Carlow TD for next Government

Villain

I know a lot of people find politics boring and don’t think they can have a say or change the bloody mess we have but if people come together that can change.

Carlow and Kilkenny share a constituency and at present our TD’s are:

Bobby Aylward (FF)
MJ Nolan (FF)
Philip Hogan (FG)
John McGuinness (FF)
Mary White (Green)

With MJ Nolan and Mary White been the Carlow based TD’s, sadly despite both of them being in power Carlow in my opinion is badly represented and has suffered from such poor representation over the past 15 years.

Mary White got my vote in the last election purely because I wanted another Carlow TD in the Government but she has failed the county and not carried through on pre-election promises.

The nature of our past 3 Governments has seen Independent TD’s hold massive sway in keeping Governments in power, TD’s like Michael Lowry, Jackie Healy Rae and Finian McGrath have been able to deliver for their local constituency.

This form of Politics is not something I particularly like nor does it do anything for the country as a whole but locally is sure does deliver.

Looking ahead to the next Dail it realistically looks like Labour and Fine Gael will be the parties in power, looking at that from a Carlow perspective Labour don’t have any strong Candidates from Carlow. FG TD Phil Hogan will most likely be a senior Minister in the next Government which is great for Kilkenny but will mean that whoever takes the other seats will be unlikely to get a senior post leaving Carlow poorly represented again.

So does anyone know of a decent Carlow Politican who has the potential to run as independent candidate? Someone whom we can start campaigning for shortly and will have the strong character to deliver some prosperity for Carlow.

Irish Politics has many flaws and while it would be great to take away the local IMBY (in my backyard) culture I don’t think we’ll achieve that this generation but we can use the system and get the best we can from it.

Any opinions or ideas and yes I’m sure some (all) will think it’s a bloody stupid idea and useless but no harm in trying?

zeds alive

MJ Nolan (FF) possibly the most useless TD I have ever encountered , he's a classic example of someone you only see every 4 years when he needs the vote.
He's also a good example of a career politician who got there through political nepotism. sorry had to get that off my chest
although I hate the greens , Mary white will make an effort to answer emails or at least see you if you need to see her.

ShayK1

I am not particularly interested in politics so forgive my ignorance.

Would you not consider William Patton a strong Labour candidate?

And from Carlow, John Cassin seemed to be a very eager and entuisiastic(sp?) candiate at the last election. Could he be backed as an indepedant?

mickos

ShayK1 wrote: »

I am not particularly interested in politics so forgive my ignorance.

Would you not consider William Patton a strong Labour candidate?

And from Carlow, John Cassin seemed to be a very eager and entuisiastic(sp?) candiate at the last election. Could he be backed as an indepedant?

I dunno if William Pattons vote stretches far outside Tullow Shay, can't see him being a strong candidate.
Did John Cassin not run for Sinn Fein last time? If so its hard to see him having any part in government even if elected.

Villian, you make a good point. A strong independant candidate could be Carlows only hope of meaningful representation in the next dail.

Haven't a clue on the candidate though. You would need somebody well known throughout the county. Who could get votes from all sorts.

My suggestion Richie Kavanagh, he could bring out a song for the campaign:D*



* I jest, seriously no Richie Kavanagh;)

Villain

ShayK1 wrote: »

I am not particularly interested in politics so forgive my ignorance.

Would you not consider William Patton a strong Labour candidate?

And from Carlow, John Cassin seemed to be a very eager and entuisiastic(sp?) candiate at the last election. Could he be backed as an indepedant?

As Mickos said Paton wouldn't have the profile outside his council area, anyway Labour have chosen Ann Phelan to be their candidate for the Carlow Kilkenny constituency in the next election. She is a councillor from Kilkenny so we can't rely on Labour for a Carlow TD.

John Cassin had ran for Sinn Fein so he is out as well, we need a strong personality well known in Carlow who hasn't been stained by previous party alignment.

ShayK1

how about you Villain?

Villain

ShayK1 wrote: »

how about you Villain?

lol Don't think so Shay not got the profile for that, maybe if we get the worst winter in History this year lol

I'm sure there is someone in Carlow that fits the bill.

sharky86

Declan Alcock!

Covert2007

Villain wrote: »

I know a lot of people find politics boring and don’t think they can have a say or change the bloody mess we have but if people come together that can change.

