Rifle models the same?

session savage

Hi folks. Could someone explain something for me please.
I am looking into getting a .223. I was wondering about one thing (this could be a stupid question). I'll use remington as an example of what I'm unsure about.
There are several different types of remington 700's. The 700 BDL, the 700 SPS, the 700 SPS Varmint, the 700 SPS tactical etc etc. I know they all have slightly different stock or whatever but what I want to know is are they all basically the same rifle (ignoring barrell finish etc.) Would they all have the same accuracy, and the same bolt, trigger and barrell etc.
Its the same with lots of rifles, like Tikka T3, Tikka T3 Hunter, Tikka T3 Lite, Tikka T3 Varmint etc etc.
Thanks if you can clear this up for me.

Rovi

Generally speaking, they're all be based on the same action, with triggers, barrels, stocks, and who knows what else in the way of extras and add-ons being different.

deerhunter1

session savage wrote: »

Hi folks. Could someone explain something for me please.
I am looking into getting a .223. I was wondering about one thing (this could be a stupid question). I'll use remington as an example of what I'm unsure about.
There are several different types of remington 700's. The 700 BDL, the 700 SPS, the 700 SPS Varmint, the 700 SPS tactical etc etc. I know they all have slightly different stock or whatever but what I want to know is are they all basically the same rifle (ignoring barrell finish etc.) Would they all have the same accuracy, and the same bolt, trigger and barrell etc.
Its the same with lots of rifles, like Tikka T3, Tikka T3 Hunter, Tikka T3 Lite, Tikka T3 Varmint etc etc.
Thanks if you can clear this up for me.

Well you have the ADL which is the basic model lower end of the scale, the BDL has nicer finished wood but no other difference mechanically, both are very light weapons to carry. The varmints and tactical actions are the same just heavier barrels for accuracy because of less recoil due to the weight, different style bolt, detachable magazines etc.

session savage

The rifle I was thinking of getting is the Remington SPS Varmint in a .223 left handed (i'm a kittogue). I'm presuming this would be as accurate and reliable as and of the other Remington 700's?

Unless of course I can save enough money to get a Tikka T3 Varmint.

It wasn't me!

session savage wrote: »

The rifle I was thinking of getting is the Remington SPS Varmint in a .223 left handed (i'm a kittogue). I'm presuming this would be as accurate and reliable as and of the other Remington 700's?

Unless of course I can save enough money to get a Tikka T3 Varmint.

The Remmy SPS stocks are awful and you'll have problems and end up swapping it out, near as damn it guaranteed. The Tikka is a better bet off the bat. It's also a nicer action and a better trigger, and barrels are more accurate in my experience. You should be able to get the Tikka Varmint for about 1200 new, and less if you look around or find one second-hand. Welcome to the pain in the arse that is looking for left-handed rifles. Don't let anyone tell you it'll be grand and just to shoot a right-handed gun. They'd be pretty put out if they were obliged to shoot a left-handed one.

deerhunter1

session savage wrote: »

The rifle I was thinking of getting is the Remington SPS Varmint in a .223 left handed (i'm a kittogue). I'm presuming this would be as accurate and reliable as and of the other Remington 700's?

Unless of course I can save enough money to get a Tikka T3 Varmint.

Well if you can hold off and save for a Tikka i would wait, Buy Cheap you Buy Twice. Well I am right handed and shoot left shoulder as my master eye is my left eye. Shooting like that all my life using right handed firearms (and weapons:p) But the fact you are left handed buy left handed they are out there and not as scarce to get as what people think. Buy what is the best for your budget because buying left handed the FD's will screw you if you decide to trade. They will whinge that it will be hard to offload it so buy a good one first time off so that you will have it for a long time and not get screwed. Take your time it is a buyers market and dont listen to the poor mouthed FD's, and no I would be not put out if I had to fire a left handed firearm. Good Luck

session savage

Thanks Deerhunter.
I know all too well the sh1te you get told if you were to try and trade in a lefty.
At the end of the day I will be buying this for keeps. So I know I should hold off and get the Tikka.
Curse my impatience.

It wasn't me!

deerhunter1 wrote: »

Well I am right handed and shoot left shoulder as my master eye is my left eye. Shooting like that all my life using right handed firearms (and weapons:p) ... I would be not put out if I had to fire a left handed firearm. Good Luck

Of course not; you're already shooting left-handed. But if people had to shoot a lefty rifle from the right shoulder? You bet they'd complain! It's well worth the time and effort to track down left-handed rifles. My lefty Sako fits me like a glove and I don't see a future where I've gotten rid of it. Just too nice a gun and too useful. Also, as a long action, I can turn it into anything shorter than a full .375 H&H length case.

