Contador Suspended

Murph100

Heh, I remember your posts that day Quigs, dont know how your keyboard survived the bashing

Its kind of ironic that Bertie gets into trouble after a TDF where he seemed to be clean and really suffering, as opposed to last years TDF where he had some ridiculous superhuman performances.

Quigs Snr wrote: »

That is interesting though isn't it. Far more damning in my eyes than the scientific results so far. It looks like it could be curtains for Bertie. Good, serves him right for not even having the decency to make it believeable in the 2009 tour during the TT.

C3PO

Don't know whether this link was posted before but the UCI seems to be shifting it's position a bit!

http://uk.eurosport.yahoo.com/02102010/58/small-amount-excuse-contador.html

mcgratheoin

RPL1 wrote: »

Don't know whether this link was posted before but the UCI seems to be shifting it's position a bit!

Sounds like the UCI are going to hang him out to dry so. Damage control after trying to keep it under wraps is what I get from that. It would seem as if nobody in the loop is particularly surprised - UCI, Chavanel etc.. and after the 2009 TT, nobody here is particularly surprised either.

Does anybody else find McQuaid a bit hypocritical when talking about Spain's doping problem though,

Pat McQuaid wrote:

The government needs to first of all recognise there is a problem and I don't know that they've actually recognised it as a problem.

drogdub

mcgratheoin wrote: »

Sounds like the UCI are going to hang him out to dry so. Damage control after trying to keep it under wraps is what I get from that. It would seem as if nobody in the loop is particularly surprised - UCI, Chavanel etc.. and after the 2009 TT, nobody here is particularly surprised either.

Does anybody else find McQuaid a bit hypocritical when talking about Spain's doping problem though,

Hypocritical or not its probably true

ednwireland

spanish finally cleaning up their doping controls ?

Margarita Fullana becomes fourth Spaniard to fail test

Fullana's test failure is another blow for Spanish cycling

Spanish cyclist Margarita Fullana has been provisionally suspended after testing positive for banned blood-booster erythropoietin (EPO).

out of competition test

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport2/hi/other_sports/cycling/9053979.stm

-Trek-

A little OT (sorry) but I'm writing a report about cycling as part of a college exercise at the moment and I have whole page dedicated to AC for his 3 wins in the tdF, now I have to write a bloody disclaimer at the end that it maybe only 2 times and he maybe getting an extended holiday, oh dear.

Edit: Better have a look at that page on LA while I'm at it, why? oh! why? did I pick cycling as a topic?

Chips Lovell

Pat McQuaid Ha Ha Ha

NickDrake

Anyone read the article in the Sunday Times by David Walsh??

Reporting that the same German journalist, read the Operation Puerto documents and stated the Contador was all over them and no doubt to the fact that he was involved. All his team were. Every one of them.

He called it the 'biggest swindle in sporting history'. One of the greatest cover ups. Stating Contador shouldn't even be in the pro ranks.

Great to see an independent report on the documents.

Very interesting indeed.

All I am doing is reporting the article for those who might be interested, before I get my head bitten off for going back to Operation Puerto. I think this is very relevant.

Murph100

McQuaid might yet get a hammering, about bloody time too !!

http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/contador-says-uci-told-him-to-stay-quiet-over-clenbuterol-affair

NickDrake

Murph100 wrote: »

McQuaid might yet get a hammering, about bloody time too !!

http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/contador-says-uci-told-him-to-stay-quiet-over-clenbuterol-affair

Should resign straight away. What is it with Irish people in positions of power. They never seem to know when its time to resign.

Chips Lovell

NickDrake wrote: »

All I am doing is reporting the article for those who might be interested, before I get my head bitten off for going back to Operation Puerto. I think this is very relevant.

Please stop misrepresenting other people's positions. If you continue along this line, I'll consider it trolling. Thanks.

dedon

<snip>

mcgratheoin

NickDrake wrote: »

Anyone read the article in the Sunday Times by David Walsh??

Is it online? - link please.

NickDrake

mcgratheoin wrote: »

Is it online? - link please.

