Dont Label them Junkies

actuallylike

seamus wrote: »

For a start because you can't choose to be black, Spanish or Pakistani so ethnic slurs have connotations of discrimination, as well as the obvious racism.

A fair point.

seamus wrote: »

You choose to be a junkie scumbag.

In fairness, I don't think anyone chooses to be a junkie scumbag, they choose to do drugs, obviously the wrong decision but they're upbringing, circle of friends or just general ignorance to the consequences will play a factor in this decision.

seamus wrote: »

We should we holding these people up in public as perfect examples of everything that you should never become. Show kids pictures of gaunt and dying junkies with needles hanging out of their arms, blood seeping from the sores on their body. It should be a social stigma, you should be left in the gutter and treated with contempt until you make the decision to get yourself off the junk and get some help.

That's your view and that's fair enough, I personally am on the fence about it. Obviously there are some people out there that are the lowest of the low, don't want to change while there are government handouts and will rob their mother without an iota of care but there are also a number of addicts who fell into their drug spiral due to varying uncontrollable circumstances that hate their life and want to change but find it extremely difficult with this stigma attached to them.
I personally would want to do whatever is possible to help these get back on their feet and by treating them with a bit of kindness and understanding will help them, then so be it.
Again, it's all just a theory or an idea. Whether it would make a difference is anyone's guess. It really is up to the users but I think there's merit in the idea.

Myrddin

actuallylike wrote: »

In fairness, the word junkie adds a stigma to the person, a bad stigma that most people don't want top be associated with. Eliminating it may (I'm just saying may now, I completely understand that it may also not work) give the users a bit of a boost to turn their life around?


Well, why can't we call black people n*ggers? It's just a variation on the spanish word negro for black. Why can't we call Spanish people spics? It's just a shortening of Hispanic. Why can't I call a person from Pakistan a Paki? It's just a shortening of their origin?

Reason is that they have over the years been deemed offensive and a slur and I think that is what the author is suggesting, that the word 'junkie' has or is becoming a slur also.

Well if they don't want to be associated with drugs, they should stop using them. The fact is they DO use drugs, so association is going to happen. Theres a member of my family who I would quantify as a Junkie, its what he is, I'm not going to pamper him. I suppose joy-riders don't want to be associated with stealing either? Should we just call them "disadvantaged people who are bored and decide to travel fast in an exciting manner"? "Oh one of those disadvantaged people who are bored decided to use my car to travel fast in an exciting manner last night, I'm so p1ssed off now because of their selfishness".

Junkies earned their tag, robbing handbags, stealing money, lying on the street half baked with kids around, story bud ha yar gor eh uro for me bus fareh etc. Thats a junkie. Someone who uses drugs recreationally @ weekends or whatever, holds down a job, provides for their family etc - well that's something different.

Your other arguments hold no merit, as it's a completely different ball game. Local slang/tags for people is a long way off interpreted racism. My point initially was, where do we draw the line?

candy-gal1

Fecking PC brigade! :rolleyes:


What happened to telling it like it is?!

Myrddin

candy-gal1 wrote: »

Fecking PC brigade! :rolleyes:


What happened to telling it like it is?!

The Celtic Tiger had it for breakfast

seamus

actuallylike wrote: »

but they're upbringing, circle of friends or just general ignorance to the consequences will play a factor in this decision.

The factors leading up to their decision may explain why they did it, but it doesn't excuse it or make it any less their own problem. The Irish justice system has the same problem - they treat people from poorer or less educated backgrounds as being less responsible for their actions by virtue of that poorer background. Whatever happened to "All citizens are held equal before the law"? Their background is irrelevant - we all have to lie in the beds that we make and play the hand that we're dealt. (I'm resisting the urge to put a Zaph Branigan quote in here).

I personally would want to do whatever is possible to help these get back on their feet and by treating them with a bit of kindness and understanding will help them, then so be it.

I will pump millions into treatment centres, education centres and rehab centres. But I wouldn't waste a single euro on anyone who didn't seek out help themselves, because you cannot force your assistance on anyone. They have to consciously choose to take the help and arrive at a rehab centre, asking for help and willing to be locked away for 6 months to deal with it.

