Liverpool v Northampton Match Thread

Dublin_Gunner

As much as some are saying tonight's defeat isn't that much of a problem in the grand scheme of things, I'd have to disagree.

We had a strong enough team out, and lost to a Div 2 team.

Its fcuking shocking TBH.

This was a cup we could have done with a decent run in, and we blew it against a shocking 2nd Div team, who finished with fcuking 39% possession AT ANFIELD.

I'm disgusted. With every single player on that Anfield turf in a Red short tonight.

4 shots on target in 90 mins is just a disgrace for a Liverpool team.

Utterly disgusted.

cantgetright

SantryRed wrote: »

Jamie Carragher is sh1t pal.

Count him out and squad still good enough.

Le King

Major over-reactions. Obviously it's a terrible result, but the reactions are as if Liverpool had their full team out and are facing relegation. The result was terrible. I didn't see the game myself, but I think Hodgson's team selection was definitely uninspiring, Northampton were obviously going to be up for it. A lot of these Liverpool players have large expectations hanging over their shoulders. This was probably a big factor along with some probably not up for the game.


Most would of predicted Liverpool to batter them. Liverpool should of had enough to beat them, this is an embarrassing result for the club. Obviously the players should be ashamed, but maybe this will wake up a few people. A lot depends on the reaction from the group of players involved. I don't know how anybody played, but the players pushing for the first team will definitely have to go out and prove their not as bad as that result. Uninspiring? Yes. Terrible result? Yes. End of the world reactions? No.


It adds to Hodgon's pressure, but he is experienced enough to deal with the crap that will be spouted in the media tomorrow about the team.

Dozen Wicked Words

Absolutely brilliant night for all long suffering Cobblers fans, half of my family included. Hopefully Man Utd away next round, sadly Stamford Bridge isnt on the cards now.

The clouds are grey, the sky is blue, the river Nene goes winding through!!!!

JerryHandbag

rossie1977 wrote: »

reminds me of blackburn a bit, they won the league and then were bottom of the table some 18 months later, who was the blackburn manager at the time................

Ray Harford?

KeithAFC

You get the feeling far too many players in the Liverpool squad aren't proud to actually wear the shirt. Hey, we got bum ****ed but at least i'll be picking up my 50k next week. Shocking.

8-10

rossie1977 wrote: »

prior to finishing second they had finished 3rd, 3rd and 4th in previous seasons, in fact year before they finished second they only lost 4 games all season

you can't keep making excuses for woy, fact remains liverpool have 4 players who made the dutch/spanish world cup squads, they have the england captain, england first choice right-back, the danish captain and vice captain, joe cole a player lauded by pundits, they should clearly have enough to finish top 8

Um...Rio Ferdinand is England captain?

8-10

Dublin_Gunner wrote: »

As much as some are saying tonight's defeat isn't that much of a problem in the grand scheme of things, I'd have to disagree.

We had a strong enough team out, and lost to a Div 2 team.

Div 2 sounds too nice, it was League 2, ie 4th tier. Below the old Div 3. :eek:

Xavi6

Chin up lads it could be worse. You could be managed by Mercurial Mancini who ignored two teams worth of highly paid international stars to field a backline of teenagers for a game against same league opposition.

35 years is worse than your situation

aidan24326

rossie1977 wrote: »

prior to finishing second they had finished 3rd, 3rd and 4th in previous seasons, in fact year before they finished second they only lost 4 games all season

you can't keep making excuses for woy, fact remains liverpool have 4 players who made the dutch/spanish world cup squads, they have the england captain, england first choice right-back, the danish captain and vice captain, joe cole a player lauded by pundits, they should clearly have enough to finish top 8

But what exactly is significant about finishing in the top 8?

Dublin_Gunner wrote: »

As much as some are saying tonight's defeat isn't that much of a problem in the grand scheme of things, I'd have to disagree.

We had a strong enough team out, and lost to a Div 2 team.

Its fcuking shocking TBH.

This was a cup we could have done with a decent run in, and we blew it against a shocking 2nd Div team, who finished with fcuking 39% possession AT ANFIELD.

I'm disgusted. With every single player on that Anfield turf in a Red short tonight.

4 shots on target in 90 mins is just a disgrace for a Liverpool team.

Utterly disgusted.

