Garda inaction and our area descending into chaos

Utik

There has been an explosion of criminal activities happening in our area in the last 6 weeks or so. Drugs(heroin) are being dealt several times a day ( today, just right in front of our gate), fireworks, stones and bottles are being thrown into our houses, bonfires being lit, etc. Droves of teenagers from elsewhere running riot every day, in groups as large as 30 on some days. Most of the time when we or neighbours rang the police, they ignore our calls. If they come, it's 40 minutes or even 3 hours after the initial call. When they come 3 hours later, all the gangs have gone and the police treat our calls as a bogus call ( the police who told us this by the way). Most of the time, we ended up have to ring them more than twice.

A couple of weeks ago a group of about 20 older youths (about 17 years in age) were shouting abuse and racist remarks against me. They were walking up and down in front of my house in order to scare me. Then they started shouted that they were going to rob me. Even after ringing the Gardai 3 times, they only turned up hours later after they had gone. At this point the Gardai said,they could only ask them to stay away. Despite this, the following day, 2 of these youths were waiting around the corner from my house for me when I was coming home from work. Naturally, i was terrified until i saw my husband coming out onto the road with a hammer in his hand!

We reported this incident to the local Garda station and nothing was happening since. They did not even take my statement, despite the video and pictures that I have, which clearly identify them.

Only 2 weeks ago, a shot was fired between 2 different groups of thugs about 30 yards from our house. It seems that the only action taken by the police was to drive around the road about half an hour later. No attempt to find out or try to see if it had been a live round fired or not.

I have been trying to get in touch with the inspector and the community police officer whom never return my calls.

I live in the same subdistrict in which 2 polish men were murdered by similar thugs not that long ago.

Today's latest instalment involved some of the ring leaders trying to damage a tree with a roadsign pole, before making a systematic attempt to break a concrete wall with the same pole.

So, the questions that arise in my mind are: what is wrong with the local police station? Why is the situation on my road treated differently to other places in Dublin? And why is harrasment and threats made against me treated differently than when made to other people?

faral

i can only ad that my thoughts are with u cause i observe an escalating aggression among youngsters since 2 years.and this is not only lack of Gardi reaction <what country is this??> but total desruption of families.the parents dont raise their kids any more ,insted kids find some other heros.well some people here should not be given permision to have any family.im sorry for strong words but thats my point of view.ireland is the only country when i`ve met individuals illiterate!!!!jesus we have 21 century.....and this country was so called celtic tiger!!!i dont want to mention which country im from as rascism is raising. i want to say that i love ireland but i can see this ceautiful country going under just because everybody says "its not my problem and what can i do"

PanchoVilla

This is nothing new but I'm sorry foreigners are bearing the brunt of it. Back in the 90s certain areas of Dublin were no-go areas. Heroin was destroying entire neighborhoods until the residents started forming vigilante groups and punished anyone who they thought were dealing or using drugs. Needless to say this got way out of hand and a lot of people were badly hurt or even killed. Just another example of how little our government actually cares about the people of this country.

I can't honestly blame the Gardaí for all of this as they are completely unequipped to deal with this and the courts usually just give pointless suspended sentences to these criminals. The Gardaí couldn't enter the estate I grew up in, Castlepark in Galway, because locals would bombard the cars with bricks or even petrol bombs.

Thankfully my family emigrated to the U.S. and I was spared growing up in this country. Yes, there are some bad neighborhoods in the U.S. as well but at least the police have the means to deal with these types and the court won't hesitate locking them up for years.

Edit: My advice to you is to get out of that neighborhood as soon as possible. Don't wait for something terrible to happen. There are loads of places to rent now and you shouldn't be forced to live in fear because of some violent thugs.

Dotsie~tmp

Utik wrote: »

There has been an explosion of criminal activities happening in our area in the last 6 weeks or so. Drugs(heroin) are being dealt several times a day ( today, just right in front of our gate), fireworks, stones and bottles are being thrown into our houses, bonfires being lit, etc. Droves of teenagers from elsewhere running riot every day, in groups as large as 30 on some days. Most of the time when we or neighbours rang the police, they ignore our calls. If they come, it's 40 minutes or even 3 hours after the initial call. When they come 3 hours later, all the gangs have gone and the police treat our calls as a bogus call ( the police who told us this by the way). Most of the time, we ended up have to ring them more than twice.

