Jack Daniels can make you run faster!

Sklarker

I've been running random distances and occassional interval sessions 3 times a week for the last 3 years, following my own very vague plan, and running a race every few months. I'm stepping up to running 4/5 times a week and hoping to follow a proper training plan - eg the Dr. Daniels plan. Hoping to get my 5mile/10km times down from 33:50/44:33 to about 32/42 by spring. Just wondering does anyone else follow this guy's plan? I started it 2 weeks ago.

gerard65

I have the book, found it very good. I don't follow his plans to the 'T' but I use the basic ideas. One thing I found is the paces from his 'VDOT' table are a bit difficult to maintain in a training session, I can race the times but translating those race times into training paces are too tough so I drop my VDOT a notch to work out the paces and this seems better.

seanynova

im following his marathon plan, the 2 quality sessions are tough but if you hit them its a good feeling. i had a look at his shorter plans and they look intense so im sure if you can work with them, the PBs will drop!

good luck

Sklarker

Cheers lads. Have given myself a VDOT of 48 and the plan for the first 3 weeks seems easy enough (lots of steady runs at 8:30ish/mile) but then looks like it gets pretty tough pretty soon. Way more scientific than my 'some longer than in a race/some at faster pace than in a race' theory I'll see how I get on...

Sklarker

4 weeks of the 6 week Phase 1 completed:
Week 1 - 16 miles
Week 2 - 27 miles (inc. a slow Frank Duffy 10)
Week 3 - 23 miles
Week 4 - 33 miles (inc. 9 mile L run)
Everything at E pace (~8:00-8:30/mile - JD suggests about 8:49) and dropped 4 pounds to 13 st 3

So far so good but there seems to be a huge step up in pace ahead in week 7(44s/200m etc.).
Anyone following this plan know if this sounds right - in Phase 2 do the Q1, Q2, Q3 sessions plus an L run and an E run per week, ie not sure what to do other than the Quality sessions...

gerard65

Sklarker wrote: »

Anyone following this plan know if this sounds right - in Phase 2 do the Q1, Q2, Q3 sessions plus an L run and an E run per week, ie not sure what to do other than the Quality sessions...

Are you following the 5k - 15k plan? I think the other days are similiar to his white, red, blue etc plans ie easy runs to make up the weekly milage. Figure 4.3 on page 77 will give you an idea.

Sklarker

gerard65 wrote: »

Are you following the 5k - 15k plan? I think the other days are similiar to his white, red, blue etc plans ie easy runs to make up the weekly milage. Figure 4.3 on page 77 will give you an idea.

That's great I'll have a look at that, I'm following the 5-15k plan alright. Should manage 2 easy runs a week. Cheers Gerard

seanynova

Sklarker wrote: »

Anyone following this plan know if this sounds right - in Phase 2 do the Q1, Q2, Q3 sessions plus an L run and an E run per week, ie not sure what to do other than the Quality sessions...

it depends, your training for a 10k race?, you would want to be getting in LSR's of around 10-15k(+) on the weeks where you only have only two Q sessions.
but when you have three Q sessions, i think it would be best to just do easy runs, 30-40mins to make up the mileage as the Q sessions look tough! some of those Q session will take you much further than 10k anyway so overall distance(or ability to go the distance) wont be an issue.

Sklarker

Well finally finished Phase 1 - 4 weeks behind schedule after a throat infection and a couple of calf niggles. Did my first Q session the other night - 6x200/200/400s with jog recovery. Not sure if you should add on any time to JD's rep times if you are running on roads (presume he gives track time for R pace) but did expected/actual times of 45/47 1:31/1:37. So a little slow on the 400s (then again distances are measrued using Google earth so may be long/short!)

seanynova wrote: »

it depends, your training for a 10k race?, you would want to be getting in LSR's of around 10-15k(+) on the weeks where you only have only two Q sessions.
but when you have three Q sessions, i think it would be best to just do easy runs, 30-40mins to make up the mileage as the Q sessions look tough! some of those Q session will take you much further than 10k anyway so overall distance(or ability to go the distance) wont be an issue.

