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Is PC Gaming worth it?

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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 1,251 ✭✭✭Sandvich


    I can't see anybody doing any actual troubleshooting, just complaining. Like I said that sort of performance issue would be outside of the Valves control. I would have expected bios upgrades, antivirus removal, OS changes, reinstalls, changes to windows power settings, disabling thermal management/power-saver settings in the bios and driver updates other then the graphics cards. Using a second monitor, checking out resource manager and process explorer while the game is running to check out is there anything happening.

    Well, there are lengthy threads that have troubleshooted this and a couple of the people in that thread have said they've tried just about everything.

    I don't know why some people have to be so obnoxious as to always presume it's the fault of the person with the issues.

    It's bull**** to say that it's outside of Valve's control, when people are clearly able to run much more recent games at good settings without FPS issues. The issue clearly TF2. It's only when a majority of games aren't running correctly that you can blame it on the system configuration, because clearly other devs don't have the same issues Valve do getting their game to work on more systems without random performance issues.


  • Moderators, Computer Games Moderators Posts: 14,711 Mod ✭✭✭✭Dcully


    You forgot to mention that the pc version suffers from horrible memory leaks meaning the game becomes unplayable after about an hour due to load times and slowdown.

    I still haven't been able to play it that much. I installed 1.04 the other day hoping it will solve some of the memory leaks. Haven't tried it yet.

    Never had that issue with my version, i have the boxed retail version.
    Console for Driving

    The pc has a massive driving community, especially the simracing community.


  • Registered Users Posts: 764 ✭✭✭ProjectColossus


    On topic: Gaming on PCs is definetly worth it. I spend entirely too much time gaming on my laptop.

    My games look great, better than the console equivelant in almost all cases, bearing in mind that I'm on a 16 month old laptop.

    Keyboard + mouse works better in any games I care to play, and even then, I can plug in a 360 controller which I did for Dead Space.

    I'm currently playing through Fallout 3 again, having gotten the GOTY edition. I have access to plenty of mods, and more importantly for me, the developer console. You don't get that on a PS3 or Xbox as far as I am aware.

    Games are usually cheaper. Multiplayer is free. PS3 has that right in fairness. Microsoft can cram it with walnuts though.

    Somewhat off topic:
    I really really like Valve, they produce fantastic games. I haven't been playing TF2 as much lately and even still I have about 270 hours played. I have no issues what so ever playing TF2, nor did I on my previous machine. But, it has to be said that a lot of people are having issues that are unusual and have so far remained unresolved. People on high end hardware are getting low fps with no explanation, and the particle engine is killing some machines. Sandviches points are valid.

    In the cases where old machines are not running the game well (excluding the somewhat rare cases of problems with high end machines), that's par for the course with PC gaming really though. Even then, Valve games tend to run well, for longer.

    Sandvich wrote: »
    Actually, a console can leave your PC free for having it up permanently. No more dicking around with Valve's ****ty alt+tab bugs.

    No longer a problem, current version of Steam has an in-built browser so you don't have to alt+tab out! (Which does usually fark up source games) Yay for porn. Or gamefaqs or whatever.


  • Registered Users Posts: 22,929 ✭✭✭✭ShadowHearth


    OP was dissapointed that there is no exclusives for pc?

    there are loads , specially if you are new to pc gaming you can pick up loads of classics which are just pure awesome!

    Trust me, after you played mw2 on xblender, and then sitting down to pc, you will newer come back to xblender version. freedom of control is just amazing.

    I grew up on consoles, and it was awesome. I got all consoles and pc. the only game that i recently played on pc was forza 3. and that was 3 months ago...

    PC all the way, spcially when prices of powerfull rights dropped so low! It used to be a pain in a hole good 7-10 years ago. when you bought latest machine , and after 1 months theres a twice more powerfull machine for same money...


