Padraig Harrington.....2015 Honda Classic Champion

ForeRight

It's telling that he started day 1 horribly and ended day 3 horribly but in between wouldn't have been too far off the pace of the best in the field.

For me it shows his mindset when starting out probably anxious, nervous and desperate to do well. Gets the better off him and starts off shocking then settles and seems to be steady.

He then sees the finish line with the chance of making the cut and putting in a very decent score and implodes.

It's heartbreaking and I can only imagine how he is feeling inside.

Pierce_1991

Only just caught up with his round, bitterly disappointing final hole but I would bet he got more birdies than the majority of the players he tied with after the three days. Still has the bad holes but I'll repeat what I said on here yesterday, it's not going to change overnight for him, it's all about making progress and taking positives, and he definitely has positives to take from this week.

Slicemeister

Fluck it anyway. That interview on Thursday showed what heights the man could still reach according to himself ( I believe him btw). just can't seem to manoeuvre himself into any good position these days.

lorenzo87

PARlance wrote: »

You didn't mention the Asian Tour....
He'll win there won't he?

Although it was nice to see him win it, it's a mickey mouse event.

Old diesel

MarcusP12 wrote: »

That's kindly at the root of what I think happened to him without the benefit of the detail...probably thought he needed to birdie the hole when the reality is a solid par would have been enough....it's so frustrating but we can only imagine how gut wrenchingly soul destroying it is for the great man himself....part of what I admire about the man is how he seems to be able to pick himself up and get out there week after week in spite of the nature of his set backs...it must be hard knowing that not that long ago,he'd have owned most of these young bucks and most will never achieve half of what he has in his career to date...

He will simply have to learn from that hole - AND look at the other more positive aspects of his performance in this event.

My worry is that he will dwell too much on that hole - im sure he knows what he actually did wrong - and not build on the positives of his performance.

But maybe im being deluded as another poster hinted

Pierce_1991

Old diesel wrote: »

He will simply have to learn from that hole - AND look at the other more positive aspects of his performance in this event.

My worry is that he will dwell too much on that hole - im sure he knows what he actually did wrong - and not build on the positives of his performance.

But maybe im being deluded as another poster hinted

Cudda sworn I've heard him speak of the benefits of sports psychologists in the past. You would think with the career he's had he would be well able to break through these mental barriers he seems to be facing at the moment.

lorenzo87

Old diesel wrote: »

He will simply have to learn from that hole - AND look at the other more positive aspects of his performance in this event.

My worry is that he will dwell too much on that hole - im sure he knows what he actually did wrong - and not build on the positives of his performance.

But maybe im being deluded as another poster hinted

I agree with you there, when you saw "dwell".
I think Padraig over-thinks everything, so much so that he has not enjoyed golf for a long time. If you can't enjoy it, you can't expect to be able to perform.

His issue is his head, we all know he has the ability to win big tournaments. I can never get to grips with why he changed his swing after it won him major championships. I think he tries so hard every single week that he loses it before he steps on the first tee. He is always smiling on the outside, but I don't think he is smiling inside.

PARlance

lorenzo87 wrote: »

Although it was nice to see him win it, it's a mickey mouse event.

You probably missed his EAGLE last week. It's deluded to think he won't win

He just needs to elimate all the bad golf he's playing... And master the art of course management.... He'll be winning week in week out soon.

MarcusP12

For me there is one thing that is glaringly obvious and seems to be a feature of far too many rounds....he racks up a big figure at some point in most rounds....to me that's the difference between missing cuts and contending.and when is say contending, I mean making cuts with comfort and challenging regularly for top 25 and top 10.I genuinely think he's actually playing reasonably well in the last 6 months...better than his stats would suggest but the big figure holes are killing Him...take this tournament for example...2 triples..he pars those holes and he's -11 and challenging for top 10....the guys regularly competing just don't seem to rack up these kind of scores on a hole...it's hard to.see how that can change but we live in hope.....for the record,I have to.say,Shane lowry is doing fantastic....he's competing regularly in the US PGA tour which is a.measure of how far he's come in a relatively short time......I don't think he.deserves or needs our support any more than paddy though...any Irish golfer should have the support of any Irish golf fan regardless of how they are playing!

lorenzo87

PARlance wrote: »

You probably missed his EAGLE last week. It's deluded to think he won't win

He just needs to elimate all the bad golf he's playing... And master the art of course management.... He'll be winning week in week out soon.

