Believers Vs Non-believers

demonspawn

pH wrote: »

Name one.

Typical debunker tactic of changing the subject when they have no real argument. Let's see, maybe they had their names stricken from the history books for being idiots after it was discovered that the world was in fact spherical.

demonspawn

Ickle Magoo wrote: »

I'm missing the admission...

The pyramids are clearly pushed to the right a bit and also, more importantly, that they're all bent out of shape too. The usual "tourist" pictures you see have been doctored to make them look far straighter than they actually are. Tourists wouldn't come if they knew that the pyramids are as old and knackered-looking as they really are.

Jesus, another one that's not paying attention. I'd hate to be a school teacher if this is what they have to put up with.

Edit: Anyway, I'm done with this thread and this forum. Thanks all for reminding me why I don't speak to atheists. You lot are more hostile and intolerant than the bloody fundamentalists.

Ickle Magoo

demonspawn wrote: »

Jesus, another one that's not paying attention. I'd hate to be a school teacher if this is what they have to put up with.

Ditto - where does his post make comment on the IMAGE being distorted rather than the pyramids themselves? Your post referred to an admission of a distorted google map - the post I read referred to pyramids being crooked and pushed to one side.

demonspawn wrote: »

Edit: Anyway, I'm done with this thread and this forum. Thanks all for reminding me why I don't speak to atheists.

Oh dear, there go the rest of the toys...is that the CT version of the debunkers changing topic tact?

demonspawn wrote: »

You lot are more hostile and intolerant than the bloody fundamentalists.

Yes, damn us and our never-ending quest for evidence! *shakes fist*

robindch

demonspawn wrote: »

robindch wrote:

The pyramids are clearly pushed to the right a bit and also, more importantly, that they're all bent out of shape too. The usual "tourist" pictures you see have been doctored to make them look far straighter than they actually are. Tourists wouldn't come if they knew that the pyramids are as old and knackered-looking as they really are.

Wow, your evidence is a Google map that you admit is distorted? That's not very scientific. :rolleyes:

demonspawn wrote: »

Jesus, another one that's not paying attention. I'd hate to be a school teacher if this is what they have to put up with.

midlandsmissus

demonspawn wrote: »

Jesus, another one that's not paying attention. I'd hate to be a school teacher if this is what they have to put up with.

Edit: Anyway, I'm done with this thread and this forum. Thanks all for reminding me why I don't speak to atheists. You lot are more hostile and intolerant than the bloody fundamentalists.

Demonspawn I feel your pain.

There is nothing like arguing on here that would literally wear you down. I get wrecked. One against 10+ is particularly tiring.

I'm not saying I am right, but I think alot of atheists on here have a particular way of coming across as condescending, and derogative. It's just we are mindsets poles apart. I'm not perfect but I like to think that I appreciate other's views, whereas atheists sometimes come across as thinking of everyone else as stupid idiots. This is what can be tiring.

Turtwig

demonspawn wrote: »

And this is why I hate atheists. You refuse to open yourselves up to the possible existence of something you can't explain because of your very limited knowledge of the universe. It's almost laughable really.

You all claim to be such great followers of science, but you fail to comprehend the fact that science is where it is today because of people constantly searching for new answers and new ideas. It's sadly ironic.

Firstly there is opening your mind to new ideas and then there is opening your mind until your brain falls out. Science is where it is today because scientists filtered out the bull**** from the actual **** like. As for the possible existence of something, I think you ought to take one real hard look at the nature of human beings. Ever, experience an optical illusion? You know that thing where you see something incorrectly? A line much longer that it should be, or the triangle that isn't there? They can be huge amounts of fun, but people fail to learn the vital lesson from them. The latter illusion is formed because of the guesses our brains take when forming a image. You may think your mind forms the best picture of reality, when in fact all it does is guesses it. You're brain constructs the world you perceive around you and very often it can make errors in judgement. Witness testimony is anything but reliable after all referees and umpires get it wrong all the time, so what makes you think the average person will fare any better?

mikhail

robindch wrote: »

You can see it yourself from the following picture:

http://maps.google.com/maps?t=h&q=29.976111,31.132778&ie=UTF8&ll=29.977558,31.134117&spn=0.009684,0.01929&z=16

The pyramids are clearly pushed to the right a bit and also, more importantly, that they're all bent out of shape too. The usual "tourist" pictures you see have been doctored to make them look far straighter than they actually are. Tourists wouldn't come if they knew that the pyramids are as old and knackered-looking as they really are.

