What if the FAI asked Mick McCarthy to come back for 2014?

SuperInfinity

I know, I know, what a crazy and random thought. But when you think about it it makes a lot of sense:

Advantages:

* Big Mick has bucketloads of experience now, both at international and at club level.

* He is possibly the best-performing Irish manager we ever had, given the players we had. Only for losing on penalties to Spain and he would have done as well as Jack Charlton ever did (who got through on penalties against Romania!!!).

* International managers seem to tire of if after a while, (otherwise why would they come and go so easily, sometimes going to other international sides). But I think it's fair to say Mick McCarthy will have had his break from Ireland managing by 2014 qualifying.

* The pride!!! The passion!!! How can you be sure that a manager like Trap will put in all the hours required? Trap's a foreign manager, he used to manage Italy. You can be damn sure Mick McCarthy would if he took the job, both because of his personality and his Irishness.

* If he's good enough for Wolves, you can be sure he's good enough for Ireland.

* He's not at the age when significant mental deficits can appear.

* He can actually speak English fluently.

EDIT: I just found this where he says he would love to. I hope they bring him back for 2014. :cool:

3hn2givr7mx1sc

McCarthy's English.

jesus_thats_gre

He should never have been forced out tbh.

Jordonvito

Think it would be great to bring him back, in 2002 I was very much Team Keane, but I think 8 years on it's not as sensitive issue as it once was. We were so close to a quarter final against South Korea, who knows what could have happened, not to mention the fact we came out of a very hard qualifying group.

Maybe Keane and McCarthy will be the two main men going for the job, could be Saipan II

Dempsey

Never say never but it depends on who's available at the time and the cost to the FAI.

flahavaj

I'd have no problem with this, he's a decent manager who has done well with Wolves and did a good job with Ireland too.

He'd be better than Liam Brady anyway who has his beady little eyes on Trap's job when he finishes up.

Kiwi_knock

No problem with him being a candidate for the job, hopefully by then Ireland will be an attractive proposition for managers and we will have plenty of candidates of suitable quality

Bodhisopha

I'd have him back but i don't think he'd have us back as long as he's managing in the Premiership.

LuckyLloyd

baz2009 wrote: »

McCarthy's English.

He was an absolute hero in the green shirt as a player, bravery personified. The likes of him and Kilbane have clearly assimilated themselves with such a strong sense of Irishness throughout their lives as to render their place of birth utterly irrelevant.

You see posts like the above on this forum all the time. Boiling down the concept of nationhood to a simple question of where one happened to be born is the worst type of narrow minded simplicity.

LuckyLloyd

You think about Steve Staunton and you look at some of the other candidates who were in the running before we got Trapp to sign, and you can only conclude that McCarthy stacks up really well relative to the type of managers we are likely to attract.

flahavaj

LuckyLloyd wrote: »

He was an absolute hero in the green shirt as a player, bravery personified. The likes of him and Kilbane have clearly assimilated themselves with such a strong sense of Irishness throughout their lives as to render their place of birth utterly irrelevant.

You see posts like the above on this forum all the time. Boiling down the concept of nationhood to a simple question of where one happened to be born is the worst type of narrow minded simplicity.

He's half Waterford - that makes him f*cking better than Irish in my book.:pac:

3hn2givr7mx1sc

LuckyLloyd wrote: »

He was an absolute hero in the green shirt as a player, bravery personified. The likes of him and Kilbane have clearly assimilated themselves with such a strong sense of Irishness throughout their lives as to render their place of birth utterly irrelevant.

You see posts like the above on this forum all the time. Boiling down the concept of nationhood to a simple question of where one happened to be born is the worst type of narrow minded simplicity.

Are you on the rag or something?:rolleyes:
Read the OPs 4th point.

Whilst he may have been a hero in a green shirt, and I have no problem with English-Irish playing for Ireland, but it still doesn't mean he's Irish.

flahavaj

LuckyLloyd wrote: »

You think about Steve Staunton and you look at some of the other candidates who were in the running before we got Trapp to sign, and you can only conclude that McCarthy stacks up really well relative to the type of managers we are likely to attract.

The only time I ever hear of Joe f*cking Kinnear is when the Irish job comes up.:pac:

SuperInfinity

LuckyLloyd wrote: »

He was an absolute hero in the green shirt as a player, bravery personified. The likes of him and Kilbane have clearly assimilated themselves with such a strong sense of Irishness throughout their lives as to render their place of birth utterly irrelevant.