Carlow and Kilkenny share a constituency and at present our TD’s are:

Bobby Aylward (FF)
MJ Nolan (FF)
Philip Hogan (FG)
John McGuinness (FF)
Mary White (Green)

With MJ Nolan and Mary White been the Carlow based TD’s, sadly despite both of them being in power Carlow in my opinion is badly represented and has suffered from such poor representation over the past 15 years.

Mary White got my vote in the last election purely because I wanted another Carlow TD in the Government but she has failed the county and not carried through on pre-election promises.

The nature of our past 3 Governments has seen Independent TD’s hold massive sway in keeping Governments in power, TD’s like Michael Lowry, Jackie Healy Rae and Finian McGrath have been able to deliver for their local constituency.

This form of Politics is not something I particularly like nor does it do anything for the country as a whole but locally is sure does deliver.

Looking ahead to the next Dail it realistically looks like Labour and Fine Gael will be the parties in power, looking at that from a Carlow perspective Labour don’t have any strong Candidates from Carlow. FG TD Phil Hogan will most likely be a senior Minister in the next Government which is great for Kilkenny but will mean that whoever takes the other seats will be unlikely to get a senior post leaving Carlow poorly represented again.

So does anyone know of a decent Carlow Politican who has the potential to run as independent candidate? Someone whom we can start campaigning for shortly and will have the strong character to deliver some prosperity for Carlow.

Irish Politics has many flaws and while it would be great to take away the local IMBY (in my backyard) culture I don’t think we’ll achieve that this generation but we can use the system and get the best we can from it.

Any opinions or ideas and yes I’m sure some (all) will think it’s a bloody stupid idea and useless but no harm in trying?

I for one wouldn't be bothered voting for an independent like Jackie Healy Rae, they rake in the money in expenses and turn up at funerals to get votes, ya can keep that.

Independents will have absloutely no say in the next Dail, the Government will be formed from the parties because people will be voting for a stable government, not dependent on the wim of a gonbeen coat tailers like Healy Rae or Mattie McGrath.

Basically from what I understand from your post is that you want someone with a bit of profile to make themselves available so that you can vote from them. You don't want party types.

I would find it very difficult to vote for someone who thinks that they can just stroll up, with their profile and win a landslide, pocketing €100k for absolutely no work they have done for the Carlow constitutency for the past few years. What's their policies or does something like that not matter? Will they just throw a bit of grass up in the air and see what way the wind blows it and then follow? I think the people of Carlow need to know where their Dáil representation will stand on important issues, do they have any experience and what's their track record. If the main reason for voting for them is that they are independent that seems to me to be very dangerous.

Wasn't there a load of independents in the last Dáil nearly 10 or so, they all but two, lost their seats at the last election because they didn't get a thing done for their constituencies in the five years they were in the Dáil. Incidently most of them have joined political parties after they lost their seats in an attempt to get back in at the next election.

FF will be encouraging alot of their councillors to do solo runs so that they can get their supporters to proxy vote for FF. I would be very wary of voting for any (ex ff) independent, they are the same gene pool and really are just sheep in foxes clothing!

And as for the above comment about Sinn Féin having no say in the Government after the next general election, Ye should know that under the Constitution (Arts. 2&3) and the Good Friday Agreement some parts government are administered through the cross border bodies, like tourism etc. so Sinn Féin will be making decisions whether they are in the govenrment in the South or not because they are de facto in Government in the 6 counties. What ever government is formed after the next general election will have to co-operate with their ministers to get things done.

And the country will be better for it.

Villain

Covert2007 wrote: »

I for one wouldn't be bothered voting for an independent like Jackie Healy Rae, they rake in the money in expenses and turn up at funerals to get votes, ya can keep that.

Independents will have absloutely no say in the next Dail, the Government will be formed from the parties because people will be voting for a stable government, not dependent on the wim of a gonbeen coat tailers like Healy Rae or Mattie McGrath.

Basically from what I understand from your post is that you want someone with a bit of profile to make themselves available so that you can vote from them. You don't want party types.

I would find it very difficult to vote for someone who thinks that they can just stroll up, with their profile and win a landslide, pocketing €100k for absolutely no work they have done for the Carlow constitutency for the past few years. What's their policies or does something like that not matter? Will they just throw a bit of grass up in the air and see what way the wind blows it and then follow? I think the people of Carlow need to know where their Dáil representation will stand on important issues, do they have any experience and what's their track record. If the main reason for voting for them is that they are independent that seems to me to be very dangerous.

