Abramovich to sue the government?

MrMatisse

http://www.reuters.com/article/idUSLDE69024P20101001

**** him.

And Fu-ck these lads too

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/newsbysector/banksandfinance/8038000/Irelands-finance-minister-Brian-Lenihan-ridiculed-by-City-investors.html

We have suffered enough!

Some traders began making what one banker on the call described as "chimp sounds", while another cried out "dive, dive". A third man said "short Ireland" before adding "why not short Citi too.

MagicMarker

Really-Stressed wrote: »

http://www.reuters.com/article/idUSLDE69024P20101001

**** him.

And Fu-ck these lads too

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/newsbysector/banksandfinance/8038000/Irelands-finance-minister-Brian-Lenihan-ridiculed-by-City-investors.html

We have suffered enough!

Some traders began making what one banker on the call described as "chimp sounds", while another cried out "dive, dive". A third man said "short Ireland" before adding "why not short Citi too?" [/

Sensationalist journalism at it's best.

200 callers on the conference call and you're not gonna hear much of anything.

Nailz

From the Irish point of view it seems like an arsehole's thing to do, but in reality it's his money, INBS owe him in bonds and Roman Abramovich has every right to do what he's doing. I'd never expect him to consider the debt, nor should he be expected to! If I happened to be in his shoe's I do the same thing. Stop having a blinkered, one-sided view on the proceeding's.

MrMatisse

Nailz wrote: »

From the Irish point of view it seems like an arsehole's thing to do, but in reality it's his money, INBS owe him in bonds and Roman Abramovich has every right to do what he's doing. I'd never expect him to consider the debt, nor should he be expected to! If I happened to be in his shoe's I do the same thing. Stop having a blinkered, one-sided view on the proceeding's.

He wants more money for them than they are currently trading in the market.

Lemming.

Son Of A Vidic

Russian Mafia to sue Irish govenrment? Does it get any better?

gurramok

Can we get Bono to launch a worldwide campaign to cancel Ireland's debt?

Jesus Wept

I'd like to short Ireland too.

Gummy Panda

Sign extradition treaty with Russia. Tell him he has to come to Ireland if he wants the money.

Phill Ewinn

Who?

orourkeda

Are the irish government within their rights to tell bond holders to go f*ck themselves?

Mardy Bum

orourkeda wrote: »

Are the irish government within their rights to tell bond holders to go f*ck themselves?

Yes I think they can and its what they should have told the f@ckers in Anglo.

orourkeda

Mardy Bum wrote: »

Yes I think they can and its what they should have told the f@ckers in Anglo.

Then why didnt they?

Gummy Panda

orourkeda wrote: »

Then why didnt they?

People think its because Germans make up the majority of the deposits in Anglo.

Can't bite the hand that feeds you.

Mardy Bum

orourkeda wrote: »

Then why didnt they?

That is what everyone would like to know.

SEPT 23 1989

Dont answer the door,turn off the TV and hide behind the couch

newmug

Is it not the case that if he won, the judgement would be, "yes, Ireland owes you x amount Mr. Abrammovitch". Sure we know that! We cant end up oweing more can we?

gurramok

Can we sue Chelsea FC for not employing enough Irish players instead? (might help the others win the English Premier league )

Kasabian

Do we now qualify for aid from Bono. Maybe he can get our debt cancelled as he has for other third world countries.

Handsome Bob

If he throws exiling Cowen to Siberia into the bargain he can do what he wants. :pac:

PeterIanStaker

orourkeda wrote: »

Then why didnt they?

Because they're far too busy slapping each other on the back in a tent at the Galway races?

mikom

In Soviet Russia government sue you.

gurramok

In Soviet Russia bankers would of been executed by balls hanging from a tree branch!

thee glitz

David Norris has it right - Nationalise the banks, take Anglo out to the mid-Atlantic and sink it.
They're still not sure about the total cost of bailing out Anglo (€29-35bn) - over twice the HSE budget for this year.
What is so difficult to understand about losing your cash when you make bad investments?

Voodoo_rasher

Mardy Bum wrote: »

Yes I think they can and its what they should have told the f@ckers in Anglo.

the european central bank in Germany, you priceless Tool.

why not be kicked out of the eu and become a U.S protectorate then :rolleyes:

Mardy Bum

Voodoo_rasher wrote: »

the european central bank in Germany, you priceless Tool.

why not be kicked out of the eu and become a U.S protectorate then :rolleyes:

To clarify who I was talking about regarding Anglo- the equity holders, my statement was pretty ambiguous to say the least, I apologise.

Your tone leaves much to be desired though.

stovelid

Stories like these - and ones like the Jay Leno story - will only have the effect of focusing anger outward from its rightful targets in this county.

If we're laughing at the sorry mess here, why shouldn't others?

