GPU help (HD 6000 series problem)

Icyseanfitz

hey guys ive just found out that the adi hd 6000 series will be releasing around November,so im going to hold off buying a hd 5970, so i guess my question is will a gtx 460 1gig keep me going till the 6000 series release? and if so which one should i buy as there is so many of them . Also do ye think that the 6870 will be one of the first cards released and if so take a guess at how much ye think it will cost.

Overheal

Someones got a hole in his pocket..

Why not indulge in the high-fidelity DirectX-Reality graphics afforded in a Gentlemen's Lounge if you're going to be pissing away money on a bleeding edge card you'll only use for a couple months? My goodness.

If I spent 3 years gaming on an 8400M GS, you can wait for the 6 series. I think it would be an absolute waste of currency to buy an interim card. Lets not forget that theres how many major game releases planned before then? 2?

To answer your question bluntly, a GTX460 would last you till the HD 7xxx series. So yes, it would last you till the HD 6xxx series, if cost was no issue in the world.

Icyseanfitz

sorry if im coming off as having a ton of money because i dont im a student who doesnt get grants but i just turned 21 so i got a little bit of money and im also selling my laptop for around €650 (it is worth easily that btw:)), but i figure i could probably sell the gtx 460 again when i go for a 6870 as it will only be in a couple of months. This will actually be my first true gaming pc so im kinda going all out with it (i dont count my laptop as it wasnt upgradeable).

Icyseanfitz

also a question regarding say this gtx460, could i run three screens off of the one card or do you need to get more than one card

Overheal

it should run 3 yes.

I think you really need to think about this though, either buy And Stay with the 460 or wait for the unreleased HD 6xxx line. You won't get the money back out of the 460 you put into it.

Monotype

You can't use current nvidia cards with three monitors without a second card or adapters.

Icyseanfitz

eh might get around €100 for it if i sell it later and i might have a bit of money at xmas so il see, im thinking im going to go buy a multiscreen setup right now specs:

ASUS Motherboard
HAF 932 Limited Edition
Antec PSU (a bit overkill but i want to buy good now so i can use it for a long time with maybe some overclocking)
HDD
AMD x6 Processor
RAM 2x2gig
DVD Burner
GTX 460 1 gig
Speakers
3 x 23 inch LG screens

and if the 6870 turns out to be a great card il upgrade to that can anyone see any problems with RAM compatibility or any other problems?

Icyseanfitz

Monotype wrote: »

You can't use current nvidia cards with three monitors without a second card or adapters.

what do you mean adapters? could you please link one if you dont mind

Overheal

just balls to the wall huh. are you suuuure you dont have money?

uberpixie

Icyseanfitz wrote: »

also a question regarding say this gtx460, could i run three screens off of the one card or do you need to get more than one card

3 screens doing what exactly?
For Nvidia surround gaming (gaming of 2-3 screens) you need x2 cards in SLI

For displaying windows probably will work: But you would need to check it up with a little research. Some cards in the past have some with 3-4 outputs but were only able to run x2 of them at a time due to their design.

Overheal

http://forums.pureoverclock.com/showthread.php?t=9095



if you look at the release schedule, Antilles (aka Caribbean??) isn't coming out until 2011; so in the meantime theres to be no successor to the 5970

Icyseanfitz

Overheal wrote: »

just balls to the wall huh. are you suuuure you dont have money?

sure dont currently have a job that gives me about 7 hours a week on minimum wage :rolleyes: my hopes for my first build are solely relying on selling my gaming laptop, its a pretty good deal actually just seems like people dont have the money they once had come onnnn sell you thing sell

Monotype

Icyseanfitz wrote: »

what do you mean adapters? could you please link one if you dont mind

Expensive adapters like this which costs as much as another card.

Your options are:
1. The adapter/splitter
2. ATI card - in this case you MUST have one monitor with displayport (unless you can get a €100 displayport adapter - the cheap ones won't do.
3. Get two nVidia cards.

Icyseanfitz

Overheal wrote: »

http://forums.pureoverclock.com/showthread.php?t=9095



if you look at the release schedule, Antilles (aka Caribbean??) isn't coming out until 2011; so in the meantime theres to be no successor to the 5970

well i wouldnt buy the successor to the 5970 anyway as it will be priced like crazy when it first comes out id actually buy the 6870 and then buy another later on down the road (probably the same as what the 6970 would be anyway) when they get cheap. As for Nvidia not supporting multi screens, doesnt that seem a bit odd it would seem fairly common place to be able to do that these days??

Icyseanfitz

Monotype wrote: »

Expensive adapters like this which costs as much as another card.

