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Irish Times Tea Party Article

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    #62
    Exile 1798
    Registered Users Posts: 709 ✭✭✭Exile 1798


    stretchtex wrote: »
    George Bush and the Republicans acted like drunken sailors on shore leave when they were in power with regard to govt. spending. The Obama administration took the reins and have the US following in the path of Greece.

    If Bush was so bad, then perhaps the Tea Party might repudiate their unwavering support for him during his administration? Most of us weren't born yesterday, the Tea Party base if made of the same people who elected Bush twice. It's a nice con job they're trying to pull and I give them credit for the sheer shamelessness of it.
    The Tea Party is advocating fiscal responsibility and a common sense approach to government spending.

    It is indeed hard to disagree with such generalities.


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    #63
    Exile 1798
    Registered Users Posts: 709 ✭✭✭Exile 1798


    donegalfella wrote: »
    This post has been deleted.

    While that's true, look at the kind of article that is now appearing in a place such as Forbes for god's sake. Worse still, penned by Dinesh D'Souza, who was meant to be one of the American Right's upcoming intellectuals.

    http://www.forbes.com/forbes/2010/0927/politics-socialism-capitalism-private-enterprises-obama-business-problem.html


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    #64
    jank
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 13,018 ✭✭✭✭jank


    donegalfella wrote: »
    This post has been deleted.

    Spot on. The Tea Party at its present form is just an outlet for pissed off citizens to vent their anger. They know damm well that it was G.W Bush who spent like a drunk but gave tax breaks to everyone. Fiscal responsibility it wasn't and don't forget that the GOP had power in 2 houses of Congress for most of this time. He was the person who gave the first bailouts to the banks and motor industry.

    So the GOP is JUST as complicit in this big government as everyone else. So what do they do, they just re-brand the GOP grass roots as the Tea Party movement with a couple of Liberations thrown in for window shopping.

    Remember how Ron Paul was lambasted on Fox News for his foreign policy views in the presidential primaries, it is now his narrative that is gaining momentum.Palin et al just jump on a bandwagon. She would fart in front of a candle if she thought it would get a few yells of approval from her minions.

    Its all a bit silly really. They stand for small government? Well where the hell were in 2004-06? They stand for civil liberties yet Beck tells us to get closer to god. What if I dint believe in god? They stand for fiscal responsibility? Well why didn't they protest on Wall st.....ever!

    The tea party will destroy itself before it ever gets off the ground. Get the popcorn as if what happened in Delaware is replicated across the nation it is going to hurt the GOP more than harm the Democrats.


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    #65
    jank
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 13,018 ✭✭✭✭jank


    donegalfella wrote: »
    This post has been deleted.

    Damm, goto stop agreeing with you!:)

    You are dead right though. It started out as a small movement but has been hijacked by the GOP for their own political aims.


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    #66
    20Cent
    Registered Users Posts: 8,939 ✭✭✭20Cent


    stretchtex wrote: »
    George Bush and the Republicans acted like drunken sailors on shore leave when they were in power with regard to govt. spending. The Obama administration took the reins and have the US following in the path of Greece. The Tea Party is advocating fiscal responsibility and a common sense approach to government spending. I have read their platform and find myself very much in agreement although I won't buy any t-shirts or go march in DC. Folks on the left feel threatened by the foothold the movement has gained and have resorted to childish tactics to disparage the affiliation. I've known myself quite well for 36 years now and to discover that I'm a racist after reading threads like this just might keep me up tonight.

    Do you have a link to their platform?
    Seems that there are loads of conflicting ideas about what the tea party is about.


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    #67
    Black Swan
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 47,251 CMod ✭✭✭✭Black Swan


    donegalfella wrote: »
    This post has been deleted.
    Many Tea Party proponents will disagree with your depiction of Sarah Palin as as self-promotional politician that fails as a fiscal conservative, advocating "astronomical levels of military spending" in her support of the military industrial complex.

    They will also ignore or otherwise try to white wash the fact that she first supported the $400 million "Bridge to Nowhere," only to flip-flop and oppose it after the national news media disclosed that it was a terrific pork barrel waste of federal transportation funds.

    ABC Charlie Gibson Interview with Sarah Palin: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4cwfPl_TPjs&feature=related

    The Fox News Sarah Palin will more than likely be the Tea Party (AKA Republican Tea Party faction) choice for president in 2012, no matter what they tell you today.


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    #68
    Permabear
    Closed Accounts Posts: 39,022 ✭✭✭✭Permabear


    This post has been deleted.


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    #69
    Sticky_Fingers
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,379 ✭✭✭Sticky_Fingers


    jank wrote: »
    Remember how Ron Paul was lambasted on Fox News for his foreign policy views in the presidential primaries, it is now his narrative that is gaining momentum.Palin et al just jump on a bandwagon. She would fart in front of a candle if she thought it would get a few yells of approval from her minions.
    Blue_Lagoon wrote: »
    The Fox News Sarah Palin will more than likely be the Tea Party (AKA Republican Tea Party faction) choice for president in 2012, no matter what they tell you today.