You see posts like the above on this forum all the time. Boiling down the concept of nationhood to a simple question of where one happened to be born is the worst type of narrow minded simplicity.

Kilbane is pure Irish. He's the cousin of someone I knew in school who is the most Irish person I've ever seen.

Tony Cascarino is the only person who I think we can all agree doesn't have any claim to being Irish. Yes I'm talking about you tonycascarino.

themont85

baz2009 wrote: »

Are you on the rag or something?:rolleyes:
Read the OPs 4th point.

Whilst he may have been a hero in a green shirt, and I have no problem with English-Irish playing for Ireland, but it still doesn't mean he's Irish.

Tell that to the millions around the world who consider themselves Irish because they were brought up in an Irish home abroad.

He captained Ireland and managed them for a massive chunk of time. He's Irish to me.

Salmon

Would love to see him back! I think he tried to get us to play attractive football which was not only nice to watch but also effective! Don't think it'll ever happen thou, we will probably end up with Brady or some newly retired ex Irish footballer looking to cut his teeth! (ala Staunton!)

tonycascarino

I would take Mick McCarthy back now.

super_furry

baz2009 wrote: »

McCarthy's English.

And Eamon De Valera was a Yank. What's your point?

McCarthy was a fine international manager and was wrongly forced out by a media witch-hunt. We'd be lucky to get him back.

L'prof

baz2009 wrote: »

McCarthy's English.

gandalf

Definitely would welcome him back. He was an excellent manager of Ireland.

mike65

Ha! Wolves will be playing in Europe by 2014, you have no chance of getting him. Then the England job will beckon...

























wakes up in cold sweat.

VinylJunkie

Id love to see him back, I would actually consider watching an Ireland game with him at the helm. However if I was him I wouldn't want anything to do with Delaney and his cronies!!

OPENROAD

LuckyLloyd wrote: »

He was an absolute hero in the green shirt as a player, bravery personified. The likes of him and Kilbane have clearly assimilated themselves with such a strong sense of Irishness throughout their lives as to render their place of birth utterly irrelevant.

You see posts like the above on this forum all the time. Boiling down the concept of nationhood to a simple question of where one happened to be born is the worst type of narrow minded simplicity.

While I do agree with you, nationality is such a vague thing anyway imo, you are spot on he was a legend in an Ireland jersey, but you have to also recognize his English character which is very obvious and I have to say I love it, that Barnsley accent and Northern English sense of humour , brilliant stuff


You can't say his birthplace is not relevant and I'm sure he would not want to see it as irrelevant how can it be????, he was born and brought up in England, does not make him any less of an Irish hero. As Irish people a lot of us have a close connection with England, why try and deny it?

Also have to say he got a raw deal with Ireland imo.

The_Kew_Tour

Let's be honest.

Some of the English born players who played for Ireland gave more heart and guts for this country then can be said for some of our so called Irish born and bread players.

I dont care if he born in Hawaii if he puts on green shirt and gives it his all then thats oood enough for me.

Back on topic like see Mick back but 2014 might be bit too soon. (looking at it from how things stand now)

OPENROAD

adrian280582 wrote: »

Let's be honest.

Some of the English born players who played for Ireland gave more heart and guts for this country then can be said for some of our so called Irish born and bread players.

I dont care if he born in Hawaii if he puts on green shirt and gives it his all then thats oood enough for me.

Exactly, but don't try and deny that they also have a partial English DNA, which is no big deal.

SuperInfinity

OPENROAD wrote: »

Exactly, but don't try and deny that they also have a partial English DNA, which is no big deal.

It's all the same DNA anyway. Even Russian people all look practically the exact same as Irish people do. A lot of the "differences" you see in some countries like France or Germany have to do with what diet they eat. We're all the same animal.

GSPfan

This is a great topic and when I opened the thread I was expecting a bad reaction. Thankfully we're all a bit older and wiser and can see that he would be a top candidate if he ever wanted to come back.

*But don't we have to consult the RTE panel before we elect a manager these days. I was sure that their opinion is the only opinion that matters.:rolleyes:

Het-Field

Mick McCarthy was charged with the hardest of hardest jobs when he took over the Irish Job in 1996.

