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"The Origin of Specious Nonsense"

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    #3602
    J C
    Registered Users Posts: 14,615 ✭✭✭✭J C


    himnextdoor wrote: »
    Maybe, but doesn't the x-chromosome have more DNA material in it than the y-chromosome? And Eve would have possessed the y-chromosome wouldn't she?

    If that is true then Eve was Adam plus a bit. Where did the extra DNA come from?

    And doesn't 'foundational stock' cause a problem for puctuationists?
    ... Eve was created by doubling up Adams haploid compliment of chromosomes including a doubling up of his x chromosome.

    Interetingly, Adam could not have been formed from a woman's genotype ... because she wouldn't have a y chromosome to donate!!!


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    #3603
    robindch
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 24,416 Mod ✭✭✭✭robindch


    J C wrote: »
    ... Eve was created by doubling up Adams haploid compliment of chromosomes including a doubling up of his x chromosome.
    Lemme remember -- genesis 3:14, wasn't it?


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    #3604
    Galvasean
    Registered Users Posts: 30,746 ✭✭✭✭Galvasean


    I think you're overcomplicating it J C. God just took out Adam's bottom rib and turned it into a woman for him.
    Of course Adam no longer had need for a woman now that he could suck his own cock.


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    #3605
    J C
    Registered Users Posts: 14,615 ✭✭✭✭J C


    robindch wrote: »
    Lemme remember -- genesis 3:14, wasn't it?
    It was actually :-
    Genesis 2:21-23 (New International Version, ©2011)
    21 So the LORD God caused the man to fall into a deep sleep; and while he was sleeping, he took one of the man’s ribs[a] and then closed up the place with flesh. 22 Then the LORD God made a woman from the rib he had taken out of the man, and he brought her to the man.

    23 The man said, “This is now bone of my bones and flesh of my flesh; she shall be called ‘woman,’ for she was taken out of man.”


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    #3606
    robindch
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 24,416 Mod ✭✭✭✭robindch


    J C wrote: »
    ... Eve was created by doubling up Adams haploid compliment of chromosomes including a doubling up of his x chromosome.
    J C wrote: »
    It was actually :-
    Genesis 2:21-23 (New International Version, ©2011)
    So the LORD God caused the man to fall into a deep sleep; and while he was sleeping, he took one of the man’s ribs and then closed up the place with flesh. Then the LORD God made a woman from the rib he had taken out of the man, and he brought her to the man.
    Gotcha. So, in Hebrew, the word for "haploid compliment of chromosomes" also means "rib"?


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    #3607
    Galvasean
    Registered Users Posts: 30,746 ✭✭✭✭Galvasean


    Silly robin, the haploid compliment of chromosomes is in the rib. God just doesn't want his followers hurting their pretty little heads with all dem dern big wurds.


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    #3608
    himnextdoor
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,042 ✭✭✭himnextdoor


    J C wrote: »
    ... Eve was created by doubling up Adams haploid compliment of chromosomes including a doubling up of his x chromosome.

    Interetingly, Adam could not have been formed from a woman's genotype ... because she wouldn't have a y chromosome to donate!!!

    Haploid material from a rib? Aren't haploid cells gametes?

    Adam must have had the y-chromosome; he was a man.

    And if Eve was made from Adam then she would have had the same x-y chromosome pair as him but women are designated female because of an x-x chromosome pair.

    So, Eve would have been infertile, no?


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    #3609
    Galvasean
    Registered Users Posts: 30,746 ✭✭✭✭Galvasean


    Genetics - taking the fun out of Bible stories :(


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    #3610
    J C
    Registered Users Posts: 14,615 ✭✭✭✭J C


    robindch wrote: »
    Gotcha. So, in Hebrew, the word for "haploid compliment of chromosomes" also means "rib"?
    ... Adam's flesh (and therefore his genotype) was used by God to form Eve ...
    It would have to be split into a haploid compliment and then fused to form a diploid compliment, including the xx female chromosomes, to form Eve.
    Modern cloning is 'stone age' in comparison to what God did to produce Eve from Adam's flesh!!!


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    #3611
    robindch
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 24,416 Mod ✭✭✭✭robindch


    J C wrote: »
    ... Adam's flesh (and therefore his genotype) was used by God to form Eve ...
    Er, that's a copier deity, not a creator deity.


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    #3612
    J C
    Registered Users Posts: 14,615 ✭✭✭✭J C


    Galvasean wrote: »
    Genetics - taking the fun out of Bible stories :(
    Creation science ... taking the silliness out of Evolutionist stories!!!:)


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    #3613
    Galvasean
    Registered Users Posts: 30,746 ✭✭✭✭Galvasean


    J C wrote: »
    Creation science ... taking the silliness out of Evolutionist stories!!!:)

    Creation science - taking two words that don't really go together and wondering why people don't take you seriously.


