How Bout Dem Bears?

padraig_f

kennyb3 wrote: »

It was the second road game (Pittsburgh last week were they did good) and I thought the Oline did okay given the Dline they faced and the fact that once we got behind cutler had to look for more time for longer passes - which is tough on the line. At the end of the day there are 2 rookies on the line and it hasn't turned into a superstar line all of a sudden.

The D is the big problem - still generating turnovers yes, blitzing well yes, everything else is not much short of awful. No pass rush, horrible against the run, giving up yards and touchdowns for fun. Cohen played some snaps off the street FFS. We've 6 sacks in 4 games, most of them from blitzing linebackers. Only the Giants and Steelers have less - and look how they are doing. Most teams have 11-13 sacks. We've the 8th most points given up.

Peppers has looked average - very far from the superstar his salary suggests. McClellin - awful, just awful. Whitney Mercilus and Chandler Jones have more career sacks than this guy has tackles - 1 solo tackle in 4 games and half a sack - give me a break. We may as well be playing with 3 line men so. If you can't get to the quarterback your going to get cut apart regardless of your cornerbacks or safties.

If we don't sort the pass rush out we won't be going to the playoffs - end of. The question is given our cap space issue, do we trade and get a decent DT to generate pressure up the middle allowing Wotton and Pepper to get to the QB. (please god bench McClellin or keep him to passing downs as a stunter/stand up rover). Thoughts on trading?

Looking ahead to the weekend game and people are saying we should cut up the saints D - well their D has 12 sacks and the 4th fewest points given up. I think we'll get thonked - I hope i'm wrong.

Good stuff, I agree the defense is the main problem. Looking at the defensive stats through 4 games...29th in yards-per-pass-attempt allowed, 30th in sacks...bottom of the league stuff. Takeaways are overrated, they're more a function of the offense screwing up than anything the defense can really control.

And yeah, laying the blame for the loss at Cutler was misplaced. One positive stat I noticed is the team is 3rd overall in sacks allowed. But it's not because it's the 3rd best o-line, they're obviously working on getting it out quicker, and that has its down-sides in terms of more interceptions. They're chasing the game from the start, so he's slinging it a bit, and he knows he can't hold onto the ball too long. Maybe there's a balance to be struck there, and taking the odd sack when the pass isn't there, wouldn't be the worst option.

The Saints offense will be a scary prospect, but I do think the defense can be got at. I keep some numbers on this stuff, here are the Saints defensive numbers:

Yards-per-play allowed: 5.75 (18th) (adjusted for strength of opponent: 22nd)
Yards-per-pass-attempt allowed: 5.92 (6th)
Yards-per-rushing-attempt allowed: 5.48 (32nd)

Below-average defense overall.
Very unusual split there between the pass-defense, which is 6th overall, and the rush-defense, which is league-worst. Almost giving up as much per-rush as per pass-attempt!

Not hard to work out what the general gameplan should be, at least on the offensive side.

Guffy

Isn't the whole bears d philosophy that they will give you the underneath yardage in order create the turnover. What I mean is they allow teams to throw on them between the red zones so that they can attack the ball which is why they have the High turnover rate.

I'm on the phone so can't check the stats but would be interested to see how those stats corralate to what percentage of drives the opposition score a td from.

kennyb3

padraig_f wrote: »

And yeah, laying the blame for the loss at Cutler was misplaced. One positive stat I noticed is the team is 3rd overall in sacks allowed. But it's not because it's the 3rd best o-line, they're obviously working on getting it out quicker, and that has its down-sides in terms of more interceptions. They're chasing the game from the start, so he's slinging it a bit, and he knows he can't hold onto the ball too long. Maybe there's a balance to be struck there, and taking the odd sack when the pass isn't there, wouldn't be the worst option.

Thanks for the Saints D stats, absolutely no doubt we should be running the ball all day long- If we don't use Bush ($14/4yrs and just 16 snaps this year) in this game we never will.

I wouldn't be giving Cutler a pass on that game - the 3 interceptions and fumble clearly don't help our defence but overall no doubt he has been much improved this year. Even showing the heart to nearly come back is a step forward. But yeah you're dead right he was slinging it and as we've both said the Oline can't stand up to a top quality pass rush if Cutler has to hold onto the ball.

