DoneDeal no-hunting/shooting policy - Read mod note #138

smokin ace

hi everyone done deal has lost the plot i placed an add to sell a ucaller handheld light on saturday evening but surprise surprise they removed my add and sent me an email saying the following

Hi,

My name is ***** ****** and I work for the website DoneDeal.ie. We have received a number of complaints from our users about your ad “Lamping Light” with specific reference to "Lamping". The ad implies that the item could be used for killing other animals.

Many of our users feel that this type of activity can be cruel to the prey, the dog, or both. Therefore we have decided to remove your ad in line with our terms & conditions:
http://help.donedeal.ie/info/dog-policy

As I am sure this was an honest mistake, I have set you up with a voucher to place a different ad on DoneDeal.

Please let me know if you have any questions.


All the best,
*****

i think its just mental that they would remove an add for someone selling a lamp and they are adds on the site selling lurchers saying the following

dogs would make good hare and rabbit dogs --killing all game --starting to hunt(hunting would be killing animals)--taken fox single handed--Good all round dog day or night. Doing it all--takes all legal game--dog taking all legal quarry day and night-- will take all game--has been used alot for drawing out of holes(drawing out of holes will make reference to killing badgers and foxes from a hole)

these adds make more reference to killing of animals because my add made no reference to killing of any animals as it would up to the buyer to decide what they do with the lamp am i over reaction over the whole thing what do you think

kildare.17hmr

Stick the ad up again and just leave out the word lamping, not a thing they can do then and anyone looking for it will know what it is.

PM me the details im looking for a good lamp:D

Grizzly 45

Nope...ICABS has been doing a campaign against anyone allowing anything remotely connected with fieldsports to advertise in Dondeal.ie.
donedeal is going the way of Ebay and paypal..If it is shooting related,they wont advertise it.:(

jap gt

i think its about time people start boycotting the site, they have done it to me in the past and others here, i think we should all email them and voice our opinions, could they not set up a section for hunting, even ebay sell lamps etc, i se maceoin in dingle have ads on every day advertising lamps etc

smokin ace

kildare.17hmr wrote: »

Stick the ad up again and just leave out the word lamping, not a thing they can do then and anyone looking for it will know what it is.

PM me the details im looking for a good lamp:D

lucky enough i was only after coming home after selling the lamp when they removed the add :D
but the point is there are adds saying about dogs clearly killing animals and they removed an add when someone is selling a lamp i think thats mad

kildare.17hmr

I know its been mentione before but what if someone wrote a letter to donedeal and everyone signed it? surely there are alot more people involved in fieldsports that there are antis? petition at the ploughing championships maybe and send that in too?

kildare.17hmr

smokin ace wrote: »

lucky enough i was only after coming home after selling the lamp when they removed the add :D
but the point is there are adds saying about dogs clearly killing animals and they removed an add when someone is selling a lamp i think thats mad

ah well maybe next time:D

Keep an eye on them ads i doubt they will be there long

smokin ace

i sent them an email saying the following

thank you for your concern about the add but i would like to start off by saying that i think this is totally unfair when i am only just selling a lamp as many lurcher whippet and greyhounds are used for hunting and killing of animals and thats a fact and they are many adds selling these there are adds that say all of the following statements that would suggest the killing of animals
dogs would make good hare and rabbit dogs --killing all game --starting to hunt(hunting would be killing animals)--taken fox single handed--Good all round dog day or night. Doing it all--takes all legal game--dog taking all legal quarry day and night-- will take all game--has been used alot for drawing out of holes(drawing out of holes will make reference to killing badgers and foxes from a hole)
the add i placed for my lamp made no reference to killing of animals at all its up to the buyer of the lamp to decide what he or she dose with it
you removed my add because you said you got complaints about my add but i dont think this was the case
so i am now making a complaint to you about all the adds that make reference to hunting and killing game or any of the statements that i pointed out above
i dont expect you to reply to this email as it points out things that you want to turn a blind eye to going on in adds just incase you might loose money from them
regards


i wonder will i get a reply

jap gt

kildare.17hmr wrote: »

I know its been mentione before but what if someone wrote a letter to donedeal and everyone signed it? surely there are alot more people involved in fieldsports that there are antis? petition at the ploughing championships maybe and send that in too?