  • Registered Users Posts: 8,405 ✭✭✭gizmo


    Trust me, after you played mw2 on xblender, and then sitting down to pc, you will newer come back to xblender version. freedom of control is just amazing.
    Is xblender the 360? Personally having played MW2 on the PC I wanted to go back to the 360 because at least there I'm used to P2P gaming. Do not want on the PC though thank you very much IW. People can say what they want about Treyarch but at least they're not up their own arses as much as the IW.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 5,112 ✭✭✭Blowfish


    Auvers wrote: »
    PC is for FPS, RPG, RTS and MMO games (World of Tanks is brilliant btw) & mouse keyboard control

    Console for Driving/Football games as I cant play FPS games on a console because those awful control pads
    Or just buy a controller for the PC and play Driving/Football games there too. Works especially well with emulators.

    Another one is JoyToKey which maps directly from gamepad to keyboard and is completely customisable, so will work with games which weren't actually designed for a controller and can be used to control things like media players and even navigating around Windows.


  • Registered Users Posts: 22,929 ✭✭✭✭ShadowHearth


    gizmo wrote: »
    Is xblender the 360? Personally having played MW2 on the PC I wanted to go back to the 360 because at least there I'm used to P2P gaming. Do not want on the PC though thank you very much IW. People can say what they want about Treyarch but at least they're not up their own arses as much as the IW.

    Iwnet thing did came from consoles. So the only ones that we have to thank for it are consoles... And how can you be sick of iwnet on pc, if you have ALL games based on IWnet on xbox?

    They droped the ball with Iwnet, but i did not had much of trouble playing with it. People make more noise about it, then there actuall is...

    Only reason why xblender version would be more whanted, is becouse people play on xbox and have all theyr friends on it. I personally have loads of friends on pc, we have our own vent server, so when you turn on pc, you turn on vent and you are socialising with all your friends! so playing on pc with friends is not an issue.

    i did bought ps3 version of MW1, after playing it for couple of months i got myself pc version. i newer came back to ps3 after that...

    people tend to be afraid of stuff they dont understand. thats why there are so many people against pc gaming. Its supperior in any given way, just people are not arsed to learn it. Its way easyer to buy same game for twice the price and drop it in to xblender, which will do everything for you...


  • Registered Users Posts: 8,405 ✭✭✭gizmo


    Iwnet thing did came from consoles. So the only ones that we have to thank for it are consoles... And how can you be sick of iwnet on pc, if you have ALL games based on IWnet on xbox?
    As I said, I'm used to P2P gaming and the associated side effects on the console so I'm more tolerant towards it. On the PC, however, I have no time for it.
    They droped the ball with Iwnet, but i did not had much of trouble playing with it. People make more noise about it, then there actuall is...
    I don't go for the usual fanboy rage associated with it but it was certainly an inferior experience compared to the usual client/server model. I understand why they did it, to an extent anyway, but that doesn't mean I agree with it.
    people tend to be afraid of stuff they dont understand. thats why there are so many people against pc gaming. Its supperior in any given way, just people are not arsed to learn it. Its way easyer to buy same game for twice the price and drop it in to xblender, which will do everything for you...
    People are against PC gaming for more reasons than that, reasons which have been brought up several times before on this very forum. At the end of the day, PC Gaming often requires a technical knowledge beyond the level of the average consumer or beyond the level they wish to learn in order to play games. Why would they need to bother if they can just put the game into the console and boom, it works? Personally I'm glad I have the best of both worlds but I do understand where some people are coming from with the console love.

    And for the love of god please stop calling it xblender. :(


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 1,251 ✭✭✭Sandvich


    I still haven't really gotten a ton of examples of games I can play...

    Sitting around I have Mass Effect, Far Cry 2 and Turok I kind of want to try that ran a bit **** on this PC(don't understand why Mass Effect was so bad), and I'm looking forward to turning up the settings on L4D2. Some of the maps can be killer on FPS. I'll probably pick up Starcraft II at some point.

    But none of those games really mega impress me.

    I miss the days when you got really unique games on PC, and they were fully developed cutting edge product, not just indie games. I'm remembering random old games I used to pick off demo discs, like Banzai Bug, Amok, Scorched Earth, Blood, Duke 3D, Lemmings Paintball, tons more I can't remember. They were all pretty interesting. FPSes had a bit more character to them back then too.