As you say either take the sack (with 2 hands on the ball) or throw it away. I'd really like to see him throw the ball away more tbh. He's not Russell Wilson - so shouldn't be running around one hand on the ball.

kennyb3

gufc21 wrote: »

Isn't the whole bears d philosophy that they will give you the underneath yardage in order create the turnover. What I mean is they allow teams to throw on them between the red zones so that they can attack the ball which is why they have the High turnover rate.

I'm on the phone so can't check the stats but would be interested to see how those stats corralate to what percentage of drives the opposition score a td from.

Well as a start they need to defend the run - Bush ran 112yards on 11 carries - over 10yards per carry. Crazy.

And my understanding is the D (Tampa 2) is set up to not give away the big plays - yet they've given up 20 yards or more on 21 plays this year. Again crazy!

kennyb3

Just to add letting Idonije go is now looking pretty dumb given his 7.5 sacks and 40 tackles from DT last season.

Realt Dearg Sec

I read where the lions vice chairman Bill Ford called the bears a bunch of thugs. Jim Schwartz meanwhile is bitching about bostic. I would have thought any team that tolerates the antics of a tinker like ndamokong suh would keep their heads down on that sort of subject.

kennyb3

Realt Dearg Sec wrote: »

I read where the lions vice chairman Bill Ford called the bears a bunch of thugs. Jim Schwartz meanwhile is bitching about bostic. I would have thought any team that tolerates the antics of a tinker like ndamokong suh would keep their heads down on that sort of subject.

Yeah the irony is palpable

kennyb3

Thought i'd put this here;

According to PFF:

"Shea McClellin has just five combined sacks, hits, and hurries on 107 pass rushes which is the lowest Pass Rushing Productivity score (3.8) of any edge rusher. That is marginally better than the 3.8 of Nick Perry who has got to do more to help out Clay Matthews."

padraig_f

Disappointing to lose two in a row, but had a look at the game again today and think it was a decent performance overall. The defense was improved, the Saints are just a tough cover. They're very good the way they use the running-backs in combination with Jimmy Graham, it's run, screen-passes to the running backs, and then when you come up to do defend the run, they'll do play-action and throw to Jimmy Graham who's a matchup nightmare. It's just tough to cover them all, but I thought the coverage was generally good and the pass-rush was improved today.

The offense dug a hole early. They just seemed to have trouble picking up the blitzes early, the first fumble came from an unblocked blitzer. I think they did set out to run the ball, but didn't get any push up the middle. Looked like they recognised this and started pitching it to Forte more for runs on the outside, which worked better.

The offense improved as the game went on but just stalled at some key points. 3rd quarter drive to 1st-and-goal from the Saints 4-yard line. Penalty on Long, 1st-and-goal from the 9. 3 shotgun passes, 3 incompletions. Would've liked to see them run here on at least one of the downs, or take a leaf out of the Saints book and do some play-action.

4th quarter, 8 mins left, down 23-10. 3rd-and-2 on the Saints 25. Incomplete pass. 4th-and-2, go for it, and Bennett dropped a really easy catch.

Apart from the Bennett drop, didn't really like the play-calling there. If you know you're using all four downs, I just prefer to run it with Bush on 3rd-and-2. Give Bush two chances to make 2 yards, that has to be a really high percentage. But Bennett really should've made the catch.

Briggs made a bad blunder at the end to commit a neutral-zone infraction when the Saints tried to draw them offside. Just a bad mistake because no way were the Saints running a play there. Up 23-10, inside their own half on 4th down. The defense effectively has one job here: don't commit a pre-snap penalty, and that's what they did. Briggs was probably the best player on the defense up to then, so unfortunate to see him make that mistake.


In general though I'm not unhappy. The Saints are a good team, and there were some fairly small margins that decided the game. Actually I thought it was an improved performance in some ways over the previous two weeks.

Fortunate enough to win some of the earlier games (e.g. Bengals, Vikings), so I think 3-2 is a fair record right now for where the team is at.

Bad news the following day about Nate Collins, already thin at that position.

Might have a look at the Giants before the game on Thursday. I hear their o-line is where all the problems are, but I suspect they're not as bad as their record suggests.

Realt Dearg Sec

Great summary. Only saw the first half at the time, but was surprised how long it took to start throwing to forte given how well he's worked out before now.

Who'd have thought coming into the year that the d line would be a bigger problem than the rookie filled o line? Collins dropping out is very bad news given that Melton is already gone.
Still we have to be beating the giants on that front, and I fancy us to do it. Haven't watched them all year but looking at how their offense is struggling injuries are no excuse. But yeah, we're doing better than I was expecting at this stage and it would be nice to push on while the packers are still struggling with injuries.

jackthetrader

Go Bears!

