Shimming a scope for windage??

Vegeta

Having a problem with getting the brother's scope set up on the rifle and could really use your help.

We have a problem with the windage adjustments, when the scope is centred for windage and mounted on rifle, it is way off target. Not wanting to waste a lot of the MOA adjustments I would rather get the scope sitting on the rifle a bit straighter.

The thing is though how the hell will I shim it for windage:
A piece of photo negative or film inside the rings touching the scope tube on one side?? Concerns over causing stress on the scope
Something between the mount and the rail?? If so what? Hard to visualise a solution with this method.
Just bite the bullet and try and get some decent windage adjustable mounts?

I would really like to fix this as cheaply as possible for him as he doesn't have the cash to be throwing at new mounts.

All comments and recommendations welcomed.

rrpc

That sounds very strange Vegeta. The scope should be centred almost by default. There must be something damaged or off centre for it to be out the way you describe.

One way would be to file off some material from the inside of the clamp on the front mount or the back mount so that it shifts slightly in the direction of the bullet strike.

Edit: Sorry that's probably not as clear as I intended . Mountings usually have a fixed side and a clamping side. If you take material off the fixed side it should change the horizontal orientation of the scope depending on which side is fixed. So if the bullet is striking to the left of the point of aim and the fixed side of the clamp is on the right, you file off a bit on the front mount, effectively rotating the scope slightly to the left. If the POI is to the right, then you adjust the back mount.

shedd7

rrpc wrote: »

That sounds very strange Vegeta. The scope should be centred almost by default. There must be something damaged or off centre for it to be out the way you describe.

One way would be to file off some material from the inside of the clamp on the front mount or the back mount so that it shifts slightly in the direction of the bullet strike.

Edit: Sorry that's probably not as clear as I intended . Mountings usually have a fixed side and a clamping side. If you take material off the fixed side it should change the horizontal orientation of the scope depending on which side is fixed. So if the bullet is striking to the left of the point of aim and the fixed side of the clamp is on the right, you file off a bit on the front mount, effectively rotating the scope slightly to the left. If the POI is to the right, then you adjust the back mount.

Or you could just try putting the mounts on with the locking screws on the opposite side, if that doesn't work ,try swapping the mounts i.e. use the one on the front on the rear and vice versa. Assuming it's not a one piece mount,of course.:D

Tackleberrywho

Vegeta wrote: »

Having a problem with getting the brother's scope set up on the rifle and could really use your help.

We have a problem with the windage adjustments, when the scope is centred for windage and mounted on rifle, it is way off target. Not wanting to waste a lot of the MOA adjustments I would rather get the scope sitting on the rifle a bit straighter.

Have you tried running a level across the mounts?
take off scope, level mounts ensuring they are parallel with the rifle.
If you get the the rifle level in a vise, then level the mounts to the rifle, then level the scope to the mounts/rings it should be level.


I would really like to fix this as cheaply as possible for him as he doesn't have the cash to be throwing at new mounts.

All comments and recommendations welcomed.

The suggestion of having the mounts facing opposite directions might work as the offset might neutralize.

If all three lines, rifle base,mounts,scope are level with each other your scope has to be centered.

Have you got anyone that could lend you mountys to check to see if your mounts are fcuked?

I could get you a lend of a 30mm set "with Windage in the mount via 2 allen grub screws."

It sounds top me that your mounts are crooked on rifle by a mill or more

sincere113

Have a look 1/2 way down this page... Stumbled across this just last night !

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2055444087&page=3

Tackleberrywho

sincere113 wrote: »

Have a look 1/2 way down this page... Stumbled across this just last night !

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2055444087&page=3

also

Torque down all the screws, see does one of them require more turns to tighten than the others or vice versa
A small burr on the mounting rail could cause a misalignment

Vegeta

rrpc wrote: »

That sounds very strange Vegeta. The scope should be centred almost by default. There must be something damaged or off centre for it to be out the way you describe.

One way would be to file off some material from the inside of the clamp on the front mount or the back mount so that it shifts slightly in the direction of the bullet strike.

Edit: Sorry that's probably not as clear as I intended . Mountings usually have a fixed side and a clamping side. If you take material off the fixed side it should change the horizontal orientation of the scope depending on which side is fixed. So if the bullet is striking to the left of the point of aim and the fixed side of the clamp is on the right, you file off a bit on the front mount, effectively rotating the scope slightly to the left. If the POI is to the right, then you adjust the back mount.

Yeah, I get ya.

It may well come to that too

Cass

Few questions.

What mounts, one piece or two, which rings, make, one what rifle. Are they staight onto the receiver or on a rail.

If you could give as much info as possible might make it a little easier to solve.

Vegeta

Tackleberrywho wrote: »

It sounds top me that your mounts are crooked on rifle by a mill or more

We did have the same problem with different mounts and a different scope.

So I think it is either how we are putting the rings on or a problem machined in the rifle.

I think the last time we just sucked it up that the Zeiss was almost completely out of windage adjustments to get it zeored.