While I think you (like many Liverpool fans) might be over-reacting just a bit, I think what tonight's game really shows up is the lack of any kind of squad depth at Liverpool. The first choice 11 is obviously pretty decent, but some of the backup players are very ordinary. United could afford to field a team that was missing Van Der Sar, O'Shea, Vidic, Evra, Scholes, Giggs, Fletcher, Rooney and Berbatov (nearly the whole first team) and still spank a mid-table championship side. That's the big difference right now.

That's not an attempt to have a dig at Liverpool fans but just that it shows up the lack of depth at Anfield and (imho) the failings of Benitez. For all that he signed the odd Torres or Reina he recruited alot of mediocrity aswell. Some of these players are not really good enough to be playing for a club like Liverpool. That said, being out of the Carling Cup is hardly in itself anything to cry over.

Fromvert

Le King wrote: »

Major over-reactions. Obviously it's a terrible result, but the reactions are as if Liverpool had their full team out and are facing relegation. The result was terrible. I didn't see the game myself, but I think Hodgson's team selection was definitely uninspiring, Northampton were obviously going to be up for it. A lot of these Liverpool players have large expectations hanging over their shoulders. This was probably a big factor along with some probably not up for the game.


Most would of predicted Liverpool to batter them. Liverpool should of had enough to beat them, this is an embarrassing result for the club. Obviously the players should be ashamed, but maybe this will wake up a few people. A lot depends on the reaction from the group of players involved. I don't know how anybody played, but the players pushing for the first team will definitely have to go out and prove their not as bad as that result. Uninspiring? Yes. Terrible result? Yes. End of the world reactions? No.


It adds to Hodgon's pressure, but he is experienced enough to deal with the crap that will be spouted in the media tomorrow about the team.

How experienced is he though? Yes he's been around years but what sort of top level experience has he got. A few months at Inter, a year at Blackburn, three years at Fulham. Not inspiring to be honest.

LuckyLloyd

rossie1977 wrote: »

prior to finishing second they had finished 3rd, 3rd and 4th in previous seasons, in fact year before they finished second they only lost 4 games all season

you can't keep making excuses for woy, fact remains liverpool have 4 players who made the dutch/spanish world cup squads, they have the england captain, england first choice right-back, the danish captain and vice captain, joe cole a player lauded by pundits, they should clearly have enough to finish top 8

Worth repeating. The majority of players in the current squad got Liverpool's record points total two years ago. We were told constantly that Rafa's bizarre tactics and man management etc were to blame for their underperformance last season - that the dressing room was lost.

Now Hodgson is here, and we're playing a fair bit worse.

LuckyLloyd

Fromvert wrote: »

How experienced is he though? Yes he's been around years but what sort of top level experience has he got. A few months at Inter, a year at Blackburn, three years at Fulham. Not inspiring to be honest.

It's a media myth that Hodgson is experienced. His longest period in a job was five years from 1985 - 1990. He has bounced around different places for an average tenure of 18 months or so. The biggest jobs on his CV would be Inter Milan, Switzerland, Finland, Fulham and Blackburn. Inter was the only job that compared to this. He wasn't there for a long time, and it was over a decade ago. He has experience, but not at this type of job.

For me, he is a manager who has never had to build a club and squad from its roots up. His positives are supposed to be parachuting in somewhere, making and immediate impact, and getting things solid before he ships on to the next gig. He has a paucity of experience at building a club up over a medium to long term period. As such, if things aren't going right from the get go, I have to wonder what we are going to get out of him. There is little in his record to base claims that he will achieve some wonderful things down the line. I can't imagine how someone with his CV could visualise plans three seasons down the line.

Mister men

Disgraceful result no matter what way you look at it. The lack of investment over the last few years combined with a sub standard manager is alway's going to equal trouble.:(

Chardee MacDennis

aidan24326 wrote:

While I think you (like many Liverpool fans) might be over-reacting just a bit, I think what tonight's game really shows up is the lack of any kind of squad depth at Liverpool. The first choice 11 is obviously pretty decent, but some of the backup players are very ordinary. United could afford to field a team that was missing Van Der Sar, O'Shea, Vidic, Evra, Scholes, Giggs, Fletcher, Rooney and Berbatov (nearly the whole first team) and still spank a mid-table championship side. That's the big difference right now.