SameOleJay

Hi fellas, first timer.

Strange game Thursday. So many problems and nearly all of them on D. The pass rush is embarrassing at this stage and it's still a notch above the tackling. I think Emery needs to consider a trade at this stage- there's too much in the offence to toss it away. Rodgers will absolutely torch that secondary with the time he'll have. I'm anticipating a clear-out at season end.

The offence is growing on me every week. The triple receiving threat with Forte from the backfield allied with Trestmann's nous gives so many dimensions. The line has been an unmitigated success. And finally Thursday's was one of my favourite performances from Jay- given any sort of time the man can boss it.

Strange, but exciting times.

padraig_f

SameOleJay wrote: »

Hi fellas, first timer.

Strange game Thursday. So many problems and nearly all of them on D. The pass rush is embarrassing at this stage and it's still a notch above the tackling. I think Emery needs to consider a trade at this stage- there's too much in the offence to toss it away. Rodgers will absolutely torch that secondary with the time he'll have. I'm anticipating a clear-out at season end.

The offence is growing on me every week. The triple receiving threat with Forte from the backfield allied with Trestmann's nous gives so many dimensions. The line has been an unmitigated success. And finally Thursday's was one of my favourite performances from Jay- given any sort of time the man can boss it.

Strange, but exciting times.

Yeah, pass-rush is brutal. I don't know if there are any trade options available, but if you're going to do something, now is probably the time, with the Redskins next week and then the bye week after that.

Maybe if there are no options available, they just try and get the defense to an average level (which seems about the best you can expect right now), and try and win games with offense.

Also thought Cutler was excellent on Thursday, maybe his best game under Trestman. The number weren't crazy, but very accurate, recognised the blitzes and hit the hot man, threw it away when necessary. Just a very accomplished game.

Note on Lance Briggs who had another big game, at the top of the charts in Football Outsiders invidual defensive stats from weeks 1-5:
Early Leaders in FO Defensive Stats

Not quite sure what "most defeats" means, but if Briggs is #1, and JJ Watt is #2, it must be pretty good.

Badabing

What do you think about the Redskins game on Sunday? I think we have a good chance if Defence tighting up a bit, Also a bye week will be good for team before we play the Packers away.

SameOleJay

I'm excited for the game.Jay should get enough time to torch that Washington secondary. Bush is red useless but Forte will tick things over. D will give up plenty to Morris and Griffin but I'm confident they'll take it in a shoot-out.

I fear the Pack could tear us a new one in Lambeau. That pass rush against Rodgers doesn't bear thinking about.

Oat23

Cutler down and the defense is a f*cking joke. Not looking good today.

How can you leave Jordan Reed undefended in the redzone after a timeout? He is the only guy catching the ball for them today. Tucker's D is embarrassing.

SameOleJay

Chris Conte, and I mean this, can never play for Chicago again.

Oat23

SameOleJay wrote: »

Chris Conte, and I mean this, can never play for Chicago again.

Ship out McClellin too. Breaking contain on read options all game like a f*cking amateur.

SameOleJay

I'd back myself to get separation on Conte in a phonebox.

Major is a write off too, pun fully intended. I won't shed any tears on Jennings' departure either.

As for Peppers, Jesus wept.

padraig_f

Jesus, doesn't sound too good:
Bears bracing for worst with Cutler injury

MRI results later today. McCown played great yesterday, but the way the defense is playing, hard to see a backup doing enough to win many games.

Oat23

Briggs out for 4-6 weeks, huge loss.

Still waiting to hear about Cutler but not looking good.

Update:

Michael C. Wright ‏@mikecwright 1m

Bears announce that Jay Cutler has a muscle tear in groin. Out at least 4 weeks.

Time to tank!

padraig_f

Thought they were gonna say season-ending, so kinda relieved. One week is the bye, so maybe if you go 1-2 in the 3 games, you have a chance.

Briggs is a massive blow on top of that though, thought the defense couldn't get any worse...

Oat23

If he's back from a torn groin muscle injury for St. Louis I'll be shocked. I'm looking at the Dallas MNF game.

I saw someone mention recently that Rex Ryan would be a good DC option if he leaves the Jets. I find it unlikely to happen, but it would be awesome to bring him in after this season to run the D as his father once did in Chicago.