First, he had to pick a demoralised team up off the ground after 1995, an Annus Horribilus for Irish football (0-0 V Lichtenstein, 1-1 v Northern Irelan, 1-3 v Austria x2, 0-3 v Portugal and 0-2 v The Netherlands). It was a horrible job, but he managed to do it.


Second, he was charged with reforming a clapped out team, which had far too many miles on the clock. Without ever giving Aldrige, Cascarino, Quinn, McGrath, Houghton, Townsend, Quinn, McGloughlin, D.Kelly, Bonner, Morris and Tommy Coyne the bums rush, he incrementally rooted them out, and never told them to go. He gave second chances to Terry Phelan, Alan Kernaghan, Liam Daish, Liam O Brien, Owen Coyle, and Brendan Carey, before letting them go before the World Cup 98 fixtures.

Third, he was expected to bring in a plethora of new players, and train them up in time for the Qualification Tournament. Moore, O Neill, Harte, Savage, Cunningham, Breen, Fleming, Branagan, Connolly, Given, Farrelly were all given early opportunities. During the qualification campaign players like Carsley, Delap, and Kilbane were introduced. These were mixed with some of the old heads, who gave invaluable experience as Ireland were within a hair's breath of qualifying.

The second part of this experement occurred in 1998/1999, as the likes of McPhail, Duff, Keane, Carr, Maybury, Kinsella, Keily and Holland were introduced. Players like Steve Staunton were redeployed, while Niall Quinn, Denis Irwin, Roy Keane, and Mark Kennedy became the senior figures in the team. Ireland managed to oust Croatia, and were within seconds of qualifying for Euro 2000

The final part of the experiment was complete in September 2000, when Mick McCarthy fielded his strongest 11 in the Amsterdam Arena. IIRC the team was A.Kelly, S.Carr,I.Harte, G.Breen, R.Dunne, R.Keane, J.McAteer, M.Kinsella, K.Kilbane, R.Keane, N.Quinn. This proved to be the guts of the team which managed to bring Ireland to the World Cup, with the likes of Steve Staunton, Gary Kelly, Steve Finnan, Matt Holland, and David Connolly playing a role. This team, was a culmination of the hard work of McCarthy between 1996 and 2000.McCarthy had sensibly moulded a team, which was capable of getting to the WC Last 16.

He made certain mistakes. Examples include the dropping of Denis Irwin before the play-off against Turkey in November 1999. The decision to play 5-4-1 against an inherently defensive Romanian team in May 1997. He also was incapabale of making easy work of Eastern-European and uber defensive teams like Lithuania, Iceland, Malta, Macedonia.

However, McCarthy's reign speaks for itself. He is a good manager, who has never been given the riches of many poorer managers. He has Two Championship Titles under his belt, three promotions, and one World Cup Qualification with a team which he built himself.

If he came back to coach Ireland in the future, I wouldnt be suprised, nor would I be gutted.

The_Kew_Tour

GSPfan wrote: »

This is a great topic and when I opened the thread I was expecting a bad reaction. Thankfully we're all a bit older and wiser and can see that he would be a top candidate if he ever wanted to come back.

*But don't we have to consult the RTE panel before we elect a manager these days. I was sure that their opinion is the only opinion that matters.:rolleyes:

The RTE panel wanted Paul Jewell as manager last time:rolleyes::pac::pac::pac:

LeeroyJones

McCarthy is a very clever manager, and I would happily have him back in the helm.
I do think though that Tardelli is being groomed to take over the reigns whenever Trap see's fit to leave.
If we were to go foreign again, Tardelli would be the only one I would really be happy with. He seems quite hands on and seems quite familiar with the set-up here and the player base. His English is pretty decent now too. What we need is continuity at the helm so Trap handing over the baton to Tardelli would be a smooth changeover

JerryHandbag

Traps contract is only until 2012 though isn't it? Big Mick could be in for it then. Or maybe the FAI will opt for continuity and keep Marco Tardelli on when Trap packs it in....or maybe they'll give Dave O' Leary a call.

God only knows what they'll do tbh

GSPfan

JerryHandbag wrote: »

....or maybe they'll give Dave O' Leary a call.

Take that back!

eagle eye

I knew Mick McCarthy when he was an Irish International and I'd have nothing but good things to say about the man as far as his character is concerned.

