Dole claimants may have to work in community

Bullseye1

Collie D wrote: »

4,000 people earning over 100k paid zero tax last year. Only heard it on the radio this morning but I'll find a link somewhere if you want.



Yes, but the reverse will happen if this scheme comes through and suddenly there are 10,000 people available to do work that 10,000 are already being paid for.



I couldn't agree with you more.

How are these people getting away without paying tax?

Sean Bateman

PAULWATSON wrote: »

I know a man who has worked for 30 years, now he is on the dole.

You little bigots would now suggest that he should be degraded to picking up litter in town centers with a high vis vest on his back.

CLOWNS, the lot of you.

The above comment is an insult to those who actually do that job for a living.

Why should the State subsidise this man if he can't provide for himself?

Make them work for it. There's plenty of work to be done - Painting over grafitti, scraping up chewing gum, cleaning up after dogs, planting trees, cutting grass etc.

Augmerson

Good idea but I agree entirely with the sentiments of the INOU -

"The Irish National Organisation for the Unemployed said it would be a mistake to make it mandatory for dole claimants to have to work in order to receive their benefits.

The organisation said that the work that recipients are asked to do must be meaningful, beneficial to the person doing it and improves their prospect of finding a job in the future."

Also, since this is Ireland, I can predict this going horribly, horribly wrong. There will probably no background vetting process to decide what people should work in what areas. Horror scenario being some kiddie fiddler gets a job helping kids with their homework after school for example.

TheReverend

Sean Bateman wrote: »

The above comment is an insult to those who actually do that job for a living.

Why should the State subsidise this man if he can't provide for himself?

Make them work for it. There's plenty of work to be done - Painting over grafitti, scraping up chewing gum, cleaning up after dogs, planting trees, cutting grass etc.

Awesome lets degrade all of them yeah lazy bastards losing there job due to reasons beyond their control. The state helps those who are unemployed as we are not heartless and know people deserve help

Collie D

Sean Bateman wrote: »

Why should the State subsidise this man if he can't provide for himself?

Make them work for it. There's plenty of work to be done - Painting over grafitti, scraping up chewing gum, cleaning up after dogs, planting trees, cutting grass etc.

Yeah, great idea. Let the cúnt clean up dog shít or starve. :rolleyes:

A guy who has paid thirty years worth of tax is surely entitled to some social welfare.

Yakult

Augmerson wrote: »

Also, since this is Ireland, I can predict this going horribly, horribly wrong. There will probably no background vetting process to decide what people should work in what areas. Horror scenario being some kiddie fiddler gets a job helping kids with their homework after school for example.

Just about to say that, and they would probably find someway of losing millions by trying to do it thus being a failure and costing more tax payers money.

Thats how they roll.

I cant see it happening tbh.

Selandia

Seeing as at the moment people who are being shortlisted for real jobs in childcare and seniorcare are being held up in the process while they await the essential Garda clearance, and in many cases losing the job because of the four month delay in obtaining it, how on earth are they going to process thousands of applications from people on the dole being asked to do community care etc?

thenightrider

Im out of work were can i sign up ? I get 40 a week on the dole so id rather be out working and geting 210 any day.


Ill be going down the SW tomorow and asking can i be put on a list or something ill come back and post what im told.

dan719

Collie D wrote: »

What experience would an out of work accountant or a recently graduated law student get from sweeping streets?

This is the most sensible post on this thread. Obviously it will be ignored because it doesn't allow AHers to slag those on the dole though. :rolleyes:

Personally I think we should get rid of all social welfare...but give people back the tax they paid assuming they would be entitled to some assistance if things ever went to sh*t.