That's not an attempt to have a dig at Liverpool fans but just that it shows up the lack of depth at Anfield and (imho) the failings of Benitez. For all that he signed the odd Torres or Reina he recruited alot of mediocrity aswell. Some of these players are not really good enough to be playing for a club like Liverpool. That said, being out of the Carling Cup is hardly in itself anything to cry over.

this is gas, that side put out tonight was more than good enough on paper to beat a league 2 side - players didn't perform simple as...

whatawaster

The under 18s could have beaten northampton. Probably would have too

Mister men

This is the team Rafa picked for Leeds away last year:

Cavalieri, Dossena, Kyrgiakos, Carragher, Degen, Aurelio, Mascherano, Spearing, Riera, Babel, Ngog

How is tonights result a direct result of Rafa's time at the club? Anyone? Someone explain it for me.

Using Rafa as an excuse for the loss is absolutely boll*cks. Hodgson picked the team, and HIS team got stuffed all game.

I'm finding it difficult to put my "Trust in Roy", he really is taking the piss.

Handsome Bob

NickDrake wrote: »

What about your position in the league? 5points?

I've never seen a team have a tougher start than we've had this season in fairness. Man U and Man City away, Arsenal at home and B'Ham away. Any team would have struggled with that.

aidan24326

BastardPrince wrote: »

this is gas, that side put out tonight was more than good enough on paper to beat a league 2 side - players didn't perform simple as...

Call it gas all you like, but the team that Hodgson picked contained 8 established members of the first team squad. This was not a bunch of rookies from the youth setup, yet they lost to the mighty Northampton. Now sure enough any team can have an off-day and these kind of shock results happen from time to time. Not the end of the world. But looking at Liverpool's teamsheet, considering that's the back-up that's available it was hardly inspiring now was it? That some of the fringe players aren't good enough has been borne out in premier league games too, not just last night. That's all I was saying, that I don't think the squad overall is very good outside of the first-choice 11 or so.

dfx-

Mister men wrote: »

This is the team Rafa picked for Leeds away last year:

Cavalieri, Dossena, Kyrgiakos, Carragher, Degen, Aurelio, Mascherano, Spearing, Riera, Babel, Ngog

How is tonights result a direct result of Rafa's time at the club? Anyone? Someone explain it for me.

Using Rafa as an excuse for the loss is absolutely boll*cks. Hodgson picked the team, and HIS team got stuffed all game.

I'm finding it difficult to put my "Trust in Roy", he really is taking the piss.

The cameras themselves were almost salivating at the prospect of an 'upset' at Elland Road too....nowhere to be seen last night, not even an online stream..

The Muppet

LuckyLloyd wrote: »

It's a media myth that Hodgson is experienced. His longest period in a job was five years from 1985 - 1990. He has bounced around different places for an average tenure of 18 months or so. The biggest jobs on his CV would be Inter Milan, Switzerland, Finland, Fulham and Blackburn. Inter was the only job that compared to this. He wasn't there for a long time, and it was over a decade ago. He has experience, but not at this type of job.

For me, he is a manager who has never had to build a club and squad from its roots up. His positives are supposed to be parachuting in somewhere, making and immediate impact, and getting things solid before he ships on to the next gig. He has a paucity of experience at building a club up over a medium to long term period. As such, if things aren't going right from the get go, I have to wonder what we are going to get out of him. There is little in his record to base claims that he will achieve some wonderful things down the line. I can't imagine how someone with his CV could visualise plans three seasons down the line.

Why should he have to build a squad from the roots up ?According to yourself he is replacing a successful manager surely all he need is a little tweeking.

That's assumining you actually believe the comment you made earlier about the success of his predecessor which of course you don't .

Le King

LuckyLloyd wrote: »

It's a media myth that Hodgson is experienced. His longest period in a job was five years from 1985 - 1990. He has bounced around different places for an average tenure of 18 months or so. The biggest jobs on his CV would be Inter Milan, Switzerland, Finland, Fulham and Blackburn. Inter was the only job that compared to this. He wasn't there for a long time, and it was over a decade ago. He has experience, but not at this type of job.

For me, he is a manager who has never had to build a club and squad from its roots up. His positives are supposed to be parachuting in somewhere, making and immediate impact, and getting things solid before he ships on to the next gig. He has a paucity of experience at building a club up over a medium to long term period. As such, if things aren't going right from the get go, I have to wonder what we are going to get out of him. There is little in his record to base claims that he will achieve some wonderful things down the line. I can't imagine how someone with his CV could visualise plans three seasons down the line.

He has been involved in management for 30 odd years now. What I meant was through his experience, lifting players mentally, he should know how to lift players from this.