Nailz

Really-Stressed wrote: »

He wants more money for them than they are currently trading in the market.

Lemming.

Obviously you don't have the greatest understanding of the monetary system, Money is created from debt and that debt has to be repaid with interest, which means there is always more debt than there is money, so essentially Money = Debt and vise verse. Debt is only expended through more interest, and also when the money is carried to different market spaces (but that's primarily only debt of the market to which the money was exported from).

This also means that depending on how rich your market it, and how much interest on the money, the value of the money always grows with market.
Remember, very single cent in your pocket is owed to someone, by someone. In the current way it works, if there was no debt, there'd be no money. There's very few currencies in this world who run a debt free bill,

So when Roman Abramovich received these bonds, that money was in our market, but now the bulk of that currency is gone to another market or has gone in debt. It's his money, it shouldn't matter to him if it isn't in our market.

thebaz

if Abramovich or the Hedge funds had made big profits on Anglo or Nationwide would they have shared their profits with the Irish people?

they lost on their gamble, so tough luck , if they wanted security they should have bought Gold , but they took a punt and lost, so **** em

I wouldn't give them a cent

Nailz

thebaz wrote: »

they lost on their gamble, so tough luck , if they wanted security they should have bought Gold , but they took a punt and lost, so **** em

Pun??? :pac:

galwayrush

He might end up buying our bananaless banana republic for a euro if we go bankrupt.

Doublin

David Norris has it right - Nationalise the banks, take Anglo out to the mid-Atlantic and sink it.
They're still not sure about the total cost of bailing out Anglo (€29-35bn) - over twice the HSE budget for this year.
What is so difficult to understand about losing your cash when you make bad investments?

Not sure about nationalise all the banks, but definitely kick Anglo. They have no value to us. There is no rational reason why an ordinary Irish citizen should be indebted to paying back FF buddies & International investors for X number of years to cover their losses and put our country's future under a massive burden.. They invested, they lost - End of.

I can't see a reason we are trying to placate them to offset this

If you look at international media, these 'financiers' think we are fair game, they think our politicians are a joke.. We are not the first country to go though this and the most effective response from others was to play hardball. I'm no expert(but don't have faith in some of the so called expert's about, don't know who pays them, same old stuff as spouted about before about 'no sure, there'll never be a property crash here - we're special) but these guy's come in try to make money when we are growing, try to make money when we are contracting. They know the risks they've done it before. They also don't hold grudges, look at historical defaulters, money was flowing back soon after.. I don't know where this idea came from but it was defiantly not in the ordinary Irish persons interest.

Look it, this is high stakes for us, so we should play high stakes/hardball back. Hint we will tell them to go jump/drop out of Europe(if that is what Germany is afraid of)/isolationist/feck why drop out of UN and ally with North Korea. Other countries who experienced global 'investor' market attacks in the past have adopted these 'hardball' tactics and rebounded quicker than if they lay down and played yes sir/no sir..

I honestly believe this is a very important time in our history. And what happens now will be as important as the 1920's.

gurramok

galwayrush wrote: »

He might end up buying our bananaless banana republic for a euro if we go bankrupt.

Does that mean we have to succumb to Soviet Russia?!

newmug

Nailz wrote: »

Obviously you don't have the greatest understanding of the monetary system, Money is created from debt and that debt has to be repaid with interest, which means there is always more debt than there is money, so essentially Money = Debt and vise verse. Debt is only expended through more interest, and also when the money is carried to different market spaces (but that's primarily only debt of the market to which the money was exported from).

This also means that depending on how rich your market it, and how much interest on the money, the value of the money always grows with market.
Remember, very single cent in your pocket is owed to someone, by someone. In the current way it works, if there was no debt, there'd be no money. There's very few currencies in this world who run a debt free bill,

So when Roman Abramovich received these bonds, that money was in our market, but now the bulk of that currency is gone to another market or has gone in debt. It's his money, it shouldn't matter to him if it isn't in our market.

So you're saying its all just a giant pyramid scheme?

I disagree. The sun shines, plants grow, animals multiply, humans exploit both. Overall there should be surplus resources in the world, obviously apart from finite ones, but there is more than enough for everybody to have a decent standard of living debt-free. Problems arise when there's too many people for the resources to supply. Then the rules of supply-and-demand come into play, and capitalism takes on a life of its own. In capitalism, there's always a loser. At the moment, we're losing.

My name is URL

They're talking about this on Prime Time now

Bigcheeze

Risk free return of 13% and it was clear that the guarantee was going to run out in September. He has no case. Bring it on Roman!