Your options are:
1. The adapter/splitter
2. ATI card - in this case you MUST have one monitor with displayport (unless you can get a €100 displayport adapter - the cheap ones won't do.
3. Get two nVidia cards.

damn seems more complex than i thought it would be (cant anything be easy )

Icyseanfitz

ok would this ati 5850 card be a better choice for 3 screens
Would you be able to link me a 20-24 inch screen with a display port as i cant seem to find any

Monotype

Overheal wrote: »

Roadmap

You know a company are feeling comfortable when they release their lower end products first.

Icyseanfitz wrote: »

As for Nvidia not supporting multi screens, doesnt that seem a bit odd it would seem fairly common place to be able to do that these days??

It's only started appearing this generation of cards with eyefinity on the 5000 series and nvidias alternative. Before that it didn't really have much of a presence in gaming, requiring the splitter or a specialist card.

ATI's eyefinity needs one of the monitors to have displayport. Here's some monitors available with it. http://www.displayport.org/consumer/?q=content/devices#pcmonitors
The problem with it is that they are a good bit dearer (like at least an extra €50) than a lot of other monitors and not as big a selection.

nVidia's solution doesn't need display port, but two cards like that generates its own problem.

Also keep in mind the resolution of three monitors. That needs considerable GPU power behind it. Not trying to dissuade you, there's people managing with 5770s, but I'd say you'd really want a 5850.

Icyseanfitz

damn it cannot find any monitors with displayports on pixmania.ie you would think this wouldnt be so damn complicated

#014917

Also just to give in my two cents, from what I've heard Intel's quad cores are supposedely better for gaming the AMD's hexacores for now. Game don't rely on the six cores as much and at the moment only a few fully utizile quad cores. You may want to look into an i5 750 or 760 (basicly the same I think, just the 760 has a slightly higher stock clock).

Here's a useful guide if you want to look at alternitives and compare your components so your gpu isn't limited by your cpu and vice versa:
http://i1002.photobucket.com/albums/af150/The_FalconO6/CurrentLogicalPCBuyingGuide/Guide.png

Also since you seem to be having trouble with finding a display port moniter, 460s in SLI are very good performance/price according to that link, "significantly better" than the performance-price ratio of the 5870, altough it seems slightly more powerful. Although this may be troublesome if you require a display port moniter later if you do decide to upgrade to the 6xxx series, altough with two 460s i think you'd be perfectly fine if not overpowered enough for the next few years.

Monotype

I was trying to find some LG display port monitors to go with the ones you had picked out, but I discovered that LG don't seem to have any display port monitors at all!

Any of the screens can be displayport. Usually you want three the same size, but I've seen some setups where the screen in the centre is slightly bigger and it looks pretty good, so one of the side ones could be display port. But I suppose you have to be very careful that they look similar etc.

Maybe the 6000 series will make it easier.

lmimmfn

Icyseanfitz wrote: »

damn it cannot find any monitors with displayports on pixmania.ie you would think this wouldnt be so damn complicated

You are completely underestimating the power you need for 3 screens
Just use the Sapphire eyefinity adapter( about 120 euro, i got mine off pixmania.ie, you can get cheaper active DP adapters but youll be taking a chance, some work some dont and loads have flickering screen issues ) and you dont need a Displayport screen, however:
1. If you want bevel management for games you NEED to have 3 of the exact same screens otherwise you have to faff around forcing it to think theyre all the same
2. For gaming a 5850 is not good enough to max games out, im running 3840x1024 resolution max overclocked at 980/1100 and overvolted( beats a stock 5870 by a good 5% ), not being able to max games out is due to both vram limitation and lack of grunt for the res, Bad Company 2 needs some settings on medium, GTA IV nearly runs max, Mafia 2 demo runs on max with physx on medium( ive an 8800GT for that ), SF IV doesnt support eyefinity properly, DMC4 runs fantastically well as does Dirt 2, Grid, Dragon Age, Burnout Paradise and Just Cause 2.

If you dont care about DX11 or maxing out games, just get 2xNvidia 260's, prob about 100euro each, wont need an eyefinity adapter, but i guarantee you if you do that you'll be pissed off and want better gfx, i.e. im looking at getting another 5850 to drive my res( and hopefully go 3x24" screens sometime next year )

Also waste of time waiting for Southern Islands( first 6000 cards due november according to todays Fud article ), its the same architecture with slight improvements but on a 28nm process so performance isint going to be that great compared to existing ATI cards, Northern Islands should change that though

One other thing, if youre ok using DX9, you can just use any 2 nvidia cards in windows XP and use extended display. Or if using Windows Vista or Windows 7 you can use SoftTH to run a tripple display( needs 1 good video card and another crappy gfx card just to display one of the 3 screens ). Its a pain to configure, but works, heres my cheapo 3 screen setup using my old Nvidia 260 and Grid - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zlp0-pbijjM