OP, buy something you'll never have to trade in, something you can see yourself shooting forever, in one guise or another. The beauty of it is that you can change the Tikka into just about any cartridge, same as the Sako, as you've still got a full length action.

Tackleberrywho

I've two remingtons VTR and SSSF II

Both are righthanded.
Both are 700 actions.

The VSSF II action is far superior to the VTR action (reflected in the price)

The SPS is almost the same as the VTR (except the barrel)

With a VSSF II you can install a karsten cheek riser and you will be very comfortable taking shots.

I have tried a edit left handed rifle, however i feel I shoot better with a right handed rifle ( I put it on a par with Hendrix playing a guitar upside down if you get the hand of it , it works )

session savage

Tackleberrywho, so your a lefty?
Did you find it awkward when you started shooting to have the bolt on the 'wrong' side?

Tackleberrywho

session savage wrote: »

Tackleberrywho, so your a lefty?
Did you find it awkward when you started shooting to have the bolt on the 'wrong' side?

I'm left eye dominant, and mostly righthanded, however i can write with my left too.

Working teh bolt is actually easy, as you can stay on target (scope on) and work the bolt with the right

I fire every rifle shotty from the left shoulder

FISMA

Fundamentally,
ADL -internal magazine, no floorplate, rounds are cycled out of the action, not dropped out

BDL -internal magazine, hinged floorplate, and nicer cosmetics

CDL - custom deluxe shop, has internal magazine, hinged floorplate, and pretty wood

SPS - special purpose synthetic, lower end of line, plastic stock

With that said. I have owned everything but the ADL. I have a SPS in 223, and just switched from the BDL to the CDL.

If you are new and have a tight budget, get the SPS and upgrade as you have money.

If you have a few euro, get the BDL - nice compromise

If you have tackleBerryWho kind of cash, get the CDL CDL's have nice stocks, the only problem I have is that they are too nice for the field and I end up buying the synthetic stock from Butler Creek or Remington anyhow.

Tackleberrywho

FISMA wrote: »

Fundamentally,
ADL -internal magazine, no floorplate, rounds are cycled out of the action, not dropped out

BDL -internal magazine, hinged floorplate, and nicer cosmetics

CDL - custom deluxe shop, has internal magazine, hinged floorplate, and pretty wood

SPS - special purpose synthetic, lower end of line, plastic stock

With that said. I have owned everything but the ADL. I have a SPS in 223, and just switched from the BDL to the CDL.

If you are new and have a tight budget, get the SPS and upgrade as you have money.

If you have a few euro, get the BDL - nice compromise

If you have tackleBerryWho kind of cash, get the CDL CDL's have nice stocks, the only problem I have is that they are too nice for the field and I end up buying the synthetic stock from Butler Creek or Remington anyhow.

I've no money anymore lol

dos29

Tackleberrywho wrote: »

Working teh bolt is actually easy, as you can stay on target (scope on) and work the bolt with the right

I fire every rifle shotty from the left shoulder

Am I reading this correctly?
You fire from your LEFT shoulder, but work the bolt with your RIGHT hand?
How in hell does that work?

Tackleberrywho

dos29 wrote: »

Am I reading this correctly?
You fire from your LEFT shoulder, but work the bolt with your RIGHT hand?
How in hell does that work?

easy, your trigger hand is your left, your bolt hand is your right

FISMA

Little known fact, TackleBerryWho actually does a bit of acting. Here he is cycling the action, a bit awkward, however, he's spot on.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4MnCqWdgeqc

Safe to open, private Ryan clip

bunny shooter

Tackleberrywho wrote: »

I've two remingtons VTR and SSSF II

Both are righthanded.
Both are 700 actions.

The VSSF II action is far superior to the VTR action (reflected in the price)

I thought they were the same action just different barrel & stocks Have you proof of this statement?

ejg

Savage,
go for a left hand rifle, it'll pay off in the long run.
I have a tikka, sako and a remmy sps stainless sporter.
Between tikka and remmy, I would choose remmy.
My remmy sporter is more accurate that my tikka,
it will cost way more to get a tikka right than a remmy.
By right I mean, I can't live with that plastic mag and plastic
bottom metal.The plastic bolt shroud.
The stock on the tikka is better than the sps and almost useable but
would also have to go.
With a remmy sps change stock and trigger and the rifle is ok.
Sako? well I'd rather have two remmy's than one sako. I would
not have much faith in a sako barrel, but that is just me.
edi

Tackleberrywho

bunny shooter wrote: »

I thought they were the same action just different barrel & stocks Have you proof of this statement?

I can show you if you like. The stainless action cycles (VSSF) smoother than the duracoat and there is less play in the action of the stainless.

The proof is using both rifles regular for the past 3-4 years approx and drawing that conclusion.