Doublin

Now we bending over for dodgy Russian oligarchs

Absurdum

go back to Rome, stupid Roman :rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes:

bobblepuzzle

Well he bought bonds through a now bailed out bank.... win some you loose some.... take the PAIN BITCH!

brianthebard

I hate Brian Lenihan as much as anyone but the ****ing financial investors trying to act like they have the moral high ground is sickening, they're the ****ers who had to get bailed out by their respective countries, a bit of humility wouldn't go amiss. But just like Alison O'Riordan they haven't learned a ****ing thing from their near destruction of the economy.

bobblepuzzle

brianthebard wrote: »

I hate Brian Lenihan as much as anyone but the ****ing financial investors trying to act like they have the moral high ground is sickening, they're the ****ers who had to get bailed out by their respective countries, a bit of humility wouldn't go amiss. But just like Alison O'Riordan they haven't learned a ****ing thing from their near destruction of the economy.

I'd actually vote FF if Lenihan was in charge... he knows what he's doing, unlike the rest!

Absurdum

Cmdr Keen wrote: »

I'd actually vote FF if Lenihan was in charge... he knows what he's doing, unlike the rest!

wait, WHAT

brianthebard

Cmdr Keen wrote: »

I'd actually vote FF if Lenihan was in charge... he knows what he's doing, unlike the rest!

That's completely untrue, but sadly you're not the only person who thinks that, and that's why FF are in with a chance of getting into power again.

10 point explanation about how Lenihan could save FF would be awesome if you're up for it.

Grimreaper666

Cmdr Keen wrote: »

I'd actually vote FF if Lenihan was in charge... he knows what he's doing, unlike the rest!

:pac::pac::pac: That's a good one!!

Frankie Lee

Cmdr Keen wrote: »

I'd actually vote FF if Lenihan was in charge... he knows what he's doing, unlike the rest!

Propaganda works

bobblepuzzle

brianthebard wrote: »

That's completely untrue, but sadly you're not the only person who thinks that, and that's why FF are in with a chance of getting into power again.

10 point explanation about how Lenihan could save FF would be awesome if you're up for it.

Well its an opinion of mine... whether you believe its untrue or not, well thats your opinion... don't state it as fact

Grimreaper666

brianthebard wrote: »

10 point explanation about how Lenihan could save FF would be awesome if you're up for it.

1 point explanation would even be good.............

Grimreaper666

Cmdr Keen wrote: »

Well its an opinion of mine... whether you believe its untrue or not, well thats your opinion... don't state it as fact

Go on, admit it. you're one of those spin doctors who gets paid a fortune for talking sh!te.......:pac:

brianthebard

Cmdr Keen wrote: »

Well its an opinion of mine... whether you believe its untrue or not, well thats your opinion... don't state it as fact

sorry that was unnecessarily combative of me. I'm just sick of hearing the same people who complain about FF go 'Now that Lenihan...' If he died of cancer in the next 5 years he'd virtually be canonised. Imo the facts of the matter are he has perpetuated policies which look after his friends in the finance industry at the expense of the majority.


Its true he has made decisions, which many praise him for; the question is not whether they were the hard decisions, but whether they were the right decisions. Because of NAMA and other policies from Mr. Lenihan, there is no scope for stimulus by the govt. There is also a guarantee that everyone will be targetted by new taxes or cuts in the next budget(s).


If changes had been made to NAMA or if Nationalisation of either the Irish banking system in general or Anglo specifically had happened, there would be money to spare for those projects. Lenihan has definitely lengthened and deepened the recession that Ireland will experience.

OPENROAD; you are right in a way but it is not without reason; FG and Labour both held policies that are preferable to NAMA.

K-9

brianthebard wrote: »

If changes had been made to NAMA or if Nationalisation of either the Irish banking system in general or Anglo specifically had happened, there would be money to spare for those projects. Lenihan has definitely lengthened and deepened the recession that Ireland will experience.

What sort of savings do you think would have been achieved?

brianthebard

K-9 wrote: »

What sort of savings do you think would have been achieved?

by nationalising the banks or accurately pricing the bad debts they hold, many many millions could have been saved. I think realistically at least 50%(perhaps more) of what was spent on NAMA could be saved. Also it is important to factor in the ownership of the properties that would result from nationalisation. NAMA does not incur a transaction of that sort, so the banks retain ownership of all properties. If nationalised those properties could at least be used to provide social housing, homeless shelters, OAP retirement homes, even schools. NAMA is the worst possible solution.

K-9

brianthebard wrote: »

by nationalising the banks or accurately pricing the bad debts they hold, many many millions could have been saved. I think realistically at least 50%(perhaps more) of what was spent on NAMA could be saved. Also it is important to factor in the ownership of the properties that would result from nationalisation. NAMA does not incur a transaction of that sort, so the banks retain ownership of all properties. If nationalised those properties could at least be used to provide social housing, homeless shelters, OAP retirement homes, even schools. NAMA is the worst possible solution.

Would we not be taking on the debts as well though, like Anglo which hardly was a success?