilmore out of government, the country is teetering on the edge of bankruptcy and only a broad based FF-FG national government will give this country decisive leadership.

Also there are little or no ideological differneces between the two parties, after all both parties are arguably the two least ideological parties in Western Europe.

Liam Byrne

rightwingdub wrote: »

I'm sick and tired of the outdated civil war politics and Its time that FF and FG decided to grow up and put the interests of the country first....

If FG decide to do that (put the interests of the country first), then they DEFINITELY wouldn't go into Government with FF.

RayM

rightwingdub wrote: »

former communist Eamon Gilmore

By pointlessly describing (or rather, dismissing) somebody who is currently a centre-left politician as a 'former communist', you run the risk of detracting credibility from your own argument. It's not because of 'Communism' (imaginary or otherwise) that the country is 'teetering on the edge of bankruptcy'.

As for the People's Front of Judea and the Judean People's Front, they shouldn't just enter into a coalition - they should cut the civil war crap altogether and merge ('Fine Fail' certainly has a nice ring to it).

murphaph

RayM wrote: »

It's not because of 'Communism' (imaginary or otherwise) that the country is 'teetering on the edge of bankruptcy'.

Maybe not, but Bertie Ahern's version of socialism (tax and spend, mostly directed at over inflated PS wages) is a core reason for our difficulties. We are still spending Bertie money, which we don't have now that the real economy is back in play and FF's (supported by the electorate) proberty bubble is over.