DCU to rejoin USI, your thoughts?

Tree

And a number of those who object (/me raises hand) have been in other colleges that /have/ been affiliated and have not been affiliated, and can see no benefit whatsoever to joining. I found that CIT (who are not signed up to USI) gave far more benefit to students than UCC did (who are). The extra few bob can be more useful on campus than off.

phantom_lord

So this doesn't seem to be in the interest of the average DCU student at all.

So what's the SUs agenda for joing?

myk

phantom_lord wrote: »

So this doesn't seem to be in the interest of the average DCU student at all.

So what's the SUs agenda for joing?

I don't know if the SU exec is pushing to join. But they would get to lots of nice conferences in plush hotels with expenses paid for them, if DCU did re-affiliate. And it would open up a whole load of new paid sabbatical positions to DCU SU hacks.

gizmo

phantom_lord wrote: »

So this doesn't seem to be in the interest of the average DCU student at all.

Tell them it'll cost them more money and they'll care.

MonaghanPenguin

I thought it was bad value at 50,000 euro, now I'm told it's gone up to 80,000 which includes €3 per head for a conference (this is second hand information from a source at Union Council, if anyone knows better do feel free to correct me). Now, I don't know the exact figures but don't USI claim to have around 250,000 members, which would go up to 260,000 if DCU joined.

260,000 x €3 for a conference.

The mind boggles.

Dj Stiggie

MonaghanPenguin wrote: »

I thought it was bad value at 50,000 euro, now I'm told it's gone up to 80,000 which includes €3 per head for a conference (this is second hand information from a source at Union Council, if anyone knows better do feel free to correct me). Now, I don't know the exact figures but don't USI claim to have around 250,000 members, which would go up to 260,000 if DCU joined.

260,000 x €3 for a conference.

The mind boggles.

Sorry I should elaborate on that. The €3 is not for a conference, it is to cover the cost of travel and training for things such as Class Rep training and Pink Training for LGBT. I'm sure more information on the breakdown will be provided in the coming days.


With regards to someone else asking how it will be paid, it will be added on to your registration fee, but the first year is free. But we only get 6 votes as opposed to the 16 we'll get when we pay.

And no, students cannot individually opt out of joining

EDIT: Penguin, if you're referring to my original post with regards to costs, I never mentioned a conference, you're the only onw who said anything about it

myk

Dj Stiggie wrote: »

Sorry I should elaborate on that. The €3 is not for a conference, it is to cover the cost of travel and training for things such as Class Rep training and Pink Training for LGBT. I'm sure more information on the breakdown will be provided in the coming days.

But hasn't pink training and class rep training been going on already out of the existing DCUSU budget? Why the extra cost?

Dj Stiggie wrote: »

With regards to someone else asking how it will be paid, it will be added on to your registration fee,

Has this been agreed with the college? Has the wording of the constitutional amendment been drawn up?

Fiftysix

It is still €80,000 for a pointless organisation. USI are riddled with problems. There are far too many sabbats that are on a full time basis.

What are these area officers for? This is a question that i have asked USI many times and have never been able to give me a concrete answer.

The welfare officers job is covered repeatedly on the officer board, with the LGBT and equality officers. Last year when they tried to remove the LGBT officer from the board the LGBT crowd went mad, understandably they are looking out for themselves. But in saying that, the removal of the LGBT officer was in the long run for the greater good as i believe it was being done to make room for more longterm staff members( which would have been good because the turnover of officers every year is ridiculous).

But the narrow minded special interest groups, like the LGBT groups are the ones that dictate USI and unfortunately they do it for their own beliefs not for the great good of the student body.

Also just to point out that the type of people DCUSU will be dealing with:

Last year St Pat's pulled out ( well done to them) . The USI campaign to keep them in was a personal attack on the current President, who's name slips my mind right now. Saying that he personally wasted the students money. Bla bla bla. Anyway the point im making is that St Pats really only give USI like €10,000 a year. USI had a bad campaign to keep them in and looked like they didn't care. Which is odd for a group that stands for all students. It also leads me to believe that they don't care about whether or not DCU is in it, it's whether or not they have the €80,000 from DCU.

