Legal drinking age.

whadabouchasir

Sentineil wrote: »

At 18 I was care free and made a lot of poor decisions. At the time, I wasn't mature enough to understand the true consequences of what I was doing. Now, I'm a planner and relatively responsible.

SO if an 18 year old isn't responsible enough to be able to drink at what age would you be?One of my friends is 19 and he has a licensed rifle.So the state has deemed him responsible enough to own a firearm but you don't think that he's responsible enough to drink?Now which is potentially more dangerous a rifle or a drink?

Sentineil wrote: »

Simply pointing out that there are those who don't drink themselves into comas doesn't derogate from the fact that most do.

If it's acceptable to ask, are you under or over 18?

This is just a crazy generalisation,the vast majority of young people do not do this.You also seem to be missing the point that ther are those over 25 who also go out and get drunk.The only difference is that they generally go to pubs instead of nightclubs and so don't mix with the younger crowd.Yes I am over 18,now if it's acceptable to ask,do you drink?

Ginja Ninja

whadabouchasir wrote: »

This is just a crazy generalisation,the vast majority of young people do not do this.You also seem to be missing the point that ther are those over 25 who also go out and get drunk.The only difference is that they generally go to pubs instead of nightclubs and so don't mix with the younger crowd.Yes I am over 18,now if it's acceptable to ask,do you drink?

it's really not,I know personally the vast majority of people I know drink and do a bad job of it when they do[I can't remember last night,it must be great]

IMO, it's not simply an age thing, it's cultural.Take France for example the drinking age is 16 and yet they have no alchohol abuse problem,here it's 18 and public enemy #1 [even though it shouldn't be] why?in france the culture is to have a glass of wine with your meal or a relaxed drink with friends,here it's how quickly can I get wasted is the norm,
example; how many times have you heard/seen someone drink something and see their facial expresion as they drink,it's not pleasurable but it gets you drunk, which to me is quite a sad situation.Drug abusers such as smokers generally don't[although withdrawel can play a factor] try and smoke as quickly as possible and as much as possible to get a nicotine high, they keep their pace and enjoy the process.It's the difference [for me anyway] between a user(enjoys it) and an abuser(doesn't enjoy,but does it anyway for the result)

Sentineil

SO if an 18 year old isn't responsible enough to be able to drink at what age would you be?One of my friends is 19 and he has a licensed rifle.So the state has deemed him responsible enough to own a firearm but you don't think that he's responsible enough to drink?Now which is potentially more dangerous a rifle or a drink?

Once again, holding a firearm won't inhibit your judgement. He's not going to pick up his rifle and decide to shoot someone just "because".

He will pick up drink and decide to get drunk.

Ginja Ninja has already responded to your second point and I agree with everything he's said, so there's no point in reiterating it.

As for drinking, I don't. It's not a moral stance, I just never started and then never bothered to.

coffee_cake

Ginja Ninja wrote: »

IMO, it's not simply an age thing, it's cultural.Take France for example the drinking age is 16 and yet they have no alchohol abuse problem,here it's 18 and public enemy #1 [even though it shouldn't be] why?in france the culture is to have a glass of wine with your meal or a relaxed drink with friends,here it's how quickly can I get wasted is the norm,
example; how many times have you heard/seen someone drink something and see their facial expresion as they drink,it's not pleasurable but it gets you drunk, which to me is quite a sad situation.Drug abusers such as smokers generally don't[although withdrawel can play a factor] try and smoke as quickly as possible and as much as possible to get a nicotine high, they keep their pace and enjoy the process.It's the difference [for me anyway] between a user(enjoys it) and an abuser(doesn't enjoy,but does it anyway for the result)

Yeah this is the main problem rather than age.
A french lady was appalled when she came to our school many moons ago and found out we don't hang around in sports clubs or something.

illiop

Sentineil wrote: »

Once again, holding a firearm won't inhibit your judgement. He's not going to pick up his rifle and decide to shoot someone just "because".

He will pick up drink and decide to get drunk.

