Speed camera mega-thread ***Read first post before posting***

cyclopath2001

dr.fuzzenstein wrote: »

That's evading the question.

You're trying to evade the subject by dragging in unrelated matters.

dr.fuzzenstein wrote: »

And what the hell are you doing in motors anyway, since you're obviously a car-hating cyclist?

---

> Cycling forum, on yer bike!

I drive a car and like many other drivers, obey the laws. I detest people who break road traffic laws and then try to rationalise their way out of blame. That's what happens in this thread.

SeanW

But you're still evading the question: do you feel as passionately about CYCLISTS who break the law? Or just motorists?

If you want to talk about cyclists... Does this death before enforcement requirement a few of you have apply to cyclists too, or just motorists for some reason?

No frankly, I don't care greatly about law breaking cyclists as - most of the time - they're not a serious danger. As far as I am concerned, a cyclist running a red light when there's clearly nothing on the junction or cycling on an empty footpath is the same as a motorist "speeding" when its safe to break the speed limit, like that HQDC in Ennis with the 50kph limit, or a regional road that is very wide and very straight, etc. Both occur with extreme and predictable regularity.

But I'm not the one going on about "THE LAW IS THE LAW AND IT MUST BE ENFORCED!!

(but only against one group)

" mantra. And im not doing so while posting under a username which glorifies insane behaviour by the other group.

I detest people who break road traffic laws and then try to rationalise their way out of blame. That's what happens in this thread.

But yet your username glorifies this precisely this type of behaviour!

SeanW

cyclopath2001 wrote: »

You're trying to evade the subject by dragging in unrelated matters.

No, it is related. You're saying the law is the law, and suggesting that all traffic laws are equal.

However you also give the impression that, like the animals in Animal Farm, "some laws are more equal than others"

I would like you to clarify this before I put you on "Ignore."

Our man in Havana

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8hGvQtumNAY

Iwannahurl

SeanW wrote: »

...

As far as I am concerned, a cyclist running a red light when there's clearly nothing on the junction or cycling on an empty footpath is the same as a motorist "speeding" when its safe to break the speed limit, like that HQDC in Ennis with the 50kph limit, or a regional road that is very wide and very straight, etc.

But I'm not the one going on about "THE LAW IS THE LAW AND IT MUST BE ENFORCED!!

(but only against one group)

" mantra. And im not doing so while posting under a username which glorifies insane behaviour by the other group.

But yet your username glorifies this precisely this type of behaviour!

Talk about clutching at straws!

There is no valid comparison to be made between a bicycle and a motorised vehicle travelling at speeds in excess of any given limit. How many people have been killed or seriously injured in single-vehicle crashes involving push-bikes? How many pedestrians (or cyclists) have been killed or seriously injured in collisions with bicycles?

FWIW, I think laws regulating cyclists should be enforced. The fact that they are not is a reflection of Ireland's habitual culture of non-compliance, IMO. However, there's also the matter of priorities and cost-effective allocation of resources. It would make little sense and provide relatively little benefit in terms of reduced road deaths to pursue footpath cyclists, for example, with the same degree of rigour as drink-driving limits and speeding.

cyclopath2001

SeanW wrote: »

I would like you to clarify this before I put you on "Ignore."

I don't mind if you ignore me as long as you don't ignore speed limits.

SeanW

So you're not going to answer the question?

Reg'stoy

cyclopath2001 wrote: »

I don't mind if you ignore me as long as you don't ignore speed limits.

SeanW wrote: »

So you're not going to answer the question?

I have to agree with the others here cyclopath. I do believe that to balance your position you should answer the question. We can hardly expect others to accept that all speed limits whether or not they believe them to be correct should be obeyed, while at the same time seem (even if you don't mean to) think that cyclists can ignore certain rules of the road when it suits them and not be seen as slightly uneven.

I along with other road users see cyclists flout particular rules of the road when it suits them. The arguement that they don't impinge on general road safety as much as say breaking speed limits does not really hold water if we expect that all rules/laws of the road what ever the user should be obeyed.

cyclopath2001

Reg'stoy wrote: »

while at the same time seem (even if you don't mean to) think that cyclists can ignore certain rules of the road when it suits them and not be seen as slightly uneven.