    I miss that era of PC gaming. All of those kind of games seem to be only on console now, but now consoles are drying up too for those kind of games.

    I really want to get into Indie games now, but it's tough. I tried Dwarf Fortress and couldn't make head nor tail of it. I used to enjoy a couple of years back downloading Multimedia Fusion based games which had been developed to a good level. But I really want to see new technology being involved in this and most Indie games are at best Half Life 2 kind of quality. Which is actually sort of fine - I like that level of graphics and don't think many games "need" better than that. But I like to see things move forward too.

    It just depresses me that a lot of the more visually inventive games were done before we actually managed to get a level of graphics where it's not so obviously made out of little triangles. Going back and playing some older games, the lack of overall smoothness and flat/dull nature of a lot of games can ruin what they set out to do. Nowadays, that's not really an issue.

    There's so much amazing stuff that could be done with today's tech on a grander scale.

    For example, imagine a Oddworld game done with the same level of technical prowess Crysis 2 will have, or a new Earthworm Jim game, or a Giants: Citizen Kabuto sequel.

    I really hope American McGee's Alice too doesn't end up in development hell.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 18,056 ✭✭✭✭BostonB


    Sandvich wrote: »
    I'm thinking about building a gaming rig as my current laptop struggles with Team Fortress 2(mostly due to optimisation issues on Valve's side, not my computer's specs which are decent).

    But is it really worth it?....

    What do mean worth it. Fun? Value for money?

    By rig do you mean Laptop or desktop?

    If the game (or version - mouse/kybd control - high res) you want is only on the PC then thats what you have to get, obviously. (simulations especially). If you want better bang for buck a console makes more sense because the hardware doesn't obsolete as fast. If you have to get a PC then a desktop doesn't obsolete as fast as gaming laptop.

    I think its thats simple.

    Personally I prefer PC games, simulations and the controls etc. I also don't have room for a big desktop rig. So if it doesn't play on my laptop, I don't play it. There are some exceptions where the game is only on a console.


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  • Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 6,315 ✭✭✭Jazzy


    well if this halo reach game is the current benchmark for consoles then sell your granny to get a gaming pc


  • Registered Users Posts: 22,929 ✭✭✭✭ShadowHearth


    gizmo wrote: »
    As I said, I'm used to P2P gaming and the associated side effects on the console so I'm more tolerant towards it. On the PC, however, I have no time for it.


    I don't go for the usual fanboy rage associated with it but it was certainly an inferior experience compared to the usual client/server model. I understand why they did it, to an extent anyway, but that doesn't mean I agree with it.


    People are against PC gaming for more reasons than that, reasons which have been brought up several times before on this very forum. At the end of the day, PC Gaming often requires a technical knowledge beyond the level of the average consumer or beyond the level they wish to learn in order to play games. Why would they need to bother if they can just put the game into the console and boom, it works? Personally I'm glad I have the best of both worlds but I do understand where some people are coming from with the console love.

    And for the love of god please stop calling it xblender. :(

    well okay, i wount. but everytime i start the damn thing, thats how i whant to call it :D

    Anyway, avarage pc consumer can easily play games, you dont need technical level to insert cd, press install and press next a few times. moust of modern games will set graphic level by your current set up too.

    i will say it again, its just laizyness. to make that extra step and actually look in to it. Decent desktop to play games are not crazy money. allmoust any desktop can play games, just make sure it has graphic card.

    anyway. consoles are good for avarege joe, but if you have atleast few extra brain cells, which are not smoked are destroyed in pub, then use them to learn that small extra about pc gaming. now i am not refering to you m8, i am talking in general ;)


  • Registered Users Posts: 8,405 ✭✭✭gizmo


    well okay, i wount. but everytime i start the damn thing, thats how i whant to call it :D

    Anyway, avarage pc consumer can easily play games, you dont need technical level to insert cd, press install and press next a few times. moust of modern games will set graphic level by your current set up too.

    i will say it again, its just laizyness. to make that extra step and actually look in to it. Decent desktop to play games are not crazy money. allmoust any desktop can play games, just make sure it has graphic card.

    anyway. consoles are good for avarege joe, but if you have atleast few extra brain cells, which are not smoked are destroyed in pub, then use them to learn that small extra about pc gaming. now i am not refering to you m8, i am talking in general ;)
    I just don't think people want to have to learn how to do new things to get into gaming. The problem is exacerbated when they can just pick up a console and know they can play every game that comes out in exactly the same way as everyone else. No need for checking specs on the box or wondering will it look as good on their machine, they'll know it'll work and continue to do so until the next console comes out.