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    #3614
    J C
    Registered Users Posts: 14,615 ✭✭✭✭J C


    robindch wrote: »
    Er, that's a copier deity, not a creator deity.
    Eve obviously wasn't a copy of Adam ... she was a creation from the manipulation of Adams flesh and genotype.


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    #3615
    robindch
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 24,416 Mod ✭✭✭✭robindch


    J C wrote: »
    Eve obviously wasn't a copy of Adam
    How do you know? Were you there?


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    #3616
    J C
    Registered Users Posts: 14,615 ✭✭✭✭J C


    robindch wrote: »
    How do you know? Were you there?
    OMG ... you're starting to sound like Dr Ken Ham ... I must tell him next time I meet him ... imitation is the best form of flattery!!!:D:)

    ... anyway, I wasn't there ... but I know somebody who was ... and He has said that He made (female) Eve from (male) Adam's flesh!!!

    ... and therefore Eve logically wasn't a copy, or full clone, of Adam.


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    #3617
    stevoslice
    Registered Users Posts: 1,007 ✭✭✭stevoslice


    J C wrote: »
    Ironically, the evidence for Creation is overwhelming ... and accessible to scientific investigation ... and that is why the Materialsts are so determined that it should not be scientifically investigated ... but despite their best efforts it has been investigated ... and proven to be true!!!
    DouglasAdams(sic) wrote:
    Now, it is such a bizarrely improbable coincidence that anything so mind-bogglingly useful could have evolved purely by chance that some have chosen to see it as the final proof of the NON-existence of God. The argument goes something like this: "I refuse to prove that I exist," says God, "for proof denies faith, and without faith I am nothing." "But," says Man, "the [CFSI] is a dead giveaway, isn't it? It could not have evolved by chance. It proves that You exist, and so therefore, by Your own arguments, You don't. QED" "Oh dear," says God, "I hadn't thought of that," and promptly vanishes in a puff of logic. "Oh, that was easy," says Man, and for an encore goes on to prove that black is white and gets himself killed on the next zebra crossing.

    lol


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    #3618
    AhSureTisGrand
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,327 ✭✭✭AhSureTisGrand


    Creationists — taking the "b-a-t" out of "basement"


    Sorry, had to be done :pac:


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    #3619
    himnextdoor
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,042 ✭✭✭himnextdoor


    J C wrote: »
    ... Adam's flesh (and therefore his genotype) was used by God to form Eve ...
    It would have to be split into a haploid compliment and then fused to form a diploid compliment, including the xx female chromosomes, to form Eve.
    Modern cloning is 'stone age' in comparison to what God did to produce Eve from Adam's flesh!!!

    But why go to the trouble of causing Adam to fall into a deep sleep in order to facilitate a serious surgical procedure when God could have simply asked Adam to pee into a cup?


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    #3620
    robindch
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 24,416 Mod ✭✭✭✭robindch


    himnextdoor wrote: »
    God could have simply asked Adam to pee into a cup?
    Bearing in mind he was on his own at the time, it wasn't the only thing he could have done into a cup.


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    #3621
    J C
    Registered Users Posts: 14,615 ✭✭✭✭J C


    himnextdoor wrote: »
    But why go to the trouble of causing Adam to fall into a deep sleep in order to facilitate a serious surgical procedure
    This was the start of God and man becoming co-creators of life ... and after Eve was created men and women have been co-creating other Humans with God ever since.
    himnextdoor wrote: »
    ... when God could have simply asked Adam to pee into a cup?
    ... what good would that do???


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    #3622
    J C
    Registered Users Posts: 14,615 ✭✭✭✭J C


    robindch wrote: »
    Bearing in mind he was on his own at the time, it wasn't the only thing he could have done into a cup.
    Settle down Robin ... and get rid of that dirty old mac ... please!!!!

    ... some would say that the tone of the A & A is low enough already!!!


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    #3623
    liamw
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,780 ✭✭✭liamw


    J C wrote: »
    ... some would say that the tone of the A & A is low enough already!!!

    I wouldn't classify this thread as a proper A&A thread. It's more of a joke thread people jump in to have a laugh at every now and then. The topic of creationism certainly does not deserve any serious discussion... a good analogy would be a thread putting forward arguments for the stork theory for the origin of babies


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    #3624
    himnextdoor
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,042 ✭✭✭himnextdoor


    J C wrote: »
    This was the start of God and man becoming co-creators of life ... and after Eve was created men and women have been co-creating other Humans with God ever since.

    ... what good would that do???

    It would have provided the haploid cells which could have been manipulated to create Eve without the trauma of an operation. It would have been quicker and easier.

    Better yet, why did God not simply make Eve using the same creative process He used to make Adam? I mean all the beasts of the earth, the fowl, the fish and that which creepeth were all created as males and females weren't they?

    God didn't take the rib of a bull to make a cow, did He?