Ginja Ninja has already responded to your second point and I agree with everything he's said, so there's no point in reiterating it.

As for drinking, I don't. It's not a moral stance, I just never started and then never bothered to.

But a lot of people who go to tesco and buy a bottle of wine are buying it solely to get hammered. So the fact that it inhibits there judgment is more or less irrelevant, he's gonna do it anyway. After one or two bad experiences everybody knows their own limit and if they choose to ignore that. Now of course everybody has times where they do go a little to far (which can result in them going way further). My 61 year old father got accidentally hammered for the first time in at least 25 years the other day, it happens to everyone (though I won't deny it's more likely to happen to young people but mainly because of peer pressure and the fact they may not know their limit).

Banning something like alcohol from people who want it is always a bad idea. Spain never had much of an underage drinking problem until they banned drinking in the street. Now, instead of sitting in the street drinking for a few hours they've developed more of a "pre-drinking" culture like us where you drink as much as you can before you leave home. That being said it will never be the same as here because alcohol is affordable in a social setting like a bar.

Also I think if youths had a safe semi-supervised area to introduce them to alcohol (whether they want to drink or just socialize with drinkers, which seems a problem for a lot of Irish non-drinkers, through no fault of their own) it would make a difference. My brother's ex grew up in Denmark (I think) and every Friday it was the norm for the equivalent of 5th and 6th class to go to the pub with the teachers. It made them feel grown up and they could have a few beers or a coke or whatever, it was about socializing. that's how it should be.

soccymonster

Ginja Ninja wrote: »

to be fair it's more of a guideline than a law, I've been drinking [realistically] since I was 13/14 by the end of first year /start of second year.Alchomahol has always been a bit of a thing with me though,now I don't drink damn all[6 cans of kopparberg only because it's nom] is about my max on a night.Saying that we ended up being hard drinkers by 15/16 [screw vodka we had poteen] and it was because of the local culture,if you weren't a p*sshead ther was nothing

Legally it should be higher in Ireland as we have an unsafe relationship with drink, but in practice it really doesn't matter

P.s:yes,I was a serious scumbag back in the day

That's preety much it for alot of places.
Moreso from what I've seen, it happens in the small local areas. Like my cousins and some friends live in the backarse of limerick and have been drinking since they were 12/13 (yea tis crazy!). My dad being brought up in the same place, he finds it common enough and allows me to drink. Even in the country pubs, they serve underage people seeing as my friends go out alot of weekends around there.

While alot of my friends around home don't drink or if they do they're responsible with it (16/17 year olds), I'd say that I'm definitely not mature with alcohol (sadly).
It all really depends on the person and you can't really mould the law to just one age because some people are able to handle it, be it 25 year olds or 15 year olds and some aren't until they could be 30!

I'm kinda rambling on now. But I think 18 is a grand age (law wise) to prevent people from buying drink and consuming it on public premises but it won't stop anyone underage from drinking/getting it (like cmon, everyone knows an 18 year old that'd get it for them at ease..alot of us have done it like.). Because if it was 16, I'm sure I'd be out buying it whenever I got a few quid handy and so would people I know which isn't really a good thing (all bias aside here with the whole "im 16, I should be able to drink legally" thing).

Wats_in_a_name

Sentineil wrote: »

Most people above 35 drink a few pints and call it a night.

Most below 25 would struggle to find their way home after a "good" night. Does that sound mature and responsible to you?
I'm getting sick of facebook status's like "My knees are cut, I lost my phone and ripped my jeans, awesome night!".

I'm 18(ish!) and went over to my mates yesterday night. There was a few of us there and we played poker and had a few beers. I remember the whole night and got up at 7 today to go do a flight lessons. Others had to get up at 9 to go to the institute. On our way home we passed a guy in his 30s staggering down the street with whiskey in his hand.

Granted some people in my year do just take the piss and go overboard. But those people tend to be the people that waited till they were 18 to drink.