What you say is utterly irrational. You ascribe a position to me, while at the same time acknowledging that I have not expressed it.

Is me, or a straw man, that you are attacking?

More distraction from the matter at hand, I fear.

Reg'stoy

cyclopath2001 wrote: »

What you say is utterly irrational. You ascribe a position to me, while at the same time acknowledging that I have not expressed it.

Is me, or a straw man, that you are attacking?

More distraction from the matter at hand, I fear.

Unfortunatly that is your problem you haven't take a position.

My position is I believe that the cameras are not revenue genertors and stand over that, you however state that everyone should obey all speed limits (all very laudable) but when asked as to whether or not other road users as in cyclist should also be held to as a high a standard you evade the question.

I'm not arguing with you but in not answering a fairly reasonable query you are being a wee bit duplicitous.

-Chris-

cyclopath2001 wrote: »

What you say is utterly irrational. You ascribe a position to me, while at the same time acknowledging that I have not expressed it.

Is me, or a straw man, that you are attacking?

More distraction from the matter at hand, I fear.

If you actually stated a position, we'd be able to move on from this part of the discussion.

cyclopath2001

-Chris- wrote: »

If you actually stated a position, we'd be able to move on from this part of the discussion.

My position is, and always has been, that people should obey road traffic laws and that any argument against the laws or how they are enforced should be based on facts and reasoning.

Could you now ask the others what their position is on these fundamentals or are you singling me out for special attention?

-Chris-

cyclopath2001 wrote: »

Could you now ask the others if what their position is on these fundamentals or are you singling me out for special attention?

I'm just asking a question, and I'm glad we can move on from this, but if there's any poster you think is being "fuzzy" with their answers, please point them out and we as a collective will try and question them to discern their true motives.

JamesBond2010

What the Hell are ye arguing about now !!..makes no sense lst few pages,

cyclopath2001

JamesBond2010 wrote: »

What the Hell are ye arguing about now !!..makes no sense lst few pages,

Some motorists don't want to discuss speed compliance, so they've tried to drag cyclist misbehaviour into the discussion.

jimmynokia

cyclopath2001 wrote: »

JamesBond2010 wrote: »

What the Hell are ye arguing about now !!..makes no sense lst few pages,

Some motorists don't want to discuss speed compliance, so they've tried to drag cyclist misbehaviour into the discussion.

And then there is some cyclists that think they own the road,and some that are totally silly,at night with no lights or reflector bands who still think they are in the right.

SeanW

cyclopath2001 wrote: »

Some motorists don't want to discuss speed compliance, so they've tried to drag cyclist misbehaviour into the discussion.

No, some motorists thought you had a one sided, hypocritical view that road law is only for motorists. Many of us felt it was necessary to clarify this.

cyclopath2001 wrote: »

My position is, and always has been, that people should obey road traffic laws and that any argument against the laws or how they are enforced should be based on facts and reasoning.

Ok, so I assume that you have an equal probelm with law breaking cyclists/pedestrians as you do motorists?

Could you now ask the others what their position is on these fundamentals or are you singling me out for special attention?

No, we have all been clear about our positions.

To clarify my own, I feel that enforcement of road law should be based on common sense. In particular in relation to speed limits, they should be enforced where there are known problems, it doesn't have to be a history of fatalities, it could also be a history of injuries, residents complaining of people speeding through their neighborhoods etc.

One example of this is in Carrickboy, Co. Longford. It's a tiny village on a crossroads with a 60kph speed limit for a short distance. As a motorist I have always obeyed it because I feel it to be very reasonable. However, I read about a year or two ago that a speeding lorry demolished a garden wall of one of the buildings on the corner. According to the article, it was not the first time a speeding lorry had caused damage in the vicinity, but that car drivers in general had obeyed the speed limit.

Areas like this - where there is a clear history of speed related hazards - are candidates for full time, signed in advance, SPECS type cameras.
That is to say that at known speed danger areas, such as Carrickboy, there should be 24/7 permanent fixed speed montioring with clear indication in advance.