A couple I know are in their late thirties with two kids. During the celtic tiget they grossed maybe three hundred thousand a year combined. They paid their taxes as well as contributing to the economy in the form of consumption tax and so on. Both of them have now lost their jobs and their savings have been exhausted. Fortunately they don't have a massive mortgage and are surviving (just about) on social welfare. Both have masters from top unis and spend all day every day looking for work. The idea of posters on this forum, (some of whom have probably paid less tax in their whole lives than these did in a year) demanding that they sweep the streets, or cut their lawns ludicrous, and quite frankly pathetic.

drunkmonkey

TheReverend wrote: »

Awesome lets degrade all of them yeah lazy bastards losing there job due to reasons beyond their control. The state helps those who are unemployed as we are not heartless and know people deserve help

Degrade them? They have nothing else to do, a Job is a Job, if your not prepared to take any job when you have none, well then i'm very sorry but you should get 0 handouts.

Chorcai

Eh hang on I paid my PRSI, TAX etc etc for over 12yrs, I am only claiming what I put in, I do enough cleaning in and around my area where I live. I'll be fúcked if anyone thinks I will be going on this "community" work ****e.

thenightrider

I dont see this as working for your dole all i see this is like a part time job its about the same amount you would get for working 19.5 hours in a part time job so i say bring it on as long as they give me a job

Collie D

Chorcai wrote: »

Eh hang on I paid my PRSI, TAX etc etc for over 12yrs, I am only claiming what I put in, I do enough cleaning in and around my area where I live. I'll be fúcked if anyone thinks I will be going on this "community" work ****e.

thenightrider wrote: »

I dont see this as working for your dole all i see this is like a part time job its about the same amount you would get for working 19.5 hours in a part time job so i say bring it on as long as they give me a job

Two completely different opinions and both completely valid. If people want to volunteer for this fair play to them. If they don't, they shouldn't be forced into community service like a petty criminal.

Töpher

Roll it out to the people who've made a profession off the dole and haven't paid any tax in something like 10 years, or went straight from school onto the dole, and I've no issue with it.

To roll it out to those who have been working hard for many years and contributed many thousands in tax to the government who are now unemployed due to circustances beyond their control would be highly unfair.

drunkmonkey

Chorcai wrote: »

Eh hang on I paid my PRSI, TAX etc etc for over 12yrs, I am only claiming what I put in, I do enough cleaning in and around my area where I live. I'll be fúcked if anyone thinks I will be going on this "community" work ****e.

But your already doing community work at least this way you'll be getting some kudos for it.
On a side note, what do you think should happen the people who have paid little or no PRSI or tax etc ever? I think this is who this is aimed at, you'd be well down the list.

Augmerson

drunkmonkey wrote: »

Degrade them? They have nothing else to do, a Job is a Job, if your not prepared to take any job when you have none, well then i'm very sorry but you should get 0 handouts.

I wonder if you lost your job tomorrow and ended up cleaning puke and piss off the streets in the morning for your dole would you still stick by your own wisdom? Because if you do, I'll have to take a piss on the road more often tbh, enjoy!

Now, let's think about this scheme. Obviously somebody is going to have to organise and administer this operation. Social Welfare doesn't have the manpower I'd suspect, is there still a ban on Civil Service recruitment? Wouldn't the Gov't only have to hire more people to get this on the road? See where this is going?

I think that they should get people off the Dole and into the higher levels of Civil Service and Government. Sack Brian Cowen, fecker is on too much anyway. I think somebody who has been out of work for the past 12 months would do more towards job creation that Brian Cowen ever has or ever will.

sellerbarry

storm2811 wrote: »

Yeah I'd agree that it's a good idea,if they're able to do it then why not?

I'd say a good few people on the dole wouldn't mind getting out and doing something anyway.
What kind of work could they do though? The county councils do pretty much everything like fixing up the town and cleaning up etc.

That's the reason they are doing it! Because the lazy Pxgs on the coucil do NADA. Never seen such a lazy shower.
It's a good idea though.

Sea Sharp

I fully endorse this proposal.
If anything, it's a shame that I'm not entitled to social welfare.