  • Registered Users Posts: 22,929 ✭✭✭✭ShadowHearth


    gizmo wrote: »
    I just don't think people want to have to learn how to do new things to get into gaming. The problem is exacerbated when they can just pick up a console and know they can play every game that comes out in exactly the same way as everyone else. No need for checking specs on the box or wondering will it look as good on their machine, they'll know it'll work and continue to do so until the next console comes out.

    to be honest, last time i actually checked the game requirments 2.5 years ago... i grabed mafia2 reccently i just bought it, droped it in and playing it on max settings...

    in fact, i got a wee bit enraged.... as mafia2 for pc is a clone from consoles...


  • Registered Users Posts: 150 ✭✭TetraxShard


    I've tried the PC gaming route and it didn't go well for me. It's certainly different, and there's a few gems on there you won't get anywhere else.

    Personally, I don't have the interest anymore. I just want to play some games and if that means I'm not teh hardcor3z, so be it. I'm quite content with the way most games look and play on consoles.


  • Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 17,134 Mod ✭✭✭✭cherryghost


    I'm a convert from console to PC in the last 3 years. Why?

    - When I play an FPS, I want to damn hell turn as fast as I intend to turn. The keyboard and mouse helps me do that easily.

    - When I get bored of a game, I just download mods that keeps me playing the game for many more years

    - PC games costs between 20-30 euro cheaper brand new. Buy 20 console games, you've spent a budget PC's worth.

    - I don't want any mother****ing subscriptions or extra costs to my games. 98% of PC games extra content is free or user made

    - I like community. The 360 allows a community sure, but you cant beat regular evenings in the same servers as your friends, and join them seemlinglessly easy.

    - I like to explore different genres, and theres a lengty list of popular free games for all types of genres on the PC

    - I ****ing hate lag. At least with PC gaming I can pick what server I want, what maps I prefer, and all without moving around like someone attached an elastic band to my back

    - A quick alt+tab gets me to my email, my music, my IM, streamed TV, whatever the hell thats possible on a PC. It's great.


    EDIT: It's also worth mentioning that anyone who bought a new PC in the last 2-3 years but cant find themselve able to play PC games, chances are you could throw in a 50 euro graphics card inside it and get started :)


    Gaming was born with PC, it sure as hell will die with PC too. :)


  • Registered Users Posts: 3,411 ✭✭✭oceanclub


    Sandvich wrote: »
    I'm thinking about building a gaming rig as my current laptop struggles with Team Fortress 2(mostly due to optimisation issues on Valve's side, not my computer's specs which are decent).

    But is it really worth it?

    As someone else said, it's a subjective question really. I am what Yahtzee might refer to as a muscular superior PC gamer. Although have a PC (and laptop), XBox 360, Wii, DS (well, the wife's) and an iPhone, I do 95%+ of my gaming on PC. Why?

    I like genres of games that are good on PC (first person shooters, RPGs, strategy, puzzle/indie), I much prefer using a mouse to a gamepad, like being able to Alt-Tab in and out of games to check mail, forums, FAQs, etc. I like the fact that you can mod older games (just been replaying Oblivion) or simply see them at their best, and what you spend on hardware (and bear in mind I haven't upgraded in three years) you more than save on the lower cost of games (Steam sales are insane).

    I figure that since I'd probably have a desktop _anyway_ for working, as a media server, etc, the extra cost of maintaining it as a gaming PC (ie, updating the graphics card every couple of years) is more than worth it. I don't understand the logic that PC gaming is uber-expensive when people spent the equivalent of the cost of a high-end graphics cards on three high-priced new consoles games.