Half of them in rehab or on methadone continue to take drugs while on their rehabilitation courses and end up back on the streets within weeks, with thousands in taxpayer money wasted on nothing.

Lemegeton

funny pisstake about this subject

http://www.thedailymash.co.uk/news/society/junkies-to-be-renamed-'heroin-buffs'-201008243031/

recylingbin

seamus wrote: »

. Whatever happened to "All citizens are held equal before the law"?

Ask Eddie Halvey.

bazmaiden

heroin injection technician

WindSock

If people from the lower classes get treated more fairly by the justice system, then why are the majority in prison and on the streets from these classes?

seamus

WindSock wrote: »

If people from the lower classes get treated more fairly by the justice system, then why are the majority in prison and on the streets from these classes?

Because the majority of crime is committed by these classes...

Pauleta

Is Smack head ok?

WindSock

Certain types of crimes. There are criminals from every class, some are easier targets than others.

henryporter

Wonder what William Burroughs would think if he were still around "hmm I think I'll call my book 'Drug Addict' that'll really sell...." more like "What the bloody F*ck are these ar$eholes talking about"

actuallylike

EnterNow wrote: »

Well if they don't want to be associated with drugs, they should stop using them.

Not that easy, it's all well and good for someone who isn't addicted to say "well just stop using them". Heroin addiction I imagine is one of the hardest addictions to beat.

EnterNow wrote: »

The fact is they DO use drugs, so association is going to happen. Theres a member of my family who I would quantify as a Junkie, its what he is, I'm not going to pamper him.

Nobody's asking you to pamper him, the issue is to stop reffering to him as a junkie. Maybe (and I use this term again, I'm not saying it will or won't work) it might change his outlook if he's not categorised as a scurge on society? It's just a maybe now, that's all.

EnterNow wrote: »

I suppose joy-riders don't want to be associated with stealing either?

Do they all steal cars? No, and that's my point. Some use their own cars. Admittedly, thay all break the rules of the roads but they don't all steal their cars to do it. Same way, all heroin addicts don't rob and steal. Some just find it extremely hard to break the habit and try to their best but they are labelled amongst the same people who rob and steal as you describe.

EnterNow wrote: »

Junkies earned their tag, robbing handbags, stealing money, lying on the street half baked with kids around, story bud ha yar gor eh uro for me bus fareh etc. Thats a junkie. Someone who uses drugs recreationally @ weekends or whatever, holds down a job, provides for their family etc - well that's something different.

Of course it's something different, I wouldn't deny that at all. I don't recall saying anything about that, sorry if I gave the wrong impression.

EnterNow wrote: »

Local slang/tags for people is a long way off interpreted racism.

I don't know about that, you are interpreting someone who is addicted to heroin as a robbing, stealing degenerate that doesn't want help when I'm positive that there are people addicted that want to change but just can't get the mental attitude to commit to it.

seamus wrote: »

The factors leading up to their decision may explain why they did it, but it doesn't excuse it or make it any less their own problem. The Irish justice system has the same problem - they treat people from poorer or less educated backgrounds as being less responsible for their actions by virtue of that poorer background. Whatever happened to "All citizens are held equal before the law"? Their background is irrelevant - we all have to lie in the beds that we make and play the hand that we're dealt. (I'm resisting the urge to put a Zaph Branigan quote in here).

I'm not looking for excuses, you're right they made their bed (albeit a manky, crusty foam mat probably) but all this is is about stopping a reference that is deemed a slur.
Bear in mind, the thread is about stopping the use of the word junkie, that's all, and I for one can see the point in this.
That Zaph Brannigan quote would have sold me

I'm going to stop with this thread now cause I don't think it's really going anywhere productive, I have my views which I stand by and others have...well others. There's no universal right or wrong answer to this, just personal opinions ("Mars bars are lovely","no they're not they're manky", etc.) which I find pretty futile to continue with.

Dudess

Are people here being disingenuous/deliberately obtuse? I don't have a problem with the word "junkie" but the reason there is an appeal for people not to use it is: it's a derogatory term. Nobody says they can't still be referred to as drug addicts, so the "I suppose we can't call paedophiles paedophiles and rapists rapists" comments are moot.

Sykk wrote: »

Well the retards knew what they were doing when they started didn't they. Fúck them, junkies.