I had an eagle today and I play off 11.

PARlance

lorenzo87 wrote: »

I had an eagle today and I play off 11.

Have you 3 majors?

I'm only messing with you. The hope is strong in this thread.

Old diesel

MarcusP12 wrote: »

For me there is one thing that is glaringly obvious and seems to be a feature of far too many rounds....he racks up a big figure at some point in most rounds....to me that's the difference between missing cuts and contending.and when is say contending, I mean making cuts with comfort and challenging regularly for top 25 and top 10.I genuinely think he's actually playing reasonably well in the last 6 months...better than his stats would suggest but the big figure holes are killing Him...take this tournament for example...2 triples..he pars those holes and he's -11 and challenging for top 10....the guys regularly competing just don't seem to rack up these kind of scores on a hole...it's hard to.see how that can change but we live in hope.....for the record,I have to.say,Shane lowry is doing fantastic....he's competing regularly in the US PGA tour which is a.measure of how far he's come in a relatively short time......I don't think he.deserves or needs our support any more than paddy though...any Irish golfer should have the support of any Irish golf fan regardless of how they are playing!

"better then his stats would suggest"

That sums up this event for him really - the bare stats suggest someone not doing very well. And yes the stats matter because that's how the end result is measured.

But they don't tell a lot the story for Padraig on this event - as good aspects of his performance this weekend aren't reflected in the score board

When in reality the poor stats are actually down to 5 holes over the 3 days - frustrating really.

But could you imagine if he managed to iron out the ability to make massive mistakes on a hole - that's where the hope comes from.

When he puts in a good round - we get excited because we hope he can repeat that.

As for being deluded - I think many of us have come to appreciate his ability to sometimes mess up a hole big style - but you always hope he will nail it

MarcusP12

Old diesel wrote: »

"better then his stats would suggest"

That sums up this event for him really - the bare stats suggest someone not very good at all.

When in reality the poor stats are actually down to 5 holes over the 3 days - frustrating really.

Imagine they redefined the scoring system and allowed all players to mulligan their worst hole per round to par...would definitely suit paddy and he'd be a force again!he'd be writing off trippled bogeys while others are only writing off a bogey or double!

ForeRight

lorenzo87 wrote: »

I had an eagle today and I play off 11.

Big deal. Padraig had one last week and he's off 18

ForeRight

Am I the only one who gets a headache reading this thread?

lorenzo87

ForeRight wrote: »

Am I the only one who gets a headache reading this thread?

No. I have taken 8 Panadol today.

JohnnyLocke

Once next week starts we should all take a break from this thread and not post until the tournament is over! Maybe we are at fault!

Next week is one of the best weeks of the year at Riviera. Nothing worse than a bogey please Padraig!

Old diesel

You know - we will all be back here for the next event hoping - for a good result.

But at the end of the day - if he never won another event again or retired tomorrow morning - the good things hes achieved in his career - the majors, all the wins in Europe and USA - hes STILL done all that.

In fact - if he hadn't - wed now be talking about someone else and not really have much interest in Padraig - the reason weve all know of him is because of what he achieved at his peak.

Id still like to see him do as well as he can for HIMSELF - and for him to be able to enjoy what he does - whether that's more Golf - or at some point in the future retirement.

mr.jingle

Old diesel wrote: »

You know - we will all be back here for the next event hoping - for a good result.

But at the end of the day - if he never won another event again or retired tomorrow morning - the good things hes achieved in his career - the majors, all the wins in Europe and USA - hes STILL done all that.

In fact - if he hadn't - wed now be talking about someone else and not really have much interest in Padraig - the reason weve all know of him is because of what he achieved at his peak.

Id still like to see him do as well as he can for HIMSELF - and for him to be able to enjoy what he does - whether that's more Golf - or at some point in the future retirement.

He has done that and fair play to him. I think its just he could so easily have done so much more and become an even bigger legend of the game.