or even better start your own website, where hunters can advertise what they want when they want with out anti eejits dictating where we can advertise, if people stop advertising working dogs on the site they wont be long reconsidering

kildare.17hmr

smokin ace wrote: »

i sent them an email saying the following

thank you for your concern about the add but i would like to start off by saying that i think this is totally unfair when i am only just selling a lamp as many lurcher whippet and greyhounds are used for hunting and killing of animals and thats a fact and they are many adds selling these there are adds that say all of the following statements that would suggest the killing of animals
dogs would make good hare and rabbit dogs --killing all game --starting to hunt(hunting would be killing animals)--taken fox single handed--Good all round dog day or night. Doing it all--takes all legal game--dog taking all legal quarry day and night-- will take all game--has been used alot for drawing out of holes(drawing out of holes will make reference to killing badgers and foxes from a hole)
the add i placed for my lamp made no reference to killing of animals at all its up to the buyer of the lamp to decide what he or she dose with it
you removed my add because you said you got complaints about my add but i dont think this was the case
so i am now making a complaint to you about all the adds that make reference to hunting and killing game or any of the statements that i pointed out above
i dont expect you to reply to this email as it points out things that you want to turn a blind eye to going on in adds just incase you might loose money from them
regards


i wonder will i get a reply

I understand your pissed off, i would be too but tbh i think all you'v done with that e-mail is put another complaint in with reference to hunting

smokin ace

jap gt wrote: »

or even better start your own website, where hunters can advertise what they want when they want with out anti eejits dictating where we can advertise, if people stop advertising working dogs on the site they wont be long reconsidering

that would not be a bad idea at all about setting up a website but like you said would anti hunting eejits look for every excuse to get the site closed down if a lad advertised a dog lets say is marked up a bit from working or put down they were killing foxes thats all it would take to get the site closed

smokin ace

kildare.17hmr wrote: »

I understand your pissed off, i would be too but tbh i think all you'v done with that e-mail is put another complaint in with reference to hunting

very very true but i was fuming mad when i seen they had removed the add on such stupid grounds

jap gt

smokin ace wrote: »

that would not be a bad idea at all about setting up a website but like you said would anti hunting eejits look for every excuse to get the site closed down if a lad advertised a dog lets say is marked up a bit from working or put down they were killing foxes thats all it would take to get the site closed

i guess antis cant do much once nothing illeagal would be advertised

kildare.17hmr

jap gt wrote: »

i guess antis cant do much once nothing illeagal would be advertised

Your dead right, all they can do is complain, which obviously worked with donedeal.

jap gt

smokin ace wrote: »

very very true but i was fuming mad when i seen they had removed the add on such stupid grounds

at least you sold the lamp and it cost you nothing

smokin ace

jap gt wrote: »

at least you sold the lamp and it cost you nothing

another very true point i never thought of that

DonnaDoneDeal

Hi,

Sorry that this has caused concern guys, but our terms and conditions state that we do not allow ads that mention "Lamping, Killing, and Digging" and therefore the ad was removed after we received complaints from other customers.

This is a very difficult topic for us to monitor, we appreciate that it is just a light, but we are also trying to protect the welfare of animals and are doing our best to keep everyone happy.....as you can imagine, that's not an easy task!

Any ads on our site that raise concerns for you, please report them to support@donedeal.ie and we will investigate them. Thanks guys.

BUACHAILL

DonnaDoneDeal wrote: »

Hi,

Sorry that this has caused concern guys, but our terms and conditions state that we do not allow ads that mention "Lamping, Killing, and Digging" and therefore the ad was removed after we received complaints from other customers.

This is a very difficult topic for us to monitor, we appreciate that it is just a light, but we are also trying to protect the welfare of animals and are doing our best to keep everyone happy.....as you can imagine, that's not an easy task!

Any ads on our site that raise concerns for you, please report them to support@donedeal.ie and we will investigate them. Thanks guys.

Fair play for the reply

I think what Donedeal and most anti's must also realise that hunters in general are only trying to protect the welfare of deer and other animals also !! You say Killing we say Culling.