    There's plenty of good games out on PC still - certain Metacritic in their 2009 roundup still has it as number 2:

    http://features.metacritic.com/features/2009/the-best-games-of-2009/

    P.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 1,251 ✭✭✭Sandvich


    I wish there were more games like Elder Scrolls on the PC. Going to check out the Witcher at some point.


  • Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 17,134 Mod ✭✭✭✭cherryghost


    Sandvich wrote: »
    I wish there were more games like Elder Scrolls on the PC. Going to check out the Witcher at some point.

    Mount & Blade

    Neverwinter Nights (DEFINITELY CHECK OUT NVN2)

    Knights of the Old Republic

    Morrowmind


    are to name but a few, all follow the same RPG element as ES. There's a huge amount of quality games similar to Elder Scrolls


  • Registered Users Posts: 3,411 ✭✭✭oceanclub


    Sandvich wrote: »
    I wish there were more games like Elder Scrolls on the PC. Going to check out the Witcher at some point.

    The Witcher is brilliant; the demo put me off, but eventually picked up the game in the Xmas Steam sale for a tenner and loved it. Looking forward to the sequel.

    Not even any need for high-powered graphic cards: I'm currently engrossed in this! (bought the beta):

    http://www.minecraft.net/

    (More at the PC blog Rock Paper Shotgun: http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/tag/minecraft/)


    P.


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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 1,251 ✭✭✭Sandvich


    Mount & Blade

    Neverwinter Nights (DEFINITELY CHECK OUT NVN2)

    Knights of the Old Republic

    Morrowmind


    are to name but a few, all follow the same RPG element as ES. There's a huge amount of quality games similar to Elder Scrolls

    I tried NWN some time ago and didn't find it my cup of tea at all.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 1,251 ✭✭✭Sandvich


    oceanclub wrote: »
    As someone else said, it's a subjective question really. I am what Yahtzee might refer to as a muscular superior PC gamer. Although have a PC (and laptop), XBox 360, Wii, DS (well, the wife's) and an iPhone, I do 95%+ of my gaming on PC. Why?

    I like genres of games that are good on PC (first person shooters, RPGs, strategy, puzzle/indie), I much prefer using a mouse to a gamepad, like being able to Alt-Tab in and out of games to check mail, forums, FAQs, etc. I like the fact that you can mod older games (just been replaying Oblivion) or simply see them at their best, and what you spend on hardware (and bear in mind I haven't upgraded in three years) you more than save on the lower cost of games (Steam sales are insane).

    I figure that since I'd probably have a desktop _anyway_ for working, as a media server, etc, the extra cost of maintaining it as a gaming PC (ie, updating the graphics card every couple of years) is more than worth it. I don't understand the logic that PC gaming is uber-expensive when people spent the equivalent of the cost of a high-end graphics cards on three high-priced new consoles games.

    There's plenty of good games out on PC still - certain Metacritic in their 2009 roundup still has it as number 2:

    http://features.metacritic.com/features/2009/the-best-games-of-2009/

    P.

    Most of those games are ports... there's maybe 2 or 3 games there that grab me... god 2009 was a **** year for games :/


  • Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 17,134 Mod ✭✭✭✭cherryghost


    Sandvich wrote: »
    Most of those games are ports... there's maybe 2 or 3 games there that grab me... god 2009 was a **** year for games :/

    At least 24 of the top 40 PC games of 2009 are NOT ports. Some other games are questionable as ports too. Personally I thought it was a decent year, not for mainstream games, but where the indie games have risen and truly shone. I found myself buying quite a large amount of AAA quality indie games


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 11,924 ✭✭✭✭RolandIRL


    i think PC gaming is worth it. i'd be a good bit into strategy, and the only way to play this is with a keyboard and mouse. i made the mistake of buying Supreme Commander for Xbox, though that was cos it wouldn't run on my computer. it was so dumbed down. control system was just aaarrggh :mad:
    Mods for PC games are just brilliant. 15 years on, and i'm still playing Total Annihilation on my laptop (god is it that old? :o). one of the best strategy games ever imo.
    FPS is also a lot better on PC. i also have a 360, but the thumbsticks aren't as fluid as a mouse. if i want to turn around quickly, i can move my mouse quicker to do it, not so much on consoles.
    that said, i mostly buy console games, cos i don't have the money to maintain my computer to the levels needed for some games. and i wouldn't be spending €50 on a console game. i wait for it to come down in price a lot before buying. and PC games are hard to come by in bricks & mortar shops cos with no credit card and crap internet, downloading games just isn't feasible for me atm