Tackleberrywho

[QUOTE=FISMA;68378958]Little known fact, TackleBerryWho actually does a bit of acting. Here he is cycling the action, a bit awkward, however, he's spot on.

I use my right hand to work the bolt, the left hand works the trigger and the hand grip.

My father is ambidextrous so I blame him for the way I shoot. I hate the AUG for the same reason...

It wasn't me!

There's no difference in the action. They're made en masse and a generic Remington 700 isn't destined to be a CDL or a VTR or a VSF coming off the line. If you can feel a tangible difference between your two, it's purely a quality control issue or your mind playing tricks on you. The difference in price comes from the barrel, the "varmint" tag and the HS Precision stock.

Tackleberrywho

It wasn't me! wrote: »

There's no difference in the action. They're made en masse and a generic Remington 700 isn't destined to be a CDL or a VTR or a VSF coming off the line. If you can feel a tangible difference between your two, it's purely a quality control issue or your mind playing tricks on you. The difference in price comes from the barrel, the "varmint" tag and the HS Precision stock.

IWM

Stainless steel vs Duracoated no comparison.
You would have to experience both to know.(in the same configuration)

Stainless is also more expensive IWM , the way in how they are machined is the same, the materials are different.
It is by rapid prototyping that costs are kept down.
If I was going custom I would use a Remington Stainless action and not a duracoated steel action.
I have seen the steel under the duracoat first hand so I have seen the difference in the metals.

bunny shooter

Tac,

I agree with IWM I think your doing it again :P

I have owned quite a few Remmys in different configurations and calibres and all the actions were the same.

Tackleberrywho

bunny shooter wrote: »

Tac,

I agree with IWM I think your doing it again :P

I have owned quite a few Remmys in different configurations and calibres and all the actions were the same.

Think what you like bunny, I've my experiences stated.

bunny shooter

Tackleberrywho wrote: »

Think what you like bunny,

I am

Tackleberrywho wrote: »

I've my experiences stated.

As I have mine

tac foley

ejg wrote: »

I would not have much faith in a sako barrel, but that is just me. edi

Must be 'just you'. Did you get a bad one? If so, it's the first one I've heard of for many years. Checking the register this evening shows that about 1/3 of our 254-strong membership have one of more Sako rifles in many different calibres. One of our shooters - a professional gamekeeper - has five, so HE obviously believes in them.

The slightly older FinnFire that I shoot [heavy barrel, varminter stock] shoots into a ragged hole at 50m with four different types of ammunition, and around 3/4" 50 round groups at 100m, even with an old fart like me shooting it.

I'm told that the 'bad' time for a very few Sako Model 95-only was very short and quickly sorted by a one-for-one exchange, and in any case, seemed to be confined to the USA.

tac

ejg

tac foley wrote: »

Must be 'just you'. Did you get a bad one? If so, it's the first one I've heard of for many years. Checking the register this evening shows that about 1/3 of our 254-strong membership have one of more Sako rifles in many different calibres. One of our shooters - a professional gamekeeper - has five, so HE obviously believes in them.

The slightly older FinnFire that I shoot [heavy barrel, varminter stock] shoots into a ragged hole at 50m with four different types of ammunition, and around 3/4" 50 round groups at 100m, even with an old fart like me shooting it.

I'm told that the 'bad' time for a very few Sako Model 95-only was very short and quickly sorted by a one-for-one exchange, and in any case, seemed to be confined to the USA.

tac

Hi tac,
sako's have always impressed me as having good actions and as far as factory stocks go they are slightly better, but at what price.
They have never impressed me on the accuracy side if one compares a sako to a howa, remmy or CZ bedded in a good stock.
Even the TRG's I see only seem mediocre shooters, not bad but certainly not brilliant.
Plenty 85's in custom rifle shops at the moment being rebarreled. ask around.
The sako I have doesn't really count because it is very old, but even so that bofors barrel was never any good, thankfully replaced.

edi

tac foley

ejg wrote: »

The sako I have doesn't really count because it is very old, but even so that bofors barrel was never any good, thankfully replaced.edi

Hmmm, interesting comment there, about the 'bofors barrel'. that something I've never heard of.

To save clogging up the thread, could you tell me more about it in a PM?

Having been to Riihimaki a while back and seen SAKO guns being built, I'm really interested.

TIA

tac

It wasn't me!

My Sako 75, from the factory, no bedding, factory barrel with well over a thousand rounds through it, lightweight hunter, shoots sub half inch groups at a hundred yards off the bipod in a prone position and has shot sub three-quarter inch at two hundred yards off the bench (My bench shooting is extremely limited. That's the only time I shot it as such) with ammo it likes. I've never seen a Sako that won't shoot well. My experience is that every one of the half a dozen I've shot and many more I've seen shot have all done groups like that.