Similarly if residents living along a given road feel intimidated by speeding motorists, they should be able to get a SPECS camera on their road, again, very well signed, to stop the unwanted speeding.

Silly speed limits, such as HQDCs with 50kph speed limits, or areas where there have not been problems attributable to speeding, enforcement serves no purpose and should not be a priority.

I take a similarly permissive view in relation to cyclists and pedestrians who break the red lights when they can clearly see that it is safe to do so. I would NOT extend that to motorists though, for semi-obvious reasons.
However I'm not exactly thrilled about people who cycle on footpaths.

In short, common sense should rule.

pa990

what the fudge have cyclists have to do with speed cams ?

imo this thread has gone off the tracks

SeanW

is that a Narrow Gauge railway?

pa990

MODS:

can we have a sticky, listing confirmed details about Garda Robot Vans, and GoSafe vans, ie radar frequency, Appearance, flash/no flash, range etc.


i'd be happy to compile such info

cyclopath2001

SeanW wrote: »

That is to say that at known speed danger areas, such as Carrickboy, there should be 24/7 permanent fixed speed montioring with clear indication in advance....similarly if residents living along a given road feel intimidated by speeding motorists, they should be able to get a SPECS camera on their road, again, very well signed, to stop the unwanted speeding.

We already have speed limit signs, why the need for these extra signs? And let's not forget that the much respected 'IrishSpeedTraps' is concerned that when drivers become aware of sped traps, they jam on their brakes and may cause accidents.

The most efficient way to deploy the limited number of cameras is to keep people guessing about where they might be caught so that they drive at or below the legally permitted speeds.

-Chris-

pa990 wrote: »

MODS:

can we have a sticky, listing confirmed details about Garda Robot Vans, and GoSafe vans, ie radar frequency, Appearance, flash/no flash, range etc.


i'd be happy to compile such info

Compile the info, I'll add a new first post that has it and update the thread title to refer to it.

ironclaw

-Chris- wrote: »

Compile the info, I'll add a new first post that has it and update the thread title to refer to it.

If you still have my thread Chris, feel free to unblock it as per my earlier request to remove it.

fasttalkerchat

pa990 wrote: »

MODS:

can we have a sticky, listing confirmed details about Garda Robot Vans, and GoSafe vans, ie radar frequency, Appearance, flash/no flash, range etc.


i'd be happy to compile such info

Not really much point on putting it o a forum because as soon as the van moves the information is useless and is hard to remove.
You could get a list of permanent speed cameras but most of them are on the garda website.

ironclaw

fasttalkerchat wrote: »

Not really much point on putting it o a forum because as soon as the van moves the information is useless and is hard to remove.
You could get a list of permanent speed cameras but most of them are on the garda website.

Take a second look there, they are offer tech info not location info.

But I'll be honest and say it would be meaningless to 99% of the posters here given the utter garbage that is currently be slung around. I'm sure someone will then have a safety report about how the K band radar is damaging our health as we drive passed etc etc. And we'll then fight about it until the actual people who know what they are talking about get drowned out by those who want a fight, like quoting stats or just generally can't read.

-Chris-

ironclaw wrote: »

If you still have my thread Chris, feel free to unblock it as per my earlier request to remove it.

Done - see first post

jimmynokia

cyclopath2001 wrote: »

My position is, and always has been, that people should obey road traffic laws and that any argument against the laws or how they are enforced should be based on facts and reasoning.

Could you now ask the others what their position is on these fundamentals or are you singling me out for special attention?

you single yourself out been obsessed with cycling on paths/roads not minding the roads do you stick to the speed limits,never break lights,stay in que,have lights on your bike.the correct tyre pressure,reflectors.
GAY BYRNES ANSWER THE NRA

Iwannahurl

jimmynokia wrote: »

you single yourself out been obsessed with cycling on paths/roads not minding the roads do you stick to the speed limits,never break lights,stay in que,have lights on your bike.the correct tyre pressure,reflectors.
GAY BYRNES ANSWER THE NRA

Does not compute.

ironclaw

Iwannahurl wrote: »

Does not compute.

For once I agree with you.

jimmynokia

ironclaw wrote: »

For once I agree with you.

does not commute maybe better