ESB cutting off homes electricity

liammur

I would agree a certain % of people don't value water. Improve the quality, get in the meters and I'm all for it. However, I buy my water now because I deem it to be substandard.

LeinsterDub

BluntGuy wrote: »

You're not comparing like with like. The point was free water units should be provided, not free wine, or whatever liquid substance of your choice.

I don't believe water and electricity should be privatised. Some industries are suited to "competition", particularly electricity. The private sector isn't the magical cure for all our problems.

OK i was being factious. If we make electric free then why isn't a loaf of bread free. Bread is more vital than electric

moceri

Generation could be privatized but not the National Grid. This Government will surely balls it up like they did with the TELECOM EIREANN privatization.

Stark

liammur wrote: »

I would agree a certain % of people don't value water. Improve the quality, get in the meters and I'm all for it. However, I buy my water now because I deem it to be substandard.

The quality standards for tap water are a lot higher than for bottled water.

SeanW

Part of the reason, I think, that people are being cut off from electricity, is that it's too damn expensive. Stop subsidising madness like wind farms, industrial peat cutting and the esb unions, cut electricity rates and you'll have less people suffering electricity poverty.

Heroditas

moceri wrote: »

Generation could be privatized but not the National Grid. This Government will surely balls it up like they did with the TELECOM EIREANN privatization.

It has been privatised to a certain extent.
Huntstown is owned by Viridian and Endesa bought two of the ESB power plants and are going to renovate them.
Quinn was going to build a power plant but we all know what happened him!
Many of the wind farms are privately owned and are in power purchase agreements with the energy supply companies.

Government have realized it would be suicide to sell the grid. The grid was privatised years ago in NI and has suffered from a serious lack of investment.
The grid suffered from neglect in RoI for years too but that had the effect of keeping prices down and amongst the cheapest in Europe.
Introducing competition has meant that prices have risen because the ESB had their prices set high so competitors would be attracted into the market and would peg a couple of % below the PES price.

One could formulate quite a strong argument that competition and privatization are two of the biggest factors that have led to higher electricity prices in this country.

dowlingm

Water might be "free", but the shocking state of "free" water in places like Galway got pretty expensive. Imposing a water charge BUT having that levied by a Water Board - NOT a county council - is vital to have proper planning and accountability for maintenance, while central government should continue to co-fund strategic infrastructure.

If you want free water, do what my granny does for her washing. Put out a rain barrel. Ability to pay should not be a Water Board issue, or indeed an ESB one - they are not social welfare agencies. The Social Welfare offices are responsible for hardship cases. At most, the ESB and Water Board should advise the Social Welfare when a final notice is issued so that the Social can ask the householders if they wish to apply for some form of hardship relief.

Mike 1972

In the old (East) German Democratic Republic electricity was practically free (or at least heavily subsidised and included with ones rent). It (among other things) was credited with effectively bankrupting the country.

galwayrush

Stark wrote: »

The quality standards for tap water are a lot higher than for bottled water.

A lot of people in Galway would disagree with that.:rolleyes:

Stark

Having something fail quality standards doesn't change the nature of those standards.

charlemont

If anyone is finding it hard to pay their bills then all they have to do is pick up the phone, have their present meter reading, bank details for direct debit and switch over to an alternative electricity supplier and put the previous bills where they belong...:)

Mike 1972

Stark wrote: »

Having something fail quality standards doesn't change the nature of those standards.

Nope but if its happening pretty consistently with damn all being done about it those "standards" are rendered pretty worthless.

Priori

liammur wrote: »

ESB seem to have changed policy since competition has arrived in the market.

See the following video. Worth a watch.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ug969WSniY0

Worztron

No household should be left without electricity if they genuinely cannot pay their electricity bill. There is a big difference between wont and cant pay.
If prisoners were denied electricity, they'd say their human rights were being denied so why should an innocent citizen be denied.
Electricity in this modern age is a necessity. Shame on the ESB. It is also a disgrace that the head of the ESB is being paid €750,000 per year (a good example of cronyism and jobs for the boys).

Zen65

moceri wrote: »

Generation could be privatized but not the National Grid. This Government will surely balls it up like they did with the TELECOM EIREANN privatization.

I'm fairly certain that generation of electricity is fully open to competition. At least 50% of all the electricity Ireland is produced privately.

Z

Zen65

Worztron wrote: »

No household should be left without electricity if they genuinely cannot pay their electricity bill. There is a big difference between wont and cant pay.

I agree fully. The Dept of Social Welfare can provide free electricity allowances to anyone who falls into the category of "can't pay". It is not the role of electricity companies to pay these allowances.

Worztron wrote: »

If prisoners were denied electricity, they'd say their human rights were being denied so why should an innocent citizen be denied.

That's a peculiar argument. Prisoners receive free accommodation, food, water, clothing and energy for heating and lighting. There are also arrangements in place to provide support for the poorest in the country to acquire accommodation, food, electricity/fuel, etc through the Dept of Social Welfare.

However, since all of these supports (to prisoners, to unemployed, to low-paid, etc) are ultimately paid for by the taxpayer there must be a limit to how much support is available. If people exceed their allowances and are unable to pay their bills, they must take responsibility for that.

Worztron wrote: »

It is also a disgrace that the head of the ESB is being paid €750,000 per year (a good example of cronyism and jobs for the boys).

Hmm, this is a fair comment but this argument is a red herring in the context of disconnections. ESB is run as a private company (it is state-owned, but not state-funded) and it is has been profitable up to now. In order to get the best results it is arguable that they must pay the market rate for a CEO. While I agree that €750k is a mad amount to pay anyone for running a company, I would not single out ESB nor any individual CEO to point the finger at.

The CEO of a company does not cough up the investment to fund the company's ventures. He/she takes only a moderate personal risk in running the company (although he/she is at the mercy of shareholders who can be fickle) so exorbitant salaries such as the banks etc have been paying out is really unjustified. Worse again the bonuses which focus on short-term gain by the company (or on short-term indicators of gain such as the volume of loans) really encourage deplorable risk-taking by these executives, with the results which we have all seen and are now suffering from.

Be at peace,

Z

dowlingm

+1. There are ways to help customers in need whether through negotiated schedules, MABS etc. but ESB are not a social service - Social Welfare is.