Kerry car accident

easyeason3

http://www.independent.ie/national-news/four-teenagers-killed-in-co-kerry-road-accident-2310856.html

Very sad news. Families & friends lives will be torn apart yet again over this tragic accident.

My deepest sympathies go to the families & friends of these kids.


So in your opinion, what do you think should be done to prevent accidents like this happening?
Should there be compulsory classes in school to educate kids about driving & it's hazards or is there anything worthwhile that can be done?

I know this is AH but try to keep it respectful, family members or friends could be reading.

Biggins

As a parent of four children, I can't begin to imagine the happening of that unfortunate event.
My heart goes out to the family involved.
My sympathies to them.

damoz

Increase the minimum driving age to 21.

starlit

My deepest sympathies to all those who have been affected. My heart goes out to them.

Introduce compulsory driving education in secondary schools and maybe include an exam with a special certificate.

Celly Smunt

damoz wrote: »

Increase the minimum driving age to 21.

there are a lot of crapperer drivers over 21

The Agogo

damoz wrote: »

Increase the minimum driving age to 21.

Not a bad idea (except maybe 17+ yr/olds who need a car to work)....just don't discern between genders.

Sympathies to the families. Alot of factors need to be considered (terrible road systems, poor driving education/information, discipline, among other things)

damoz

pmcmahon wrote: »

there are a lot of crapperer drivers over 21

the statistics would beg to differ.

Celly Smunt

damoz wrote: »

the statistics would beg to differ.

common sense should be put in place of age.

damoz

pmcmahon wrote: »

common sense should be put in place of age.

In general (yes that word) - they are correlated.

Sykk

Awful news..

No increasing the age is ridiculous.. How about a driving test instead of sending the bloody license out in the post...

challengemaster

damoz wrote: »

the statistics would beg to differ.

Actual stats, or the RSA generated crap?

I drove past 2 crash scenes yesterday, one involving 2 cars, the other was a 3 car crash. In either case, none of the drivers were young.

Tomebagel

damoz wrote: »

Increase the minimum driving age to 21.

damoz wrote: »

the statistics would beg to differ.

And another rant about how all young male drivers are dangerous begins:rolleyes:

My thoughts are with the families and friends

Celly Smunt

damoz wrote: »

In general (yes that word) - they are correlated.

i beg to differ strongly.


but moving on,sympathies R.I.P

Kiera

damoz wrote: »

Increase the minimum driving age to 21.

I know an 18yr old who's a far better driver than some people i know that are over 30.

VERYinterested

easyeason3 wrote: »

So in your opinion, what do you think should be done to prevent accidents like this happening?

Set up more speed traps on safe, revenue generating and statistic distorting suburban roads!

Seriously though, I don't know what can be done, apart from getting kids to do a proper course when on Transition Year in school that might actually be of some use to them.

kippy

A lot of common sense comes with age..........sometimes you make a mistake at a young age and are lucky enough to be able to walk away having learnt a lot from it, sometimes you dont get that second chance.
Tough to know how to reduce these kind of accidents. Better driver education, perhaps a graduated driver education system, only allow certain hours where people of a certain age and drive in, but policing all this is the issue.


RIP to all, my thoughts are with the families.

Snowie

why do people feel the need to start these threads?

as much as it is a sad to hear

why start one and get a load of people who don't know the people to say sorry for some one they didnt know?

efb

Prevent young people carrying more than one passenger, with the exception of children of the driver.

myflipflops

We need to properly implement the rules we have concerning drivers on provisional licences and change others.

You are supposed to have a fully licensed driver with you at all times when you are on a provisional licence but this is not policed at all.

We have it backwards in Ireland. In most places, you learn to drive and then you get a car. Here, you get a car and then learn to drive. It leaves us with way too many poorly trained, inexperienced drivers on the road.

Biggins

Snow-Monkey wrote: »

...why start one and get a load of people who don't know the people to say sorry for some one they didnt know?

1. Because some care and wish to express regret at such things happening.

2. As a reminder that accidents occur and to be careful out there.

3. Because they in the accident have now passed away, their deaths will not be just not thought of with the same value as yesterdays chip wrapping paper. Lives have meaning, well at least to some.

Sorry if you don't get that.

Fratton Fred

really tragic news, RIP to those killed and my thoughts to those involved.


You can only legislate so far, maybe a few TDs should STFU about drink driving for a start, maybe driving tests should be tougher and a lot of the more dangerous roads improved.

Making the NCT test annual and actually making it ensure that a car is safe,rather than just a paper exercise to keep Brussels happy would also help.

