"no, I'm actually an athiest"

NoQuarter

oppenheimer1 wrote: »

re·li·gion
[ri-lij-uhn]
–noun

The body of persons adhering to a particular set of beliefs and practices.

It could be argued that atheism fits that definition of religion.

WIKI wrote:

Religion is the belief in and worship of a god or gods, or a set of beliefs concerning the origin and purpose of the universe.[1] It is commonly regarded as consisting of a person’s relation to God or to gods or spirits.

link: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Religion

Mate im sorry but your point here is fundamentally wrong im afraid!

Deus Ex Machina

As an agnostic and formerly devout Catholic, it seems to be that both sides of the debate have their excruciatingly annoying tendencies, which are sort of symptomatic of their positions. Some atheists seem to think that their lack of religious belief means that they are more intelligent than religious folks. This can lead to some hilarious pontificating, particularly in that well of human wisdom, youtube comment boards.

On the theistic side, there is that extraordinarly irksome trend towards claiming the moral highground, despite the fact that no evidence has ever backed up the largely held belief that religion is the source of people's basic morality.

Both are equally annoying, and both could be solved with a smack of reality. It's just a pity that's such a hard thing to come by.

Ickle Magoo

oppenheimer1 wrote: »

Well it could be argued that atheism is a godless religion, at least to some. You're missing my point in that you take issue with the teachings of certain churches, particularly the Catholic Church, but (hopefully) not the fact that they believe in God.

Would you dismiss a person you know to be "spiritual" but keeps their beliefs to them self and doesn't evangelise? Are they worthy of ridicule?

I don't think it can be argued that atheism is anything other than a lack of belief in a god. That atheists happen to have other things in common is generally entirely incidental. There is no core tenet or dogma that atheists follow - as the old saying goes: atheism is a religion as not collecting stamps is a hobby.

I appreciate your point that belief in a god in itself doesn't have to impinge on anyone else but I think you are failing to acknowledge the reality that more often than not, it does - usually by virtue of motivating those who set such offensive doctrine and the others who deem it worthy of support.

I don't dismiss anyone's beliefs other than when they choose to post them publicly on an appropriate internet discussion fora. I think you could count my posts on the religion fora on one hand - and even then it's generally only if I spot someone claiming some falsehood about atheists or the A&A forum. There are theists who post on A&A more than some of the most rabid atheists do and seek to be offended by everything they read and then wonder why other posters think they aren't the full deck, which is all a bit silly.

AudreyHepburn

MrStuffins wrote: »

Because your argument doesn't exist.

At least you THINK it does, and you say it does, but you can't prove it.

This argument is the perfect example of Religion :P

And this post is a perfect example of the arrogance and superiority complex I originally posted about.

oppenheimer1

MrStuffins wrote: »

So, thinking that there is no God is a religion? You're being silly!

So, at work, i adhere to a particular set of practices. Is that religion?

When i play sport, i have to adhere by practices... is that religion?

Silly silly silly!

Beliefs and practices

Belief in a God(s) is not a requirement for something to be considered a religion.

Scuid Mhór

AudreyHepburn wrote: »

I just gave you some links where the threads had some posts that insulted believers but you've clearly chosen to ignore them.

I'm not going to argue with you anymore, it's not worth the effort tbh.

your links PROVED NOTHING. don't delude yourself.

Scuid Mhór

AudreyHepburn wrote: »

And this post is a perfect example of the arrogance and superiority complex I originally posted about.

and this is a perfect example of the pure ignorance you've subjected us to ever since stumbling into this thread.

MrStuffins

Deus Ex Machina wrote: »

As an agnostic and formerly devout Catholic, it seems to be that both sides of the debate have their excruciatingly annoying tendencies, which stem from sort of symptomatic of their positions. Some atheists seem to think that their lack of religious belief means that they are more intelligent than religious folks. This can lead to some hilarious pontificating, particularly in that well of human wisdom, youtube comment boards.

For any who have ever frequented the Christianity forum, this is a great point! Because the mods there come across as some of the most intelligent people you'll meet (in the afterlife of course).