He is a short term manager. But this will clearly be his last big job so I wonder how is Liverpool career will pan out.

Mr Alan

The Muppet wrote: »

Why should he have to build a squad from the roots up ?According to yourself he is replacing a successful manager surely all he need is a little tweeking.

That's assumining you actually believe the comment you made earlier about the success of his predecessor which of course you don't .

Why do you post like such a cunt in any thread relating to Liverpool? Seriously?

stumpypeeps

Rafa Benitez has left Liverpool with as poor a squad of players as Gerard Houllier, perhaps worse. Thats a fact Mr. Alan.

Our Premiership charge was built on Xabi Alonso.

No Xabi Alonso, Liverpool are suddenly a 7th place team. Thats my realisation of the past few weeks.

Roy Hodgson may not be the answer, the problem lies with the dross Benitez left behind him.

Mr Alan

stumpypeeps wrote: »

Roy Hodgson may not be the answer, the problem lies with the dross Benitez left behind him.

Would I find posts from you saying last season that our squad was good enough, or very nearly good enough & that Benitez just couldn't get the best out of them cause they didn't believe in him anymore if I looked?

I think (in fact, I know) I would.

stumpypeeps

Mr Alan wrote: »

Would I find posts from you saying last season that our squad was good enough, or very nearly good enough & that Benitez just couldn't get the best out of them cause they didn't believe in him anymore if I looked?

I think (in fact, I know) I would.

No you won't. Search all you like. I said when Benitez left that I was seriously worried about the players that remained. If you break it down, player by player, only Torres, Reina and perhaps Agger, Skrtel at a push are of sufficient quality. After 6 years, thats horrendous.

Mr Alan

stumpypeeps wrote: »

No you won't. Search all you like. I said when Benitez left that I was seriously worried about the players that remained. If you break it down, player by player, only Torres, Reina and perhaps Agger, Skrtel at a push are of sufficient quality. After 6 years, thats horrendous.

Are you ****ing joking?

stumpypeeps

Mr Alan wrote: »

Are you ****ing joking?

Not really. I've had a serious dose of realism.

Gerrard and Torres have shouldered the burden for so long, when they don't perform, we look as ordinary a side as Blackburn.

CSF

stumpypeeps wrote: »

Not really. I've had a serious dose of realism.

Seriously, do you have the digits of the lad who is giving you that dose?

stumpypeeps

CSF wrote: »

Seriously, do you have the digits of the lad who is giving you that dose?

I do, its your da.:p

Mr Alan

stumpypeeps wrote: »

Not really. I've had a serious dose of realism.

Ok, let let me help you a bit here, the following players who were at the club when Rafa left we KNOW beyond any doubt are good enough for a title challenge in the premier league....

Reina
Carra
Johnson
Agger
Skrtel
Insua
Kuyt
Mascherano
Lucas
Gerrard
Yossi
Babel
Torres

Then we have the likes of Maxi, Aquilani, Soto who have come in since, who I think are all good to be involved in a title challenging team.

In reality the team we were left with needed 2 or 3 astute signings to be good enough to challenge for the league. However, the last couple of transfer windows our team has been weakened, i'd imagine it'll be the same for the next couple as well.

stumpypeeps

Mr Alan wrote: »

Ok, let let me help you a bit here, the following players who were at the club when Rafa left we KNOW beyond any doubt are good enough for a title challenge in the premier league....

Reina
Carra
Johnson
Agger
Skrtel
Insua
Kuyt
Mascherano
Lucas
Gerrard
Yossi
Babel
Torres

Then we have the likes of Maxi, Aquilani, Soto who have come in since, who I think are all good to be involved in a title challenging team.

In reality the team we were left with needed 2 or 3 astute signings to be good enough to challenge for the league. However, the last couple of transfer windows our team has been weakened, i'd imagine it'll be the same for the next couple as well.

I didn't include Gerrard and Carragher because they were already here. Outside of that, Yossi left because of Rafa. Thats a fact, I can get you quotes. Mascherano was always going to leave. Sorry to say but Insua, Babel, Lucas, Kuyt and perhaps even Johnson are not good enough for Liverpool. Likewise Maxi, Soto, Aquilani.

That title challenging season seemed more overperformance than a realistic position. Credit to Benitez, he managed to get the ordinary to perform extraordinarily. Last season he lost that touch.