A couple of weeks ago a group of about 20 older youths (about 17 years in age) were shouting abuse and racist remarks against me. They were walking up and down in front of my house in order to scare me. Then they started shouted that they were going to rob me. Even after ringing the Gardai 3 times, they only turned up hours later after they had gone. At this point the Gardai said,they could only ask them to stay away. Despite this, the following day, 2 of these youths were waiting around the corner from my house for me when I was coming home from work. Naturally, i was terrified until i saw my husband coming out onto the road with a hammer in his hand!

We reported this incident to the local Garda station and nothing was happening since. They did not even take my statement, despite the video and pictures that I have, which clearly identify them.

Only 2 weeks ago, a shot was fired between 2 different groups of thugs about 30 yards from our house. It seems that the only action taken by the police was to drive around the road about half an hour later. No attempt to find out or try to see if it had been a live round fired or not.

I have been trying to get in touch with the inspector and the community police officer whom never return my calls.

I live in the same subdistrict in which 2 polish men were murdered by similar thugs not that long ago.

Today's latest instalment involved some of the ring leaders trying to damage a tree with a roadsign pole, before making a systematic attempt to break a concrete wall with the same pole.

So, the questions that arise in my mind are: what is wrong with the local police station? Why is the situation on my road treated differently to other places in Dublin? And why is harrasment and threats made against me treated differently than when made to other people?

I was working in Benbulben Road (where youre from I assume) and went to the local shops for some lunch. A scumbag (bout 24) comes up to me and says "will I keep an eye on your van". Meaning give me some money or your van might not be in the state when you get back, the usual. Wasnt intimmidated Ive heard this **** before so I told him dont bother pal.

He turns away back to his mates tucking in his shirt in an obvious fashion to reveal an eight inch knife in his belt so I can see it. This is the crap I assume people around there have to put up with when getting a few messages. We have similar sub human filth in Finglas.

As for the Gardai? Incompetant and unmotivated. Thats from experience not opinion. Their "detection rate" is a joke and covictions uniformly below 10% for important stuff. The force needs to be torn down and rebuilt. Cant make the grade? Sacked, back down to rank and file. US style.

BostonB

Move area or move country. There is no good reason to stay somewhere like that. Not all of Ireland is like that.

pablo_escobar

i would move out Utik, Gardai won't do anything until a corpse is put in front of them... even then they'll do very little.

either that or higher some charles bronson type vigilante...Death Wish 3

you can't win against filthy useless individuals like that, they have no life, no aspirations to improve their own lives and basically nothing to lose...that's why the Gardai can't be bothered to do anything..

it's better to move out.

Dotsie~tmp

Become a vigilate and watch the Gardai turn into supercops all of a sudden. The may not do their job, but they'll be damned if you try do it for them.

pablo_escobar

and run the risk of being killed?

easier said than done TBH.

i lived in similar circumstances some years ago and of course you could engage in conflict with those making your life difficult, but in the end, it's not worth it..not worth the hassle.

you will end up in court just for trying to do the right thing.

Zambia

I assume these mobs of youth gain their power because they feel safe in numbers. These days local estates are mad up of houses that the residents have disconnected from each other.

This makes the estate easier to cause trouble in. In essence there needs to be a community built in this sense then everyone begins to know the people that live beside them and the families involved start to rise to the top.

If you are friends with most of your neighbours they may be more inclined to actually help you when gangs of youths gather. As you might be inclined to help them. Even a display of numbers will dampen their courage a little. They will still act the hard man but may not bother starting the next time.

You also need to get heard, in the last election you voted for someone get on to them about this. You have a local council get on to them about this. Chances are if a residents group start to get involved there will be less council property damaged for them to replace. Contact your local paper.
Get these people to also pressure the gardai on response times etc

Organise days to tidy the neighbourhood/estate ask a few local businesses to donate the money for bags gloves etc. Especially if you have a MacDonalds near by. Dirt attracts dirt if an area is dirty and run down it makes people think they have carte blanche to do what they like there.
Clean up Graffiti if you can. This also gets you and your neighbours talking and if Mr A spent a Saturday cleaning up a wall. Mr A does not want his son hanging with a crowd that destroys it.