Jesus Juice

I've noticed people with really strict parents are always the ones who down a shoulder of vodka, get sick everywhere and ruin their night (plus the friend who has to mind them).My parents have always been very lenient with me and drinking, and I've never gone out and got so drunk I've blacked out and had to be carried home!I've never even puked drinking!
Tbh, I'm actually kinda over drinking cause I get insanely bad hangovers because
I've a stomach condition so the thoughts of that just for a few pints...

Pigwidgeon

Jesus Juice wrote: »

I've noticed people with really strict parents are always the ones who down a shoulder of vodka, get sick everywhere and ruin their night (plus the friend who has to mind them).My parents have always been very lenient with me and drinking, and I've never gone out and got so drunk I've blacked out and had to be carried home!I've never even puked drinking!

I completely agree with this. One of my friends has insanely strict parents, she's 20 and they're still incredibly strict with her, and every night we go out, she's the one who ends up in bits, falling over, puking and needing help home.

While, my parents were never overly strict about it, but still don't agree with a huge amount of alcohol, I've outgrown the "omg lets go get pissed" attitude. I don't like being overly drunk, I used to do it a fair bit, but the last few months, even when I'm slightly drunk I feel embarrassed the next day about what I've been saying, what I did, it was never usually anything bad, or anything at all really, but I still didn't like it. So now, at the old age of 19 :P, I'll still go out and have a few drinks, but once I start feeling myself getting drunk, I'll stop for a while and switch to water.

I started drinking at 15/16, and there is a huge maturity difference between now and then. Although, my friend with the strict parent, was only able to start drinking at 18, so in my area, it seems people have a year or two of going mad, which happens to be when they're underage, and then calm down.
Lowering the drinking age will do nothing good, my friend's 14 year old sister stole a naggin of vodka from her room the other day. We always found a way, asking random people on the street for hours until we found someone to buy us alcohol. But generally, I think 18 is a pretty good age for here. Everything else that classes you as an adult is at 18, so if you're mature enough as others have said to vote, to drive a car, to do pretty much whatever you want, then why shouldn't you be allowed to buy alcohol? There's always going to be underage drinking, no matter what the legal age is, so if we lower the legal age, people will start drinking even younger. I can't see the age being raised any time soon either, it just wouldn't be practical.

magneticimpulse

18 is fine. I did start when I was 17 and a half, but that was because I had already started 1st year in college.

Saying that now, at 29 I dont drink a whole lot, prob 2 drinks maximum on a night out and then cranberry juice. Alot of my friends drive into town, so they dont drink (i sometimes drive too)...the only downside is you see the shocking behaviour of some girls...they just look totally out of it and falling all over the place and this isnt teenagers...these are grown women in their 30s and up. Its very sad to see. Its wasnt really cool to be in that state when you were a teenager and its certainly even less classy in your 30s.

magneticimpulse

Wats_in_a_name wrote: »

I'm 18(ish!) and went over to my mates yesterday night. There was a few of us there and we played poker and had a few beers. I remember the whole night and got up at 7 today to go do a flight lessons. Others had to get up at 9 to go to the institute. On our way home we passed a guy in his 30s staggering down the street with whiskey in his hand.

Granted some people in my year do just take the piss and go overboard. But those people tend to be the people that waited till they were 18 to drink.

You sound sensible, but i hope you dont actually have to fly planes :eek: not after a few beers anyhow

magneticimpulse

Ginja Ninja wrote: »

it's really not,I know personally the vast majority of people I know drink and do a bad job of it when they do[I can't remember last night,it must be great]

IMO, it's not simply an age thing, it's cultural.Take France for example the drinking age is 16 and yet they have no alchohol abuse problem,here it's 18 and public enemy #1 [even though it shouldn't be] why?in france the culture is to have a glass of wine with your meal or a relaxed drink with friends,here it's how quickly can I get wasted is the norm,
example; how many times have you heard/seen someone drink something and see their facial expresion as they drink,it's not pleasurable but it gets you drunk, which to me is quite a sad situation.Drug abusers such as smokers generally don't[although withdrawel can play a factor] try and smoke as quickly as possible and as much as possible to get a nicotine high, they keep their pace and enjoy the process.It's the difference [for me anyway] between a user(enjoys it) and an abuser(doesn't enjoy,but does it anyway for the result)