They are terribly knowledgable about their religion and very helpful if you need to know something.

Their beliefs are different, but take it from me, they are very very intelligent over there!

oppenheimer1

NoQuarter wrote: »

link: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Religion

Mate im sorry but your point here is fundamentally wrong im afraid!

Can't do better than wikipedia? Maybe try the dictionary, at least you can cite that.

MrStuffins

oppenheimer1 wrote: »

Beliefs and practices

Belief in a God(s) is not a requirement for something to be considered a religion.

Ah, so what "belief" is it that makes me, as an athiest, religious then?

bleg

Eating pie is a religion.


Converting carbohydrates to energy is a religion.

Donkey Oaty

Scuid Mhór wrote: »

and this is a perfect example of the pure ignorance you've subjected us to ever since stumbling into this thread.

Let's be fair, folks - this thread is about whether atheists are arrogant and claim the moral high ground, not about whether God exists.

Fluffybums

Personally I do not believe there is a god, I can find no evidence for God or at times I see a lot that would indicate a lack of God. Oddly I struggle with this, I think part of me wants to believe. In the modern day and age I do kind of admire anyone who weighs everything up and can still believe, that is faith, in my opinion.

I think it is wrong to ridicule someone else's faith or lack of.

What I will ridicule is someone as an example, who purports to be a scientist and use supposed scientific argument to disprove evolution when that scientific evidence is false and would be seen to be false by someone with junior cert science.


In rural Ireland there is little freedom of relgious belief or lack of unless you have access to transportation and money. I can here the indignation as I write. How often have you heard someone say that they have had to have their child christened to ensure that they cannot be excluded from the local schools on that basis if numbers get tight and because if they don't the child would not be able to go for communion and would be left out which could lead to being picked. The alternative in rural areas is an early start and a drive into the nearest large town. Is this religious freedom or subtle sectarian discrimination?

MrStuffins

Donkey Oaty wrote: »

Let's be fair, folks - this thread is about whether atheists are arrogant and claim the moral high ground, not about whether God exists.

So it's ok for someone to come into the thread, make wild claims and refuse to back them up?

NoQuarter

oppenheimer1 wrote: »

Beliefs and practices

Belief in a God(s) is not a requirement for something to be considered a religion.

To be fair your being silly now!

Its like saying football is a religion, its more of a play on words that a true meaning. Athiesm is not a religion as its not a belief in something specific!

I think its about time i left this thread, when posts and arguments like this come out things have gone a bit downhill!

Night folks,

God be with you! :pac:

Major Lovechild

Just because someone doesn't believe in evolution - even though it is the most rational and best proven equation of the birth and development of all living things on this planet doesn't mean that they are wrong.

It also means that they are blinkered with ignorance.

Donkey Oaty

MrStuffins wrote: »

So it's ok for someone to come into the thread, make wild claims and refuse to back them up?

I'm not sure what the wild claim is that everyone is discussing. Is it that atheists are arrogant (or whatever)?

oppenheimer1

MrStuffins wrote: »

Ah, so what "belief" is it that makes me, as an athiest, religious then?

Look, is there any point in debating with you when you fail to acknowledge the argument that someones personal belief in God has nothing to do with you an your non belief has nothing to do with them.

Your pontificating and condescension towards anyone who disagrees with your world view is exactly what the OP was referring to.

bleg

MrStuffins wrote: »

So it's ok for someone to come into the thread, make wild claims and refuse to back them up?

Ya, it's the internets, not the UN. Just ignore them, you'll be happier.

MagicMarker

Donkey Oaty wrote: »

I'm not sure what the wild claim is that everyone is discussing. Is it that atheists are arrogant (or whatever)?

She claimed that she's seen so many atheists on boards claim to be much more intelligent and more enlightened than theists, or something along those lines!

We're just asking for examples is all.

Scuid Mhór

MrStuffins wrote: »

So it's ok for someone to come into the thread, make wild claims and refuse to back them up?

it's okay, mrstuffins. our unholy coalition has shown these punks who's boss. let 'em go.