Yep, training for 10k. Hopefully sub 43. A LSR every week with only 2 Q sessions sounds good, I'll do that alright. Cheers Seany

Sklarker

Q-sessions so far (trying to follow the plan to the tee)
Phase 2/Week1:
Q1: 6x(200/200/400) @ 47s/98s
Q2: 5x1mile @ 7:07
Q3: 3x(2min/1min/30s) 500m/260m/140m

---

Phase 2/Week2:
Q1: 8x400m @ 96s
Q2: 40min Tempo ~5.4mi

---

Phase 2/Week3:
Q1: 4x200,2x400,800,2x400,4x200 @ 46s/94s/191s
Q2: TBD
Q3: TBD

Ouch me hammers are in bits! Finding some of the Q sessions quite tough on the legs and slacking off a bit on putting in the miles. Doing less than 30miles per week

Sklarker

So I'm following a 24 week plan...grand. Now I know I'm a long way away from completing the plan but I'm wondering now what happens after the 24 weeks. What I mean is - it will be March/April, I should be in good shape for the GI run and a few other races around then I'm interested in, but I've completed the plan. I don't really want to start the 24 week plan again till the autumn so how should I approach staying in top form for 5/6 months I've seen some other logs were runners do short taper programs. Maybe I should repeat the JD phase 4 over and over? Or is 5/6 months too long to try and maintain form? Anyone else completed the 24 weeks 5-15k program?

ecoli

Sklarker wrote: »

So I'm following a 24 week plan...grand. Now I know I'm a long way away from completing the plan but I'm wondering now what happens after the 24 weeks. What I mean is - it will be March/April, I should be in good shape for the GI run and a few other races around then I'm interested in, but I've completed the plan. I don't really want to start the 24 week plan again till the autumn so how should I approach staying in top form for 5/6 months I've seen some other logs were runners do short taper programs. Maybe I should repeat the JD phase 4 over and over? Or is 5/6 months too long to try and maintain form? Anyone else completed the 24 weeks 5-15k program?

Maintaining phase four will prob not be the most beneficial to you. My advise would be that have a "Goal race" which you aim towards at the end of the plan. If you want to continue on after this race (I am presuming its the GI Run) take a week of easy jogging after this race and go back to phase 2 and work from there through the summer months rather than start from the beginning.
Phase 4 is a sharpener phase to get you ready for competition so if you kept repeating it you would not see the developments you could. You normally cannot hold a "peak" for longer than 6-8 weeks however you can still see improvements of race results through your strength and aerobic development.
Listen to your body if you are getting constantly tired dont be afraid to throw in weeks of easy running every few weeks during this period. There is no point in continuing to race through the summer for the sake of it if you are running "flat" its a good plan an you will no doubt make progress with your times.
Remember its phase 2 and three where you will see alot of the work put in so dont ignore them if you want to continue to progress but again its all about balance

Sklarker

ecoli wrote: »

Maintaining phase four will prob not be the most beneficial to you. My advise would be that have a "Goal race" which you aim towards at the end of the plan. If you want to continue on after this race (I am presuming its the GI Run) take a week of easy jogging after this race and go back to phase 2 and work from there through the summer months rather than start from the beginning.
Phase 4 is a sharpener phase to get you ready for competition so if you kept repeating it you would not see the developments you could. You normally cannot hold a "peak" for longer than 6-8 weeks however you can still see improvements of race results through your strength and aerobic development.
Listen to your body if you are getting constantly tired dont be afraid to throw in weeks of easy running every few weeks during this period. There is no point in continuing to race through the summer for the sake of it if you are running "flat" its a good plan an you will no doubt make progress with your times.
Remember its phase 2 and three where you will see alot of the work put in so dont ignore them if you want to continue to progress but again its all about balance

Thanks a lot ecoli..thats exactly what i was looking for.

Sklarker

Well after 8 months I still haven't managed to get as far as Phase 3 of the plan:eek: I completed phase 2 just before the ice came before Christmas and I missed so much running I went back to the start of the plan.
On my second attempt I got half way through Phase 2 then got injured :mad: and decided to go back to the start again. I'm not sure if that's the way to do it, but I guess you can only miss so much and then you can't really pick up where you left off. Everytime I restart the plan I seem to be a lot better than before - have changed my VDOT from 48 to 48.5 and now maybe 49!
Fingers crossed, I can remain injury free and maybe target a low 42 for the 10k. Did a 26:17 4 mile pb at the weekend:cool:

Sklarker

Managed to break 42 minutes for 10km at the weekend :cool:
Interesting to see that JD's tempo run table put me at about 41:39 and I ran 41:43 so guess it's a good gauge to predict times.
If I can manage to keep the plan going whilst holidaying in Kerry for a week I'll be doing well so still hoping I start the elusive Phase 3

Dr Nic

Old thread, but a good one!
Are you still running Sklarker?

How exactly do you calculate the Daniels times?
Thanks!

gerard65

I think he became a daddy for the first time last year and that put a halt to his racing days.

dev123

Dr Nic wrote: »

Old thread, but a good one!
Are you still running Sklarker?

How exactly do you calculate the Daniels times?
Thanks!

Google "vdot calculator" and input your latest race time and you will get your easy, tempo, interval and repetition pace times