Wasn't there a load of independents in the last Dáil nearly 10 or so, they all but two, lost their seats at the last election because they didn't get a thing done for their constituencies in the five years they were in the Dáil. Incidently most of them have joined political parties after they lost their seats in an attempt to get back in at the next election.

FF will be encouraging alot of their councillors to do solo runs so that they can get their supporters to proxy vote for FF. I would be very wary of voting for any (ex ff) independent, they are the same gene pool and really are just sheep in foxes clothing!

And as for the above comment about Sinn Féin having no say in the Government after the next general election, Ye should know that under the Constitution (Arts. 2&3) and the Good Friday Agreement some parts government are administered through the cross border bodies, like tourism etc. so Sinn Féin will be making decisions whether they are in the govenrment in the South or not because they are de facto in Government in the 6 counties. What ever government is formed after the next general election will have to co-operate with their ministers to get things done.

And the country will be better for it.

You see if Enda Kenny was from Carlow or Phil Hogan even I'd agree with you but the simple fact is based on current polls FG and Labour will form the next election but there is also a chance that they will need Independents or that FG along with some Independents could secure a majority leaving Labour on the outside unlikley but possible.

Now taking that scenario the stong FG's candidates in the constituency are going to come from Kilkenny so even if Phil Hogan gets a senior position Kilkenny will do well from that but not Carlow. Labour again only have a Kilkenny candidate so Carlow won't be represented at the next cabinet I think everyone can agree on that.

Now you can bash Healy Rae and Lowry all you want but in doing a deal with the Government to support the Government they have received plenty in return and their local areas has benefited. There is many many reasons why this is wrong but trying to change that is not something that is going to be achieved this generation or the next imo.

I certainly wouldn't even entertain an ex FF party member but I don't think there is any in Carlow that would be able to pull it off anyway.

As for Sinn Fein (and I get a hint this is why you replied) I have voted for them in the past and strongly support what they have achieved in Northern Ireland and I also agree with plenty of their European policies however the fact is Carlow isn't a strong area for Sinn Fein so even if they are involved in the next Government I'm afraid I can't see the Carlow electorate giving them a seat.

Carlow imo needs a strong Independent Candidate that is a genuine Hardworking person who will work for his/her constituency.

Covert2007

Villain wrote: »

You see if Enda Kenny was from Carlow or Phil Hogan even I'd agree with you but the simple fact is based on current polls FG and Labour will form the next election but there is also a chance that they will need Independents or that FG along with some Independents could secure a majority leaving Labour on the outside unlikley but possible.

Now taking that scenario the stong FG's candidates in the constituency are going to come from Kilkenny so even if Phil Hogan gets a senior position Kilkenny will do well from that but not Carlow. Labour again only have a Kilkenny candidate so Carlow won't be represented at the next cabinet I think everyone can agree on that.

Now you can bash Healy Rae and Lowry all you want but in doing a deal with the Government to support the Government they have received plenty in return and their local areas has benefited. There is many many reasons why this is wrong but trying to change that is not something that is going to be achieved this generation or the next imo.

I certainly wouldn't even entertain an ex FF party member but I don't think there is any in Carlow that would be able to pull it off anyway.

As for Sinn Fein (and I get a hint this is why you replied) I have voted for them in the past and strongly support what they have achieved in Northern Ireland and I also agree with plenty of their European policies however the fact is Carlow isn't a strong area for Sinn Fein so even if they are involved in the next Government I'm afraid I can't see the Carlow electorate giving them a seat.

Carlow imo needs a strong Independent Candidate that is a genuine Hardworking person who will work for his/her constituency.

John McGuinness spent 35k plus on his general election campaign last time round, I really don't think there is an independent candidate out there with that sort of money to spend, out of their own pocket, on a gamble to get elected. Granted they can make it back if they get elected, but I would not vote for someone who had that expectation of minting it once they get a foot in the door of Leinster House.

Fine Gael and Labour will have a huge majority after the next election, no independent will have the balance of power. Sending an independent to the dail would be a waste of a seat, they would be silent on the backbenches, they would have limited speaking time and very little ability to raise issues and motions etc. That's the fact of the reality.

Also sending someone who is not experienced in local or national poltics would be a disaster, look at George Lee didn't last even six months, he had no idea what he was getting himself into.