I think best thing donedeal could do is understand something properly before you make a decision like this !!

kildare.17hmr

DonnaDoneDeal wrote: »

Hi,

Sorry that this has caused concern guys, but our terms and conditions state that we do not allow ads that mention "Lamping, Killing, and Digging" and therefore the ad was removed after we received complaints from other customers.

This is a very difficult topic for us to monitor, we appreciate that it is just a light, but we are also trying to protect the welfare of animals and are doing our best to keep everyone happy.....as you can imagine, that's not an easy task!

Any ads on our site that raise concerns for you, please report them to support@donedeal.ie and we will investigate them. Thanks guys.

There is an ongoing campaign by an anti huntin organisation to complain about these ads on your website. You say they are customers but i would think most of the people who complain only go to your website to look for these types of ads and are in fact not customers at all

smokin ace

hi donna thanks for the email reply but i think your website is dictated to much by anti hunting people complaining and as far as i know and i am open to correction lamping is not illegal

Section 45 of the Wildlife (Amendment) Act 2000 amends Section 38 of the 1976 Act which applied to the use of lamps, mirrors, dazzling equipment etc., for the purposes of hunting. Section 38 of the '76 Act was substituted by this completely new Section. The amendment states that it will be illegal for any person to hunt any protected wild animal or protected wild bird while using a lamp, light, torch, mirror or other artificial dazzling device. Also prohibited are any devices for illuminating, image intensifying or heat seeking, night sights, or any device which the Minister may declare as coming within this category.

so if lamping is not against the law why is certain adds not looked upon favourably on the done deal website to be honest i think you are bowing to pressure from anti hunting folk but hunting legally is a way of life for so many people and shame on done deal for making us hunting folk feel like we are doing something wrong or breaking the law in some way

J.R.

DonnaDoneDeal wrote: »

Hi,

Sorry that this has caused concern guys, but our terms and conditions state that we do not allow ads that mention "Lamping, Killing, and Digging" and therefore the ad was removed after we received complaints from other customers.

This is a very difficult topic for us to monitor, we appreciate that it is just a light, but we are also trying to protect the welfare of animals and are doing our best to keep everyone happy.....as you can imagine, that's not an easy task!

Any ads on our site that raise concerns for you, please report them to support@donedeal.ie and we will investigate them. Thanks guys.

I can understand that it's difficult to please everybody but it's also unfair to allow one sector of society to dictate their views and ideas on others and deciding what can & can't be sold on the site.....especialy when ads are advertising something legal which is not breaking any law.

Groups of 'animal lovers' who released mink from farms caused untold, ongoing, damage to wildlife by their 'good intentioned' actions.

Cars, jeeps, trucks, buses, vans & agricultural machinery account for many road casualties for wildlife (granted not intentionally)....often resulting is a slow painful death from such injuries.....perhaps all of these ads should also be removed & banned from the site in the interest of animal welfare!!!

Vegeta

Hey Donna,

I know your policy is probably already set in stone but are you guys aware that the number of people who hunt is much greater than the number who are anti hunting campaigners.

If you need proof of that, look up the number of people who campaign for RISE.

If it is your intention to exclude this portion of the market well then that's fair enough but it seems odd that the site would take a political stance like that.

I bought my last car through your site but cant see myself ever using it again or recommending it if your policy continues.

As other posters have pointed out lamping is not illegal. Such an odd decision you seem to have taken. 18 dogs were put down everyday in 2009 yet you allow the sale of pet dogs. You have taken an anti hunting stance but support a trade which is famously cruel.

I sincerely hope you change your mind and realise that hunters are a greater market opportunity than the antis.

kildare.17hmr

Ill 2nd what Vegeta has said about not using donedeal and recomending it, i use it on a weekly basis for work to sell cars and have done for ages. so there is two actual customers lost, not just people who used your site to complain

johngalway

I won't be using DoneDeal either until your policy changes.

I'm a farmer and a hunter. Many, many farmers use your site, a lot of those have registered firearms. Those same farmers have pest and predation problems. Those problems are caused by rats, rabbits and foxes.

Rats are a threat to food stored on farm destined for animal or human consumption. They can be removed in many ways, one of which is lamping.

Rabbits are a major pest in some areas, they destroy crops if numbers are left unchecked, they present problems to cattle and horses by digging burrows and to those two animals plus sheep by competing from grass. One of the ways they can be controlled is by lamping.