  • Registered Users Posts: 3,411 ✭✭✭oceanclub


    Sandvich wrote: »
    Most of those games are ports... there's maybe 2 or 3 games there that grab me... god 2009 was a **** year for games :/

    Well, some are ports, some are multiplatform. And there's nothing wrong with a good port. For example, looking at the PC list:

    http://features.metacritic.com/features/2009/the-best-games-of-2009/3/

    Number 3: Dragon Ages: Origins was multiplatform, but it's acknowledged by most that the PC version was far superior (different controls for one).

    Number 4: I imagine Valve will go on to support Left 4 Dead 2 on PC far longer than on Xbox (think Team Fortress 2). And if you prefer mouse to gamepad for FPSs like, it's a no-brainer.

    I mean, there's a huge overlap between that the list and the list for the XBox, so you can't really argue that it was a bad year for the PC specifically. Certainly, I wish I had less games to play sometimes, not more. :)

    P.


  • Registered Users Posts: 7,383 ✭✭✭Dave_The_Sheep


    Sandvich wrote: »
    I wish there were more games like Elder Scrolls on the PC. Going to check out the Witcher at some point.

    Not that the Witcher isn't a very good game, it really is, but its nothing like Oblivion. If you want to compare it to another RPG I'd say compare it to Dragon Age. Oblivion you could just go around forever without completing the quests in a massive open world (sure that might suck a bit but you had the freedom to do it), but in the Wticher, you can't. It's far more controlling than Oblivion.

    I prefer the free to roam approach of Oblivion/Fallout to the story driven approach of Bioware. Though I do love the Bioware games still.


  • Registered Users Posts: 3,411 ✭✭✭oceanclub


    You could always get Morrowind and "beautify" it if you want an Elder Scrolls fix. Here's a blog that details how to enhance the game using various mods and tweaks:

    http://morrowind2009.wordpress.com/

    P.


  • Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 6,315 ✭✭✭Jazzy




    - I like community. The 360 allows a community sure, but you cant beat regular evenings in the same servers as your friends, and join them seemlinglessly easy.

    this


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 2,987 ✭✭✭Auvers


    I found myself buying quite a large amount of AAA quality indie games

    any chance of your top 5 releases?


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  • Registered Users Posts: 9,046 ✭✭✭Dustaz


    I'm a convert from console to PC in the last 3 years. Why?

    - When I play an FPS, I want to damn hell turn as fast as I intend to turn. The keyboard and mouse helps me do that easily.

    - When I get bored of a game, I just download mods that keeps me playing the game for many more years

    - PC games costs between 20-30 euro cheaper brand new. Buy 20 console games, you've spent a budget PC's worth.

    - I don't want any mother****ing subscriptions or extra costs to my games. 98% of PC games extra content is free or user made

    - I like community. The 360 allows a community sure, but you cant beat regular evenings in the same servers as your friends, and join them seemlinglessly easy.

    - I like to explore different genres, and theres a lengty list of popular free games for all types of genres on the PC

    - I ****ing hate lag. At least with PC gaming I can pick what server I want, what maps I prefer, and all without moving around like someone attached an elastic band to my back

    - A quick alt+tab gets me to my email, my music, my IM, streamed TV, whatever the hell thats possible on a PC. It's great.


    EDIT: It's also worth mentioning that anyone who bought a new PC in the last 2-3 years but cant find themselve able to play PC games, chances are you could throw in a 50 euro graphics card inside it and get started :)


    Gaming was born with PC, it sure as hell will die with PC too. :)


    Quoting this as the OP should actually read it instead of repeating the same "but what games is there" question.


    OP, If you have to actually ask the initial question, you might be better off staying with console.


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