Thanks for that, but I was really looking for a source on the figure of 2' 28".

Google maps is stitched together from aerial photography at that range, so there may be some distortion - the plane isn't necessarily straight up from the pyramids. For example, here's the Empire State building, of which, as you can see, the southern and eastern flanks are visible, making it look like it's leaning to the north-west.

pH

demonspawn wrote: »

Typical debunker tactic of changing the subject when they have no real argument. Let's see, maybe they had their names stricken from the history books for being idiots after it was discovered that the world was in fact spherical.

So I take it that's a "No, I can't name one of many respected scientists that thought the earth was flat" then.

demonspawn

Ickle Magoo wrote: »

Ditto - where does his post make comment on the IMAGE being distorted rather than the pyramids themselves? Your post referred to an admission of a distorted google map - the post I read referred to pyramids being crooked and pushed to one side.

Are you seriously suggesting that the pyramids were physically pushed to one side? Or are you saying that the image of the pyramids is doctored?
Which is it, I'm absolutely perplexed.

Oh dear, there go the rest of the toys...is that the CT version of the debunkers changing topic tact?

No, this is me being absolutely fed up with people claim to be intelligent, rational people when in fact they're just as ignorant and intolerant as the ones they are so opposed to.

Yes, damn us and our never-ending quest for evidence! *shakes fist*

Yes. Evidence just doesn't seem to be enough. You continuously want more and more evidence, regardless of what's already been offered. When there's a chance you may be proven wrong, you demand even more evidence. Well, I'm done providing evidence, it's obviously a complete waste of my time.

Ghost Buster

demonspawn wrote: »

Are you seriously suggesting that the pyramids were physically pushed to one side? Or are you saying that the image of the pyramids is doctored?
Which is it, I'm absolutely perplexed.



No, this is me being absolutely fed up with people claim to be intelligent, rational people when in fact they're just as ignorant and intolerant as the ones they are so opposed to.



Yes. Evidence just doesn't seem to be enough. You continuously want more and more evidence, regardless of what's already been offered. When there's a chance you may be proven wrong, you demand even more evidence. Well, I'm done providing evidence, it's obviously a complete waste of my time.

Have any aliens been about in recent times?
Jesus is due back and i dare say a few others.
We might get some documented footage this time or maybe they'll all meet and have to slug it out.
My moneys on Thor.

demonspawn

Malty_T wrote: »

Firstly there is opening your mind to new ideas and then there is opening your mind until your brain falls out. Science is where it is today because scientists filtered out the bull**** from the actual **** like. As for the possible existence of something, I think you ought to take one real hard look at the nature of human beings. Ever, experience an optical illusion? You know that thing where you see something incorrectly? A line much longer that it should be, or the triangle that isn't there? They can be huge amounts of fun, but people fail to learn the vital lesson from them. The latter illusion is formed because of the guesses our brains take when forming a image. You may think your mind forms the best picture of reality, when in fact all it does is guesses it. You're brain constructs the world you perceive around you and very often it can make errors in judgement. Witness testimony is anything but reliable after all referees and umpires get it wrong all the time, so what makes you think the average person will fare any better?

Ok, tell me which one of the following things you don't believe to be an absolute reality.

1. Genetic engineering
2. Space travel
3. Extraterrestrial life

When you're done with that, explain to me why you disagree so strongly with my theory that aliens may have visited Earth many thousands of years ago, genetically engineered a new species capable of living on this planet, and that certain people hold the knowledge of this event.

Tell me that my theory is a scientific impossibility.