SameOleJay

Talk on the HH forum was of a defensive fire sale. But Emery came out yesterday and said there was no value in any prospective trades. I've a lot of confidence in Emery and think he can revamp the defence much like he did the o-line in quick time. I'm very encouraged to hear the noise that the likes of Peppers, the safeties and even Jennings are all but tossed.

The offence needs little work. A centre is needed but that's about it. Jay is obviously the big decision. If we lose the next 4 will he be benched for the season remainder? Is it worth tagging him next season? What impact will the injury have on other bidders and his potential earnings in Chicago? He's my favourite player in the league and I hope he stays a Bear but that tackle looked so innocuous you'd have to think the injury will impact his next contract.

padraig_f

Sounds like a good read:
Ditka vs. Ryan: The Feud That Fueled the '85 Chicago Bears

Comes out next week.
Monsters: The 1985 Chicago Bears and the Wild Heart of Football

SameOleJay

So Jay may only miss the one game after all… or so the noise goes.

Monday is gonna be one long night. We could genuinely be talking career numbers for Rodgers and Lacy. I think McCown has enough time and options to put up 20 odd. I suspect The Packers may triple that.

Realt Dearg Sec

SameOleJay wrote: »

So Jay may only miss the one game after all… or so the noise goes.

Monday is gonna be one long night. We could genuinely be talking career numbers for Rodgers and Lacy. I think McCown has enough time and options to put up 20 odd. I suspect The Packers may triple that.

Yeah I'm not nervous about being beaten (I think only a miracle would prevent that), but the way our D has been going, and the rate at which they are going down injured, a serious annihilation could be on the cards. Big night for the running game to keep the pressure off McCown. Presume we'll be seeing a lot of Michael Bush. That is not a sentence that fills me with joy.

Badabing

When did then Bears last beat Green Bay? This season is looking like a 8-8 or a 9-7 at best as i see it now.

Realt Dearg Sec

Badabing wrote: »

When did then Bears last beat Green Bay? This season is looking like a 8-8 or a 9-7 at best as i see it now.

Not since 2010. And we didn't beat them in 09 either. So it's pretty long overdue. And given that the Packers, who have been torching us with their passing game all that time, are now also the league's 4th best in rushing yards, I just don't see how our D can handle them.

SameOleJay

The Detroit game is big. I reckon they're the main opposition for the second play-off spot (Carolina's schedule is very tough). Lose that and we're done.

Peppers is all but gone anyway. 8 mill in dead money but it's an absolute no-brainer. Man has he fallen off the cliff this season.

Innish_Rebel

Is it just me or are other bears fans not sure what to do watching tonight - All interested to see how mcCown does hope he continues his form from last day, or cringing at what Rogers & Lacy might do to the badly beaten up defense?

Realt Dearg Sec

Innish_Rebel wrote: »

Is it just me or are other bears fans not sure what to do watching tonight - All interested to see how mcCown does hope he continues his form from last day, or cringing at what Rogers & Lacy might do to the badly beaten up defense?

No that just about sums it up for me. As the week has worn on I've gotten more confident about the offense and hopefully mccown will keep things motoring while I have total faith in forte. Mccown doesn't seem to have a great arm so I would like to see martellus Bennett and forte a good bit in passing. But I'd fear for our d, it's so depleted and has been so inept that we could get carved up. Hopefully we'll see some signs that we are making progress, the offense was progressing beautifully up until cutlers injury and I'd still give us hope of picking up a wild card spot if we can resume our form in next week's game. Really can't see anything but a loss tonight though.

Still...it's a funny league and stranger things have happened. Would love to wrong tonight!

Realt Dearg Sec

Innish_Rebel wrote: »

Is it just me or are other bears fans not sure what to do watching tonight - All interested to see how mcCown does hope he continues his form from last day, or cringing at what Rogers & Lacy might do to the badly beaten up defense?

No that just about sums it up for me. As the week has worn on I've gotten more confident about the offense and hopefully mccown will keep things motoring while I have total faith in forte. Mccown doesn't seem to have a great arm so I would like to see martellus Bennett and forte a good bit in passing. But I'd fear for our d, it's so depleted and has been so inept that we could get carved up. Hopefully we'll see some signs that we are making progress, the offense was progressing beautifully up until cutlers injury and I'd still give us hope of picking up a wild card spot if we can resume our form in next week's game. Really can't see anything but a loss tonight though.