I have to say that I am disappointed with both Fine Gael and Labour. Fine Gael are running a relatively unkown county councillor, with little local or national experience, in an attempt to get their preferred Kilkenny candidate John Paul Phelan elected, from his base in Kilkenny. While Labour have abandonned Carlow altogether, in favour of trying to win back a seat in Kilkenny. So the only real chance for Carlow to hold on to it's two seats is to re-elect two people who have shown themselves to be totally incapable of representating the people's concerns.

I agree with you that there must be a third way, I just don't see the independent candidate doing it. The only independent type candidate that would be successful is someone with a lot of money to spend on a campaign and that's the sort of person that goes into to politics for all the wrong reasons.

Jacques Thelad

Well zeds alive, I'm glad I'm not the only one who thinks MJ Nolan is the country's most useless politican. I would be happy to be enlightened by anyone who can tell me even one genuine benefit Carlow has derived from his tenure beyond lining his own pocket.

And MJ, if you're reading this, 'genuine benefit' does not mean turning up for a photo opportunity or standing at a minister's shoulder like Banco's ghost.

Way to go on the expenses though. They're quite an achievement.

byhookorbycrook

I await the arrival of the Greens and FFers to my door.If I had hounds to release a la Mongomery Burns, I would do so. I'm not political but I am in education and have seen how families have been hit every which way for school fundraising. Then I see Gormeless on tv telling schools that rain water harvesters should be installed to reduce water bills in school. Guess where the money is going to come from???Hint: not the DES.Next of all we hear about how the smart economy will save us all, yet there are 10 year old computers-if schools are "lucky" and poor broadband service to schools as well.

91011

Next government will be either Lab/FG or FF/Lab or FG/Lab (FG havign more seats)

The common party in above is labour.

Taking a totally independent view - FF/Lab are the most suited on policies but gilmore won't deal with FF whilst Cowen and other old stalwarts are still in place.

If FF have a new leader - Micheal Martin / Brian Lenihan, the a FF/lab may be more likely.

And as labour would be targeting carlow/kk for a seat, this is who I'd target for egttin things done in advance.

zeds alive

Jacques Thelad wrote: »

Way to go on the expenses though. They're quite an achievement.

€279,464 , Just a reminder of how much someone as useless as MJ Nolan costs per year.

maynooth_rules

I still remember Mary Whites rant at my door before the last election. We have to get FF out, they are a disgrace to this country. Then she gladly hops into bed with them and i personally think there is nothing that FF could do now for the Greens to finally grow a backbone and walk out on government. In fairness to her she was at my door again about a year ago, just before the programme for government came out I was an unemployed teacher at the time (still am:eek:) and White said that FF had agreed to 300 new teaching positions in the programme for government. None of these positions have actually been created. I would rather chop off my right testicle than vote for MJ Nolan, or any FF representative for that matter

Bersouth

Jackie Healy Rae keeps saying he was elected by the people of South Kerry and they are the people he is answerable to, the Dail elects the Goverment....

leincar

Sadly in this little nation of ours, people feel the need to elect a local person as a T.D. whether they are in a political party or an Independent. The jobs that a lot of these T.D.'s get involved with could and should be handled by councillors, but due to multi-seat constituencies they find themselves in a battle to get re-elected the day after they have been elected.

T.D.'s are there to legislate and govern the country, sadly this is not happening at the moment nor the past few years.

The Carlow Fianna Fáil T.D. M J Nolan will be gone at the next election as will Mary White T.D.. Of the Kilkenny T.D.'s only Fine Gael's Phil Hogan and Fianna Fáil's John McGuinness are sure of re-election, and McGuinness only on the basis that he has voiced his concern at the direction of Government and is hoping that he has the high ground over Bobby Aylward. In this he is probably right.

I don't think Aylward will retain his seat, but I don't think there are enough votes there for Fine Gael to get three seats(Maybe if Enda Kenny was gone). With recent opinion polls showing well for Labour and with the feeling out there for change, they could well get two seats. With this in mind I think a Carlow Labour candidate is the best chance of having a Carlow T.D. in the next Dail.

My predictions are as follows

1. Phil Hogan - Fine Gael
2. John Paul Phelen - Fine Gael
3. John McGuinness - Fianna Fáil
4. Kilkenny Labour candidate
5. Carlow Labour candidate.

This prediction does depend to some extent on excellent vote management by Labour and this could be their downfall. If thats the case then I would go with a toss up on Aylward for Fianna Fáil and possibly a Carlow based Fine Gael candidate.I think the Greens are finished, possibly for a generation and I don't see Sinn Féin getting a quota.