At the end of the day though, accidents do happen and you can only legislate so far.

Dravokivich

easyeason3 wrote: »

Should there be compulsory classes in school to educate kids about driving & it's hazards or is there anything worthwhile that can be done?

Just because someone is thaught in school, doesn't mean they are going to come out better more aware drivers. It's all based on the individual who is driving and from my experience in school... not alot of them were set on learning / studying... It was all acting the maggot and taking shortcuts to get work done... Can you imagine that in a situation when someone is trying to instruct a kid how to drive?

r3nu4l

Snow-Monkey wrote: »

why do people feel the need to start these threads?

as much as it is a sad to hear

why start one and get a load of people who don't know the people to say sorry for some one they didnt know?

Well anyone with any empathy can relate these stories to people they know!

As a father myself I know that the thoughts of anything bad happening to my daughter makes me shiver so the thoughts that some parents out there are now faced with burying their children is heartbreaking!

Snow-monkey, maybe you should read this to get a sense of what I'm talking about.

00112984

Lower the ridiculously high insurance policies for young drivers.

I'm from Kerry and grew up in an area where you have two types of young male driver-

1) The types from wealthy families who drive around in souped-up, Modified Subarus and Audis and wore the fact that they could pay the insurance on such a car as a badge of honour. It went to their heads so we always had a lot of young guys racing eachother through towns just to draw attention to the fact that they could drive such cars.

2) The types from not so wealthy families who drove around in souped-up, modified Micras and Puntos and tried to keep up with the Subarus. Often, they've spent so much on mod kits and insurance that the car is a status-symbol among their peers.

Removing the high insurance costs would open the market to more young drivers and reduce the novelty, show-off factor that leads to speeding and reckless driving.

Would also support the introduction of driving lessons in schools.

kippy

00112984 wrote: »

Lower the ridiculously high insurance policies for young drivers.

I'm from Kerry and grew up in an area where you have two types of young male driver-

1) The types from wealthy families who drive around in souped-up, Modified Subarus and Audis and wore the fact that they could pay the insurance on such a car as a badge of honour. It went to their heads so we always had a lot of young guys racing eachother through towns just to draw attention to the fact that they could drive such cars.

2) The types from not so wealthy families who drove around in souped-up, modified Micras and Puntos and tried to keep up with the Subarus.

Removing the high insurance costs would open the market to more young drivers and reduce the novelty, show-off factor that leads to speeding and reckless driving.

Would also support the introduction of driving lessons in schools.

That makes absolutely ZERO sense.

Mrmoe

One solution would be fit all cars with a GPS based speed limiter. This would set the maximum speed that you can drive in a particular location. I would also introduce a blackbox type system for the first 3-4 years for a new driver and use this to determine insurance and licensing issues. You could use this to limit the speed on certain blackspot and dangerous routes.

I do not think raising the age at which someone can drive will work. If anything it should be lowered. I would say that a big reason why older drivers have less accidents is that they have more experience.If you increase the age limit you will merely be transferring the inexperience to an older age bracket.

I do not think you will ever eliminate accidents and we will always have a certain baseline level that are often unavoidable. There are so many factors that could influence whether an accident occurs or not.

There should also be more unmarked traffic core cars to spot bad driving. I think any one who drives will see bad driving on a daily basis. People will not do this as often if there is a chance there is an unmarked car behind them.

Tomebagel

kippy wrote: »

That makes absolutely ZERO sense.

Actulally it does

challengemaster

Biggins wrote: »

1. Because some care and wish to express regret at such things happening.

2. As a reminder that accidents occur and to be careful out there.

3. Because they in the accident have now passed away, their deaths will not be just not thought of with the same value as yesterdays chip wrapping paper. Lives have meaning, well at least to some.

Sorry if you don't get that.

This may sound harsh, detatched or whatever else, but...

How many people die in the world every day though? What makes some more special than others? If everyone were to care about every single person that dies in the world every day, the world would come to a complete halt.

What about all the people in Pakistan or wherever it is this time, do you care about all of those in the same way?

People die, it's a fact of life. I for one don't see any point in it when you have no link to them.

kielmanator

I think we should implement driving tests like they have going in Finland.

There, teenagers in school are taught how to drive in the ice, control fishtails etc.

Some people may say "But sure, that's drifting, innit?"

Maybe so, but God knows on more than one occasion that the experience of cars I got from throwing them about in car parks (empty, mind you) has saved my life.:o

00112984

kippy wrote: »

That makes absolutely ZERO sense.

