Insert stove - whistle

paulb

Hi,

I have an Esse insert stove installed for a while now. When the wind is blowing hard there is a persistent and annoying whistle coming from the small gap(s) that exists between the stove an the fireplace it sits inside. Now there was a lot of effort to get it all snugly fitted and the stove is connected into the precast flue via an elbow connector - the seal would seem to be not great. Obviously there is a bit of seal issue and air is being sucked through some small gap somewhere.

So I have some questions I would welcome advice on....

- in the tiny space surrounding the stove is it possible to poke in some rockwool to lessen or disrupt the airflow - is there any danger in having insulation material in contact with the (outside of the) stove, is there any melting point for it. Is there any alternative solutions like heat resistant caulk or cement that would be flexible enough to get in that small space?

- is there a reducing cowl or turn-away cowl that would reduce the updraft that causes the whistle? Some of the advice on cowls elsewhere on the boards is quite conflicting - some people suggesting that they spin into the wind sometimes. As I live in a very exposed location I'd like to be sure that a cowl might be contribute to a solution and not to the problem!

Thanks in anticipation.

Dilbert75

More importantly have you a Carbon Monoxide alarm in the vicinity? If there's a bad seal and combustion gases leaking down....

rpmcs

hi paul,
i work in as stove fitter, and i know the esse quite well, i take it is the 350 your on about?
i would be of the opinion that if the stove is connected to the flue, gaps would be irrelevant on face of stove, but i have come across 350's that with the 2nd burn/air wash at top side of stove, that play some tunes!! have been on to esse and they have said it dissipates with use, and to be fair that seems to be the case, how long have you had yours? much use?
as for insulation, i always surround back and top of stove with rockwool, [not standard fiberglass wool], to maximize output to room!

paulb

Thanks very much for that rpmcs. Yes it is a 350. I have it less than a year and it would have had intermittant use through last winter and spring. The house is very exposed so there was always a savage draw up the chimney, so any small openings were likely to so this I suppose. It wasn't insulated when it was installed and to be honest it was a very difficult install, very tight fit - I was hoping to pack some rockwool in without having to move reseat it.
once
I guess one of my concers was that the convected air would be escaping up the 'whistle channels' where ever they migh be.

Great heat though - the whistle mostly disappears when it is lit for a while but when the thing is empty and have a few minutes peace and quiet with the TV it is an annoying whine - a bit like Dunphy really :-#

rpmcs

havent heard it described like dunphy before, very good!!!
but doubt that as you say stuffing rockwoll aronud sides will make much difference, but feel free to try.
as you said when you have it on on for a while it mostly goes, so if you think about it your chimney when hot should draw best, hot air rising etc, so if it was from sides the whistle came it would get worse rather than improve, my opinion is that its coming from the top air intake/airwash, and as it heats this expands or settles better, just my opinion.
to identify this maybe, when door is open block the vent that runs across top of opening,tape of some kind as it only 10mm by width of glass, this is the one that when door is closed pushes air across inside of glass to keep clean, when blocked and door closed i would bet this would stop noise! dont leave blocked, just to test, and if it still makes noise then you could go down route of sealing around sides, sorry if i might have lost you by now!!
another idea and im just bouncing ideas here, do you have a cowl on top of chimney? if you put a cowl on top of chimney it may help,

paulb

Hi,

We had a windy day over the weekend so I tried out the door vent theory - I had never noticed it before, I used some duck tape but there was no discernable difference to the whistle. I had been also considering a cowel as part of the solution - there isn't one there currently. Does a standard chinaman's hat-type reduce the updraft? I was trying to find a 'turn-away from the prevailing wind' type but without much luck. There is never a problem with updraft (or downdraft) other than it was always too strong when it was an open fireplace.

The whistle is hard to tie to a particular side of the 350, I used a bit of thread and it seems to get sucked in (not savagely) on either side and the top. Not sure what to make of that information. If I poked in rockwool it might get plugged into any opening but maybe some gaps that are an integral part of the stove, which might give me other another set of problems!

If I was to try (re)seal it with fire cement or fire sealer through the access hatch - do you know if the stuff would adhere if I just hoovered whatever loose soot was near the sleeve/joint? As soot is oily by nature the soltion mightn't last too long.

Appreciate any advice.

Thanks

rpmcs

hi paul, well now im running out of ideas!! i suppose two options would be to put cowl on top and reseal stove with rockwool as well,
or spend another few pound and run flexi flue from top to stove and back fill with vermiculite, this should stop all draught except from the vents!!!
other than that i dont know, but as to save rain into stove i would recommend a cowl in any case!!