I think you have to pay for Sunday Times online now. It is on back page of sports section anyway.

Murph100

... and Bertie fights back :


http://velonews.competitor.com/2010/10/news/alberto-contador-says-he-may-quit-cycling-if-banned-for-doping_144526

mcgratheoin

Contador in stating the obvious shock!

Alberto Contador says he may quit cycling if banned for doping

Does he think that anyone wants to see dopers returning to the sport?
Baffles me as to what sort of a response he's hoping for here - does he expect everyone to say "Oh that's alright Bertie, your such a big star we'll ignore the cheating if you promise to keep playing and not take your ball home"

Chips Lovell

mcgratheoin wrote: »

Is it online? - link please.

Sunday Times is subscriber only these days.

I read it this morning. Walsh sums up what's come out about Contador to date, from the fact that his former team Liberty Seguros was implicated in Puerto and that he was named in the documents, to the fact that Astana wasn't invited to the Tour in 2008 because of its doping record.

He said that Contador's explanation about contaminated meat would be difficult to prove, especially seen as how he hasn't been able to say where the meat came from yet despite knowing about the positive since August 24 and claiming the meat was brought especially from Spain.

Walsh said that Rasmus Damsgaard thought a contaminated transfusion was likely and then mentioned that the new tests for plastics could prove if one took place.

Junior

el tonto wrote: »

Sunday Times is subscriber only these days.

I read it this morning. Walsh sums up what's come out about Contador to date, from the fact that his former team Liberty Seguros was implicated in Puerto and that he was named in the documents, to the fact that Astana wasn't invited to the Tour in 2008 because of its doping record.

He said that Contador's explanation about contaminated meat would be difficult to prove, especially seen as how he hasn't been able to say where the meat came from yet despite knowing about the positive since August 24 and claiming the meat was brought especially from Spain.

Walsh said that Rasmus Damsgaard thought a contaminated transfusion was likely and then mentioned that the new tests for plastics could prove if one took place.

So basically nothing like what Nick said the report was ?

petethedrummer

NickDrake wrote: »

Stating Contador shouldn't even be in the pro ranks.

It doesn't state that. It doesn't even infer it.

Murph100

Lads, seriously... get a room !

Half this thread has consisted of tiresome bickering, couldn't give a rats arse at this stage who is responsible, I just dont want to hit 'Ignore' as the rest of this thread has been very interesting.

Handbags at dawn can be arranged if you guys still want to slug it out :rolleyes:

leftism

Quigs Snr wrote: »

Serves him right for not even having the decency to make it believeable in the 2009 tour during the TT.

So true! That was such a joke of a stage. A bit like the infamous Landis stage where he just rode away from the entire peleton. Watching as a spectator you kind of wonder what goes through their heads at times like that. Surely if they had any sense, they'd back off a bit and make it look half human...

Like at some point would the director sportif not have a little word in their earpiece and say "I think you might want to slow down now... Its starting to look a bit ridiculous"

Chips Lovell

I suppose it depends on who your directeur sportif is.

levitronix

leftism wrote: »

So true! That was such a joke of a stage. A bit like the infamous Landis stage where he just rode away from the entire peleton. Watching as a spectator you kind of wonder what goes through their heads at times like that. Surely if they had any sense, they'd back off a bit and make it look half human...

Like at some point would the director sportif not have a little word in their earpiece and say "I think you might want to slow down now... Its starting to look a bit ridiculous"

They said that ricardo rico used to make mo-ped noises as a joke when he'd kick on a hill and pull away, i cant imagaine someone dopping slowing down

Morrisseeee

Contadoper




/...hope it hasn't already been posted

NickDrake

Junior wrote: »

So basically nothing like what Nick said the report was ?

Nothing like?? Exactly where is it 'nothing' like it?? Did you read the article?

It is pretty much bang on if you read it again. Expect bit which I have stated in the post below there now. My quotes are exactly from the article

I have done nothing wrong here.

