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"no, I'm actually an athiest"

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    #932
    MrStuffins
    Registered Users Posts: 19,191 ✭✭✭✭MrStuffins


    Mr. Loverman wrote: »
    Have you never read any science histoty books? Theories are constantly proven to be wrong. I'm surprised I have to explain this...

    You're a scientist and you have to be explained TO! Ridiculous!

    his ground has already been covered, so i will no longer engage you aftert his unless you actually read the thread.

    The Heliocentric Theory is also "just a theory" using your logic.

    Are you saying it is not a fact that Earth orbits the Sun?

    Please!


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    #933
    Mr. Loverman
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,001 ✭✭✭Mr. Loverman


    cypharius wrote: »
    For Christs sake, YES IT'S A THEORY, and in scientific terms a theory is something that has lots of evidence to support it. I for one am sick of saying this, Dawkins is right, we need a new word for scientific theories that we're super sure of.

    There is evidence to support it, but that doesn't make it a fact.

    Having such a black and white attitude to science is wrong and probably why the religious folk think we're smug.


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    #934
    Saganist
    Registered Users Posts: 1,333 ✭✭✭Saganist


    Mr. Loverman wrote: »
    Have you never read any science histoty books? Theories are constantly proven to be wrong. I'm surprised I have to explain this...

    Gravity is just a theory too... Would you not accept this so much that you would be willing to call the theory a "fact" ??

    The same is true for evolution. Its as close to fact as we can get because in science, we never claim absolute truth.


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    #935
    MrStuffins
    Registered Users Posts: 19,191 ✭✭✭✭MrStuffins


    Mr. Loverman wrote: »
    I went to Stanford. I'm not some dummy.

    Ha, congratulations :rolleyes:


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    #936
    cypharius
    Closed Accounts Posts: 504 ✭✭✭cypharius


    MrStuffins wrote: »
    You're a scientist and you have to be explained TO! Ridiculous!

    his ground has already been covered, so i will no longer engage you aftert his unless you actually read the thread.

    The Heliocentric Theory is also "just a theory" using your logic.

    Are you saying it is not a fact that Earth orbits the Sun?

    Please!


    Yes actually, those are all theories.


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    #937
    stevoslice
    Registered Users Posts: 1,007 ✭✭✭stevoslice


    Mr. Loverman wrote: »
    Have you never read any science histoty books? Theories are constantly proven to be wrong. I'm surprised I have to explain this...

    and surprisingly enough, scientific history is also littered with theories that have never been proven wrong.

    shocking, i know.


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    #938
    cypharius
    Closed Accounts Posts: 504 ✭✭✭cypharius


    Mr. Loverman wrote: »
    There is evidence to support it, but that doesn't make it a fact.

    Having such a black and white attitude to science is wrong and probably why the religious folk think we're smug.


    wgreefqafwwtf? That's what I just said, it's a theory! One that is almost definitely true, I'm on your side!


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    #939
    cooker3
    Registered Users Posts: 6,646 ✭✭✭cooker3


    Malty_T wrote: »
    Not wanting to add to your reading list even further but has anyone here Kenneth Miller's book "Finding Darwin's God." It's been on my to do list with a quite a while now. Alas, like Jakkass, I have yet to finish the GSOE.:o

    You definitely should give it a read. He absolutely destroys intelligent design in the first half; there is no way you could read that and still accept ID if you have any intellectual integrity. The 2nd half where he explains why he thinks Quantum mechanics is compatible with a God of free will is a bit more questionable but even with that still more than worth it.


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    #940
    Mr. Loverman
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,001 ✭✭✭Mr. Loverman


    Saganist wrote: »
    Gravity is just a theory too... Would you not accept this so much that you would be willing to call the theory a "fact" ??

    The same is true for evolution. Its as close to fact as we can get because in science, we never claim absolute truth.

    Have you never heard of the pioneer anomaly? The rules of gravity may have to be changed.

    Seriously, theories are not facts. You won't get hurt if you open your mind that some of your beliefs may be wrong.


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    #941
    MrStuffins
    Registered Users Posts: 19,191 ✭✭✭✭MrStuffins


    cypharius wrote: »
    Yes actually, those are all theories.

    So you don't thin kit is a fact that we orbit the Sun....... seriously?

    Like..... really


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    #942
    MrStuffins
    Registered Users Posts: 19,191 ✭✭✭✭MrStuffins


    Mr. Loverman wrote: »
    Have you never heard of the pioneer anomaly? The rules of gravity may have to be changed.