    Ron Paul, the archetypal libertarian doesn't seem to think much of the Tea party either seeing it for what it really is, a movement born of legitimate disaffection and outrage over government mismanagement and hijacked by self serving charlatans like Palin and Beck for their own personal gain and glory.
    I don't always agree with Paul but I have immense respect for the man and would love to see him run again in 2012 but with Palin possibly in the race and currently doing a hatchet job on the term libertarianism I doubt very much that he stands much of a chance.

    http://www.digitalmeetingcenter.com/ron-pauls-shocking-message-to-the-tea-party/851883/


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    #70
    Lockstep
    Registered Users Posts: 9,030 ✭✭✭Lockstep


    There are some spot on analysis of the Tea Party in this thread (especially Jank and DF)

    Once again, I'm glad the Boards.ie's politicos show their intelligence and that be they conservative, leftists or libertarians, can see the wood from the trees.


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    #71
    Mjollnir
    Registered Users Posts: 888 ✭✭✭Mjollnir


    This is one of the best deconstructions of the current Tea movement I've read to date, just this morning:

    http://alicublog.blogspot.com/2010_09_12_archive.html#1590191755906502234


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    #72
    stretchtex
    Registered Users Posts: 33 ✭stretchtex


    The govt in the UK is responsible for 50% or more of the income in 1 out of 3 households in the country. I can understand why Europeans would be opposed to such a movement. Don't bite the hand that feeds you.


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    #73
    Manic Moran
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 16,392 Mod ✭✭✭✭Manic Moran


    donegalfella wrote: »
    This post has been deleted.

    It is to be pointed out that the miltary budget is one of the few things that the Constitution specifically says that Congress is to spend money on, mainly because the States are prohibited from doing so. It's all the additional things that Congress thinks is a good idea to spend money on which they should be taking a look at.

    NTM


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    #74
    Overheal
    Registered Users Posts: 82,970 ✭✭✭✭Overheal


    And in fairness to conservatives if you listen to CTR you will hear the ideas that make sense, yet somehow, are not being put forth by the GOP. Why should taxes from Utah for instance be used to subsidize the operating costs of the Nevada Police through federal grants?


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    #75
    fontanalis
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,619 ✭✭✭fontanalis


    stretchtex wrote: »
    The govt in the UK is responsible for 50% or more of the income in 1 out of 3 households in the country. I can understand why Europeans would be opposed to such a movement. Don't bite the hand that feeds you.

    Europe = continent
    UK is not


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    #76
    Overheal
    Registered Users Posts: 82,970 ✭✭✭✭Overheal


    fontanalis wrote: »
    Europe = continent
    UK is not
    Though it is a microcosm of European politics.


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    #77
    fontanalis
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,619 ✭✭✭fontanalis


    Overheal wrote: »
    Though it is a microcosm of European politics.

    Hmmmmmmmmmm, I'd say for every similraity you may find osmethign 180 degrees the other way. It's just I hear the term European/Europe thrown about by some commentators in the US almost as if Europe is some identical monolithic block, bit of a pet peev of mine.


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    #78
    Victor
    Registered Users Posts: 78,404 ✭✭✭✭Victor


    veritable wrote: »
    Quite the opposite. The Tea party seeks to reform the Republican party. Just yesterday in Delaware we saw how the tea party candidate beat the repub supported candidate. The tea party wants to get rid of repubs known as RINOs (repub in name only), i.e. the big govt repubs like many in washington now.

    I used to hear RINO as a term referring to Republicans, that becuase of (some of) their policies might otherwise be Democrats, but were members of the Republican Party.

    Now I'm hearing it as a term of abuse for the bulk of Republicans that aren't "hard" enough.


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    #79
    Victor
    Registered Users Posts: 78,404 ✭✭✭✭Victor


    Overheal wrote: »
    And in fairness to conservatives if you listen to CTR you will hear the ideas that make sense, yet somehow, are not being put forth by the GOP. Why should taxes from Utah for instance be used to subsidize the operating costs of the Nevada Police through federal grants?
    Sure, living within your means is important. But, in what circumstances are such payments made? Sometimes such things are desireable, e.g. if there was a large city on the boundary between the two and one was disproportionately affecting the other through drive'n'rob scenarios.

    Its a bit like Dublin 100 years ago, where all the wealth was in the suburbs, but all the need in the city. Rathmines and Pembroke screwed the city out of taxes that were not rightly theirs, simply because they could (and because it benefited their land owners) and they had corrupt governments to back them up.


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    #80
    monosharp
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,981 ✭✭✭monosharp


    veritable wrote: »
    That comes across as being a bit prejudicial. Beck or Palin may be dramatic but you still haven't provided evidence of their supposed evil?

    Who said anything about evil ?

    Palin's an imbecile, plain and simple. She's a trained parrot at her very best. The things she has said about science and foreign relations are so incredibly ignorant that half the time you think it has to be satire.

    Beck I'm more confused about. He's either a complete lunatic or a pretty good clown. I don't believe that be actually believes most of the crap he comes out with, it's just for entertainment.

    As for the prejudice against the Right in America, no one needs to prejudge them. They're judged afterwards.