Peyton Manning

stumpypeeps wrote: »

I didn't include Gerrard and Carragher because they were already here. Outside of that, Yossi left because of Rafa. Thats a fact, I can get you quotes. Mascherano was always going to leave. Sorry to say but Insua, Babel, Lucas, Kuyt and perhaps even Johnson are not good enough for Liverpool. Likewise Maxi, Soto, Aquilani.

That title challenging season seemed more overperformance than a realistic position. Credit to Benitez, he managed to get the ordinary to perform extraordinarily. Last season he lost that touch.

Whatever about the others, to say Kuyt isn't good enough is ignorant at best, downright ludicrous at worst. He's come on leaps and bounds since he arrived, and has done nothing but get better and better. If that's how you reward the players who actually perform and deliver for your team, then your support of the club is pretty pathetic.

stumpypeeps

Archimedes wrote: »

Whatever about the others, to say Kuyt isn't good enough is ignorant at best, downright ludicrous at worst. He's come on leaps and bounds since he arrived, and has done nothing but get better and better. If that's how you reward the players who actually perform and deliver for your team, then your support of the club is pretty pathetic.

I would never question Kuyt's workrate, application and effort.Is he the standard of right midfield player that we need. I don't think so.

My support of the club is unquestionable. I'm not a player fans club.

Peyton Manning

stumpypeeps wrote: »

I would never question Kuyt's workrate, application and effort.Is he the standard of right midfield player that we need. I don't think so.

My support of the club is unquestionable. I'm not a player fans club.

Kuyt is a world cup finalist who has been consistently one of your best players over the past 2 - 3 years, yet you don't rate him and obviously hold a grdge against him because of his ties to a former manager you have a vendetta against and you blame your current predicament on. Your support is very much questionable.

Wolfe Tone

All I have to say is that I am enjoying Liverpools seeming slide into mid table mediocrity.


Oh how I lol'd when I heard about this result. lol

LuckyLloyd

stumpypeeps wrote: »

I would never question Kuyt's workrate, application and effort.Is he the standard of right midfield player that we need. I don't think so.

Did you watch the World Cup?

stumpypeeps

Archimedes wrote: »

Kuyt is a world cup finalist who has been consistently one of your best players over the past 2 - 3 years, yet you don't rate him and obviously hold a grdge against him because of his ties to a former manager you have a vendetta against and you blame your current predicament on. Your support is very much questionable.

My support is questionable because I don't think Kuyt is the standard of player that will help us achieve success?

I have no vendetta against Benitez, he performed miracles at the club with the playing staff he had. I question the standard of player he has left behind. Kuyt aside, do you think our squad is of sufficient standard to finish top four?

Peyton Manning

stumpypeeps wrote: »

My support is questionable because I don't think Kuyt is the standard of player that will help us achieve success?

I have no vendetta against Benitez, he performed miracles at the club with the playing staff he had. I question the standard of player he has left behind. Kuyt aside, do you think our squad is of sufficient standard to finish top four?

I think Kuyt is exactly the type of player who will help you achieve success, i.e. one that actually looks like he gives a damn out on the pitch. You could do with a lot more Kuyts on your team. He gets plenty of goals, he gets plenty of assists, what more do you want? Some fancy stepovers and backheels? Perhaps his name should end in 'inho' before you rate him.

No I don't think your squad is good enough to finish in top four, but the only issue I raised with your post was your under rating of Kuyt.

stumpypeeps

Archimedes wrote: »

I think Kuyt is exactly the type of player who will you achieve success, i.e. one that actually looks like he gives a damn out on the pitch. He gets plenty of goals, he gets plenty of assists, what more do you want? Some fancy stepovers and backheels? Perhaps his name should end in 'inho' before you rate him.

No I don't think your squad is good enough to finish in top four, but the only issue I raised with your post was your under rating of Kuyt.

Patronising twaddle. I guess you didn't watch much of Kuyt last season.

And why nit pick one aspect of my post when you agree with the thrust of it.

The Muppet

Mr Alan wrote: »

Why do you post like such a cunt in any thread relating to Liverpool? Seriously?

Whats Up Al?

LuckyLloyd made a post earlier today praising the success of Rafa and had a little dig at me in the process, A few hours later he made a post saying Rafas successor is not suitable for the job because he doesn't have experience of building a team from the ground up.

Those two posts don't tally with each other do they? I was just pointing out that fact.

Mr Alan

stumpypeeps wrote: »

Yossi left because of Rafa. Thats a fact, I can get you quotes. Mascherano was always going to leave.