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    #3625
    strobe
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7,872 ✭✭✭strobe


    liamw wrote: »
    I wouldn't classify this thread as a proper A&A thread. It's more of a joke thread people jump in to have a laugh at every now and then. The topic of creationism certainly does not deserve any serious discussion... a good analogy would be a thread putting forward arguments for the stork theory for the origin of babies

    I'll have you know that there was a sharp decline in the stork population between 1970 and 1990. The lowest recorded period being in the mid 1980's. But they started to see this decline turn around during the 1990's and during the 2004-2005 White Stork Census a 100% increase was shown in stork numbers. This has risen since so that the largest increase in percentage population of stork numbers has been in the last couple of years.
    (source)
    http://www.suite101.com/content/white-stork-population-trend-in-europe-a102007

    Now if we compare this to the Irish birth/fertility rates in the same time period what do we see? Oh, that's right. The sharpest decline in the birth rates in Ireland's history occurring in the mid 1980's. This decline stabilised and started to turn around during the 1990's.
    (source)
    http://www.esr.ie/Vol32_2fahy.pdf

    With records from the latter half of the 2000's on showing that Ireland now has the highest birth rate in the EU.
    (source)
    http://www.breakingnews.ie/ireland/irish-birth-rate-highest-in-eu-467025.html

    Behold.......... my mathematical proof of ............the stork theory......... for the origin of babies.......:pac::(:P;):cool::eek::confused::eek::p


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    #3626
    sponsoredwalk
    Registered Users Posts: 3,038 ✭✭✭sponsoredwalk


    JC, what about Eve, who is at least 80,000 years older than Adam being
    made from Adams rib, this rib coming about 80,000 years after Eve? Is it
    the flaw of radiometric or carbon dating that is leading us to astray?

    I also must have missed the part of the bible where we are told that "Adam
    had an exceedingly diverse (nuclear) genetic compliment, just like all of the
    other foundation stock of each kind", could you tell me where in the bible
    we are told this? If I had known this was true I might have given pause to
    think of the validity of all of my beliefs beforehand!


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    #3627
    J C
    Registered Users Posts: 14,615 ✭✭✭✭J C


    strobe wrote: »
    I'll have you know that there was a sharp decline in the stork population between 1970 and 1990. The lowest recorded period being in the mid 1980's. But they started to see this decline turn around during the 1990's and during the 2004-2005 White Stork Census a 100% increase was shown in stork numbers. This has risen since so that the largest increase in percentage population of stork numbers has been in the last couple of years.
    (source)
    http://www.suite101.com/content/white-stork-population-trend-in-europe-a102007

    Now if we compare this to the Irish birth/fertility rates in the same time period what do we see? Oh, that's right. The sharpest decline in the birth rates in Ireland's history occurring in the mid 1980's. This decline stabilised and started to turn around during the 1990's.
    (source)
    http://www.esr.ie/Vol32_2fahy.pdf

    With records from the latter half of the 2000's on showing that Ireland now has the highest birth rate in the EU.
    (source)
    http://www.breakingnews.ie/ireland/irish-birth-rate-highest-in-eu-467025.html

    Behold.......... my mathematical proof of ............the stork theory......... for the origin of babies.......:pac::(:P;):cool::eek::confused::eek::p
    You are making the classical error of confusing a statistical correlation with a real one ... I suppose it is an occupational hazard for an evolutionist !!!
    ... anybody who believes that muck spontaneously produced man will believe anything!!!


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    #3628
    Delirium
    Moderators Posts: 51,778 ✭✭✭✭Delirium


    J C wrote: »
    You are making the classical error of confusing a statistical correlation with a real one ... I suppose it is an occupational hazard for an evolutionist !!!
    ... anybody who believes that muck spontaneously produced man will believe anything!!!

    Isn't that creationism?? :P

    If you can read this, you're too close!



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    #3629
    equivariant
    Registered Users Posts: 966 ✭✭✭equivariant


    koth wrote: »
    Isn't that creationism?? :P

    God, muck, whatever - it's all the same


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    #3630
    The Mad Hatter
    Registered Users Posts: 4,718 ✭✭✭The Mad Hatter


    equivariant wrote: »
    God, muck, whatever - it's all the same

    Or Genesis Chapter 2 Verse 7:

    And the LORD God formed man of the dust of the ground, and
    breathed into his nostrils the breath of life; and man became
    a living soul.


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    #3631
    equivariant
    Registered Users Posts: 966 ✭✭✭equivariant


    liamw wrote: »
    I wouldn't classify this thread as a proper A&A thread. It's more of a joke thread people jump in to have a laugh at every now and then. The topic of creationism certainly does not deserve any serious discussion... a good analogy would be a thread putting forward arguments for the stork theory for the origin of babies

    This thread provides a valuable service to A&A - it allows people an easy view of just how utterly bonkers creationism is. I think that J C should be given some kind of special award for services to Irish atheism (it might compensate him a little for not having that nobel prize that he claims he deserves)


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