This is not an easy task and I could be taking out my ass here. What you have to ask yourself is can I make this any worse? Its fight or flight time.

Oh and be really carefull in regards hammers and fighting back and the like if you strike a kid with a hammer you could kill them very easily. No one wants that.

On a thread recently I asked what crime did people fear/hate most and in reality this is it. Its like death by a thousand cuts. Best of luck in what you decide to do.

irishh_bob

Utik wrote: »

There has been an explosion of criminal activities happening in our area in the last 6 weeks or so. Drugs(heroin) are being dealt several times a day ( today, just right in front of our gate), fireworks, stones and bottles are being thrown into our houses, bonfires being lit, etc. Droves of teenagers from elsewhere running riot every day, in groups as large as 30 on some days. Most of the time when we or neighbours rang the police, they ignore our calls. If they come, it's 40 minutes or even 3 hours after the initial call. When they come 3 hours later, all the gangs have gone and the police treat our calls as a bogus call ( the police who told us this by the way). Most of the time, we ended up have to ring them more than twice.

A couple of weeks ago a group of about 20 older youths (about 17 years in age) were shouting abuse and racist remarks against me. They were walking up and down in front of my house in order to scare me. Then they started shouted that they were going to rob me. Even after ringing the Gardai 3 times, they only turned up hours later after they had gone. At this point the Gardai said,they could only ask them to stay away. Despite this, the following day, 2 of these youths were waiting around the corner from my house for me when I was coming home from work. Naturally, i was terrified until i saw my husband coming out onto the road with a hammer in his hand!

We reported this incident to the local Garda station and nothing was happening since. They did not even take my statement, despite the video and pictures that I have, which clearly identify them.

Only 2 weeks ago, a shot was fired between 2 different groups of thugs about 30 yards from our house. It seems that the only action taken by the police was to drive around the road about half an hour later. No attempt to find out or try to see if it had been a live round fired or not.

I have been trying to get in touch with the inspector and the community police officer whom never return my calls.

I live in the same subdistrict in which 2 polish men were murdered by similar thugs not that long ago.

Today's latest instalment involved some of the ring leaders trying to damage a tree with a roadsign pole, before making a systematic attempt to break a concrete wall with the same pole.

So, the questions that arise in my mind are: what is wrong with the local police station? Why is the situation on my road treated differently to other places in Dublin? And why is harrasment and threats made against me treated differently than when made to other people?

no offense but your obviously not of a higher social standing or else you dont know anyone in high places , the police in this country are highly political and how willing they are to take action depends on who is doing the asking

i saw this 1st hand a few years ago , my mother who is a widow and retired farmer asked someone to cut her hedges , now cutting hedges for a farmer involves hiring in someone with a tractor and cutter , anyway , the contractor accidently cut her neighbours hedge , this guy was a scourge to my mum and brother for years , he was also a well connected individual and also incredibly well educated and articulate , the kind of guy who would write to the minister for justice if he thought he wasnt getting enough attention from the local garda station

anyway , he complained to the guards that thier had been damage done to trees on his property , a few months later, my mum got a summons to attend court , in the end , the charges were dropped as the troublemaker in question wasnt interested in getting my mum in trouble , it was my brother he had his eyes on but thats beside the point , the guards were prepared to see a 60 year old widow get convicted over the accidental cutting of a hedge

how willing guards are to act depends entirely on who is doing the asking

i stress that this is in the context of a relativley minor case , they dont willy nilly dismiss murders but when its a case which will never garner headlines like the OP,s story , they know thier will be no consequences ( for them ) should they do nothing

gurramok

I feel for you Utik. I could of written the exact same experience 10+ years ago. I used to live in Finglas back then and it was a nightmare. Those youths back then have moved onto bigger things like been members of criminal gangs you hear about in the news.