I can get you quotes that Mascherano was about to sign a new contract before Benitez left. You seem to put 100% faith in players quotes, yea?

stumpypeeps wrote:

Sorry to say but Insua, Babel, Lucas, Kuyt and perhaps even Johnson are not good enough for Liverpool. Likewise Maxi, Soto, Aquilani.

Johnson has played for Chelsea when going for the league & was wanted there again last season before coming to us.

Insua, Babel, Lucas & Kuyt all contributed massively to our league challenge the year before last. In fact in a lot of peoples opinion Kuyt was up there with Alonso as our best player that season.

stumpypeeps wrote:

That title challenging season seemed more overperformance than a realistic position. Credit to Benitez, he managed to get the ordinary to perform extraordinarily. Last season he lost that touch.

So we got rid of a manager who potentially had the ability to get the team to over perform to such an extent that a team full of ****e could come within a gee hair of winning the league? is that what you're saying? with a straight face?

just out of curiousity, do you think Roy could get a team full of such ****e to overperform in such a way?

Mr Alan

The Muppet wrote: »

Whats Up Al?

LuckyLloyd made a post earlier today praising the success of Rafa and had a little dig at me in the process, A few hours later he made a post saying Rafas successor is not suitable for the job because he doesn't have experience of building a team from the ground up.

Those two posts don't tally with each other do they?

Perhaps LL was pointing out that Roy seems intent on building from the ground up having sold a lot of players this summer & said only a couple of weeks ago that our squad was still way too big?

perhaps he was getting at the fact that some Liverpool fans are nearly refusing to judge Roy until he has his own players around him?

stumpypeeps

Mr Alan wrote: »

I can get you quotes that Mascherano was about to sign a new contract before Benitez left. You seem to put 100% faith in players quotes, yea?



Johnson has played for Chelsea when going for the league & was wanted there again last season before coming to us.

Insua, Babel, Lucas & Kuyt all contributed massively to our league challenge the year before last. In fact in a lot of peoples opinion Kuyt was up there with Alonso as our best player that season.



So we got rid of a manager who potentially had the ability to get the team to over perform to such an extent that a team full of ****e could come within a gee hair of winning the league? is that what you're saying? with a straight face?

just out of curiousity, do you think Roy could get a team full of such ****e to overperform in such a way?

Benitez left because the players lost faith.

I don't think it looks likely Hodgson will get the team to perform as well as Benitez did. Firstly, he's not as good a coach. Secondly he doesn't have Alonso. And thirdly he doesn't have Gerrard and Torres performing for him. Yet, I hasten to add. Hopefully things change.

The Muppet

Archimedes wrote: »

I think Kuyt is exactly the type of player who will help you achieve success, i.e. one that actually looks like he gives a damn out on the pitch. You could do with a lot more Kuyts on your team. He gets plenty of goals, he gets plenty of assists, what more do you want? Some fancy stepovers and backheels? Perhaps his name should end in 'inho' before you rate him.

No I don't think your squad is good enough to finish in top four, but the only issue I raised with your post was your under rating of Kuyt.

Kuyt's a headless chicken most of the time, He did have a good world cup playing on the left. I don't beleive he's consistantly good enough.

The Muppet

Mr Alan wrote: »

Perhaps LL was pointing out that Roy seems intent on building from the ground up having sold a lot of players this summer & said only a couple of weeks ago that our squad was still way too big?

perhaps he was getting at the fact that some Liverpool fans are nearly refusing to judge Roy until he has his own players around him?

He was talking rubbish in his initial comment, that's what he was doing.

Mr Alan

stumpypeeps wrote: »

Benitez left because the players lost faith.

Which players? Gerrard? he is playing exactly as he was last season? Torres? He's on the record as saying Benitez was very harshly treated & is full of admiration for Benitez? Mascherano? He may have been on the verge of signing a new contract, but has now left (after also trying to get a move to follow rafa). Kuyt? Rafas love child. Yossi? what does it matter he is gone now. Johnson? Doubt it, the man brought him to Liverpool & Johnson has been full of praise for him? Reina? On record as saying that Rafa shouldn't have been sacked.

Honestly, this "players don't believe in him anymore" thing has been proven to be absolute bull****.

SlickRic

we're not even talking about the match anymore, and it's stupid to have two threads talking about the soap opera that is Liverpool FC.

continue the discussions about Kuyt and Rafa's man-management skills (yay!) in the other thread if you like.