    And as for putting the Left on a pedestal I don't believe that either. American politics has taken a dramatic step in the last 10 years. The left has moved to the centre and the right has moved further right.

    Oh and just so any democrats here think I'm leaving them out, I think Joe Biden is pretty stupid has a bigger mouth than Palin. Obama promised so much and has given almost nothing. He just seems to be there.

    As for the tea partiers, well what can anyone say. What do they represent ? What do they want ?

    Apart from the rather loud extremists, what do the 'average' tea partiers want or represent ? Because as far as I can see they represent nothing except the extremists on the right who don't even know what they want if they can't read it off a bumper sticker.


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    #81
    Lockstep
    Registered Users Posts: 9,030 ✭✭✭Lockstep


    Was recently reading about Christine O'Donnell (Republican/Tea Party candidate in Delaware) who used campaign funds to pay her rent/go bowling. I heard these actions defended as there's nothing illegal about using campaign funds for personal use.

    Is there any truth in that at all or is it immoral without being illegal.


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    #82
    Black Swan
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 47,251 CMod ✭✭✭✭Black Swan


    kickoutthejams wrote: »
    Was recently reading about Christine O'Donnell (Republican/Tea Party candidate in Delaware) who used campaign funds to pay her rent/go bowling. I heard these actions defended as there's nothing illegal about using campaign funds for personal use.

    Is there any truth in that at all or is it immoral without being illegal.

    Interesting CNN vid regarding this:
    http://ac360.blogs.cnn.com/2010/09/21/odonnell-sidesteps-specifics-on-funds-says-no-truth-to-allegations/


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    #83
    fontanalis
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,619 ✭✭✭fontanalis


    Matt taibbi article
    http://www.rollingstone.com/politics/news/17390/210904?RS_show_page=0


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    #84
    Memnoch
    Registered Users Posts: 4,276 ✭✭✭Memnoch


    fontanalis wrote: »
    Matt taibbi article
    http://www.rollingstone.com/politics/news/17390/210904?RS_show_page=0

    What an amazing article. If only I could tie up every single tea party supporter, tape their eye-lids open and force them to read this.


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    #85
    mgmt
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,361 ✭✭✭mgmt


    Oh yeah the Tea Party is a racist, gun loving, violent organisation. Lets ban them. Lets ban Fox News too while we're at it. After all, a conflicting opinion according to Obama is dangerous to America. :rolleyes:


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    #86
    Denerick
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 6,488 ✭✭✭Denerick


    mgmt wrote: »
    Oh yeah the Tea Party is a racist, gun loving, violent organisation. Lets ban them. Lets ban Fox News too while we're at it. After all, a conflicting opinion according to Obama is dangerous to America. :rolleyes:

    Who is saying they should be banned? By this ridiculous logic we aren't allowed to label tea partiers mind nummingly moronic, dishonest, hypocritical, rabble etc.


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    #87
    Overheal
    Registered Users Posts: 82,970 ✭✭✭✭Overheal


    mgmt wrote: »
    Oh yeah the Tea Party is a racist, gun loving, violent organisation. Lets ban them. Lets ban Fox News too while we're at it. After all, a conflicting opinion according to Obama is dangerous to America. :rolleyes:
    Who said they were violent?

    And ironic isn't it that an opinion that conflicts with the Tea Party is classified as radical left-wing.

    The hypocrisy stems from the fact that, GOP and Tea Party alike, they all claim to oppose big government, demand budget cuts, but when it comes to medicare and social security, theres barely a hum.

    Are you actually going to refute the argument here, or just hold your hands up in the air and roll your eyes at everyone else in the room?


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    #88
    Memnoch
    Registered Users Posts: 4,276 ✭✭✭Memnoch


    mgmt wrote: »
    Oh yeah the Tea Party is a racist, gun loving, violent organisation. Lets ban them. Lets ban Fox News too while we're at it. After all, a conflicting opinion according to Obama is dangerous to America. :rolleyes:

    Next time, try to actually read the article before tossing in pointless throw away remarks.


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    #89
    mgmt
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,361 ✭✭✭mgmt


    Memnoch wrote: »
    Next time, try to actually read the article before tossing in pointless throw away remarks.

    I wasn't arsed, the author had made up his mind in the first few paragraphs so I wasn't going to waste my time on a hitpiece.


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    #90
    20Cent
    Registered Users Posts: 8,939 ✭✭✭20Cent


    mgmt wrote: »
    I wasn't arsed, the author had made up his mind in the first few paragraphs so I wasn't going to waste my time on a hitpiece.

    You should its very good.
    Reading the Bank Bailout story now well worth a read also.
    This Matt Taibbi guy is good.


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    #91
    Overheal
    Registered Users Posts: 82,970 ✭✭✭✭Overheal


    mgmt wrote: »
    I wasn't arsed, the author had made up his mind in the first few paragraphs so I wasn't going to waste my time on a hitpiece.
    So you decided not to read an article because you made up your mind that the piece wasn't worth reading because the writer of the article had made up their mind?

    Do you not see the irony?


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