Solitaire

lmimmfn wrote: »

Also waste of time waiting for Southern Islands( first 6000 cards due november according to todays Fud article ), its the same architecture with slight improvements but on a 28nm process so performance isint going to be that great compared to existing ATI cards, Northern Islands should change that though

Link plz, that doesn't match with common sense nor what everyone else is saying! No-one has a new process node ready yet, hell ATi just switched theirs from 32nm to 28nm so if you're right there'll be big delays on HD6000 anyway! Much more likely that Southern is going to be the new GPU on the existing 40nm node because ATi really want to redress the tessellation issues in DX11

lmimmfn

Solitaire wrote: »

Link plz, that doesn't match with common sense nor what everyone else is saying! No-one has a new process node ready yet, hell ATi just switched theirs from 32nm to 28nm so if you're right there'll be big delays on HD6000 anyway! Much more likely that Southern is going to be the new GPU on the existing 40nm node because ATi really want to redress the tessellation issues in DX11

Sorry N.I. is purported to be the 28nm process( the rumours are all conflicting, read an article yesterday saying S.I. was to be 28nm ), but rereading id be sure youre right. If they stick with 40 S.I. will be rubbish, if they go 32nm, it could be a nice improvement.

Either way, Northern Islands is the one to wait for but its not due for sometime next year.

Todays Fud article is - http://www.fudzilla.com/graphics/graphics/graphics/southern-islands-reportedly-coming-in-november
Google ati southern islands for lots of conflicting info

Monotype

I had a look around and displayport monitors are still thin. It might be worth considering just getting 2 GTX 460s. That should work out on average to be a bit better than a 5870. A little more expensive than the 5870 but you can pick your monitors easily and cheaper.
That motherboard can be patched to take SLI, but the 460 isn't supported yet so don't run straight into it.

Overheal

Mini DisplayPort adapters do not exist for the older component video, S-Video, or composite video connectors. Connectivity can be achieved by converting the Mini DisplayPort digital signal first to VGA, DVI, or HDMI, then to the appropriate signal type.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mini_DisplayPort

Icyseanfitz

Monotype wrote: »

I had a look around and displayport monitors are still thin. It might be worth considering just getting 2 GTX 460s. That should work out on average to be a bit better than a 5870. A little more expensive than the 5870 but you can pick your monitors easily and cheaper.
That motherboard can be patched to take SLI, but the 460 isn't supported yet so don't run straight into it.

Damn it completely forgot about the mobo not supporting sli, was going to just go with the 2 x gtx 460's to keep me going for two years (would they be able to handle the 3 screens properly under gaming?). Could someone link me a good sli board for amd processors please , also i heard on another forum that you have to buy a nvidia 3d vision kit in order to get multiple screens working in games this is false right?
and to the above poster that said i should go with intel well my reasoning behind not going with them is that they change their sockets far two quickly and they also turn out to be more expensive with mobo's and RAM i mean with AMD there is a fair chance il be able to use some of their new bulldozer processors next year on an AM3 socket, also a six core isnt really going to bottleneck any GPU on the market il maybe lose 1-3 fps in high cpu intensive games

Icyseanfitz

will this support sli/crossfire? i see that it has 2 x PCI-Express 2.0 x16 slots but doesnt mention whether it can sli/crossfire or not

Overheal

Why not just suck it in and get the 5970 then? ATI's Eyefinity will support up to 6 monitors per card.

Icyseanfitz

but will i need to get a monitor with a display port in order to use multiscreen with a 5970?

Monotype

No that's an a crossfire board. I think the third digit in Asus' name tells if it's nvidia or ATI (i.e., whether it's an A or N).

M4N98TD EVO - It's not on pixmania.

Overheal

Icyseanfitz wrote: »

but will i need to get a monitor with a display port in order to use multiscreen with a 5970?

No. you can use displayport adapters.

http://www.google.com/products/catalog?q=displayport+to+dvi&oe=utf-8&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:official&client=firefox-a&um=1&ie=UTF-8&cid=9923238192836032208&ei=uWtlTJf2JYKBlAeF35WTDg&sa=X&oi=product_catalog_result&ct=result&resnum=1&ved=0CDQQ8wIwAA#

and actually on the cards its MiniDisplayPort so http://www.google.com/products/catalog?q=minidisplayport+to+dvi&cid=4801236161875149936&ei=GGxlTJ2HNYLWwAWF7dilBQ&sa=title&ved=0CIEBEPMCMAk4AA#p