Garda inaction helped them graduate to become senior crims. Nothing will change. Finglas for example has been affected by the street violence for nearly 40years now, it will never change. Same for all the other areas blighted by street crime.

Now I live in D4(actually Ringsend), and even though we have a few scummers here as well, the Gardai are so swift in responding and dealing with crime, its just a total contrast when living in Finglas. You'd actually feel safe here.

Your only solution to to move area as Garda action depends on your postcode. :mad:

bamboozle

elections are coming up, if i was in your shoes i'd be phoning/emailing all local td's and councillors asking them to help/advise, you'll be suprised how helpful politicians can be (especially with an election looming)

dare i say it, sounds like an area where Sinn Fein may have a strong foothold, they're local reps would be well placed to help out

mikemac

Feel your pain OP though your case is very bad.

Live near Ballyfermot in Dublin and the local kids just love to throw empty beer bottles at me and roar abuse. Scooter vandalised and trashed
I'm not even a local, it's not like they know me or have some feud against me, I'm only renting.

The gardai move them on and they are back the next night.
Tbh, within 10 years I'm certain a few of them will be on the news for getting into drug gangs and getting shot.
And I won't shed a tear.

Ballyfermot has a deserved bad reputation but area has the best of facilities, too many to list. So called disadvantaged areas often have more money pumped into them then anywhere.

I will say our local councillor is brilliant. Do you have a councillor in your area?

Utik wrote: »

Naturally, i was terrified until i saw my husband coming out onto the road with a hammer in his hand!

You can kill someone with one blow.
Be very careful on this, it could be your husband in jail, not the little runts

gazzer

I really feel for you Utik. I lived in a certain area of Dublin 15 for 6 years and a lot of the stuff you mentioned .. drug dealing, bottles and rocks been thrown at our windows, teenagers squaring up to you trying to be the hard man were an almost daily occurrance.

I joined the residents committee, went to meetings, plauged the guards with phone calls, contacted all the local councillors and td's. I even went as far as doing out a document outlining a years amount of incidents and the times they happened and the response to the guards.

Nothing changed. If anything it got worse. For my sanity (and also the fact that I was prepared to do a term in Mounjoy if I got my hands on any of the scumbags) I get out of the place and moved out of Dublin all together. Now I have a totally fantastic quality of life and it is the best move I ever made.

I know moving out of your house may not be an option for you but if it is I would strongly recomend doing it. Life is too short to put up with sub human scum

johngalway

I am not surprised by the OP. We have had reason to ring the Gardai in Mill Street in Galway. More often than not they don't bother to return calls, even important ones.

The only "advice" I could give you is to go to the station in person and firmly insist on making a "written complaint". There are various levels of "complaint", most are informal and result in a Garda caution, which isn't worth a sh1t being perfectly honest with you as it's not recorded anywhere.

If you get no joy from the desk Garda, then ask to see the Duty Sergent.

Do. Not. Be. Fobbed. Off. Be polite, but be firm and stand your ground.

Be prepared for a long wait in the station so go at a day & time you will have 4-5 hours free or more if possible.

If the above doesn't work. I would go higher up the food chain and ask to see the Superintendent.

If that doesn't work I would go to Local Councilors and all of the TD's in your constituency.

If that doesn't work then maybe consider contacting Radio Programmes or Garda Ombudsman or some other official body like that.

Try everyone, you've nothing to lose.

jock101

What about these poor deprived so called troublemakers, it not there fault this country gives them no options mainly because there white, Irish and working class. So dont be so quick to attack them for striking back at a society who treats them as filth. The samething has happened in English working class housing estates for years now, it only starting to happen here. A lot more to come in the coming years.:rolleyes:

AlekSmart

I live in the same subdistrict in which 2 polish men were murdered by similar thugs not that long ago.

Utik,what more can be added to your post than the above.

The responses say it all really,and almost uniform in their advising you to flee.

What a statement of just how modern Ireland sees itself.

We have,in a few short years,handed over the real power to a violent,destructive,non-conformist elite of sub-humans (That is not a description I use lightly)

Our Administrative agencies shrug their shoulders and pass the decisions sideways.

