gps vs map and compass.

SNAKEDOC

hey guys just wanted to start a bit of a census on whats used out there in the way of navigation. i am a firm believer that a map and compass are the best way to go but others may think different. i have seen lots of folks using the garmin and other brand GPS with the read outs and with the map screen however i hardly ever see anybody out practicing some basic map and compass navigation. does anybody run nav courses around wicklow for the novice hill walker starting off?

Glenalla

Map and compass every time, have a GPS but just use it for fun

Evil Phil

Contact Mountaineering Ireland (http://www.mountaineering.ie/) for courses on navigation. Should be plenty around Wicklow.

DeepSleeper

Map and Compass all the way for me too. The way I see it, the only limitation on my route options during the day is the terrain - with a map and compass I am always aware of where I am (not in National Grid terms, but in real terms of slopes, cols, bumps, hollows, ridges etc.) and can vary my route at a moments notice... again, and again, and again... It's fast too (new bearing, distance and time worked out in less than a minute) and I enjoy the 'always thinking' aspect of walking with map and compass.

I've always had a feeling that GPS users operate on a point-to-point basis and aren't so fully aware of the myriad of route options and minor variations open to them or of the tiny clues on OSI maps which can be related to small topographic changes on the ground. However, I think the newer GPS units which have OSI maps loaded into them are quite interesting... Perhaps they represent the best of both worlds?

Tester46

DeepSleeper wrote: »

Map and Compass all the way for me too. The way I see it, the only limitation on my route options during the day is the terrain - with a map and compass I am always aware of where I am (not in National Grid terms, but in real terms of slopes, cols, bumps, hollows, ridges etc.) and can vary my route at a moments notice... again, and again, and again... It's fast too (new bearing, distance and time worked out in less than a minute) and I enjoy the 'always thinking' aspect of walking with map and compass.

I've always had a feeling that GPS users operate on a point-to-point basis and aren't so fully aware of the myriad of route options and minor variations open to them or of the tiny clues on OSI maps which can be related to small topographic changes on the ground. However, I think the newer GPS units which have OSI maps loaded into them are quite interesting... Perhaps they represent the best of both worlds?

I would agree with you, but in reality, how many people use that level of micro-navigation regularly? When I am in the hills, 9 times out of 10 I know where I am going and, at most, I'll do the odd check with map and compass to confirm I'm on track and that what I'm seeing matches the map (and vice versa).

It's only when the weather is bad/misty/getting late that I end up using the magnifying glass on the compass to really read those contours - and that's so rare I'm usually out of practice, hence my other thread about getting a cheap and simple GPS to confirm where exactly I am on the map.

Having said all that, I think my ideal would be to use map and compass 95% of the time, but have the GPS on standby as a foolproof way to confirm position on the map. Not as an electronic device to blindly follow. Map and compass will always win out for route planning.

Tester46

Oh, and in the Maamturks Walk earlier this year, the weather was appalling for the first half - mist, rain, snow and cold winds. People with GPS were flying past those who were struggling to read their maps. The map readers ended up following the GPS guys. It was the best example of the utility of a GPS I have ever seen. Still prefer the map and compass though .

SNAKEDOC

Tester46 wrote: »

Oh, and in the Maamturks Walk earlier this year, the weather was appalling for the first half - mist, rain, snow and cold winds. People with GPS were flying past those who were struggling to read their maps. The map readers ended up following the GPS guys. It was the best example of the utility of a GPS I have ever seen. Still prefer the map and compass though .

you have made my point exactly. thank you. i believe people that use maps are out of practice. regularly using a map and compass is good fun as well as keeping your skills up. does anybody do night exercises navigating. they can be fun. those who have the gps just walk a line on a screen where as maps require thinking maths and good observation. if used right a map and compass would beat any gps in my opinion

Tester46

I'm not disagreeing with you, but the people I saw on the Maamturks Walks knew how to use a map. Its just that there was no visibility at all, the terrain was very, very confusing (lots of undulations - if it was clear you could have seen the "slope" in front of you only ran for 30m or so), so the people with the maps had to stop very frequently for regular re-evaluations and adjustments.

The people with the GPSs knew exactly where they were and where they were going and simply shot on by - they didn't have to stop every few minutes.

I prefer the maps and compass myself too, but I am just acknowledging there are situations where a GPS could be of serious help.

hmmm

There's often a bit of inverse snobbery in conversations about GPS versus map/compass. I don't know why, but a lot of hillwalkers like to rubbish GPS systems as navigational aids and desperately search for reasons to rubbish them. Often it's simple technophobia (present company excepted).

A GPS gives you all the benefits of a compass, i.e. directional indicator allied to telling you where you are located. A competent navigator will find a GPS extremely useful and shouldn't need to pull out a compass. The new mapping GPS make like even easier as you can easily mark the location on the map you would like to navigate to and then simply follow the arrow.

Mapreading is the key skill imo for both those who use a GPS or a compass. Neither tools will tell you the best route or how to avoid hazards, only a map can tell you this.

The downsides of GPS are when they are used as a crutch by people who are not competent navigators. You have got to be able to use map and compass if something happens the GPS.

I recently was out with a group in Wicklow in very poor visibility in the Barnacullian area, which some of you will know is a nightmare. A mapping GPS made life very easy for the leader (who had his route card prepared etc). A compass would have worked just as well, but it would have been slower and more stressful for everyone.

Alun

Well put hmmmm.

It's important to see a GPS as a tool, just as a map and a compass are tools too. If you don't know how to use a map and compass properly, getting a GPS won't magically turn you into a competent navigator overnight. Conversely, if you already have a thorough grounding in navigational techniques, using a GPS won't make you suddenly start blindly following it off the edge of a cliff.

If you have a proper route card prepared beforehand with all your waypoints and bearings then transferring these to a GPS as a route will just make your life easier for you. Following a bearing using a GPS to navigate to a waypoint using the built-in compass is no different to doing the same on a normal compass, apart from the fact that the GPS will adjust it's bearing if you veer slightly off course .. for example if you're navigating through rough, boggy terrain with peat hags and have to do lots of small detours.

We have a few technophobes / Luddites in our group too, but that doesn't stop them from asking me for confirmation of their position and/or elevation now and then.

hmmm

Maybe I'm being unfair describing people as technophobes. Navigating with a compass is a difficult enough skill that has to be mastered, so I can understand some people getting a bit annoyed when a newbie turns up with a GPS and can replicate much of that skill with seeming no effort.

But like you say, for the already competent navigator a GPS adds to their skills, it doesn't dumb them down.