The Corrib gas project should be suspended

Jeboa Safari

NewVision wrote: »

How developed?
Developed like Cameroon?
Developed like Nigeria?

I have previously pointed out that we can no more afford to give our resources, the country's last comodity, into the hands of multinationals.

You were asking for a fairer share for our country. Not even that is given to us.

The multinationals don't care about the people. They don't care about safety, about the social climate they're causing.

The two main aims of a multinational company are

maximising profits in the shortest period of time.

financial growth and influence.

The conditions for drilling in this country are set by a gremium of several multinationals and one Irish minister. Doesn't that look insane?

The times 'we need to attrack' those companies are well over considering worldwide growing demand and price. Canada is dealing with peak gas already.

On the one hand we're shoveling 35 billion euro into a bank to shut it down literally.

On the other hand we read that Ireland hasn't the money to (invest some 2 to 3 billion to) put up its own petroleum industry to manage and control its own resources, a business profitable tens if not even hundreds of billions of euros.

:eek:

Is it the odd believe that dumb Irish, ourselves, wouldn't find some gas?
We have to be greatful to those companies 'creating wealth for the country'. Because we, ourselves, are not capable of creating wealth with our comodities? Not in the existing way I'm afraid. Getting 25% share of the country's own 'weath' back some day is a very bad option, ladies and gentlemen. It is the worst deal of it's kind currently I would know in Europe.

What would you do with Anglo?
Not a bad deal for the country.
You do realise how our current market works dont you? Profit drives it.
We can't just tell shell to f**k off now that they've nearly built it.
There has also been some shell contributions to the community. They gave 200k to the RNLI when they were fundraising, and of course there was people complaining that this comprimised the RNLI, which is ridiculus.
Well what if the Irish government, did invest 2-3 billion, and there turned out to be no gas? I'm sure you'd be one of the first complaining.

NewVision

Deadline for submission to John Gormley tomorow, 30th of August, 2010

FlutterinBantam

Peddle your outdated left wing rubbish elsewhere .

Here's a suggestion, get down to the Fás office and apply for a job and contribute.

Stop being a burden and maybe for once think of supporting the state.

The former USSR is

---

> thataway;)

Eliot Rosewater

FlutterinBantam wrote: »

Here's a suggestion, get down to the Fás office and apply for a job and contribute.

In fairness, there's nothing to suggest that NewVision doesn't have a job or that he isn't contributing. In fact, with an unemployment rate of roughly 12.5%, he's 7 times more likely to have a job than not.

But you do raise an interesting point. Many on the Left, and thus many in S2S, consistently demonize and criticise big bad businesses and corporations. However, a lot of these companies are engaging with environmental problems and trying to formulate constructive solutions to them. Members of S2S are doing nothing to help the environment. They're only wasting taxpayer's money by forcing such a large Garda contingent to be present in Corrib; money that could be spent on environmental programs. So the irony is that the people S2S are wont to criticise are actually the ones doing the work.

FlutterinBantam

I have apologised for those rather ill-judged remarks and will not be posting in Politics for some time.

Sorry 'bout that and I withdraw any inference of not contributing.

FB

NewVision

Eliot Rosewater wrote: »

In fairness, there's nothing to suggest that NewVision doesn't have a job or that he isn't contributing. In fact, with an unemployment rate of roughly 12.5%, he's 7 times more likely to have a job than not.

In Donegal it's roughly 30% unemployment rate now.

Contributing to what?

And anyway does it matter how much someone earns, or whether s/he applies for a Fás course or not, that you have the right to have a stance and a voice?

FlutterinBantam's contributions are just right wing ... what is coming out of him backwards... whatever provocations.

Don't know why this kind of a joker hasn't got red already.
Maybe they keep him as kinda "half-time entertainment"
Not a funny one in my view.