I live in France...in fact i live in the alcohol capital of wine that is Bordeaux. Haha your statement is so not true. This is freshers week in France and by god its so annoying to see so many young skinny 18 year olds getting hammered and acting like twats. If I can say anything positive is that in general people compose themselves abit better in Dublin on nights out (of course there are people out of it too) but compare that to French people. They get hammered after a half a pint (ok maybe not just 1) but they are so not used to drinking. And go into this really inmature kiddie role that is really sad to see. Mix that with their odd sense of humour and its a disaster.

Ive been on nights out with PhD students in Bordeaux at around the age of 26 and I couldnt believe they were that old as they were acting like 12 year olds. Seriously its not just an "Irish only" problem. I think all universities around the world with Freshers (bar muslims) get completely wasted. Nobody has a magic gene which can resist binch drinking regardless of what country you live in or your DNA. Everybody looks foolish

Also French teenagers smoke loads quite openly on their school breaks in the school yard....its the "norm". We would have been killed at school for doing that in Dublin. I definitely do not think there is a "healthy" teenage attitude in France. Ireland has its problems, but I think its just the norm to what alot of teenagers prob do throughout the world.

DingosAteMyBaby

I used to argue it should be lowered to 16, but 18 is grand! Plus underage drinking was the best laugh ever:D*



*not that I'm condoning it:P

Jesus Juice

The difference between a 16 year old from Ireland compared with one from say Holland or France or Belgium is MASSIVE.Like having been there they are so much more mature in general. Irelands 16 year olds just wouldn't be able to handle it!!

magneticimpulse

Jesus Juice wrote: »

The difference between a 16 year old from Ireland compared with one from say Holland or France or Belgium is MASSIVE.Like having been there they are so much more mature in general. Irelands 16 year olds just wouldn't be able to handle it!!

I dont agree after living in France. And I had a Dutch boyfriend when I was 21. The Dutch boyfriend even at 21 was quite inmature....but then he was comparable to any Irish or UK guy.

I think you will get mature Irish 16 year old and other mature European/World wide 16 years olds....but every country has its fair share of inmature ones as well.

SarahBeep!

I think it should stay 18 but you should be allowed to drink in private at your guardians discresion.

I'm 18 and a half and I have been drinking for a few years but I never went out on major sessions until I started college last year. Not because it was college, coz my friends weren't mature enough to go out with!

Anita Blow

SarahBeep! wrote: »

I think it should stay 18 but you should be allowed to drink in private at your guardians discresion.

That is the current law.
I'm up for a staggered age. 17 for alcohol below 14%, 18 for anything higher.
Bit silly that the state trusts a 17 year old to join the army, drive a car etc. at 17 but he/she can't even buy a bottle of beer.

NTMK

Mr.S wrote: »

Basic fact is that around the age of 15/16 teenagers will start to drink.

Drinking age should be 16. (age of clubs should be 18 though).

I've found that Irish kids tend to start drinking young anyway behind their parents back and end of just drinking to get completely pissed, and such get into a bad habit.

While kids on the continent where its mostly a 16 year old age limit, start drinking slowly and tend to know when to stop, drink for enjoyment not to just get drunk etc.

It'l never be reduced though.

Kids/people in other countries have a different attitude towards alcohol most people under the age of 25 drink to get hammered

i'd say it it should be 17 for anything below 10%, 18 for 11-25 and 21 for spirits. oh and offy prices should be upped as its dirt cheap

magneticimpulse

Mr.S wrote: »

Basic fact is that around the age of 15/16 teenagers will start to drink.

Drinking age should be 16. (age of clubs should be 18 though).