Zillah

demonspawn wrote: »

Yes. Evidence just doesn't seem to be enough. You continuously want more and more evidence, regardless of what's already been offered. When there's a chance you may be proven wrong, you demand even more evidence. Well, I'm done providing evidence, it's obviously a complete waste of my time.

Have you considered that maybe your standards of evidence are lower than everyone else's? That perhaps, instead of us refusing to believe the truth, we simply think you are wrong and that your evidence is scanty?

For example, if there is so much evidence that it is patently obvious, why don't the world's historians, astronomers and anthropologists accept your theory? What makes you so much better at understanding ancient Egyptian civilisation than the thousands of people who have spent their whole lives doing dotorates about ancient Egypt? Are you a unrivalled genius? Is there a conspiracy to cover it up? How did they, in their combined centuries of analysis, miss the fact that the ancient Egyptians couldn't have built what they built?

Why, if what you are saying is so reasonable, does the entire scientific community think you are crazy?

pH

demonspawn wrote: »

Tell me that my theory is a scientific impossibility.

My theory that Hitler is alive and well and living on Mars isn't a scientific impossibility either, and has as much supporting evidence as yours, where do we go from here?

demonspawn

Zillah wrote: »

Why, if what you are saying is so reasonable, does the entire scientific community think you are crazy?

Stephen Hawkins accepts the possibility of intelligent lifeforms visiting Earth, he even goes so far as to assume they would be much like us and only here for resources, which is ridiculous. So what the f**k are you talking about? Now you see why I ignore your posts?

Ghost Buster

demonspawn wrote: »

Ok, tell me which one of the following things you don't believe to be an absolute reality.

1. Genetic engineering
2. Space travel
3. Extraterrestrial life

When you're done with that, explain to me why you disagree so strongly with my theory that aliens may have visited Earth many thousands of years ago, genetically engineered a new species capable of living on this planet, and that certain people hold the knowledge of this event.

Tell me that my theory is a scientific impossibility.

Genetic Engineering = fact
Space Travel = fact. Manned travel is limited however
Extraterrestrial lief = very probable.
I dont think anyone here has disagreed with your "Theory" that aliens "May have visited" because you have not presented it as such. You have presented it as a fact. It much more likely than other theories but has no substantiated evidence for it than any notions.

Zillah

demonspawn wrote: »

Ok, tell me which one of the following things you don't believe to be an absolute reality.

1. Genetic engineering
2. Space travel
3. Extraterrestrial life

When you're done with that, explain to me why you disagree so strongly with my theory that aliens may have visited Earth many thousands of years ago, genetically engineered a new species capable of living on this planet, and that certain people hold the knowledge of this event.

Tell me that my theory is a scientific impossibility.

Ok, tell me which one of the following things you don't believe to be an absolute reality.

1. Bunnies
2. Zepplins
3. Ice cream

When you're done with that, explain to me why you disagree so strongly with my theory that just this moment a bunny rabbit arrived by zepplin in front of my house to deliver to me some ice cream?

This is possibly the most adorable post I have ever made.

Ickle Magoo

demonspawn wrote: »

Are you seriously suggesting that the pyramids were physically pushed to one side? Or are you saying that the image of the pyramids is doctored?
Which is it, I'm absolutely perplexed.

In your post you claim robindch stated an admission of distortion to the image, as I read it he was referring to tourist pictures being altered and distorted - I have no idea whether the pyramids are perfectly even sided or not; after 4000 years and having been built on sand, I suspect not.

demonspawn wrote: »

No, this is me being absolutely fed up with people claim to be intelligent, rational people when in fact they're just as ignorant and intolerant as the ones they are so opposed to.

You seem to be mistaking intelligence and rationality with gullibility. Show me the evidence and I'll listen, copy and paste from a conspiracy theory website about how it just HAS to be true despite no supporting evidence and I'm going to treat it the same way I do all other unevidenced claims of third party intervention.

demonspawn wrote: »

Yes. Evidence just doesn't seem to be enough. You continuously want more and more evidence, regardless of what's already been offered. When there's a chance you may be proven wrong, you demand even more evidence. Well, I'm done providing evidence, it's obviously a complete waste of my time.

Evidence is certainly enough. What reliable, unbiased and universally recognised evidence that extraterrestrials built the pyramids have you presented?

demonspawn

pH wrote: »

My theory that Hitler is alive and well and living on Mars isn't a scientific impossibility either, and has as much supporting evidence as yours, where do we go from here?

Now you're just being childish. Please tell me how you believe that we had the technology to send a human to Mars in the 1950s. I don't think we even have the technology for that now. Actually, never mind. You can join Zillah on my list of people I no longer respond to.

Zillah

demonspawn wrote: »

Stephen Hawkins accepts the possibility of intelligent lifeforms visiting Earth, he even goes so far as to assume they would be much like us and only here for resources, which is ridiculous. So what the f**k are you talking about? Now you see why I ignore your posts?

No no, we're not talking about the possibility of extra-terrestrial life. I think it almost impossible that there are no alien life forms in existence. But that's not what I'm talking about. I'm talking purely about your assertion that the ancient Egyptians were instructed by aliens. You claim that there is tons of irrefutable evidence. I want to know why you think that all of the world's experts on Egyptian history think you are completely and utterly wrong.

demonspawn

Ghost Buster wrote: »

Genetic Engineering = fact
Space Travel = fact. Manned travel is limited however
Extraterrestrial lief = very probable.
I dont think anyone here has disagreed with your "Theory" that aliens "May have visited" because you have not presented it as such. You have presented it as a fact. It much more likely than other theories but has no substantiated evidence for it than any notions.

Another favorite debunker argument. I've never presented anything as fact. This is what I believe to be true and have said so on numerous occasions. It's a theory, open to be proven wrong. Not one person has tried to prove it wrong, they just make personal attacks or dismiss evidence out of hand.

MagicMarker

demonspawn wrote: »

Another favorite debunker argument. I've never presented anything as fact. This is what I believe to be true and have said so on numerous occasions. It's a theory, open to be proven wrong. Not one person has tried to prove it wrong, they just make personal attacks or dismiss evidence out of hand.

''Why believe someone when you have no way of knowing?''

This is more or less what you said in this very thread, why don't you answer your own question?

drkpower

Zillah wrote: »

Why, if what you are saying is so reasonable, does the entire scientific community think you are crazy?

Because its a COVER UP; by the Bilderberg group; and Dick Cheney; they have covered it up for centuries; to protect the position of the ELITES; until Demonspawn found out. Obviously.

demonspawn

Zillah wrote: »

I want to know why you think that all of the world's experts on Egyptian history think you are completely and utterly wrong.

All the world's experts on Egyptian history can not explain how the Great Pyramid was built with such precision.

Yet another failed argument from Zillah.

mikhail

demonspawn wrote: »

Another favorite debunker argument. I've never presented anything as fact. This is what I believe to be true and have said so on numerous occasions. It's a theory, open to be proven wrong. Not one person has tried to prove it wrong, they just make personal attacks or dismiss evidence out of hand.

I didn't dismiss evidence out of hand. I dismissed evidence because I have an professional and educational background which gives me strong reasons to doubt the evidence.

MagicMarker

demonspawn wrote: »

All the world's experts on Egyptian history can not explain how the Great Pyramid was built with such precision.

Yet another failed argument from Zillah.

Can not explain = aliens did it?

You fail at logic.

Ghost Buster

demonspawn wrote: »

Another favorite debunker argument. I've never presented anything as fact. This is what I believe to be true and have said so on numerous occasions. It's a theory, open to be proven wrong. Not one person has tried to prove it wrong, they just make personal attacks or dismiss evidence out of hand.

Why believe something without it being confirmed? Why not just accept it as a possibility and wait and see? What you say is plausable (relatively) but I cannot fathom why you latch onto something unless its substantiated. Does it make you happy?
It cannot be proven wrong AND it cannot be proven right.http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russell's_teapot

demonspawn

MagicMarker wrote: »

''Why believe someone when you have no way of knowing?''

This is more or less what you said in this very thread, why don't you answer your own question?

Because I have evidence which I believe is true. What evidence do you have that what I say is not true, other than your skepticism? And I'd like to remind you that the theory of human evolution has a massive hole in it.

MagicMarker

demonspawn wrote: »

Because I have evidence which I believe is true. What evidence do you have that what I say is not true, other than your skepticism? And I'd like to remind you that the theory of human evolution has a massive hole in it.

Show me the evidence and I'll answer any question you want.

You've shown zilch so far.

Zillah

demonspawn wrote: »

All the world's experts on Egyptian history can not explain how the Great Pyramid was built with such precision.

Yet another failed argument from Zillah.

No no, you've wandered off the mark again. We need to get you some blinders or something. I wasn't asking if they can explain everything, I was asking why, despite all the obvious and irrefutable evidence you say exists, all of the world's best Egyptologists think what you are saying is complete nonsense? Are you so much smarter than thousands of people with doctorates in Egyptology?

demonspawn wrote: »

And I'd like to remind you that the theory of human evolution has a massive hole in it.

Oh this is going to be fun. Ok, what's the big hole in human evolution?

demonspawn

MagicMarker wrote: »

Can not explain = aliens did it?

You fail at logic.

There's plenty of evidence of extraterrestrial visitors. Don't blame me if you're too ignorant to see it. I've already posted a video of decorated officers from the U.S. military prepared to swear in front of Congress that they have witness extraterrestrial UFO activity. I suggest you go watch that before you make any more comments on this subject.

Ickle Magoo

demonspawn wrote: »

Because I have evidence which I believe is true. What evidence do you have that what I say is not true, other than your skepticism? And I'd like to remind you that the theory of human evolution has a massive hole in it.

It's hardly evidence if it requires faith to believe it.

Lots of theories are not complete. Just because from A-Z we are missing d n & k is no reason to assume the theory is not the best explanation we have and certainly the most logical. Are you about to propose the missing link is related to the ET pyramid architects?

demonspawn

MagicMarker wrote: »

Show me the evidence and I'll answer any question you want.

You've shown zilch so far.

I've already posted several videos which you've chosen to dismiss instead of watching. Your willful ignorance is the problem here, not my lack of evidence.

MagicMarker

demonspawn wrote: »

There's plenty of evidence of extraterrestrial visitors. Don't blame me if you're too ignorant to see it. I've already posted a video of decorated officers from the U.S. military prepared to swear in front of Congress that they have witness extraterrestrial UFO activity. I suggest you go watch that before you make any more comments on this subject.

I'm not disputing the possibility of aliens, I've said this time and time again.

I'm asking for evidence that aliens built the pyramids and genetically engineered the whole human race.

I mean, for someone who has so much evidence, surely it's not that hard to show it to us?

demonspawn

Ickle Magoo wrote: »

It's hardly evidence if it requires faith to believe it.

Lots of theories are not complete. Just because from A-Z we are missing d n & k is no reason to assume the theory is not the best explanation we have and certainly the most logical. Are you about to propose the missing link is related to the ET pyramid architects?

Why not? Do you have a better explanation? Of the hundreds of thousands of fossils we've recovered, why are there so many links in the chain missing?

Ghost Buster

demonspawn wrote: »

Why not? Do you have a better explanation? Of the hundreds of thousands of fossils we've recovered, why are there so many links in the chain missing?

Cut to the chase. You believe it cos you want to believe it. It gives you a jolly and you're sticking with it. RESPECT:D

mikhail

demonspawn wrote: »

Why not? Do you have a better explanation? Of the hundreds of thousands of fossils we've recovered, why are there so many links in the chain missing?

Er, what? We have maybe 200 hominid fossils, worldwide, and there's no "missing link" particularly.

demonspawn

MagicMarker wrote: »

I'm not disputing the possibility of aliens, I've said this time and time again.

I'm asking for evidence that aliens built the pyramids and genetically engineered the whole human race.

I mean, for someone who has so much evidence, surely it's not that hard to show it to us?

http://www.youtube.com/user/DennyFromSpaceAgain2

Go watch some of the documentaries on that channel if you want so much evidence. There's 400+ videos worth of evidence.