3 majors is an unbelievable achievement but without his tinkering he could have doubled that total such was his form at that time.

A lot of the criticism of the man is just through frustration of what could have been instead of what he's actually done in his career

JohnnyLocke

Just checked there. Harro has missed 11 cuts on the PGA Tour since this event last year! This will be no. 12. If that sounds bad he has only achieved a position high enough to obtain any sort of world ranking points ONCE in 20 events on the US tour which was a tied 22nd at the Byron Nelson Championship last year! (2.38 ranking points) These stats are beyond dreadful!

In contrast hes played 11 events on the european tour/asian tour. 3 missed cuts. 73rd 61st 47th 28th 27th 18th 14th and obviously the 1st in Asia. (total ranking points - 22.71)

By no means are the stats on the Euro/Asian Tour amazing but considering its in almost half the events its a substantial difference.

I was always in the court of him staying on the PGA tour because of the elite fields and higher ranking points available but now im firmly with the guys who believe he should switch tours. If you cant make a cut in America then dont be thinking about the big prize money and "easy ranking points"

MarcusP12

Old diesel wrote: »

"better then his stats would suggest"

That sums up this event for him really - the bare stats suggest someone not doing very well. And yes the stats matter because that's how the end result is measured.

But they don't tell a lot the story for Padraig on this event - as good aspects of his performance this weekend aren't reflected in the score board

When in reality the poor stats are actually down to 5 holes over the 3 days - frustrating really.

But could you imagine if he managed to iron out the ability to make massive mistakes on a hole - that's where the hope comes from.

When he puts in a good round - we get excited because we hope he can repeat that.

As for being deluded - I think many of us have come to appreciate his ability to sometimes mess up a hole big style - but you always hope he will nail it

I think you've touched on something interesting here.....the trollers on this forum seem to think the hope that a lot of us have that paddy can turn things around is deluded...but I don't think that is the case...the reason why a lot of us have and maintain the hope is because in between the horror big numbers,he's playing quite well...the hope lies in eliminating these horror holes.eliminate them,and the good results will return...if though for example last week in the farmers where he stunk the place out and was all over the place, was typical of his cut missing performances generally, it would be reasonable to say that the hope was deluded....but this week is more representative of his woes...the ability is still there but the brain farts are holding him back....

Old diesel

JohnnyLocke wrote: »

Just checked there. Harro has missed 11 cuts on the PGA Tour since this event last year! This will be no. 12. If that sounds bad he has only achieved a position high enough to obtain any sort of world ranking points ONCE in 20 events on the US tour which was a tied 22nd at the Byron Nelson Championship last year! (2.38 ranking points) These stats are beyond dreadful!

In contrast hes played 11 events on the european tour/asian tour. 3 missed cuts. 73rd 61st 47th 28th 27th 18th 14th and obviously the 1st in Asia. (total ranking points - 22.71)

By no means are the stats on the Euro/Asian Tour amazing but considering its in almost half the events its a substantial difference.

I was always in the court of him staying on the PGA tour because of the elite fields and higher ranking points available but now im firmly with the guys who believe he should switch tours. If you cant make a cut in America then dont be thinking about the big prize money and "easy ranking points"

Its mindblowing to think that ONE event in Indonesia has done more for him in world rankings and prize money then all the US events this season

MarcusP12

mr.jingle wrote: »

He has done that and fair play to him. I think its just he could so easily have done so much more and become an even bigger legend of the game.

3 majors is an unbelievable achievement but without his tinkering he could have doubled that total such was his form at that time.

A lot of the criticism of the man is just through frustration of what could have been instead of what he's actually done in his career

I might be wrong but the reason he decided to tinker was because he felt his game had to evolve in order to become a dominant force...maybe he had a dominant tiger coming back from injury in mind...no one could have imagined how things would eventually pan out for tiger within a short period of time so with the benefit of hindsight,if paddy had left well enough alone,he may well have picked off another couple of majors....who knows!