I've found that Irish kids tend to start drinking young anyway behind their parents back and end of just drinking to get completely pissed, and such get into a bad habit.

While kids on the continent where its mostly a 16 year old age limit, start drinking slowly and tend to know when to stop, drink for enjoyment not to just get drunk etc.

It'l never be reduced though.

This is a generalisation....as for me I grew up in Dublin and even now its too expensive to drink out and we were just hanging out at the cinema at age 16. Sorry but lots of girls in my class were having babies at 15 so it was a real eye opener. You had a choice...be a nerd and go to college or knacker drink in a field and have a baby at 15!! It was an easy choice to make

Im still fed up with the "on the continent" reference. Either there is loads of Irish people like meself living here or people are just assuming what they think its like. I invite you to spend a night out in France....in a student city, from Paris, to Nantes, Toulouse, Lyon to Bordeaux and tell me that they know when to stop. Im sorry but they are just as crazy here if not more compared to Ireland. But again....you get people who binge drink everywhere...and people who dont drink so much.

questionmark?

Imo the Irish attitude to drink is an immature one. I think this is down to a number of reasons

1. The red button syndrome -- before your 18 its taking as no alcohol allowed and when you tell somebody they cant do something they want to do it even more.

2. The strict laws -- around europe you can party away till 6 in the morning in ireland your out of the late bars/clubs depending on the district court area between 1.30 and 2.30 so people know they dont have much time left to drink and thus binge and do too many shots

3. The price -- how many people do you know want to go and get drunk cant afford to do it in the pubs because of the price and thus pre-drink and instead of being drunk they get totally out of their mind

4. nanny state attitude to drink. Instead of promoting such things as having a glass of wine to enhance the taste of a meal drink is considered evil and responsible people cant buy a drink after 10 at night?

highlydebased

I always thought it we had 24 hour pubs, offys and clubs it would solve the problem. the novelty would wear off very quickly...

mahamageehad

NTMK wrote: »

Kids/people in other countries have a different attitude towards alcohol most people under the age of 25 drink to get hammered

i'd say it it should be 17 for anything below 10%, 18 for 11-25 and 21 for spirits. oh and offy prices should be upped as its dirt cheap

Offy prices should be upped?? Are you serious??? :eek:

Richard Cranium

magneticimpulse wrote: »

Im still fed up with the "on the continent" reference. Either there is loads of Irish people like meself living here or people are just assuming what they think its like. I invite you to spend a night out in France....in a student city, from Paris, to Nantes, Toulouse, Lyon to Bordeaux and tell me that they know when to stop. Im sorry but they are just as crazy here if not more compared to Ireland. But again....you get people who binge drink everywhere...and people who dont drink so much.

I agree. I think. During one of the countless alcohol discussions on the radio a while ago, I heard one of the panellists point out that France (not to mention other continental countries) has a serious problem with underage binge drinking too. He had facts and figures to back this up but I can't remember where they came from so I can't quote them myself. It's something that skews the debate here a lot- the continental drinking culture isn't the panacea it's made out to be.

Cian92

I think it is fine at 18, but obviously the underage drinking will start from around 14. I was 17 when I started drinking (when I say drinking I mean getting **** faced, I had had a few drinks before that but never enough to get drunk).

I think you need to drink too much once so you know your limit. It is probarly part of growing up trying to get drink, finding a place to drink it, getting drunk, and regretting it the next morning.

whadabouchasir

Mr.S wrote: »

Basic fact is that around the age of 15/16 teenagers will start to drink.

Drinking age should be 16. (age of clubs should be 18 though).

I think that if it was reduced to 16 then people would just start underage drinking at a younger age.I do think that having 24 hour licensing laws would be a good idea though,that way people wouldn't drink really quickly earlier on in the night.It would also stop a lot of the fights outside pubs and clubs since people wouldn't all be thrown out at the same time.

Fighting Irish

crayolastereo wrote: »

Well then you were highly unusual.
I vote 16 years old, however make alcohol prohibitively expensive for teens.

:rolleyes: