Where do people buy their models????

Kashkai

I've bought my planes from an online store in the UK that has provided excellent service to date, i.e. order today, get it 2 days later.

I was looking at some much larger models being flown in the Curragh and the Phoenix Park over the weekend. These were nitro powered with at least 5ft wingspans. Where would you buy one of these? Any place I've checked online only sell foamies, which are perfectly good planes for beginners up to advanced pilots btw, in my opinion anyways. However, I would like to advance to a large scale aircraft at some point.

T-Maxx

I buy most of my stuff from Tower Hobbies in the States. There prices are very competitive, they have a huge range and they have a very good website. Delivery is not cheap, but always very prompt. They constantly have a discount coupon scheme going as well with very decent discounts.

Cookie_Monster

ehattons
Marks Models
Belfast model shop

are the main ones

coolwings

I've used Green Hobby & Model, Slough, and Midland Helis for most items last few years.

The Doktor

Try www.century-rc.com its in hong kong, but the prices for kits (mainly helis) and radios is just so cheap compared to uk and even the usa.
Ive ordered a good bit from them and have had no issues at all, and never been hit by customs and usually get my stuff in 3-4 days.
Though generally parts are the same price in the uk.

eg, Futaba 8fg radio and reciever:
Tower. €350
sussex model center €461
midland helicopters €438
century €286

I know postage is more than from the uk, but still just doesnt compare. Also anything ive ever ordered from tower ive been got by customs.

Bruthal

I used this site before

http://www.sussex-model-centre.co.uk


Here is an example of a petrol engine type plane, a lot cheaper on fuel than nitro. Although Nitro is what i always used before electric power.
But i`l go for petrol myself when start back at the IC aircraft.
http://www.sussex-model-centre.co.uk/shopexd.asp?id=22197

Another site here
http://www.elitemodelsonline.co.uk/

And another IC petrol engine example.
http://www.elitemodelsonline.co.uk/Products/Aircraft/IC-Aircraft/Sport/5347-/5500914-CMPRO-EDGE-540T-2000mm-ARTF-CMP-065

Kashkai

Many thanks for the replies guys.

I've just bought my 3rd plane, a T28 Trojan which will be a big step up from my other planes, a supercub and a Radian glider, as the Trojan has ailerons and a more powerful engine and thus I will be getting into more and more aerobatics from now on.

However, one day I hope to be proficient enough to progress to a large scale model which will probably be IC for a decent power to weight ratio, though with advances in Lipo technology, perhaps electric power will have advanced enough to remain on the "green" side of the debate.

If you haven't guessed by now, I was very impressed at the flying characteristics of the large scale planes in the Curragh and Phoenix Park last weekend. One guy had a low wing trainer that could climb vertically up to about 300 feet before it stalled, (or he deliberately stalled it?) before doing manouvers that would not be possible in an electric powered plane. The speed was incredible as well.

Once you get addicted to this hobby, you just can't walk away!!!:D

Bruthal

Prosperous Dave wrote: »

Many thanks for the replies guys.

I've just bought my 3rd plane, a T28 Trojan which will be a big step up from my other planes, a supercub and a Radian glider, as the Trojan has ailerons and a more powerful engine and thus I will be getting into more and more aerobatics from now on.

However, one day I hope to be proficient enough to progress to a large scale model which will probably be IC for a decent power to weight ratio, though with advances in Lipo technology, perhaps electric power will have advanced enough to remain on the "green" side of the debate.

If you haven't guessed by now, I was very impressed at the flying characteristics of the large scale planes in the Curragh and Phoenix Park last weekend. One guy had a low wing trainer that could climb vertically up to about 300 feet before it stalled, (or he deliberately stalled it?) before doing manouvers that would not be possible in an electric powered plane. The speed was incredible as well.

Once you get addicted to this hobby, you just can't walk away!!!:D

You`d be surprised how powerful the electric planes can be, id say the electric motors are as powerful as the equivalent nitro or petrol ones, its just its easier to fill up with fuel than to charge batteries, and with fuel you will get the same power through the flight but with lipo`s it tails off a little, and fuel means longer flights especially on bigger aircraft

I have a trex 600 electric heli and its very powerful and able to perform any manouvers the nitro one could.
The moves described above would be possible with electric planes alright,

You will find the bigger planes easier to fly than smaller ones as well, more stable and easier to see, but while they fly more realistically when bigger, they tend to crash more realistically too.

Last time i flew my p51 mustang last summer it seemed like a rocket compared to sons radian, but was still easy enough for son to fly it around having only flew the radian before, but starting off with a nitro one it may be a good idea for someone experienced to trim it out for you if you get into faster ones. Is your radian still going?
Straight from the radian you should have no trouble flying most planes,
but someone to help with new one is a good idea.

Here is an electric one, it was a 50cc petrol one converted to electric,,, at 2.15 it prop hangs so it could continue straight up from take off out of sight or near enough. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7VLy0n797s0&feature=related

Bruthal

Prosperous Dave wrote: »

Once you get addicted to this hobby, you just can't walk away!!!:D

Its great alright, im going the opposite way to you, started with the powerful nitro planes and now onto the foam gliders, a cularis going now, but will probably go for a pertol plane during next year,

Did you ever get another battery for that first one out of your radian?

coolwings

Dave: those guys you see at the club are flying their fast nitro planes at a power level of 200-250 watts per kilo of model, and the aerobatic 3D vertical climbing/hovering models are at 350 W/Kg. It's simply a matter of getting the right electric for the plane.

The FAI and F3A pattern aerobatic championships are flown at about 450 W/Kg. Five years ago these competition models used to be all 4-stroke glowfuel engines running on high % nitro fuel because 4-stroke has a better throttle curve to 2-stroke.
But the competition models are now electric since electric has a superior torque/power/throttle curve to 4-stroke.

If you just want to fly well I recommend staying electric and moving up, and not getting into oil, with engine tuning and cutouts.

But if what you want most is to try out glowfuel flying next, then only a nitro engine model can do that of course.

Bruthal

Why not try a 25cc petrol size plane though, 5 euro a gallon for fuel, nitro must be 30 a gallon now,
Although nothing wrong with the electric flight, i was thinking of converting the p51 i have to electric as well.

coolwings

If you want quarter scale or bigger models, gasoline makes good sense. But as the fuel gets cheaper the model gets bigger/more costly/more cumbersome.

For the middle sizes, remember a 120-140 glow engine needs NO nitro in the fuel, ie straight fuel, so the tank may be big, but the glowfuel inside it is cheaper than most think, and no spark ignition, lighter engine

The size criteria is a good basis for decision on this.

Fact is big batteries are expensive so large electrics are not logical, and the bigger the engine size the more reliable gas becomes.
I know some people have converted small glow engines to gas, but in my opinion they are playing games and breaking a successful formula.
Having seen plenty of 18cc gassers with problems, I personally would not consider gas under 23cc, better still 26cc. So my take would be gas 26cc to 100cc. Straight glowfuel from 15cc to 20cc. And 5-10% nitro glowfuel from 8 -15cc.
Under 8cc (a .50 engine) I would always prefer electric.

Bruthal

coolwings wrote: »

If you want quarter scale or bigger models, gasoline makes good sense. But as the fuel gers cheaper the model gets bigger/more costly/more cumbersome.

For the middle sizes, remember a 120-140 glow engine needs NO nitro in the fuel, ie straight fuel, so the tank may be big, but the glowfuel inside it is cheaper than most think, and no spark ignition, lighter engine

The size criteria is a good basis for decision on this.
Fact is big batteries are expensive, and the bigger the engine size the more reliable gas becomes.
I know some people have converted small glow engines to gas, but in my opinion they are playing games and breaking a successful formula.
Having seen plenty of 18cc gassers with problems, I personally would not consider gas under 23cc, better still 26cc. So my take would be gas 26cc to 100cc. Straight glowfuel from 15cc to 20cc. And 5-10% nitro glowfuel from 8 -15cc.
Under 8cc (a .50 engine) I would always prefer electric.

Yes id agree with all that. (a miracle your thinking):), i have flown my p51 with no nitro in the glow fuel and it runs quite well, better with the nitro alright, and its a 0.61 i think, it could be 0.70 or so as i think the recommended size was 0.61 and i usually put next size up into it.

A nitro 2 stroke is more powerful than petrol one as well of equal displacement. But not much point in anything under 25cc alright.

How much is a gallon of 5% and 0% nitro now?

coolwings

The interesting mixes are between 12 and 21 a gallon, assuming synthetic oil and imperial gallon .....

The lower cost comes from straight fuel (no nitro) and low % synthetic oil.
If you use less nitro, you don't need so much oil to lube and cool so both go down together.
A 1.35 high compression engine would go nicely on straight with 4% oil, maybe in winter switch to 2-3% nitro and 6-9% oil for same tuning reliability as summer.
The synthetic and nitro are the two most expensive ingredients. So eg 4.55 litre gallon of 0% nitro straight with 2-4% oil was between 12 and 13 the last time I had one in my hand, but you have to realise not many modellers have it figured out well enough to try that. Most just want bog standard 5% or 10% nitro castor oil based fuel because its standard and cheaper than synthetic. Nothing beats synthetic for 4-strokes however.

coolwings

Interesting to see Supertigre have evolved their fuel recommendations :

Once your BIG SuperTigre has a gallon or two of regular fuel run through it, you can use one of the so-called "SuperTigre", "ST" or "Super-T" fuels, which have 10%-12% oil content. Keep Nitro 10% or lower for best operation

Mick Wilshere of World Engines in the UK who knew his stuff right well always shouted from the rooftops to USE NO NITRO in his big ST engines! Learning to tune is optional nowadays I guess!

Kashkai

Plenty of food (or fuel:D) for thought there!.

I started off with a Radian Glider and aside from one mishap, I became quite competent flying her and then I turned her into a camera platform which added a whole new dimension to the flight as I could view the flight from the Rad's perspective later at home on the pc. However I had a narrow escape when I stupidly let the batteries in my tx run down and I lost the radio link to the Rad when she was way up high (I reckon about a 1,000 feet). She flew off into the sunset literally but I had teh presence of mind (despite a sick feeling in my gut) to follow her progress until I saw her go down about a mile and a half away. I spent over an hour searching the estimated crash site until I found her upside down in a field relatively undamaged. These foam models are pretty tough!

I then bought a Supercub for take off and throttle control practice but I've been pleasantly surprised at how she can carry off simple aerobatic manouvers and how well she handles.

So my next logical step is the T28 Trojan which is an aileron equipped bird. Haven't received it yet but hopefully it'll arrive next Monday.

I fly almost every day before work as the weather has been very kind lately and I love the feeling of making my plane dance in the sky. Its a great feeling pulling off loops, stall turns, spiral dives and smooth landings. Puts me in a good frame of mind before I'm chained to a desk for 8 hours.

So you can see that I've got it bad when it comes to getting my flight time fix. But while I think my Rad and Cub are great planes, they look like toys compared to the large scale models I saw flying last weekend. Thats where I want to end up at some point but I think I've still a lot to learn, but that'll be the fun part!!

I've ordered the Phoenix sim to practice on as the evenings (and mornings) are getting dark and no doubt the weather will disimprove thus limiting flighttime.

As for batteries, I'm buying mine from Hobbyking as they are about 1/3 the price of batteries sold in the UK.

Poly

I use my local builders providers and sign maker:D


http://www.spadtothebone.com/

Bruthal

Prosperous Dave wrote: »

But while I think my Rad and Cub are great planes, they look like toys compared to the large scale models I saw flying last weekend. Thats where I want to end up at some point but I think I've still a lot to learn, but that'll be the fun part!!

Depends how you look at it, as i said i started with the big powerful nitro`s in the 80`s and now fly the radian and cularis, i dont look at it as a step down, its a different type of flying. The radian may be slower than the fast p51 i have, but i find the p51 just as easy to fly, but would`t want to crash it though as it would be wrecked. While it seems a step up from the radian or cularis as its far faster, i just see it as a different flying style. You would`t end up laughing at someone turning up in 2 years time with their radian for advice when you have your large powerful IC plane now would you

I get all batteries from hobbyking the last 2 years. I had the small heli (trex 450) out with you that time when you got the radian, it had a hobbyking battery in it. Have 2 hobbyking battery`s for the cularis, and 4 for the trex 600. Great batteries for their prices.

One or 2 crashes of the bigger nitro planes can put a dent in the enthusiasm, but they will happen sometime, my best one, or most stupid at least was forgetting to put the airial back up on the radio after doing a range check, i got someone to carry the plane from the take off area as with a lot of other fliers around the plane needs to move away from all the radios to range test properly, but i forgot to put the aerial back up and the plane flew out of range and full throttle straight into the ground.

Bruthal

coolwings wrote: »

Interesting to see Supertigre have evolved their fuel recommendations :

Mick Wilshere of World Engines in the UK who knew his stuff right well always shouted from the rooftops to USE NO NITRO in his big ST engines! Learning to tune is optional nowadays I guess!

I had a supertigre 90 in my third plane and never used nitro in it. Seems like a long time ago now though, when an 89D car was new:)

A galaxy mystic it was. I think they are back out again.

Kashkai

Don't get me wrong, I think the Radian is a great plane, very relaxing to fly and she has the stamina to stay up high when all other battery powered planes have gone through 3 or 4 battery packs. I've kept the Radian up for over 50 minutes on one battery and I reckon it would have made the hour except my kids were bored at that stage so I had to land her.

The Cub is a well behaved plane but she can surprise you with how well she flies for a rudder/elevator aircraft. My new plane still hasn't showed up but as its blowing a gale today, I wouldn't have been able to fly her anyway.

Bruthal

Prosperous Dave wrote: »

Don't get me wrong, I think the Radian is a great plane, very relaxing to fly and she has the stamina to stay up high when all other battery powered planes have gone through 3 or 4 battery packs. I've kept the Radian up for over 50 minutes on one battery and I reckon it would have made the hour except my kids were bored at that stage so I had to land her.

The Cub is a well behaved plane but she can surprise you with how well she flies for a rudder/elevator aircraft. My new plane still hasn't showed up but as its blowing a gale today, I wouldn't have been able to fly her anyway.

I tried for the hour with radian myself, about 20 seconds short of the hour and battery all used, a week later 45 minute flight but blinded with no sun glasses on so had to land and only 25% of battery used, lots of thermals so easilly would of got hour and more,

I might get the p51 back flying in the park soon, the cularis is the current one now. p51 i have 10 years, its very fast and will almost go straight up continous, if i was to get another plane i might go for a petrol one, cheaper fuel. As c.wings says your heading into fairly big planes before you get to cheaper fuel. But i will try it i think. The longest flight i got from the p51 is about 17 or 18 minutes, the last few spent gliding down from a fair altitude, but its a different faster flying so 10 or 15 minutes is long enough per flight.

I would see the flying skill required to move from the radian to something like the p51 mustang as a step up alright, more so than the aircraft itself. It is obviously a better plane alright as well, but i would distinguish between a step up from a slower glider to fast powerful nitro planes and the step up in the pilot skill level needed from glider to fast nitro.

I had a fella out with me last summer and he was after learning to fly the radian. So i took the p51 out and he was able to fly it around using the buddy box setup straight from flying the radian. And I let him take it off as well and he managed that no bother. Landing i think is where the most tricky part is to learn on the nitro planes. What type of one will you try, i think you could bypass the high wing trainer ones at this stage.

Kashkai

This is the plane I have on order:

http://www.squadronleader.co.uk/product/T-28D_Trojan_%28RTF%29_PKZ5000xi

I went for this one because it has a DX6i tx in the box. I find it a bit of a pain having to rebind planes when swapping between my models. The DX6i has a 10 model memory so this should do me for some time to come.

The Trojan is supposed to be an excellent 4 channel plane with plenty of power for aerobatics. Like I said previously, I want to progress in this hobby but I don't want to go from a sedate plane like the Rad straight to a 1/4 scale i/c plane which will only end in tears .

I've also invested in the Phoenix flight sim. With the shortening days, flight time will become limited and this sim can be used ay any time by connecting the DX6i up to my pc. If I crash on the sim, I just press the reset button and I'm off again with no plane to fix first. This sim comes highly recommended so I'm looking forward to using it when my DX6i shows up that is.

Bruthal

Prosperous Dave wrote: »

This is the plane I have on order:

http://www.squadronleader.co.uk/product/T-28D_Trojan_%28RTF%29_PKZ5000xi

I went for this one because it has a DX6i tx in the box. I find it a bit of a pain having to rebind planes when swapping between my models. The DX6i has a 10 model memory so this should do me for some time to come.

The Trojan is supposed to be an excellent 4 channel plane with plenty of power for aerobatics. Like I said previously, I want to progress in this hobby but I don't want to go from a sedate plane like the Rad straight to a 1/4 scale i/c plane which will only end in tears .

I've also invested in the Phoenix flight sim. With the shortening days, flight time will become limited and this sim can be used ay any time by connecting the DX6i up to my pc. If I crash on the sim, I just press the reset button and I'm off again with no plane to fix first. This sim comes highly recommended so I'm looking forward to using it when my DX6i shows up that is.

Yes that looks a good setup, it was the DX7 i had with me the day we met up, but the DX6i will do just as good, i would of got that myself but i think the DX7 was out before it. The DX6 was first, but it was not full range.

I flew the parkzone p51 mustang a friend had got. It is the same size as the trojan, and it flew unbelievably smooth, so the trojan should be nice to fly. Your competent with your radian and cub so the trojan should be no bother. You just have to control the ailerons the whole time as it wont self level at all, but that makes them great to fly.

Kashkai

Thats one of the reasons I bought the simulator to practice on as it has the Trojan on it as one of the models (and the Cub and the Radian too!).

I'll take it easy with the Trojan once I get her into the air until I get the feel of her. Maybe I'm wrong, but I'll probably get away with not using the rudder for a while and just turning her with the ailerons.

All of my planes are from the Parkzone stable. The build quality is not 100% on them and I've had to carry out repairs to the planes like a rudder separating from the tail on my Radian and the battery box on the Cub coming loose from the fuze. None of this was as a result of crash damage, more like poor build quality. Are there any other manufacturers who have better quality control??? One guy recommended FMS as they do warbirds like P47's, P51's, Spitfire etc. That'll be the next step for me.

Bruthal

Prosperous Dave wrote: »

Thats one of the reasons I bought the simulator to practice on as it has the Trojan on it as one of the models (and the Cub and the Radian too!).

I'll take it easy with the Trojan once I get her into the air until I get the feel of her. Maybe I'm wrong, but I'll probably get away with not using the rudder for a while and just turning her with the ailerons.

All of my planes are from the Parkzone stable. The build quality is not 100% on them and I've had to carry out repairs to the planes like a rudder separating from the tail on my Radian and the battery box on the Cub coming loose from the fuze. None of this was as a result of crash damage, more like poor build quality. Are there any other manufacturers who have better quality control??? One guy recommended FMS as they do warbirds like P47's, P51's, Spitfire etc. That'll be the next step for me.

Im not sure really, never had any problems with sons radian and it has a lot of flights on it carrying camera gear and all, but we regularly check flight surfaces etc on all aircraft and and parts that are glued into foam planes i check when the planes are new. I get the thick cyano from hobbyking and use that for anything that has to be repaired. Used it to build the cularis as well.

Rc aircraft are the type of things i would`t just assume they are going to be perfect right out of the box even though they are supposed to be, a few of the ARTF planes i had had flaws in the build that i had to improve on, its the nature of them, the 4th or 5th landing on the p51 mustang i have sent the wheel strut up through the wing, and no hard landings, opened wing and hardly any glue used on the blockes holding the wheel strut.

As for the tail on the trojan, you wont need to use it in flight at all for normal flying really, as you bank with ailerons, the elevator turns it as well as keeping it from descending. Dont even have to think about it, just fly it the same as the radian or cub. Rudder is needed on the ground to steer though and to keep it straight for takeoff run.

The rudder is used a lot for some aerobatic moves alright, A stall turn for example is a nice use of it. And a nice easy one to do once your comfortable flying that plane.

Bruthal

Prosperous Dave wrote: »

This is the plane I have on order:

http://www.squadronleader.co.uk/product/T-28D_Trojan_%28RTF%29_PKZ5000xi

Might be tempted by that one myself for the young lad, he still just has the DX5e as well, so a plane and the DX6e might be a handy christmas thing.

Kashkai

Or you could get him a plug and play version so he could swap the AR500 receiver out of his Radian and put it into the Trojan and use his DX5 to control it.

http://www.squadronleader.co.uk/product/T-28D_Trojan_%28PNP%29_PKZ5075

That way you say £100 or €120. That would be enough to buy him a mini helicopter for use indoors.

I came across this crowd where I bought the Phoenix flight sim and a new battery charger from. They do a line in indoor helicopters as well as the bigger models:

http://www.fast-lad.co.uk/store/deal_of_week.php

This will work off a DX5 as well.

I ordered last Wednesday night and I received my order this morning. So thats pretty good service imo.

Bruthal

Prosperous Dave wrote: »

Or you could get him a plug and play version so he could swap the AR500 receiver out of his Radian and put it into the Trojan and use his DX5 to control it.

http://www.squadronleader.co.uk/product/T-28D_Trojan_%28PNP%29_PKZ5075

That way you say £100 or €120. That would be enough to buy him a mini helicopter for use indoors.

I came across this crowd where I bought the Phoenix flight sim and a new battery charger from. They do a line in indoor helicopters as well as the bigger models:

http://www.fast-lad.co.uk/store/deal_of_week.php

I ordered last Wednesday night and I received my order this morning.

No the idea is to get him the multi model memory radio, he will still be flying the radian, i got him an indoor helicopter last year, great crack it is, its one of the lama v3 ones, good challenge to fly it from room to room and up and down the stairs, tricky not to hit a wall or door frame. Its interesting flying the t-rex 600 then this little one a few minutes later in the house.

Yea i used fast lad before

Manic Moran

As much as possible, I've tried to support my local brick-and-mortar establishments. Though often times it does come out as slightly more expensive, I think the greater exposure to the hobby that a storefront causes to the general population and, quite frankly, the simple convenience of being able to drive to the shop to get that tin of paint which you've just realised you're missing for the job you had set aside time for that afternoon, both outweigh the extra 5% or whatever that you're be paying.

NTM

Bruthal

Manic Moran wrote: »

As much as possible, I've tried to support my local brick-and-mortar establishments. Though often times it does come out as slightly more expensive, I think the greater exposure to the hobby that a storefront causes to the general population and, quite frankly, the simple convenience of being able to drive to the shop to get that tin of paint which you've just realised you're missing for the job you had set aside time for that afternoon, both outweigh the extra 5% or whatever that you're be paying.

NTM

Yes but too many trips in to find shops dont have what you need even after calling ahead and being told they do have it, and also driving into grid lock traffic is not too convienient for some of us. Last example was when i was looking for profilm for a wing repair, and it was endless looking to find the red one i needed, then drove into city centre after being told they had it, they did`t though.
I do like visiting the shops though, but if it was only a 5% difference i would`t see it as a difference, but the fact is everything in ireland is more than 5% more expensive, not just models etc, everything.

If i was headin into a shop and was looking for a plane etc i would`t be too bothered about a 5% price either though.

Kashkai

I agree with Robbie. If the model shops in Ireland (which are tiny in size with a very limited choice of models btw) had what I was looking for, then I would do my business with them, even if it meant paying slightly more. However, the model shops that I've visited in Dublin appear to only sell models that have been lying round on their shelves for years and their supply of parts is non existant. The staff were also extremely unhelpful and when I did buy some glue for repairing my foam plane, I was told that it was the best on the market. However when I tried to use it on my plane, it just ran off the foam and I couldn't repair the plane. I honestly would have been better off using spit to try to stick the plane back together.

I dare say that in California where you're based, the model shops are big, bright and airy places with all the models you could want. However, model shops here are firmly stuck in the dark ages. I'm a member of a rc aircraft forum based in the UK and the guys on that forum are forever going on about the latest model plane they've seen in their local model shop. They post up pictures of large scale warbirds like the P51, P47 and Spitfires which the model shops here probably haven't even hearh of.