I don't want this to go on and on. Can we leave it please

NickDrake

petethedrummer wrote: »

It doesn't state that. It doesn't even infer it.

Sorry got that bit wrong. Everything else is ok. the German does mention the fact that he should have been banned for OP though.

petethedrummer

NickDrake wrote: »

Sorry got that bit wrong. Everything else is ok. the German does mention the fact that he should have been banned for OP though.

I only bring it up because I was excited to read that bit. To find out he was very average and only a pro due to lorry loads of dope intrigued me muchly.

I hope those Operacion Puerto docs get leaked sometime. Surely someone took some photocopies.

RobFowl

petethedrummer wrote: »

I hope those Operation Puerto docs get leaked sometime. Surely someone took some photocopies.

The documents are in the open domain. It's just that all the names used are coded. They are linked to individual bloods bags.
Brillo turned out to be Basso for example.
There was one labled AC as yet unidentified.......

TinyExplosions

RobFowl wrote: »

The documents are in the open domain. It's just that all the names used are coded. They are linked to individual bloods bags.
Brillo turned out to be Basso for example.
There was one labled AC as yet unidentified.......

Wouldnt' it be great if Lance had used the moniker AC...

Chips Lovell

NickDrake wrote: »

Nothing like?? Exactly where is it 'nothing' like it?? Did you read the article?

In fairness, you got some other stuff wrong too.

NickDrake wrote: »

Reporting that the same German journalist, read the Operation Puerto documents and stated the Contador was all over them and no doubt to the fact that he was involved. All his team were. Every one of them.

He didn't say this. It wasn't the German journalist (Hans Joachim Seppelt) who'd seen the Operation Puerto Documents. What Walsh said was that German molecular biologist and anti-doping campaigner Werner Franke had seen them and concluded Contador was involved. Franke made these allegations in 2007. In other words, it's nothing new.

Chips Lovell

RobFowl wrote: »

The documents are in the open domain. It's just that all the names used are coded. They are linked to individual bloods bags.
Brillo turned out to be Basso for example.
There was one labled AC as yet unidentified.......

Yep, I've seen PDFs of some of the documents already. They've been floating around the internet for a few years now.

One of the documents (Document 31) had a doping plan for Liberty Seguros. "AC" was put down to either get nothing or the same as Jorg Jaschke, who has since confessed he was doped up to the gills at Liberty Seguros.

NickDrake

el tonto wrote: »

Yep, I've seen PDFs of some of the documents already. They've been floating around the internet for a few years now.

One of the documents (Document 31) had a doping plan for Liberty Seguros. "AC" was put down to either get nothing or the same as Jorg Jaschke, who has since confessed he was doped up to the gills at Liberty Seguros.

How they couldn't get him from that I will never know. How obvious was it. Disgraceful really

Chips Lovell

NickDrake wrote: »

How they couldn't get him from that I will never know. How obvious was it. Disgraceful really

Operation Puerto was a police investigation. At the time, doping wasn't a crime in Spain. The authorities tried to prosecute the doctors and team managers instead with the crime of "endangering public health". They couldn't make it stick, so the investigation was dropped. The riders were never going to be investigated, only called for evidence.

Riders could have been suspended if the judge had handed the evidence over to the cycling authorities, but he refused to, because it was deemed illegal to give evidence collected by the police to a private organisation.

Junior

My thoughts on the matter eventually what's the beef

JacksonHeightsOwn

el tonto wrote: »

Operation Puerto was a police investigation. At the time, doping wasn't a crime in Spain. The authorities tried to prosecute the doctors and team managers instead with the crime of "endangering public health". They couldn't make it stick, so the investigation was dropped. The riders were never going to be investigated, only called for evidence.

Riders could have been suspended if the judge had handed the evidence over to the cycling authorities, but he refused to, because it was deemed illegal to give evidence collected by the police to a private organisation.

A we'd bit off topic, but wasnt there a shed load of other athletes from other sports involved with Puerto?