Not going to settle for that this time

It's a remington 700, it's got 2 piece picantinny rail (this is new and the problem existed before this) and I am not sure of the ring brand. We are attaching the rings from the bolt action side i.e. tightening all 4 ring screws from the right hand side of the rifle.

That make sense or is there a recommendation from Remington about which side the scope screws should go on?

Vegeta

ezridax wrote: »

Few questions.

What mounts, one piece or two, which rings, make, one what rifle. Are they staight onto the receiver or on a rail.

If you could give as much info as possible might make it a little easier to solve.

One piece mounts, warne I think, same as these



On a remington 700, on 2 piece picantinny base.

That make sense?

Tackleberrywho

Vegeta wrote: »

We did have the same problem with different mounts and a different scope.

So I think it is either how we are putting the rings on or a problem machined in the rifle.

I think the last time we just sucked it up that the Zeiss was almost completely out of windage adjustments to get it zeored.

Not going to settle for that this time

It's a remington 700, it's got 2 piece picantinny rail (this is new and the problem existed before this) and I am not sure of the ring brand. We are attaching the rings from the bolt action side i.e. tightening all 4 ring screws from the right hand side of the rifle.

That make sense or is there a recommendation from Remington about which side the scope screws should go on?

I have same Remington 2 piece Picantinny rail.
I have Burris mounts tightened from the bolt side of the rifle with 3/8" nuts.

I think your mount holes on the rifle may be faulty ie off alignment. If the rifle is new I'd go to dealer.
If the rifle is not new a customrifle builder might be able to re-tap your rifle "TRUE"
I saw this done to a Ruger recently where the owner had wrung screws off in rifle after dropping rifle.

the action was put in a mill, and the holes were re drilled & tapped.

Putting the action in a mill would tell you if the holes are off centre. All current evidence is pointing there.

Cass

Going on the assumption that the scope is 100% then the problem lies in the rings and mounts. I always advise to stay away from 2 piece mounts (too much hassle), but as this is not an option we work around it.

A few people/friends have had the same problem. All with 2 piece mounts. I usually try the other suggestions above. Switching mounts, turning them, etc. Most times this fixes the problem. Usually it comes down to proper alignment of the 2 piece mounts. Even the smallest fraction out and they twist the rings causing the problems with the windage. Other times it is both mounts are actually straight with each other but not "straight" on the rifle.

A quick test. Get a micrometer. Measure the width of the receiver where both pieces attach to the receiver. At the screws. Make a light pencil mark exactly at exactly the half way point on the receiver. Now measure the 2 piece mounts. Mark each one exactly in the middle. Affix them to the rifle. The mark on the mounts should line up with the marks on the receiver. If they do not it will show you which way they are pulling the scope of center.

johngalway

But I went clicking with my rig.

From O I can go 77 clicks left and a whopping 194 right.

From O I can go 189 down and 199 up.

greenpeter

Tackleberrywho wrote: »

I have same Remington 2 piece Picantinny rail.
I have Burris mounts tightened from the bolt side of the rifle with 3/8" nuts.

I think your mount holes on the rifle may be faulty ie off alignment. If the rifle is new I'd go to dealer.
If the rifle is not new a customrifle builder might be able to re-tap your rifle "TRUE"
I saw this done to a Ruger recently where the owner had wrung screws off in rifle after dropping rifle.

the action was put in a mill, and the holes were re drilled & tapped.

Putting the action in a mill would tell you if the holes are off centre. All current evidence is pointing there.

Any reason to have the nuts on the bolt side?
In the process of fitting mine.
Thanks

Vegeta

johngalway wrote: »

But I went clicking with my rig.

From O I can go 77 clicks left and a whopping 194 right.

From O I can go 189 down and 199 up.

Yeah that's not great but not terrible, looking at the drop charts for cheapy American Eagle 50 grain hollow point flat bases out of my rifle it would be just enough for 20 mile an hour wind at 500 yards. Take from that what you will

The 300 Win Mag was worse, off paper at 30 yards

Going to give it a good shot tomorrow night and see can we sort it. This is one time a laser bore sighter would be a god send

Tackleberrywho

Vegeta wrote: »

Yeah that's not great but not terrible, looking at the drop charts for cheapy American Eagle 50 grain hollow point flat bases out of my rifle it would be just enough for 20 mile an hour wind at 500 yards. Take from that what you will

The 300 Win Mag was worse, off paper at 30 yards

Going to give it a good shot tomorrow night and see can we sort it. This is one time a laser bore sighter would be a god send

I think the only way you will get your answer is by dialing it in on a mill and checking alignment

It wasn't me!

I've got that problem as well. Going to switch out for a set of Warne mounts or a one piece unit of some kind as I've maxed out the windage on my Schmidt. They're not known for huge adjustment anyway, but I'm not happy to have it at the very edge either. The two piece setup on the Optilocks is a pain in the arse anyway.

Tackleberrywho

greenpeter wrote: »

Any reason to have the nuts on the bolt side?
In the process of fitting mine.
Thanks

No reason, Thats just the way I put tehm on 2 years ago, and I put them back the same way every time

If it's not broke ........