You'd have done things differently if you were one of them eh? Easy to say that from your comfortable ivory tower.

Sykk wrote: »

Not all people who drink are addicted to it. Now I've not heard of people who like the odd line.

I have.

um7y1h83ge06nx

I hate to way people just use bullsh*t excuses to absolve themselves of personal responsibility. People need to grow up and live in the real world. We've all had set backs in life but we didn't all decide to stick a needle in our arms and inject sh*t into ourselves.

My mother HATES people that blame their situation on their upbringing whne they're dragged into court etc. Her mother died when she was 12 and her father ended up in hospital long term with Polio two years after that. When she was 14-15 she was looking after a household of kids while her two older brothers kept the farm going. None of them ended up as junkies or addicted to other substances.

strobe

Sykk wrote: »

Not all people who drink are addicted to it. Now I've not heard of people who like the odd line.. JUNKIES! :pac:

You would be in a minority there then.

Degsy

Dudess wrote: »

it's a derogatory term.

Good..i wish i could think of a more derogatory term for people who've dedicated thier whole lives to the selfish and criminal pursuit of injecting themselves with drugs soo THEY can feel good..if only for a second.

I think junky is too leniant a term for people who drag two year old children around town with them while they beg,steal and deal in order to satisfy thier cravings.

I hate the scum who think that doctors and chemists are there primarily to look after them and stop them feeling "sick" while everybody who works for a living has to pay for a doctor's visit,and often will forgo seeking treatment for a genuine illness because of it.

What about the lovely people who inject drugs on the luas in front of commuters,tourists and children?Should they be dignified with a less-derogatory term for fear of offending them?

The sooner people wake up to the fact that junkies are an ever-increasing menace,a state-sponsored subculture and not some sort of forgotten-victims of our social concsience the better.

Myrddin

Dudess wrote: »

Nobody says they can't still be referred to as drug addicts, so the "I suppose we can't call paedophiles paedophiles and rapists rapists" comments are moot.

Well what about paedos, scumbags etc, are those words next? I see what your saying Dudess, but in my opinion there is a difference between a Junkie & a drug user. As I said earlier, stealing, & lying on the streets in front of people out of your face fully justifies someone being called a Junkie. They ARE a scourge to society, and should be made fully aware how much of a scourge they are.

A genuine user with responsibilities who harms nobody, & enjoys it on their own time, well no, live & let live in that case. So it's more complicated than the "if you take drugs your a junkie, but thats a bad word" debate. I seriously wonder if Irish society has the intelligence to even BE politically correct sometimes. People will whine & moan about junkies/head shops/heroin all week, & then come the weekend, spend their wages getting blitzed on alchohol.

Dudess

Yara Grumpy Reactivation wrote: »

People need to grow up and live in the real world.

I agree.

We've all had set backs in life but we didn't all decide to stick a needle in our arms and inject sh*t into ourselves.

We've all had setbacks in life but some people have had FAR worse setbacks than others.

My mother HATES people that blame their situation on their upbringing whne they're dragged into court etc. Her mother died when she was 12 and her father ended up in hospital long term with Polio two years after that. When she was 14-15 she was looking after a household of kids while her two older brothers kept the farm going. None of them ended up as junkies or addicted to other substances.

Fair play to your mother - not an environment where there's heroin though, to be fair.
I despair of people being so dismissive of heroin addicts when they have no idea what brought them to that point, and never will - when a person who was born to a teenage heroin addict and spent their life in and out of care posts to this thread their negative views on junkies, I'll pay heed, but until then: you've no ****ing idea what you're talking about.
And yes, I know many people don't go down the road of heroin despite horrific lives, but only because they are a lot stronger than your average bear.

Blazer

I fúcking hate junkies...blah blah society is to blame for my complete lack of willpower in not saying no to drugs like heroin/coke etc.
Sure you have a setback,....get off your ass and work it out, not go home and inject/snort yourself full of drugs..

I'm sick of all this pc shíte.
I have a meeting today where I had to listen to some HR woman talking about the great women's network they were setting up...
Then I remember hearing how the EU want to force companies to have a set quota of women on the board.
If I see a woman in a good job more than likely it's because she got there through her own ability and fair play to her...I also agree she should be paid the exact same as a bloke doing the same job.
If the EU get their way then I'll view her as being the token woman, probably slept with half the board to get her seat etc....