Still...it's a funny league and stranger things have happened. Would love to wrong tonight!

SameOleJay

I'll be watching from behind the couch.

padraig_f

Would be looking forward to it more if Cutler & Briggs were playing, but still looking forward to it in a no-lose kind of way. You're not supposed to win with your backup QB on the road, and it's still Bears-Packers. I think McCown will do ok, and could actually do quite well. And while it's hard to make a case for the Bears winning the game with how the defense has been playing, if you move the ball on offense, you'll always have a chance.

Just looking for a good performance, even if it's a losing result. Don't beat yourself on offense. Play within the restrictions of a backup QB, but at the same time, don't be overly conservative/predictable. Part of the process this year has been developing a more structured offense, so I think that continues this week.

On defense, it's probably gonna be damage limitation, but at least make them earn it, make some receiver other than Jordy Nelson beat you. Kind of hard to see the defense keeping up, but you never know.

Guffy

Great TD. defenders had hands on both players!!

Innish_Rebel

Feeling a bit under the weather so bit the bullet and did not stay up to watch last night - did sky+ the game though... Woke up this morning thinking I'll check the phone for the result & while waiting for it to load I was even wondering would I be able to watch the recording tonight. Pleasantly surprised... Great win. Still worrying how many rushing yards the packers had but looking another way. Greenbay had a blocked punt, recovered an onside kick & 200 yards on the ground and still the Bears won - very impressive.

Trestman must have b*lls of steel, 4th & inches own 32 yard line leading by 4, 4th quarter & he goes for it... Forte is having some year - lets be honest he's having a great career, one of the most underrated running backs in the league

adrian522

Realt Dearg Sec wrote: »

Yeah I'm not nervous about being beaten (I think only a miracle would prevent that), but the way our D has been going, and the rate at which they are going down injured, a serious annihilation could be on the cards. Big night for the running game to keep the pressure off McCown. Presume we'll be seeing a lot of Michael Bush. That is not a sentence that fills me with joy.

Where was the confidence going into this?

Epic drive there at the end of the game to take about 9 mins off the clock, McCowan was actually very good and much better than the packers backup.

Realt Dearg Sec

adrian522 wrote: »

Where was the confidence going into this?

Epic drive there at the end of the game to take about 9 mins off the clock, McCowan was actually very good and much better than the packers backup.

Check my later post on this thread from yesterday, where I expressed growing confidence in mccown. Wasn't expecting a win mind you, and certainly wasn't expecting the D to turn up as well as they did, particularly peppers and mcclellin. Rodgers or no Rodgers, it was a great performance, although the difficulty they had dealing with lacy was very troubling when we knew he was pretty much their only viable offensive weapon. Tbf he was unstoppable though.

adrian522

Good win all the same, no harm letting Lacy have his yards, they were never going to win without being able to pass the ball.

Realt Dearg Sec

adrian522 wrote: »

Good win all the same, no harm letting Lacy have his yards, they were never going to win without being able to pass the ball.

Yeah it's just something that needs work in future weeks, he found it very easy to get space and we really struggled to take him down.

But a win is a win is a win, you can only beat what's in front of you, and all the other cliches. And a win over the packers is always sweet, I don't care who they're missing, we were missing plenty of absolutely vital players ourselves and I'd be quite optimistic looking forward now. Cutler possibly back next week? Good times.

padraig_f

Take a bow Josh McCown and Marc Trestman. Great gameplan, I loved that they came out throwing the ball. Other teams talk about how they have confidence in their backup, but the Bears showed it yesterday in their gameplan, and McCown delivered.

Didn't get much help from the running game in the first half, but McCown showed great poise in the pocket. Didn't run out too early, stayed when the pressure was there and made the throws. Have to give the guy credit for that, you don't see many backup QBs with that much coolness in the pocket.

Got good protection, but still had to trust it. Jeffery had a big first half, he's having a great season. Pass-rush was great, even before Rodgers went out. Didn't see that coming at all. Run-defense we'll gloss over (don't know how they missed so many tackles stacking the box). Special teams we'll also gloss over (unblocked rusher on a punt).

Got the run-game going in the second half and Forte had a big game to take it home. Actually didn't like the call to go for it on 4th-and-inches from their own 30. Packers offense was perfoming pretty badly at that stage, and with a 4-point lead, I thought a punt would be a better option. Forte had a big play there because it looked like he was going to get stopped.