Old diesel

MarcusP12 wrote: »

I think you've touched on something interesting here.....the trollers on this forum seem to think the hope that a lot of us have that paddy can turn things around is deluded...but I don't think that is the case...the reason why a lot of us have and maintain the hope is because in between the horror big numbers,he's playing quite well...the hope lies in eliminating these horror holes.eliminate them,and the good results will return...if though for example last week in the farmers where he stunk the place out and was all over the place, was typical of his cut missing performances generally, it would be reasonable to say that the hope was deluded....but this week is more representative of his woes...the ability is still there but the brain farts are holding him back....

exactly - I think he still has the ability to play golf - he wouldn't have been 7 under for the tournament in round 3 after 17 holes today if he DIDN'T have the ability to play.

the difficulty is that ability to do things is different somewhat from performance.

the performance lets him down because of bad mistakes

Worth remembering that after hole 17 today - Padraig was just 4 shots behind someone whose number 40 in the world (Lowry).

Was this because Lowry played poorly - no - it was because Padraig was doing something right out there to be that close.

But the bad mistake changes everything

MarcusP12

Old diesel wrote: »

exactly - I think he still has the ability to play golf - he wouldn't have been 7 under for the tournament in round 3 after 17 holes today if he DIDN'T have the ability to play.

the difficulty is that ability to do things is different somewhat from performance.

the performance lets him down because of bad mistakes

Worth remembering that after hole 17 today - Padraig was just 4 shots behind someone whose number 40 in the world (Lowry).

Was this because Lowry played poorly - no - it was because Padraig was doing something right out there to be that close.

But the bad mistake changes everything

I don't think people should be so dismissive of the whole if he didn't trippled bogey those holes he would have been 10 under, type points as reasons to be optimistic.I think most golfers think in terms if what could have been as a reason to go out the next day. For example if I hadn't scratched those couple of holes, I'd have broken standard scratch.we all do it...it applies to every standard.sure if you didn't,why would you ever play again!

vienne86

Pierce_1991 wrote: »

Cudda sworn I've heard him speak of the benefits of sports psychologists in the past. You would think with the career he's had he would be well able to break through these mental barriers he seems to be facing at the moment.

I heard him speak on radio about going to Steve Peters all right.

He must be shattered after that last hole.

Ormus

Steve Stricker, Henrik Stenson, Lee Westwood and Sergio Garcia off the top of my head are just some of the golfers who have lost their game for years, gone way down the world rankings and recovered to win again. Golf is that kind of game.

The longer Harrington goes without winning (Asian Tour aside) the less likely it becomes that he will win again. At this stage it's been so long that there's a good chance it won't happen. But to suggest it's impossible is deluded, especially as most of his game is still in good nick.

9to5

Sorry lads but most of you are completely missing the obvious here. The mental side of his game is completely gone. And that means his game is gone! Go watch all the talented players who stripe it on the range and chip/putt with the best of them. They don't make it on tour cos for whatever reason they cant score. I play with guys every week who strike the ball better than their handicap suggests but go months without putting a score together.
Pros have to play well at least 3 days in a row.

Bob Torrance warned him of this.
He has gone down a windy road and cant find his way back.

Great champion but its embarrassing now.

If I thought he could completely give over his game to the right coach and listen to him 100%
id give him a chance to come back. But he has shown no sign of that.

Ormus

9to5 wrote: »

Sorry lads but most of you are completely missing the obvious here. The mental side of his game is completely gone. And that means his game is gone! Go watch all the talented players who stripe it on the range and chip/putt with the best of them. They don't make it on tour cos for whatever reason they cant score. I play with guys every week who strike the ball better than their handicap suggests but go months without putting a score together.
Pros have to play well at least 3 days in a row.

Bob Torrance warned him of this.
He has gone down a windy road and cant find his way back.

Great champion but its embarrassing now.

If I thought he could completely give over his game to the right coach and listen to him 100%
id give him a chance to come back. But he has shown no sign of that.

If his mental game was completely shot he would have the yips and he wouldn't be able to shoot a round under par.

He definitely has some issues, but you're being sensational.

What Tiger did last week was embarrassing. Harrington is just yet another pro having problems with his game. Such is golf.

charlieIRL

ForeRight wrote: »

Am I the only one who gets a headache reading this thread?

Imagine how myself and Keano feel?