NoQuarter

oppenheimer1 wrote: »

Can't do better than wikipedia? Maybe try the dictionary, at least you can cite that.

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/religion

Enjoy!

MrStuffins

oppenheimer1 wrote: »

Look, is there any point in debating with you when you fail to acknowledge the argument that someones personal belief in God has nothing to do with you an your non belief has nothing to do with them.

Lol, so what you're saying is "is there any point talking to you if you won't change your view to mine"?

Also, you never answered the questuion, what belief is it that makes me, an athiest, religious?

Your pontificating and condescension towards anyone who disagrees with your world view is exactly what the OP was referring to.

It's not pontificating or condescension, it's my opinion. I haven't pontificated at all. If i have, kindly point out the instances.

oppenheimer1

NoQuarter wrote: »

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/religion

Enjoy!

No 3.

scientific1982

I love how all the agnostics are trying take the high ground by claiming that both atheists and religious people are arrogant. Big pat on the back for you folks, well done.

MrStuffins

oppenheimer1 wrote: »

No 3.

Yes but, like other posters, you are just saying things and not backong it up.

again, what is this "belief" that makes me, an athiest, religious?

Donkey Oaty

MagicMarker wrote: »

She claimed that she's seen so many atheists on boards claim to be much more intelligent and more enlightened than theists, or something along those lines!

Seems like an uncontroversial comment to me, unless she drew some unsavoury conclusions from it.

MrStuffins

Donkey Oaty wrote: »

Seems like an uncontroversial comment to me, unless she drew some unsavoury conclusions from it.

Yeah, but it's what the thread is about no?

oppenheimer1

MrStuffins wrote: »

Lol, so what you're saying is "is there any point talking to you if you won't change your view to mine"?

Also, you never answered the questuion, what belief is it that makes me, an athiest, religious?

Well Atheism is a set of beliefs (or non-beliefs) and practices (evangelising - for some), which ironically fits a definition of religion.

It isn't about changing your view, but I want you to explain to me how my Sun worshipping has any effect on your life, and what entitles you to dismiss it if I don't force my views upon you?

NoQuarter

oppenheimer1 wrote: »

No 3.

3: the body of persons adhering to a particular set of beliefs and practices: a world council of religions

Thanks mate, ya proved my point! Damn that was easy...

MrStuffins

oppenheimer1 wrote: »

Well Atheism is a set of beliefs (or non-beliefs) and practices (evangelising - for some), which ironically fits a definition of religion.

What? You're just making that up!

You still haven't answered me, what belief is it which makes me religious? Come on now! How many times do i need to ask?

Donkey Oaty

MrStuffins wrote: »

Yeah, but it's what the thread is about no?

I was hoping it was going to be "All atheists are arseholes" and then I'd get a chance to stick my oar in.

I'm disappointed.

Ickle Magoo

oppenheimer1 wrote: »

Well Atheism is a set of beliefs (or non-beliefs) and practices (evangelising - for some), which ironically fits a definition of religion.

No, atheism is one thing & one thing alone - lacking a belief in a god...secularists, anti-theists, etc, may share a common goal but you cannot claim anything applies to all atheists bar lacking belief in a god/s....unless you are about to announce your religion in the loch ness monster and unicorns, that is? :P

oppenheimer1

MrStuffins wrote: »

What? You're just making that up!

You still haven't answered me, what belief is it which makes me religious? Come on now!

Read it carefully, I never said you were "religious". Do you disagree that Atheism is the belief in the non-existance of a God?

Conveniently you haven't answered me either.

Donkey Oaty

oppenheimer1 wrote: »

Do you disagree that Atheism is the belief in the non-existance of a God?

Don't answer! It's a trap!

Ickle Magoo

oppenheimer1 wrote: »

Read it carefully, I never said you were "religious". Do you disagree that Atheism is the belief in the non-existance of a God?

Conveniently you haven't answered me either.

Do you believe in the non-existence of unicorns? Or do you just lack belief that they exist at all. I don't think belief in the non-existence of something is even linguistically possible...