DonJose

Stinicker wrote: »

Slavery ended in America after the Civil war, it looks as if it is about to be introduced to Ireland. Either every single person on the dole is put out to work or no-one is simple as that. This cannot and will not work and should be on a voluntary basis only. Wage subvention is a far better idea than this crock of sh1te at least this way the economy would benefit.

The United States did abolish slavery, however their unemployment benefits last a maximum 26 weeks, then its onto the food stamps program. The Irish welfare system is too generous as it is, the recipients should be grateful to offer something back in return.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unemployment_benefits#United_States

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Supplemental_Nutrition_Assistance_Program

It's a better idea than the Work Placement Program anyway, that's for sure.


That said, I hope they make the work interesting. Management, art, photography, Civil Defence, etc. would be great. Can't see anyone running o sign up for it to clean up after scumbags or to stack shelves in Tesco.


Haven't worked in a few years and a part time job for €210 per week would be grand.

TheReverend

drunkmonkey wrote: »

Degrade them? They have nothing else to do, a Job is a Job, if your not prepared to take any job when you have none, well then i'm very sorry but you should get 0 handouts.

If I was unemployed no I wouldn't take just any job, I would go clean **** off the street like you proposed, nor would I clean the streets, I would search for a job in which I feel comfortable in doing, for one in which I am getting qualified to do.

drunkmonkey

Augmerson wrote: »

I wonder if you lost your job tomorrow

If I lost my Job tomorrow i'd have another one the day after. I passed a few signs for barmen today. There's jobs out there. I saw them and I wasn't even looking.

TheReverend

DonJose wrote: »

The United States did abolish slavery, however their unemployment benefits last a maximum 26 weeks, then its onto the food stamps program. The Irish welfare system is too generous as it is, the recipients should be grateful to offer something back in return.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unemployment_benefits#United_States

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Supplemental_Nutrition_Assistance_Program

The American welfare system is a load of ****.

Mrmoe

I think this is a great idea. It means tax payers get value for money and encourages people who do not genuinely seek work to get their act together.

Chorcai

drunkmonkey wrote: »

But your already doing community work at least this way you'll be getting some kudos for it..

Yea great, have some snotty wan from the SW coming along and inspecting my community work... please:rolleyes:. I tidy up around where I live cause it's nice and some of us around here would like to keep it that way, nothing to do with kudos or patting each others back.

I agree with Collie D "If people want to volunteer for this fair play to them. If they don't, they shouldn't be forced into community service like a petty criminal."

drunkmonkey

TheReverend wrote: »

If I was unemployed no I wouldn't take just any job, I would go clean **** off the street like you proposed, nor would I clean the streets, I would search for a job in which I feel comfortable in doing, for one in which I am getting qualified to do.

Me neither but there has to be a line in the sand somewhere. How long can you keep searching? 1, 2, 3 years?
What's a reasonable time frame to give someone to find a Job?

Dean820

They should only make people who have been on the dole say, 1+ years on it to take part. That would be fair enough I think.

Long Term Louth

I wonder if we will see any of the developers or bankers doing any community work? :eek:

nachoman

Collie D wrote: »

What experience would an out of work accountant or a recently graduated law student get from sweeping streets?

It'll toughen them up, get rid of the silver spoon wedged in their gob and get rid of the sense of entitlement graduates had in the celtic tiger blah blah blah insert Bill Cullen rant here.

foxshooter243

drunkmonkey wrote: »

Do you not think someone who works long hours and pays a lot of tax deserves some free help at home seen as there out there trying to keep the country on it's feet.
I see nothing wrong with people on the dole having to help out the employed. Some people might say it's a form of slavery but when your getting paid it's not.

i have worked longer hours than you would imagine, made a lot of cash and im retired at 50, but I dont see any reason to knock folks claiming benefits when the assholes running the country squander money by the truckload..a sense of clarity would go a long way ..the biggest problem this countrys got is the wasters in the public service;)