Last year the now current deputy preisdent, told DCU if they wanted to change it, join. That is bollocks. USI is a failure of an organisation, who have repeatedly failed at doing their Job.

Their national representation is terrible. The president sits with the HEA, but do the listen to him? Well unless he said the thing to do is get a 9% reduction in head count in the colleges to combat the lack of fees, i don't think they are. The government can put up the student service charge as much as they want contrary to what USI tell you.

DCUSU rejoining in a complete waste of money. Money that is usually spent on the stuff THAT THEY ALREADY GOT WITHOUT USI.

MonaghanPenguin

Dj Stiggie wrote: »

Sorry I should elaborate on that. The €3 is not for a conference, it is to cover the cost of travel and training for things such as Class Rep training and Pink Training for LGBT. I'm sure more information on the breakdown will be provided in the coming days.


With regards to someone else asking how it will be paid, it will be added on to your registration fee, but the first year is free. But we only get 6 votes as opposed to the 16 we'll get when we pay.

And no, students cannot individually opt out of joining

EDIT: Penguin, if you're referring to my original post with regards to costs, I never mentioned a conference, you're the only onw who said anything about it

Take a look at my original post and you'll see where I said I heard it from. €3 per student for class rep training and travel isn't even worth it. That's €30,000 from DCU for those things. Anyone who asks whether USI is worth it should consider that figure for a moment.

Give me that budget alone and I could organise class rep training for the entire country for a number of years. I speak having organised/helping to organise DCU Class Rep training a number of times.

MightyMighty737

Forget USI, the main priority of the SU should be getting FIFA11 in the xbox room!



Also, what in the name of god is pink training!?

irish_boy90

MightyMighty737 wrote: »

Forget USI, the main priority of the SU should be getting FIFA11 in the xbox room!



Also, what in the name of god is pink training!?

you could just bring it in yourself

supine

while i respect the right of dcu students to vote on this, hopefully a resounding no vote will put this issue to bed until USI reforms

I didn't even know they existed until 3 and a half years in DCU and since then i haven't heard a convincing argument to join them. In their current form, anything they could possibly do for us, we can do more efficiantly and cheaper ourselves here if we are not already doing so.

Put it this way, if USI went on Dragon's Den where the dragons were successful DCU Aliumni and had to justify being invested in, I suspect the response would be a resounding "I'm out!"

Green Hand Guy

phantom_lord wrote: »

So this doesn't seem to be in the interest of the average DCU student at all.

So what's the SUs agenda for joing?

Far as I can see, last year the College View seemed to become USI propoganda soc and forced the question onto the agenda.

supine

Green Hand Guy wrote: »

Far as I can see, last year the College View seemed to become USI propoganda soc and forced the question onto the agenda.

well they need some content...those spelling mistakes aren't going to make themselves

Winters

Join the USI? What a stupid idea. Another organisation with no real ability to make a decision or difference to any student. Great way to waste good money that could be spent on drink.

DCU SU would be better off ignoring the USI and getting on with solving their own problems. There was good reasons for the SU to leave it when we did and nothing has changed to make the USI in anyway beneficial to DCU Students.

monument

Is there anybody reading this thread who is willing to defend joining USI?

Garseys

monument wrote: »

Is there anybody reading this thread who is willing to defend joining USI?

If they were, they wouldnt say everyone who's posted so far is pretty much Anti-USI.:pac:

Considering 3 ex-SU sabats(who as myk pointed out earlier have already dealt with them) have already posted here aswell;)

Sephiroth_vg

i dont even understand what we will gain from it

MonaghanPenguin

monument wrote: »

Is there anybody reading this thread who is willing to defend joining USI?