Eliot Rosewater wrote: »

But you do raise an interesting point. Many on the Left, and thus many in S2S, consistently demonize and criticise big bad businesses and corporations. However, a lot of these companies are engaging with environmental problems and trying to formulate constructive solutions to them. Members of S2S are doing nothing to help the environment. They're only wasting taxpayer's money by forcing such a large Garda contingent to be present in Corrib; money that could be spent on environmental programs. So the irony is that the people S2S are wont to criticise are actually the ones doing the work.

Are you kidding?
You are blaming that S2S would cost taxpayers money, which could better be spent on environmental issues, being unhelpful for our environment therefore, because they protest against a corrupt system made a corrupt deal with Shell who actually is causing polution and breaching the contract

...

Easier to just call people a 'bunch of leftwing greenies contributing nothing to our society but trouble' I suppose. Saves bothering beyond what's going on.

Edit: Just realising. FlutterinBantam dismissed. Good job. Cheers...

Scofflaw

Just to remind you, NewVision - what's sauce for the goose is sauce for the gander. There's no difference between him provoking you and you provoking him as far as I'm concerned.

moderately,
Scofflaw

Eliot Rosewater

NewVision wrote: »

Are you kidding?

No, I'm not kidding. The Shell To Sea protest is going nowhere. It is going to achieve exactly nothing. The situation, whether you agree with it or not, is a permanent one. The protesters would be better off getting into research or starting green companies to help the environment.

NewVision wrote: »

You are blaming that S2S would cost taxpayers money

It's not a conditional 'would'; it's a present tense 'is'. The Corrib Garda presence of 100 officers is costing this country about four million euro a year. Given that the protest is futile, this is a complete and utter waste of money.

NewVision wrote: »

which could better be spent on environmental issues, being unhelpful for our environment therefore, because they protest against a corrupt system made a corrupt deal with Shell who actually is causing polution and breaching the contract.

You have to stop banging this drum. You've been given overwhelming evidence here to show that the regulations under which oil and gas companies operate in Ireland are the most favourable for the exploration of the resources and for government revenue. This evidence was backed up by official reports, legislation and statistics.

But you have consistently refused to consider these arguments. As such, I feel it futile to respond to your corruption allegation because I know that, quite simply, you're not listening to me at all.

NewVision wrote: »

Easier to just call people a 'bunch of leftwing greenies contributing nothing to our society but trouble' I suppose. Saves bothering beyond what's going on.

Whether it's easier or not, this name calling was not the predominant feature of the thread. Careful and rational argument was; argument you have totally ignored.

NewVision

Scofflaw wrote: »

Just to remind you, NewVision - what's sauce for the goose is sauce for the gander. There's no difference between him provoking you and you provoking him as far as I'm concerned.

moderately,
Scofflaw

Compare to that guy I didn't only shout, I only shouted back once.
Makes a difference, doesn't it?

Eliot Rosewater wrote: »

No, I'm not kidding. The Shell To Sea protest is going nowhere. It is going to achieve exactly nothing. The situation, whether you agree with it or not, is a permanent one. The protesters would be better off getting into research or starting green companies to help the environment.

Is that because you want it or because you say it?
Was that a call for 'protesters wanted for environmental research'?
The research is already available and this because of S2S et al.

Eliot Rosewater wrote: »

It's not a conditional 'would'; it's a present tense 'is'. The Corrib Garda presence of 100 officers is costing this country about four million euro a year. Given that the protest is futile, this is a complete and utter waste of money.

Who says that about 4 million a year could be saved if protest suddenly stopped (as that would even happen) against the Corrib Gas Project in its current form?
Compare to the money could be raised by a 'better deal' and by restructuring our policies concerning this matter, a drip in the ocean anyhow.

Eliot Rosewater wrote: »

You have to stop banging this drum. You've been given overwhelming evidence here to show that the regulations under which oil and gas companies operate in Ireland are the most favourable for the exploration of the resources and for government revenue. This evidence was backed up by official reports, legislation and statistics.