    Seriously, theories are not facts. You won't get hurt if you open your mind that some of your beliefs may be wrong.
    MrStuffins wrote: »
    So you don't thin kit is a fact that we orbit the Sun....... seriously?

    Like..... really

    Same question to you as you failed to answer me the first time.


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    #943
    Mr. Loverman
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,001 ✭✭✭Mr. Loverman


    MrStuffins wrote: »
    Same question to you as you failed to answer me the first time.

    I think the earth probably* does orbit the sun. But I am not so arrogant to say it is a fact. Why? Because history tells us we get this kind of stuff wrong all the time. Science's biggest failure is the arrogance of some of its scientists.

    (*99.99999% likely)


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    #944
    Turtwig
    Registered Users Posts: 26,578 ✭✭✭✭Turtwig


    MrStuffins wrote: »
    So you don't thin kit is a fact that we orbit the Sun....... seriously?

    Like..... really

    There is always the possibility that we could be missing something. Also even the concept of a day or year on earth isn't as straight forward as it may seem to who people experience a day or year.

    Einstein said it best :

    No amount of experimentation can ever prove me right; a single experiment can prove me wrong.


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    #945
    Marcus.Aurelius
    Registered Users Posts: 2,314 ✭✭✭Marcus.Aurelius


    Malty_T wrote: »
    Evolution cannot be 100% proven, therefore it can only be considered a fact in the colloquial sense that Earth goes around the sun is a fact. It's only a theory and that's all it ever will be. The only thing science can actually prove is that if a theory is wrong, never right.

    Yes, of course we use colloquialisms like "fact" to describe some theories which are rock solid and viewed as such. While nomenclature will vary, evolution is as strong a theory as one can find.


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    #946
    Saganist
    Registered Users Posts: 1,333 ✭✭✭Saganist


    Mr. Loverman wrote: »
    Have you never heard of the pioneer anomaly? The rules of gravity may have to be changed.

    Seriously, theories are not facts.

    What about it ? Were hardly going to throw everything we know about gravity away over something that could be caused by a "measurement error"...

    We'd need to see something like a cross between a tree and a mouse to falsify evolution. And to date thats not what we find, rather order sets of species that prove common ancestor. Over and over and over and over.......


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    #947
    Sea Sharp
    Registered Users Posts: 2,593 ✭✭✭Sea Sharp


    Atheism is too trendy these days.
    I'm thinking of becoming a Hindu for trolling purposes.


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    #948
    MrStuffins
    Registered Users Posts: 19,191 ✭✭✭✭MrStuffins


    Mr. Loverman wrote: »
    I think the earth probably* does orbit the sun. But I am not so arrogant to say it is a fact. Why? Because history tells us we get this kind of stuff wrong all the time. Science's biggest failure is the arrogance of some of its scientists.

    (*99.99999% likely)

    So what you are saying is, there is no such thing as a fact?

    I mean, there is also an incredibly minute chance that the clothes you are wearing right now are not real. That, in fact, you are not real and the whole world around you is part of an elaborate trick being played on your conciousness.

    So, your existence isn't actually a fact? is that right?

    Afterall, how can you know for sure?


    :rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes:


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    #949
    Marcus.Aurelius
    Registered Users Posts: 2,314 ✭✭✭Marcus.Aurelius


    Mr. Loverman wrote: »
    Maths, then stats, then computer science. I went to Stanford. I'm not some dummy.

    Theories are not facts. History tells us this. This is basic stuff.

    You are totally being as closed minded as the religious nuts if you think science theories are infallible.

    Oh, I thought you were a biologist or someone with some taught knowledge of evolution.

    Never mind.


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    #950
    OutlawPete
    Closed Accounts Posts: 17,689 ✭✭✭✭OutlawPete


    MrStuffins wrote: »
    Oh my Gosh!!!!!!

    You haven't read the thread either!

    What do you mean "Just a theory"? You do know there is more than one definition of the word theory right? And the one you are using is not the one being used for the "Theory" of Evolution!

    So many circles with people in this bloody thread!

    READ THE THREAD!!!! :mad::mad::mad:

    Quite sad.

    You, among others, are making the error of thinking that because you have stated something on this thread and posters who disagreed, then did not return, that this must then mean that you were right and that they have somehow accepted what you have said as being fact.

    Arrogance in the extreme.


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    #951
    Mr. Loverman
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,001 ✭✭✭Mr. Loverman


    Saganist wrote: »
    What about it ? Were hardly going to throw everything we know about gravity away over something that could be caused by a "measurement error"...

    My point is it suggest "facts" like gravity are not rock solid. Hence why I have an open mind. You should try it. Science is littered with unfortunate individuals who refused to accept current science might be wrong.