I'd defend the idea behind USI any day. I've always believed in a strong, well organised national union for students. Unfortunately it's a few key words in that sentence that makes me reject the reality of what USI has become. A pale insignificant joke of itself.

college1988

St. Pat's wiped the floor against USI. Over 1,200 people voted and 96% of those voted to disaffiliate. The point of the matter is that they had an excellent campaign plastered around the college in comparison to the moronic campaign run by the heads of USI which attacked the pres and completely backfired. The reason why Maynooth fell back into U.S.I. was because the no campaign was poorly organized and the nuimSU remained unbiased, thus USI had no one to campaign against. To summaries there needs to be a competent anti USI campaign similar to st. pat's and also su cannot be unbiased on this matter!!!

I guess we can only wait for the next College View

RyDar

I was at the class rep training,what I gathered from this is that USI is all talk and no walk, they haven't actually done anything.All they can say is "we plan to do this and plan to this,and this and this and this", they are a stagnant,politically affiliated organisation that would have zero benefit to the students of DCU. My own personal opinion is that the only reason they want us to join is because it's 10,000 more soldiers to add to their ranks.

If we join this year then it will be free,but we will have to pay the next year, however even if we join this year we will not be able to avail of many (if any) USI facilities such as PINK training,Sab training and most other benefits.

I am 100% for the student body deciding whether we affiliate or not, that's why we passed a vote for a campus-wide referendum,however my own personal opinion is that it is an organisation which acts in its' own interest before it acts in the interest of students,they can talk the talk but they can't walk the walk and any affiliation with this organisation is of little or no benefit to DCU students and the 8 euro a year fee (which every student has to pay) could go to much better causes across the campus.

Laydee

gizmo wrote: »

So are the SU taking a side on this or do they have to remain impartial? If so, then I hope to hell we have some competent people leading the no vote.

Anyone can start a No campaign afaik.

Gman1

Ive been reading through this topic, and then had a gander at the USI's website. To me all they seem to do is provide information to students, organise marches, and fight for rights of students.

This is from their website on what they actually do, and to be honest it aint much. Some of the below are in the EQUAL STATUS ACT, 2000.

So there isnt much point to join the USI.

The Union works for:
- An education & training system open to all, irrespective of any consideration of national origin, race, sex, sexuality, creed, political beliefs or economic circumstances, so that each individual can realise their full potential in the service of the Irish people.

- An education & training system that through the development of art and literature, natural and social sciences truly serves the interests of the people of Ireland.

- The right of students to a decent standard of living, with the right to adequate financial support, proper housing and future prospects of employment in Ireland.

- The defence and promotion of all democratic and human rights.

- The provision of student services for the benefit of the membership on the principle that control of student services should lie with the membership.

Hauk

We really really should rejoin the USI. We should at least unify under a national student banner.

myk

Mr.S wrote: »

Hmm. Could this have anything to do with the proposition of higher college fees and all that?

Noticed that the USI are on the posters for the student march. Seems like every college is trying to gang up, and going through USI seems like the best way?

DCU can co-operate with USI on student marches and national campaigns. That is what we did when I was in DCU and active in the SU. It is not necessary to affiliate and pay €8 in order to work on a national campaign.

Interestingly though the current USI officers seem more and more keen to not co-operate with disaffiliates by cutting them off from Pink Training and other activities. Seems like a bad attitude to me.

gizmo

Hauk wrote: »

We really really should rejoin the USI. We should at least unify under a national student banner.

myk

Hauk wrote: »

We really really should rejoin the USI. We should at least unify under a national student banner.

That is an expensive banner you are looking at; an expensive, unreformed, low-quality banner.

lithiumoxide

What about forming an alternative to USI? I know there'd be a lot of work involved in setting it up and then developing it, but if there was a better alternative to USI maybe some universities would change over?

myk

lithiumoxide wrote: »

What about forming an alternative to USI? I know there'd be a lot of work involved in setting it up and then developing it, but if there was a better alternative to USI maybe some universities would change over?

I think a better option would be for DCU SU to set out what they want from a national union including maximum costs, number of sabbats, role of sabbats, what focus on issues. Then to say to USI that we would affiliate if they reach those criteria. Obviously different colleges will want different things from a national union, but such a plan would be a good start to the reform process.