Our Legal System lies in a paralyzed stupor as it flails around in far fetched and expensive attempts to ensure fair-play and scrupulous attention to detail.

The Garda Siochana,enmeshed as it is,in a semi-permanent politically driven leadership race,sits idly by with those of it`s members who do show initiative and determination in the face of naked aggression and anti-social challenges quickly sidelined in favour of those Gardai who "know the ropes",particularly the PC ropes which regularly hang the ordinary classes.


But even still,I`d say tough it out...don`t allow the modern Irish Savage to win out here....keep your profile low,and observe....

Watch everything about the ringleaders who target you...never pass up on an opportunity to surrupticiously disrupt their day or night if you get a chance....If they have a car/van for example having the DSPS Clampers number on your mobile can be a very heartwarming experience.....:D

Take reg numbers of cars or motorcycles you see them in/on and note down stuff,their clothing,hairstyles anything that they do that draws attention.

Get familiar with the Garda Confidential Phone Line 1800 666 111.
This underclass thrives on the maintenance of fear and will react with utmost savagery against you should you challenge them,so do NOT go head-to-head with them.

Unfortunately Utik,the "silent majority" in places such as you live are just that,silent and afraid,but for the sake of everybody you have to be supported and in the absence of the State supplying it then you have to try for yourself.

But always,always remember those two names...

Pawel Kalite. Marius Szwajkos.....they paid the ultimate price for refusing to bow to the savages, R.I.P.

Utik

Thanks for all your posts.
Unfortunately, to move to other area is not possible for us at the moment as we own a private house here. It will be difficult to sell a house in current economic condition. My husband is Irish born whose family has been living here for more than 72 years. I do not understand, why we the one who should move.

Faral - I agree with your point. If all of us just gave up, I am sure the place that you are considering safe today, wont be safe in the future.

"poor deprived"...."country gives them no options"....."striking back at a society that treats them as filth". Would that be the society that gives them free education, free housing, free hospital, free medication and social welfare, in some cases for generations? When we say free, really meaning paid for by hard working tax payers the same tax payers who are their usual prey. Such as a recently widowed neighbour in her late eighties whose door they left a rocket outside just a week ago. BTW that was no random attack she was targeted deliberately!

"white irish working class" - actually 4 of these thugs are foreign nationals, two of whom are ringleaders and I believe are Somalian. One of the two mobile heroin salesmen is eastern European. As for working class from a previous wave of trouble makers, the few whose identities became known to people living here are second and third generation unemployable.

Dotsi-tmp we dont live quite near Benbulbin Road, but know and feel exactly the atmosphere in which the two murdered Polish men lived. Actually the majority of the thugs causing problems here are from not that far away Slievemore Road to be precise.

"Become a vigilante and watch the Gardai turn into supercops all of a sudden" my husband says he remembers only too well about how communities elsewhere were treated years ago when they were forced to try and do something themselves.

"If you are friends with most of your neighbours they may be more inclined to actually help you when gangs of youths gather." You are completely correct to say that, but the majority here are too afraid and seem to want to keep their heads down.

I believe there is something wrong with that particular Garda station. One night when about 30 youths lit a bonfire and threw fire works into our houses, I rang the station. After waiting for about 40 minutes, out of desperation I rang other Garda station (at Crumlin Village). I explained them what happen and begged them to send their car into our area. They agreed to do so but they said it was once off as our area is out of their territory. Their car came and they cleared out the whole road in less than 5 minutes (two different gangs at that time) and we able to enjoy peace for 2 days after that. Conversely, if the local car does turn up while these youths are here they usually drive right past them and dont even stop!
It is kind of funny that the police send the community guard to school in order to speak to the students about ASBO. Most school days, some of them will even appear here while on their lunch from school! I know that some of these youths rarely spend their time in school anyway. So, yet another waste of time not to mention more of tax payers money.
Maybe if we lived in another constituency, the local representatives will do something, but not in our constituency.


As for today:
Our house had 3 rockets fired at it one of which went off on the roof.
Another house down the road had at least 2 directed at it this house was picked because the lady who lives there went out to them last week. The road sign pole from yesterday was used again by them in a continued effort to knock a tree down.
Rang the Gardai at 6.30 and again 15 minutes later Im positive at least one neighbour rang also. Gardai never appeared at all.