You'r trying to put my posting upside down.
There has been no proof that this deal is the 'most favourable'. You owe us this 'evidence'. I could prove that Ireland is on the bottom of the world's countrie when it comes to royalties from oil and gas drilling corporations. I could prove there is 0% royalties for us in Corrib. Any worse deal on royalties would mean we would be paying Shell to explore our resources.

Eliot Rosewater wrote: »

But you have consistently refused to consider these arguments. As such, I feel it futile to respond to your corruption allegation because I know that, quite simply, you're not listening to me at all.

Come forward. What do you know more about?

Eliot Rosewater wrote: »

Whether it's easier or not, this name calling was not the predominant feature of the thread. Careful and rational argument was; argument you have totally ignored.

What argument am I ignoring, Sir. May I have a chance to un-ignore it then?

I think I wrote quite a lot of arguments why I'm supporting the campaign.

NewVision

Scofflaw wrote: »

Just to remind you, NewVision - what's sauce for the goose is sauce for the gander. There's no difference between him provoking you and you provoking him as far as I'm concerned.

moderately,
Scofflaw

You're already giving me a second infraction point at boards.ie.

This time for 'Breach of Peace'

Is it the third one out then?

May I ask your consideration about you possibly overreacted a little?

How else has it been possible that on the other hand you've had a poster, registered since 2006 who has been posting some 9,190 posts? Regarded as man sitting on a toilet with a mobile at his ear, was commenting some obvious fascist views for so long?

Don't want to believe that. I suppose I won't be here for that long then.

Scofflaw

NewVision wrote: »

You're already giving me a second infraction point at boards.ie.

This time for 'Breach of Peace'

Is it the third one out then?

May I ask your consideration about you possibly overreacted a little?

How else has it been possible that on the other hand you've had a poster, registered since 2006 who has been posting some 9,190 posts? Regarded as man sitting on a toilet with a mobile at his ear, was commenting some obvious fascist views for so long?

Don't want to believe that. I suppose I won't be here for that long then.

Indeed - certainly not for the next week anyway. You could use the time to read the forum charter, since you seem to have skipped that step.

moderately,
Scofflaw

yermanoffthetv

From reading the 13 pages of this thread: 1) my eyes hurt and 2) i have not seen one scrap of hard fact from the S2S advocates reguards this project just "evil corporations this, corrupt politicans that..ect" pipe fed and regurgatated from the likes of indemedia/youtube. The complete ignorance to any economic understanding or indeed concept of law of the land is just astounding really.

Cudos to Oafley Jones with the atricle: http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=67689846&postcount=166 Pretty much is pulls the rug from the whole S2S arguement. While the Garda review article nails the lid on it. Why these morons continue with the endless vuvuzela like drone of "Dude! Eire has been rooobed mwa" on and on and on and on and on to infinity....arrrgh someone need to teach these people how to listen. Maybe we should invite the Russian police over to protect the Shell workers. I think theyd get the picture fairly sharpish

NewVision

yermanoffthetv wrote: »

... Maybe we should invite the Russian police over to protect the Shell workers. I think theyd get the picture fairly sharpish

Already happening.
Shell is hiring Eastern European security companies and within Russian employees to do the 'dirty job'.

Eliot Rosewater

NewVision wrote: »

There has been no proof that this deal is the 'most favourable'. You owe us this 'evidence'.

I'll post links, for the last time.

The principle argument is summed up nicely in this post by Scofflaw.

This post gives good reasons as to why comparing Ireland with Norway is inappropriate.

There are other arguments peppered across this thread. The first link is the main one.

NewVision

Eliot Rosewater wrote: »

I'll post links, for the last time.

The principle argument is summed up nicely in this post by Scofflaw.

This post gives good reasons as to why comparing Ireland with Norway is inappropriate.

There are other arguments peppered across this thread. The first link is the main one.

Eliot, I've put some more arguments on the table than you just pointing to two links where the arguments are more than overhauled.

NewVision

Controversy over Corrib gas - The Irish Times - Mon, Sep 06, 2010