    Btw I do believe in evolution. And I am an athiest. I'm just not close minded about being wrong.


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    #952
    Saganist
    Registered Users Posts: 1,333 ✭✭✭Saganist


    MrStuffins wrote: »
    So what you are saying is, there is no such thing as a fact?

    I mean, there is also an incredibly minute chance that the clothes you are wearing right now are not real. That, in fact, you are not real and the whole world around you is part of an elaborate trick being played on your conciousness.

    So, your existence isn't actually a fact? is that right?

    Afterall, how can you know for sure?


    :rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes:


    Hes a solipsist..


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    #953
    My name is URL
    Registered Users Posts: 25,068 ✭✭✭✭My name is URL


    scientific1982 wrote: »
    Doesnt matter if it hasnt been applied. The law is still there and could be applied in the future. Its still illegal to make blasphemous comments.

    Well it's a stupid law and very unlikely to be enforced before a referendum takes place on it
    Helix wrote: »
    then what about getting non catholic kids into school in ireland being so bloody tough?

    or taxpayers money paying off abuse victims?

    Those two things have more to do with connections between the organisations of religion and the state. And I'm definitely against organised religion impeding on public life. To me it's more of a political problem than a religious one.


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    #954
    stevoslice
    Registered Users Posts: 1,007 ✭✭✭stevoslice


    ok everyone it seems the op has planted the seed for the long prophesied atheists war.

    "Allied Atheist Alliance is the most logical"


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    #955
    MrStuffins
    Registered Users Posts: 19,191 ✭✭✭✭MrStuffins


    OutlawPete wrote: »
    Quite sad.

    You, among others, are making the error of thinking that because you have stated something on this thread and posters who disagreed, then did not return, that this must then mean that you were right and that they have somehow accepted what you have said as being fact.

    Arrogance in the extreme.

    You can't argue with the dictionary my friend.

    Although, you'd probably condescend to it!


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    #956
    DOC09UNAM
    Closed Accounts Posts: 8,305 ✭✭✭DOC09UNAM


    Nobody that ignorant and silly could have ever got into stanford, it just doesn't make sense.


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    #957
    strobe
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7,872 ✭✭✭strobe


    Sea Sharp wrote: »
    Atheism is too trendy these days.
    I'm thinking of becoming a Hindu for trolling purposes.

    :( Hinduism is getting pretty trendy too apparently.
    http://boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2056049283

    Better off going for Shinto or something man.

    Or maybe we could start our own religion, with hookers and blackjack........actually forget the blackjack.


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    #958
    MrStuffins
    Registered Users Posts: 19,191 ✭✭✭✭MrStuffins


    Saganist wrote: »
    Hes a solipsist..

    According to his logic, my believing that my existence is a fact makes me arrogant

    :rolleyes:


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    #959
    Turtwig
    Registered Users Posts: 26,578 ✭✭✭✭Turtwig


    Mr. Loverman wrote: »
    Have you never heard of the pioneer anomaly? The rules of gravity may have to be changed.

    Seriously, theories are not facts. You won't get hurt if you open your mind that some of your beliefs may be wrong.

    The pioneer anomaly is a funny one as it may just be mathematical hiccup because calculating the trajectory of an object and its gravitational influences is very complicated and relies on a significant number of approximations. That said if the data is correct then we do have problem with gravity. But, we already knew that after all our understanding of gravity is largely limited to Newtonian Mechanics and General Relativity. We have no Quantum theory of gravity and we have no proof as yet of a graviton. We only have indirect evidence so far for one of the central predictions of GR concerning the existence of Gravity Waves. To be fair though, our detectors aren't yet sensitive enough to detect these waves. Exciting times are ahead as ironically the instrument that led Einstein down the path to Relativity is now being used to see if we are going to need to take a path different from Einstein's.


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    #960
    Mr. Loverman
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,001 ✭✭✭Mr. Loverman


    DOC09UNAM wrote: »
    Nobody that ignorant and silly could have ever got into stanford, it just doesn't make sense.

    Yes, you have to be close minded and view all science as fact to be smart. I assure you most people in Stanford were like me.


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    #961
    Marcus.Aurelius
    Registered Users Posts: 2,314 ✭✭✭Marcus.Aurelius


    Mr. Loverman wrote: »
    You are totally being as closed minded as the religious nuts if you think science theories are infallible.

    Who among us said that any theory is infallible?

    Who said that? We are simply moving with evidence, if the evidence strongly suggests tomorrow that evolution is not adequate for explaining the diversity of life, I would be among the first to admit it and turn my attention to solving the riddle anew.


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