Antheia

I'm very sorry to hear about this Utik, I have a relative living in similar circumstances. He was living in a respectable housing estate until a couple of years ago a group of thugs bought a house in the area. Due to the younger neighbours finding themselves unemployed they have basically formed a gang with these thugs, It started as intimidation and has escalated into violence, Last week one of the local house owners discovered they had stolen personal belongings. Considering they are also on drugs make this extremely worrying. My relative has decieded the only viable course of action is to move, I would advise you to do the same if at all possible. The worrying part is that prior to the recession the majority of these people were employed and respectable members of society, It is saddening to see society decreasing to such a high extent.

Stinicker

I think people should organise and protest against the Guards in your locality for their lack of action against such scum. Quite frankly when Guards fail to do something people should dish out justice themselves.

southsiderosie

Have you and your neighbors started videotaping? It doesn't have to be obvious, but from an upstairs window or something. Tape what is going on outside, when you call the guards, what you say, and call every 15 minutes until they show up. Sometimes naming and shaming is the only way to get attention.

paddyland

Dermot Ahern should be publicly shamed over this. What the bloody hell do we have a department of justice for anyway?

Lockstep

Did you call The Citizen?

BostonB

I think you might have better results if you put pressure on the local politicians and newspapers.

murphaph

Stinicker wrote: »

I think people should organise and protest against the Guards in your locality for their lack of action against such scum. Quite frankly when Guards fail to do something people should dish out justice themselves.

Maybe that's what needs to happen. Decent people should not be living in fear of scum like the OP has described. Decent people need to stand together. These trouble makers wouldn't stand a chance if even half the people in an estate stood shoulder to shoulder and ran them.

gurramok

murphaph wrote: »

Maybe that's what needs to happen. Decent people should not be living in fear of scum like the OP has described. Decent people need to stand together. These trouble makers wouldn't stand a chance if even half the people in an estate stood shoulder to shoulder and ran them.

And if the troublemakers have access to guns?

murphaph

gurramok wrote: »

And if the troublemakers have access to guns?

Fair point, but what do we do, never tell anybody off ever again because they might shoot us? Where do we draw the line.

The do-gooders on here will tell us that long harsh prison sentences are not the answer, rather that we should embrace our tracksuit wearing friends and love them and throw incense over them or some other guff.

The cops should be armed and they should do a better job than currently, no doubt about that, but ordinary citizens should be able to pass comment about poor behaviour by other ordinary citizens without the fear of being shot at.

mikemac

Utik wrote: »

Dotsi-tmp we dont live quite near Benbulbin Road, but know and feel exactly the atmosphere in which the two murdered Polish men lived. Actually the majority of the thugs causing problems here are from not that far away Slievemore Road to be precise.

Another solution might be use your local paper, South Side edition of your local paper, you will see it in your local shops.
It's your paper so call up.
These papers love their shocking headlines, I can't remember the last time I saw the edition of this paper with a good news story.

They will run a story on it, might force the issue.
Maybe then the locals can get organized, have a meeting, bring along a senior garda.

paddyland wrote: »

Dermot Ahern should be publicly shamed over this. What the bloody hell do we have a department of justice for anyway?

The minister isn't aware of every incident but the OP can certainly escalate it.
Councillors can be helpful here, our local councillor is great.
But certainly escalate it and contact the superintendent and demand a better response.

Utik wrote: »

I believe there is something wrong with that particular Garda station.

Again, escalate it to the superintendent and beyond this if you don't get satisfaction

murphaph wrote: »

The do-gooders on here will tell us that long harsh prison sentences are not the answer, rather that we should embrace our tracksuit wearing friends and love them and throw incense over them or some other guff.

This thread has almost 1,000 views and nobody here on here has said that, well post 16 was joking.

Skrynesaver

As the OP noted, these kids have no intention of ever finding work, they've never seen a parent go out and earn a living and have no role model for normal family life.