Foxes can cause major problems in sheep areas, also for poultry producers. Lamping is one of the most effective methods of removing problem foxes.

Lamping, whether using shotgun, rifle or dogs such as lurchers is a perfectly acceptable, and legal, method of pest control.

If you continue to have this policy, one influenced by a minority of misguided people, I will continue not to use your site and neither will I recommend it to other farmers. In fact, any opportunity available to me I will mention this to other farmers, those potential customers of yours who I lamp for. I will instead direct them to other sales sites which don't have such a ridiculous policy in force.

I sincerely doubt the antis will be buying the agricultural items for sale on your site.

You're entitled to have your policy, but you've not considered your market in my opinion.

Grizzly 45

Hi Donna,
I would also like to know will it also be donedeal.ie future policy to also under pressure from "other customers" to remove all adverts relating to rifles,shotguns,gunsafes[we already had one discussed here appx 14 days ago]airguns, archery equipment,catapults,cammo clothing,natural fur coats,pelts, knives of the legal variety,fishing tackle,netting,food preparation equipment,horses and related?

As all this kind of stuff your "other customers" could and wil eventually take umbrage with??As this is not really related to animal welfare rather a destruction of a lifestyle choice by covert and overt means.
If it is donedeals policy to exclude in the future any of the above.I,and I think appx 100,000 others in the fieldsports organisations will boycott donedeal.ie.Not just on fieldsport adverts,but on every other kind of advert too relating to daily life...

I would suggest you look at how much busisness Paypal.com and Ebay.com loose every year through their anti gun trading policy.Seeing that both have a HQ in Ireland it shouldnt be too difficult to obtain that info??There is an active campain against Ebay and paypal by gun owners both in the US and EU who will absolutely NOT deal with anyone with either accounts. I will also point out that your competitors here are still only too happy to take our adverts and money and give the same service and coverage..

Finally may I point out that while our 4legged friends are not inanimate objects,and are proably sentinent beings.They really dont have much choice in how they are brought up or used by us ,supposedly superior apes:rolleyes:.IOW just because the dog is a pitbull,doesnt mean it will be a voracious killer willing to rip the throat out of the next innocent.As we say in the shooting world "guns dont kill,people kill people". A good guideline for you would be the dog is innocent,it is the owner who might misuse it in a legal or illegal act here ...
Donedeal would have gained more respect by simply stating that it is not responsible for the use or MISuse of ANY product advertised ,and that all animal adverts suggesting misuse of animals in illegal activities such as dog fighting,badger baiting will be removed.Rather than fold up to the whims of a total minority of irish society and their militant extremists.

sincierly
Grizzly 45.

tfox

So what sites are recommended now as an alternative for us hunting folk...?

lofty95

has anybody actually read there terms and conditions i think there is actually some anti, head honcho in that company. It seems they are banding badger bating in with other legal forms of dog use.

Grizzly 45

www.buyandsell.ie, www.exchangeand mart.co.uk,

Wasnt there an Irish version of www.guntrader.co.uk ?? Remember seeing it advertised in Birr Game and country show abt two years ago

jap gt

http://irishguntrader.openseason.ie/

Sparks

First off, well done to Donna for posting in here. Many wouldn't. I would recommend you email hello@boards.ie and let them know you're an official representative of DoneDeal though, just to avoid confusion.

That said, the policy makes no sense to me. I don't mean from the point of view of any particular ideology; frankly, it's your website and you pay the bills and if you decide you don't want to allow ads like this, that's just more market share for boards.ie and adverts.ie to mop up.

The reason it makes no sense to me is that there are maybe 5-10 active members of ICABS; there are around 300,000 people involved in fieldsports in Ireland. I won't say the business case is a no-brainer, but it's hard to see how even a very brief cost/benefit analysis could say anything other than that dropping 300,000 paying customers during a recession to support the ideology of 5-10 nonpaying protesters is not a very profitable business plan.

cavan shooter

Grizzly 45 wrote: »

www.buyandsell.ie, www.exchangeand mart.co.uk,

Wasnt there an Irish version of www.guntrader.co.uk ?? Remember seeing it advertised in Birr Game and country show abt two years ago

Lads,
Dont want to be a spoil sport here but will someone check the policies on Buy ands sell.:o