But that was about the only one I disagreed with in a brilliant gameplan. I'm really enjoying having a good offensive coach on the sideline. Just all the little things he gets right, the variation in the plays, the little wrinkles you see. I was thinking before the game 'this is when you find out about your coach, not when you have everyone healthy, but when you're without key players'. And a win in Lambeau is a pretty good result in that respect.

SameOleJay

I spent yesterday drawing up my own scouting report on Clowney- now I'm freeing up some post-season holidays. Football, eh?

I adore this offence. No league leaders in any position but so much talent spread so well across the field- masterminded by Trestman, whose array of plays has been sensational. That trio of receivers is lethal and Forte just bossed it. I'm rubbing my eyes at every down watching the O-line- I didn't know what one was until this season. Emery needs serious kudos for that revamp- it's remarkable.

Credit where it's due- I never saw that pressure coming from the D. It's possibly the biggest positive of the night. Shea was a different player. Run defence is chronic but eminently fixable, especially when Lance gets back. The safeties are beyond a disgrace.... it's the one area where there's no hope. And I mean none.

But last word can only go one way. Given the latest, I may never see Josh McCown play another snap but I won't forget that one in a hurry. He should be proud of himself. He managed the game so well. He was chuffed afterwards, family travelled from all over to see it and I'm delighted for him.

Realt Dearg Sec

Regarding mccown, we can also be fairly confident that if anything else happens to Cutler during the season we won't be hitting the panic button.

I'm delighted with yesterday same as everyone but coming back down to earth, where does this leave us? A win next week (whichever QB we are using) seems possible but we will be facing a better offense...but IF we won, and with AR out for a few weeks, wouldn't it be nice to start thinking that a playoff spot might be a very real possibility again, maybe, just maybe, even finishing top of NFCN?

But my realistic side is telling me this is one win against a depleted team and the bear fan tendency to lose the run of ourselves needs to be kept in check.

At least til next week...

Realt Dearg Sec

Regarding mccown, we can also be fairly confident that if anything else happens to Cutler during the season we won't be hitting the panic button.

I'm delighted with yesterday same as everyone but coming back down to earth, where does this leave us? A win next week (whichever QB we are using) seems possible but we will be facing a better offense...but IF we won, and with AR out for a few weeks, wouldn't it be nice to start thinking that a playoff spot might be a very real possibility again, maybe, just maybe, even finishing top of NFCN?

But my realistic side is telling me this is one win against a depleted team and the bear fan tendency to lose the run of ourselves needs to be kept in check.

At least til next week...

SameOleJay

Any thoughts on player of the season?

Forte is on course for 2k in yardage and 14 tds. Probably the indispensable in that offence. Marshall has cemented himself a top 5 WR- given the amount of options in the passing game his production is impressive. Long has been a flat out revelation. Honourable mentions to Jeffery (Stud), the Black Unicorn and Mills (A 5th round rookie ffs). Briggs may have had a shout but for the injury. He was the last trace of blu-tac holding that D together before Monday night.

All things considered I'll plum for Chris Conte, the unsung hero of the flourishing Chicago safety unit.

Oat23

Cutty has been cleared to play

Badabing

Massive game tonight and probably a must win, although with the Packers without Rodgers for a few weeks they might lose a few. Our Defence must tighting up especially with the Lions running game. High scoring game but Bears to just shade it I hope.

padraig_f

Badabing wrote: »

Massive game tonight and probably a must win, although with the Packers without Rodgers for a few weeks they might lose a few. Our Defence must tighting up especially with the Lions running game. High scoring game but Bears to just shade it I hope.

Yeah huge game, the fact that they've already lost to the Lions. Win and you take control of the division, lose and you're probably scrapping for a wildcard.

Good to have Cutler back, but getting the win probably depends on the defense keeping Reggie Bush and Calvin Johnson in check. Interesting to see how they play that, whether they leave the safeties deep or bring them up into the box more. I'd kind of favour defending the run first, and trusting Tillman more or less one-on-one with Johnson. Even if Tillman got beaten for a couple of big plays, probably better than getting gashed for 7 or 8 yards every play in the run game.

Hopefully they get better start than the previous Lions game, when they got behind early and had to abandon the run.

Oat23

Can't believe Cutler played the whole game. First time I've been pissed with Trestman. He should have been taken out in the 3rd Q after the first series.

edit: McCown in for the final series. Too f*ckin late now Trest.