Think about it.

I don't know how many 17 year old drivers you know but I know a few (nieces and nephews of that age) and they all see their car and ability to drive as an extension of their ego.

Allowing more 17 year olds on the road at a reasonable rate of insurance would reduce the big-balls factor we see from so many young, male drivers.

Open up the market and make it the norm for a 17 year old boy to drive; it'll reduce the cause of ego and the showing off.

Biggins

challengemaster wrote: »

This may sound harsh, detatched or whatever else, but...

With the greatest of respect, this is not the main topic of this thread so I'm abstaining further from this debate direction.
Another time, another thread.

myflipflops

challengemaster wrote: »

This may sound harsh, detatched or whatever else, but...

How many people die in the world every day though? What makes some more special than others? If everyone were to care about every single person that dies in the world every day, the world would come to a complete halt.

What about all the people in Pakistan or wherever it is this time, do you care about all of those in the same way?

People die, it's a fact of life. I for one don't see any point in it when you have no link to them.

They were young and they were Irish.

I'm young and I'm Irish.

These are 4 deaths that are close to home in many ways. They are relevant to my world. The same was true of the 8 who died in Donegal. For some of us (me anyway), these things resonate with us quite a lot and discussing it is relevant to us.

tfitzgerald

Tomebagel wrote: »

And another rant about how all young male drivers are dangerous begins:rolleyes:

My thoughts are with the families and friends

tomebagel is right i dont think this is the time for a rant about young or old drivers .There are a lot of grieving people in kerry tonight and my thoughts are with them

Newtown90

Have friends that know these young people...

Please lads can ye stop the discussion about the speed and all that on this thread...

Its tough enough for friends and families...

Nobody knows what happened yet so don't be jumping to conclusions...

Hopefully the fifth lad will pull threw..

Rip and thoughts are with the familys...

Another Black day in the Kerry Area:(

SeaFields

Get rid of Gay Byrne as RSA chief. Why would a young driver listen to a 70+ year old man? Get a young sports star to head it up.

Restrict engine sizes for inexperienced drivers.

Introduce overtaking lanes on single carriageway primary roads.

Start to clean up the secondary roads - better lighting, cats eyes, etc.

Adjust speed limits on same secondary roads. They should not all be 80/100kph. Some shouldn't be anymore than 50kph

A transition year program on driving, road safety, and everything that goes with it.

BigEejit

All it takes is AGS actually enforcing the law. They got the law changed so that everyone has to carry their license while driving, then they barely ask for them to be produced.

I also saw mentioned here (possibly elsewhere) that the new driver is only allowed to carry family members as passengers. This kid wouldnt have been speeding like that if his mam was sitting behind him.

Fratton Fred

Are young drivers subject to the same rukles regarding points as more experienced drivers?

In the UK, if a Driver accumulates six points within two years of passing their test, they have their licence revoked. Not banned, or suspended, revoked.

It means they have to go through the whole driving test procedure again, whch is quite tough.

myflipflops

00112984 wrote: »

Think about it.

I don't know how many 17 year old drivers you know but I know a few (nieces and nephews of that age) and they all see their car and ability to drive as an extension of their ego.

Allowing more 17 year olds on the road at a reasonable rate of insurance would reduce the big-balls factor we see from so many young, male drivers.

Open up the market and make it the norm for a 17 year old boy to drive; it'll reduce the cause of ego and the showing off.

So your solution is to allow MORE 17 year old males to be driving around??

Seriously??

If anything they should just limit the size of the engine you can drive at that age.

00112984

Glenviewjf wrote: »

Have friends that know these young people...

Please lads can ye stop the discussion about the speed and all that on this thread...

Rip and thoughts are with the familys...

Another Black day in the Kerry Area:(

Agree with all this but, to be fair, this wasn't a sympathy thread for the crash victims which got derailed into a road safety thread; it was a thread prompted by the accident to discuss road safety. I think that can be done respectfully separately from condolences.

Dravokivich

Fratton Fred wrote: »

Are young drivers subject to the same rukles regarding points as more experienced drivers?

In the UK, if a Driver accumulates six points within two years of passing their test, they have their licence revoked. Not banned, or suspended, revoked.

It means they have to go through the whole driving test procedure again, whch is quite tough.