I'm guessing footballers, they're just too big to take down

So what's Contadors chances of pinning this one on a dodgy steak then? Surely he can't get away with it

Planet X

Snooker players also!


http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/sport/76376.stm

Beasty

I am sure we can all find examples of doping from most sports - this is the cycling forum, so let's stick to cycling - Puerto is relevant and on-topic - snooker is not (particularly as the drugs used in that sport are typically aimed at slowing you down!)

Thanks

Beasty

Pherekydes

Planet X wrote: »

Snooker players also!


http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/sport/76376.stm

Jeez, that's from 1998!

And why is it on the BBC's sport website? :pac:

Diarmuid

Check out the RealPeleton podcast this week. Very good.

tunney

http://msn.foxsports.com/cycling/story/Urine-sample-shows-Tour-de-France-champ-Alberto-Contador-doped-100410

Think this was already posted but sure what harm. Flithy as your ma.

Chips Lovell

Here's the original New York Times piece:

A test performed on at least one of Contador’s urine samples from the Tour revealed levels of that chemical eight times higher than the minimum amount that signifies doping, according to a person with knowledge of the test results.

The test to detect plasticizers from IV bags has been around for more than a year in antidoping, but is not yet validated for use, so an athlete could easily question its validity in court. Still, the test could be used in conjunction with other facts to build a doping case, antidoping experts said.

“Even without a validated test, it could be looked at in a case-by-case basis,” Francesco Botré, the chief of the World Anti-Doping Agency-accredited laboratory in Rome, said. “If someone has a very, very high level of plasticizers in the urine, it would be hard for that athlete to explain how that happened if not for doping. If the level is lower, it obviously would make it much harder, but it would still be possible to prove.”

Vélo

tunney wrote: »

Flithy as your ma.

That's just lovely!:)

Chips Lovell

Actually, the NYT also points out one potential hitch. The positive for plasticizers came a day before the one for Clenbuterol.

manwithaplan

I predict a defence based on the steak having been shrink wrapped.

niceonetom

manwithaplan wrote: »

I predict a defence based on the steak having been shrink wrapped.

Hey! That was MINE about 130 posts ago.

manwithaplan

Bugger!

ednwireland

loved this from cycling weekly
http://www.cyclingweekly.co.uk/news/latest/501965/alberto-contador-the-clenbuterol-the-beef-excuse-and-the-traces-of-plastic.html

So what happens now? If the letter of the law were to be applied, Contador would be suspended for two years. He could appeal and if his "meat excuse" stood up at the Court of Arbitration for Sport his ban might be reduced.

But the damage is done. In the eyes of the world, the three-time Tour de France has tested positive for drugs and that is that.

It was the beef, it was the Jack Daniels and beers, it was the pressure from team management, the drugs were for my dog, my mother-in-law, it's a witch-hunt, it's a mistake. It's all very tiring.

i'm starting to feel the same

Lumen

I don't really understand why the UCI doesn't just delegate all doping issues to WADA. There is no way for the UCI to get involved that doesn't constitute some sort of conflict of interest.

manwithaplan

This may seem like a very basic question but do WADA actually conduct testing in any sport? They obviously produce guidelines, codes of practice, approved tests, research, publicity etc. but would they even be prepared to take over a testing programme in any particular sport?

Chips Lovell

Research paper on plasticizer presence from transfusions. This bit is interesting:

DEHP is released from a variety of PVC products (food contamination, food packaging, plastic toys, furniture, automobiles, etc.) and from PVC medical devices. The common exposure in our environment has been evaluated with subjects of the control group. The results for urinary DEHP metabolites in these subjects are in accordance with published data, where the concentrations of DEHP metabolites were all below 50 ng/mL in subjects not occupationally exposed to phthalates. Recent studies also reflect a steady decrease over recent years of the common exposure to phthalates and this fact further supports that high unexpected concentrations of DEHP metabolites can be easily detected compared with usual urinary background.

The exposure due to medical treatments with PVC devices different from blood transfusions has been evaluated with the nontransfused patients group. DEHP metabolite concentrations for these subjects were not significantly different from those obtained in the control group.