At the time I always thought he shouldn't have been first choice for Ireland(never told him that of course) but looking back in hindsight he is the type of lad you would want on your team. He gave everything when he was on the pitch but even more than that he had a sensible head on his shoulders and was a leader too and I'm talking off the field. Its something we don't often think about when we criticise a manager's selection of a player.

The Saipan thing was very unfortunate back when he was manager, who knows we could have went a lot further in that tournament if that didn't happen. I do know this though, Mick McCarthy is not easily annoyed and he will go out of his way to make people feel comfortable. I can understand Roy Keane's frustrations at the time but he didn't know where to stop.

McCarthy got unfairly branded at the time as a bad manager which was ridiculous. Its taken him a long time to get his rep back and being the nice guy that he is I wouldn't rule out him ever taking up the Irish job again but personally I think he should avoid it like the plague after the way he was treated.

As for the he is English/Irish or whatever, I think when you bust your backside and spill blood, sweat and tears for the country that you have the right to be called Irish regardless of your place of birth.

Whats ridiculous is that the person that said he is English more than likely never did anything for the country.

3hn2givr7mx1sc

eagle eye wrote: »

Whats ridiculous is that the person that said he is English more than likely never did anything for the country.

What does that have to do with anything?

Kevin Kilbane is an example, I would defend him to the end. One of my favourite players to play for Ireland, despite his lack of technical ability, he's still a legend. I'm sure I'd think the same about Mick McCarthy if I saw him play.

But you can't hide the fact that they are English, it wasn't meant as an insult to the man, just in reply to the OP. He is English with Irish connections, get over it.

OPENROAD

eagle eye wrote: »

Whats ridiculous is that the person that said he is English more than likely never did anything for the country.

don't understand what you are getting at?


Not sure if that is directed at me, so I will clarify what I said, Mick was a legend of a player for Ireland and gave 100% and obviously chose to play for Ireland because of his Irish parents/grandparents and obviously felt a very close bond to the country. But you can't say that he is not English at all in character when he was born and brought up there, his English personality is very obvious in most of his interviews. You(not you) can't come out with a statement that is place of birth is totally irrelevant.

flahavaj

eagle eye wrote: »

Whats ridiculous is that the person that said he is English more than likely never did anything for the country.

Jesus Joey when I think of what them bai's done.

SuperInfinity

baz2009 wrote: »

What does that have to do with anything?

Kevin Kilbane is an example, I would defend him to the end. One of my favourite players to play for Ireland, despite his lack of technical ability, he's still a legend. I'm sure I'd think the same about Mick McCarthy if I saw him play.

But you can't hide the fact that they are English, it wasn't meant as an insult to the man, just in reply to the OP. He is English with Irish connections, get over it.

Hey, you seem to be retarded. That's okay. But he has more than "irish connections", his father is Irish.

Why exaggerate your point and try to stir up flames? If you want to say that he is technically English because he happened to be born in England then that's fine, but don't say "with Irish connections" when you know that's total bollocks.

3hn2givr7mx1sc

SuperInfinity wrote: »

Hey, you seem to be retarded. That's okay. But he has more than "irish connections", his father is Irish.

Why exaggerate your point and try to stir up flames? If you want to say that he is technically English because he happened to be born in England then that's fine, but don't say "with Irish connections" when you know that's total bollocks.

How is it total bollocks?
My Ma is English, I'm Irish with English connections.
Go crawl back up whatever hole you came out fo.

SuperInfinity

baz2009 wrote: »

How is it total bollocks?
My Ma is English, I'm Irish with English connections.
Go crawl back up whatever hole you came out fo.

"connections" means you have some association with them, not that you are related to them by blood. If you have "connections" in Kuala Lumpar does that mean you have Kualar Lumparese(?) ancestry? No, of course not... connections is a different word.

And I think both of Kilbane's parents are Irish. He's no more English than Tony Cascarino is Irish. What if a Japanese woman has a baby here on holiday, is he Irish then?

OPENROAD

SuperInfinity wrote: »

"
And I think both of Kilbane's parents are Irish. He's no more English than Tony Cascarino is. What if a Japanese woman has a baby here on holiday, is he Irish then?

But the thing is that woman would just have been on holiday, big difference.

Yes Kibane is Irish and so is Big Mick but you can't turn around and say his place of birth is irrelevant, when he has been born and brought up in England.

davyjose

In fairness Andy Townsend is a former captain of Ireland, you'd imagine to get there he was dedicated to the cause of the Ireland team. Now ... he refers to the England team as "we" and "us".