I frakking hate PC muppets more than anything else in this world.

candy-gal1

Sykk wrote: »

Not all people who drink are addicted to it. Now I've not heard of people who like the odd line.. JUNKIES! :pac:

No your right i wouldnt call someone who liked the odd line of coke a junkie, they are idiots!

Myrddin

Dudess wrote: »

when a person who was born to a teenage heroin addict and spent their life in and out of care posts to this thread their negative views on junkies, I'll pay heed, but until then: you've no ****ing idea what you're talking about.

Is that a general statement, or directed at Super_Sonic? I've no doubt there's PLENTY of Boardsies here who's life or family has been touched by drug addiction. And those that have, are fully qualified to express their interpretation of it. Theres an addict in my family, and let me tell you, his addiction is driven out of pure selfishness & greed. Nothing else. Yes there are those unfortunates who are born into it, I do sympathise with them. But I also know a LOT of people who have no excuses, they are junkies because they WANT to be, and that, deserves the tag.

The Highwayman

More PC bullsh1t

Whats next? Larry Murphy and other rapest will be called 'suprise love distributors'?

Myrddin

candy-gal1 wrote: »

No your right i wouldnt call someone who liked the odd line of coke a junkie, they are idiots!

Wow, trust me, far worse goes on all over the countrys pubs every weekend.

evercloserunion

Dudess wrote: »

Are people here being disingenuous/deliberately obtuse? I don't have a problem with the word "junkie" but the reason there is an appeal for people not to use it is: it's a derogatory term. Nobody says they can't still be referred to as drug addicts, so the "I suppose we can't call paedophiles paedophiles and rapists rapists" comments are moot.

You'd have done things differently if you were one of them eh? Easy to say that from your comfortable ivory tower.

I have.

Did you read the article?

People should stop calling heroin users "junkies" or "addicts", an influential think tank on drugs has said.

Which I think is truly ridiculous.

That said I largely agree with you, there is very little thought going into these posts.

Not that anyone cares, but because I like sh*ting on about my opinions but don't like repeating typing the same thing twice, my thoughts copy-pasted from another thread:

--

Hmm, that's an interesting article. I suppose the question is, the kind of people we have been talking about on this thread, would they bother trying to sort themselves out even if there wasn't a stigma attached to it? Also, I don't buy that the stigma results from the use of the word "junky" as opposed to the behaviour of these people. There are undoubtedly a lot of people out there who are seriously struggling with drug addiction and trying to sort themselves out. Far more damaging to these people is the perception of heroin users created by junkies walking down O'Connell Street strung out of their minds, harassing, stealing, pissing, puking, etc.

Also, LMFAO about not being allowed call them addicts.

candy-gal1

EnterNow wrote: »

Wow, trust me, far worse goes on all over the countrys pubs every weekend.

Ah i know but tbh who in their right mind puts some white powder up their nose willingly, more than once especially?! usually "posh" scangers lol

Myrddin

evercloserunion wrote: »

undoubtedly a lot of people out there who are seriously struggling with drug addiction and trying to sort themselves out.

Well that to me, allows that person the respect that they deserve. I would NOT quantify that person as a junkie. The issue is much bigger than that.

Degsy

Dudess wrote: »

I despair of people being so dismissive of heroin addicts when they have no idea what brought them to that point, and never will

the one thing that brought them to that point is the taking of heroin..nothing more,nothing less.

People deal with horror in thier lives in different ways..some seek religion,some self-harm,some get on with it,some drink and some take heroin...but nobody HAS to take heroin no matter how fcucked up thier lives are..its thier choice to take it nobody else's.

Drugs are for weak people..not strong people..you take drugs when you cant cope with reality,your choice,your decision.

Myrddin

candy-gal1 wrote: »

Ah i know but tbh who in their right mind puts some white powder up their nose willingly, more than once especially?! usually "posh" scangers lol

In principal, to me it's no worse than inhaling carcenogenic gases, & swallowing poisonous liquids, who in their right mind would do that? I'm not being smart here, but just bear than in mind next time you light one up

For the record, I do not do cocaine.....I can't afford it