Diabhal Beag

OutlawPete wrote: »

Have to agree with the OP here.

People just can't wait to tell you that they are atheists these days.

I really don't care if people are or not.

It's the fact that they titter and sneer at anyone who happens to believe in any kind of spirituality, that I find so contemptible.

Go and masturbate to Dawkins and his ilk as much as you want, I couldn't care less.

Just stop being so obnoxious about it in the process, it's boorish in the extreme to be quite honest.

Welcome to the Atheists of AH. They'll belittle your religion at any opportunity.

MrStuffins

oppenheimer1 wrote: »

Read it carefully, I never said you were "religious". Do you disagree that Atheism is the belief in the non-existance of a God?

Atheism is not a belief in the non-existance of God, no! It is the non-belief, or rejection of belief, of God! You were the one who said Atheism is a religion and qualified it by saying a Religion is when there are practices and beliefs.

So far you have not been able to tell me what it is i'm supposed to believe!

Conveniently you haven't answered me either.

I will happily entertain your question when you have answered mine.

Was that the answer? You think the belief is a belief in non-belief?

NoQuarter

oppenheimer I think you should call it a night, anyone reading this thread now can see your just on a losing run here with this latest line of thought you have. Theists, athiests, stamp collecters whatever, we can all see that calling athiesm a religion is ...well...just plain wrong!

Jesus Wept

Cliff notes?

NoQuarter

Diabhal Beag wrote: »

Welcome to AH. They'll belittle your anything at any opportunity.

Fixed that for ya.

MrStuffins

NoQuarter wrote: »

oppenheimer I think you should call it a night, anyone reading this thread now can see your just on a losing run here with this latest line of thought you have. Theists, athiests, stamp collecters whatever, we can all see that calling athiesm a religion is ...well...just plain wrong!

When you go out of your way to twist words and invent an argument, you're gonna need a bit of substance to back it up.

Although, isnt it funny that all of the Ahtiests in the thread have been able to back up any claims that they make, yet the ones who can't are the Creationsists? I wonder is that an inherent thing?

Mr Benevolent

I'm utterly anti-religion,but I do think athiests who constantly talk about their beliefs are almost as bad as extreme christians.

Major Lovechild

Sorry folks! I didn't realise that this thread was adolescent.

KeithAFC

Perhaps god did create earth, he just decided to f*ck off and go look after some of his other planets?

NoQuarter

MrStuffins wrote: »

the Catholic Church has absolutely NO effect on my life as an Irishman

MrStuffins wrote: »

kids can't go to school

MrStuffins wrote: »

i'd really like to believe

MrStuffins wrote: »

you refuse to engage in conversation

Rob you made loads of crazy comments you cant back up, look at post 267!!!

Crazy!!! :pac:

aDeener

OutlawPete wrote: »

Have to agree with the OP here.

People just can't wait to tell you that they are atheists these days.

I really don't care if people are or not.

It's the fact that they titter and sneer at anyone who happens to believe in any kind of spirituality, that I find so contemptible.

Go and masturbate to Dawkins and his ilk as much as you want, I couldn't care less.

Just stop being so obnoxious about it in the process, it's boorish in the extreme to be quite honest.

the irony of these militant atheists becoming the opposite extreme of the religious loonies seems to be lost on them

MrStuffins

NoQuarter wrote: »

Rob you made loads of crazy comments you cant back up, look at post 267!!!

Crazy!!! :pac:

Notice how i didn't say "My kids can't go to school" because of religion.

My kids can't go to school because i don't give their mothers any money to cloth them :P

Ickle Magoo

aDeener wrote: »

the irony of these militant atheists becoming the opposite extreme of the religious loonies seems to be lost on them

Yeah, those religious loonies flying planes into buildings and bombing abortion clinics - and those militant atheists - writing books and posting on the internet...ehhhhh....

If people are so sure there is a god and their views are rational and plausible, why would anything atheists say be upsetting?

Guill

Eh, i am an atheist. (not many people know because whether i am atheist or your religious, i dont give a sh1t!)