I'm not necessarily tarring McCarthy with that brush, but some of the comments jumping on Baz are OTT. He's got a point. Comparing the man to Devalera FFS.

leedsfan88

I'm a huge fan of Mick and I'd love to him manage Ireland again and if not Mick how about Big Sam

OPENROAD

leedsfan88 wrote: »

I'm a huge fan of Mick and I'd love to him manage Ireland again and if not Mick how about Big Sam

:eek::eek::eek:

3hn2givr7mx1sc

SuperInfinity wrote: »

"connections" means you have some association with them, not that you are related to them by blood. If you have "connections" in Kuala Lumpar does that mean you have Kualar Lumparese(?) ancestry? No, of course not... connections is a different word.

And I think both of Kilbane's parents are Irish. He's no more English than Tony Cascarino is Irish. What if a Japanese woman has a baby here on holiday, is he Irish then?

Are you fcuking serious?
Cascarino was only allowed to play for Ireland because his adopted mother supposedly had Irish grandparents, which turned out to be untrue. So Cascarino is 100% not Irish.
You can't say that a man who was born and raised in England(did he ever even live in Ireland?), with an Irish father is 100% Irish.

pickarooney

baz2009 wrote: »

McCarthy's English

is very good. We could probably do without the interpreter.

parker kent

That would actually be the perfect time for Mick to get the job. Even though he did well at 2002, he was too young and naive a manager in 1996 to get the job. You could see he was learning on the job and that should not be the case. A better manager at that stage would have got us to one of Euro 2000 and France 98. We just lacked that extra 5% to get us over the line. Or that extra 5% to gte us through the last 11 seconds against Macedonia

Now is the perfect point in his career to take over as he has experience. I would love him to get the job but I imagine it will be Tardelli that gets the nod.

Trotter

Some of the best RTÉ soccer clips come from away matches where the TV companies used to put the microphones too close to the Irish bench (RTÉ knew better).

I remember him bellowing during one match in his Barnsley accent... HARTEY! THAT IS F^KING AWFUL!

Cue cheers in the pub

Le King

baz2009 wrote: »

Are you fcuking serious?
Cascarino was only allowed to play for Ireland because his adopted mother supposedly had Irish grandparents, which turned out to be untrue. So Cascarino is 100% not Irish.
You can't say that a man who was born and raised in England(did he ever even live in Ireland?), with an Irish father is 100% Irish.

Being 100% Irish, which nobody is, but to be "100% Irish" both your parents would have to be Irish.


Both my birth parents are Irish, I was born in the States. Does that make me 65% Irish or something?


If I lived in Laois but was born in Clare I''d consider myself 0% Irish. :pac:

Manc-Red

LeeroyJones wrote: »

McCarthy is a very clever manager, and I would happily have him back in the helm.
I do think though that Tardelli is being groomed to take over the reigns whenever Trap see's fit to leave.
If we were to go foreign again, Tardelli would be the only one I would really be happy with. He seems quite hands on and seems quite familiar with the set-up here and the player base. His English is pretty decent now too. What we need is continuity at the helm so Trap handing over the baton to Tardelli would be a smooth changeover

For me McCarthy would be two steps back, he was decent for his time but the real truth is we, with a better manager in 2002 would have went further in the WC...

At that level we need to pay-well and bring in the best we can bring in with whats available out there at the time.

McCarthy is at best a first-division manager imo - and for that reason and that reason alone - I'd think we'd be shooting ourselves in the foot.

Manc

johnnyjb

Regarding the English - Irish debate, if my children were born in england for whatever reason i would consider them irish, technically they were born on foreign soil and would be entitled to that nationality ( i think ) Would people call there children or grandchildren foreigners and would you want your children to be able to play for ireland.

Every country has different social and economical issues and we are a nation of emmigrators ( every 20 years or so )


Whether people like to admit it or not in the future there will be more foreign blood in the irish team from alot of our african , polish etc.. visitors. It might help us though

Manc-Red

johnnyjb wrote: »

Whether people like to admit it or not in the future there will be more foreign blood in the irish team from alot of our african , polish etc.. visitors. It might help us though

Thats a brilliant point - It's something that I've never even thought about, but now that I have - It can only be beneficial.