Over here people don't understand it's a priviledge... alot of these wreckless drivers consider it to be a right and just think of themselves and what they are doing, without thinking of what else is going on around them.

myflipflops

tfitzgerald wrote: »

tomebagel is right i dont think this is the time for a rant about young or old drivers .There are a lot of grieving people in kerry tonight and my thoughts are with them

Now is exactly the time for the country to have this debate. Not a rant about young drivers, a discussion about how we can stop so many young people in rural areas dying on the road.

Respect for the grieving families can be achieved at the same time.

-Trek-

Tragic story, thoughts are with the families.

fullstop

Sykk wrote: »

Awful news..

No increasing the age is ridiculous.. How about a driving test instead of sending the bloody license out in the post...

News just in...we have a driving test system in this country :eek:

00112984

myflipflops wrote: »

So your solution is to allow MORE 17 year old males to be driving around??

There is nothing wrong with a 17 year old driving a car. How can a 17 year old because a good driver at 18 or 19 if they can't get experience? It's a 17 (or 18 or 15 or 40) year old who is inclined to show off because they have the financial means to drive that car that leads to recklessness. Young male drivers are targetted by insurance companies with higher premiums.

Think about it, male drivers under 22 probably make up one of the smaller groups of drivers on Irish roads but have a much higher accident rate. We need to educated these kids on how to operate a car properly and safely and take the reckless novelty out of the equation.

Snowie

Biggins wrote: »

1. Because some care and wish to express regret at such things happening.

2. As a reminder that accidents occur and to be careful out there.

3. Because they in the accident have now passed away, their deaths will not be just not thought of with the same value as yesterdays chip wrapping paper. Lives have meaning, well at least to some.

Sorry if you don't get that.

How can you express regret to some one you dont know? what difference are they going to feel? honestly?

accedents happen all the time.

im not saying life hasnt got a meaning...

r3nu4l wrote: »

Well anyone with any empathy can relate these stories to people they know!

As a father myself I know that the thoughts of anything bad happening to my daughter makes me shiver so the thoughts that some parents out there are now faced with burying their children is heartbreaking!

Snow-monkey, maybe you should read this to get a sense of what I'm talking about.

Nothing wrong with empathy but I beleave theres a place for it. Not to people you dont know. Thats how I am/braught up i guess.

I respect that but I do have the right to say what I think. Yes I can agree If I had kids I know I'd feel the same.

We all have an eye opener at one point in our lives, its weather we see it or not that matter that kid did fair play to him. Ive had mine.

Celly Smunt

myflipflops wrote: »

If anything they should just limit the size of the engine you can drive at that age.

surely insurance limits that already.

my solution would be to come down on the NCT to not allow any modifications to cars unless the regestered driver is over a certain age,this would wipe out the ego.

edit:however this is discriminatory,therefore ban cráp cars altogether

Tomebagel

What about keeping one car for first time drivers,say a 1.0 opel corsa and they cant drive anything bigger till they turn 19,but the insurance is alot cheaper so most 17 year olds (who want to drive) can afford it,it would stop all the showing off etc..?

Biggins

Snow-Monkey wrote: »

How can you express regret to some one you dont know? what difference are they going to feel? honestly?
accedents happen all the time.
im not saying life hasnt got a meaning...

Please see post 31.

myflipflops

00112984 wrote: »

There is nothing wrong with a 17 year old driving a car. How can a 17 year old because a good driver at 18 or 19 if they can't get experience? It's a 17 (or 18 or 15 or 40) year old who is inclined to show off because they have the financial means to drive that car that leads to recklessness. Young male drivers are targetted by insurance companies with higher premiums.

Think about it, male drivers under 22 probably make up one of the smaller groups of drivers on Irish roads but have a much higher accident rate. We need to educated these kids on how to operate a car properly and safely and take the reckless novelty out of the equation.

Nothing wrong with a 17 year old driving a car at all in a learning environment.

Something completely wrong with a 17 year old carrying 3 young passengers driving a car at speed in a a rural area.

Clare Bear

Just saw on TV3 News that the reporter went to two of the victims' house (the two brothers that were killed) today to talk to their Mother and asked how she was feeling?! How the hell does he think she's feeling?! TV3 News did the same with the boys in Donegal recently. A couple of hours after her son died they knock on her door to ask her how she is. Fcuking disgusting! :mad:

RIP. Such a waste

hidinginthebush

Fratton Fred wrote: »

Making the NCT test annual and actually making it ensure that a car is safe,rather than just a paper exercise to keep Brussels happy would also help.

I don't have the numbers in front of me, but that's just not true. You are actually MORE likely to be in a car accident if you're a pedestrian rather than an accident caused by the car having a fault which would result in it not having an NCT.