The Mad Hatter

demonspawn wrote: »

Stephen Hawkins

Ah yes, him. He's a friend of Richard Dawking, isn't he?

MagicMarker

demonspawn wrote: »

http://www.youtube.com/user/DennyFromSpaceAgain2

Go watch some of the documentaries on that channel if you want so much evidence. There's 400+ videos worth of evidence.

Link me to one that shows me evidence that aliens built the pyramids and genetically engineered the human race.

Zillah

The Mad Hatter wrote: »

Ah yes, him. He's a friend of Richard Dawking, isn't he?

Nice.

EDIT: Holy **** I have exactly 10,000 posts. I am never posting again.

demonspawn

Ghost Buster wrote: »

Cut to the chase. You believe it cos you want to believe it. It gives you a jolly and you're sticking with it. RESPECT:D

What other reason is there to believe in something? I believe it because I think it's true. What's the problem? Am I hurting anyone with my belief? Are you trying to hurt me because you don't agree with my belief? See where this all ends up?

Ghost Buster

demonspawn wrote: »

http://www.youtube.com/user/DennyFromSpaceAgain2

Go watch some of the documentaries on that channel if you want so much evidence. There's 400+ videos worth of evidence.

and theres hundreds of other videos of 'evidence' for dozens of other theories some of which are more likely than yours, some of which are much less likely. What makes yours better?

demonspawn

MagicMarker wrote: »

Link me to one that shows me evidence that aliens built the pyramids and genetically engineered the human race.

No, you watch the videos. I'm not gonna hold your hand all the way through this debate. Act like a grown up and do it yourself.

MagicMarker

demonspawn wrote: »

No, you watch the videos. I'm not gonna hold your hand all the way through this debate. Act like a grown up and do it yourself.

So you can't even link to one that shows the actual evidence?

Hmmm, I wonder why that is?

Ickle Magoo

demonspawn wrote: »

Why not? Do you have a better explanation? Of the hundreds of thousands of fossils we've recovered, why are there so many links in the chain missing?

Because there are so many factors in our ever changing landscapes that deplete and destroy skeletal remains, the older the skeleton you are trying to find, the more "needle in a haystack" it becomes. I have a hunch that even if a thousand more skeletons showing even more of an undeniable gradual evolution were found, some would just point to the holes between those as the missing links - regardless, there is at least evidence to support evolution and it is a universally recognised theory by all who don't feel the need to invoke third party involvement.

Ghost Buster

demonspawn wrote: »

What other reason is there to believe in something? I believe it because I think it's true. What's the problem? Am I hurting anyone with my belief? Are you trying to hurt me because you don't agree with my belief? See where this all ends up?

Well. Proof beyond doubt is a good reason.
Dont believe or think something to be true. Find out for certain.
Im not trying to hurt you (Diddums). Stop being so strident!

philologos

Can we have a triple debate sometime? Militant atheists, militant agnostics, militant faithful? I'm sure adding another position to the debate would make it about a third more fun than it usually is!

demonspawn

MagicMarker wrote: »

So you can't even link to one that shows the actual evidence?

Hmmm, I wonder why that is?

They all do. I guess I will have to hold your hand. Good grief. Fine, you can start with this one. Watch all parts and get back to me when you're finished.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r9_r4ghZahU

Zillah

demonspawn wrote: »

No, you watch the videos. I'm not gonna hold your hand all the way through this debate. Act like a grown up and do it yourself.

From what I can see, most of his videos are about UFOs. You realise that one can absolutely believe that there are frequently unexplained (and possibly even very interesting and unusual) flying objects, but remain highly sceptical about them having anything to do with aliens.

Not to mention that this says nothing about your claims that aliens built the pyramids.

demonspawn

Ghost Buster wrote: »

Well. Proof beyond doubt is a good reason.
Dont believe or think something to be true. Find out for certain.
Im not trying to hurt you (Diddums). Stop being so strident!

There is always doubt. It's the absolute basis for scientific discovery, or am I wrong? Scientists are constantly questioning what we believe to be true.

Edit: I should have said real scientists are always questioning.