The free education they receive is wasted on them as their homes placed no value on education, self-improvement or social participation.

Vigilantism isn't a real solution but the guards are hamstrung, the courts won't lock them up and when they eventually do in a few years after they've graduated to serious crime (not that terrorising someone in their home isn't serious) they come out as grunts of the criminal gangs.

I don't have a solution but I do know that there is an expanding cohort of these kids and they can destroy an area.

Are the council following up on their promise to evict "problem" families?

Are the child protection services protecting the rights of these kids when they are 5/6 by taking them out of destructive families?

I sympathise with the OP and feel we should have a better solution to offer her and people in her situation as otherwise we've effectively ceded areas of our national territory to these thugs.

bamboozle

BostonB wrote: »

I think you might have better results if you put pressure on the local politicians and newspapers.

this is the way to go, elections are looming, politicians and wanna be politicians are willing to please

Turner

Contact the Superintendent he is responsible for Garda resources.

Gardai in cars dont worry about resources, they just get into the car at the start of their shift and take calls from the radio, they go from call to call.

As the calls build up they form a queue, so sometimes you might be waiting anything from 1 minute to 6+hrs for them to arrive.

Its not like America where you might have 10+ cars patrolling a district. In Ireland its usually one.

bmaxi

Chief--- wrote: »

Contact the Superintendent he is responsible for Garda resources.

Gardai in cars dont worry about resources, they just get into the car at the start of their shift and take calls from the radio, they go from call to call.

As the calls build up they form a queue, so sometimes you might be waiting anything from 1 minute to 6+hrs for them to arrive.

Its not like America where you might have 10+ cars patrolling a district. In Ireland its usually one.

That depends on where you live. I once drove the MD of my company to Leopardstown golf centre to collect something he'd lost. I parked at the junction of Westminster Road and Torquay Road and counted three Garda patrol cars in the twenty odd minutes I was waiting.
Of course, this is the other Ireland, there probably hadn't been a Garda car in Monkstown Farm for a week.

Nehaxak

There's plenty the Gardaí can do so don't be fobbed off. They can place JLO's on youths for a start as a bare minimum. Take pictures (without being seen) of the youths causing the trouble and provide them to the Gardaí. Note down the times the Gardaí do call and if they call to you in person, note their names as well if possible. Phone your local station and ask to speak to the community officers for your area (best to phone during the daytime) then request if they could call out to you to discuss matters and what can be done - the community Gardaí are usually very helpful and a lot more so than just the Gardaí that might be on different shifts as they're specifically tasked to deal with stuff like this and liaise directly with the community, that being yourself. You could ask that Garda to request of the different shift units to increase patrols in the area if possible and to pay particular attention to your house.

Besides that, take a deep breath, sit down and write as eloquently as you can the complete details of what is and has been going on, along with the lack of Garda response as you see it and email it off to Dermot Ahern personally. You will get a reply from him, it won't be immediate but you will get a reply from him personally or his office. At the very least he will order a Garda report be carried out and they'll take it from there. Do NOT just accept that, every second day phone his office yourself personally and request some feedback and help.

We are and have been going through absolute hell in Ballymun with the same crap you are, worse even, but it's only since the introduction of the massive amount of CCTV here that things seem to have taken a turn and abated a little. It's only youths between the ages of 12 and around 17 too, anyone older than that seems to have more sense or at least not be such a prick to other people, even drug dealers and so on here generally leave people alone and don't bother anyone. Probably because those under 18 think they can't be touched, which is not true, there's plenty that can be done to stop them within the law and with the help of the Gardaí.

In fairness though, the Gardaí here in Ballymun do their best and have been very responsive and forthcoming to help with the crap that goes on from gangs of youths, placing JLO's and further actions including criminal prosecutions of the most troublesome.
You don't need to go as a witness with any of this, just provide pictures of those carrying out the anti social behaviour to the Gardaí, preferably the community Garda, and let them take it from there, the Sargent can speak on your behalf if it needs to be taken to the special criminal court if it is as such (or of course) deemed to come under the new anti gang laws.

What I would suggest also is that you ask the community Garda to stay over in your house one evening for an hour or two and see first-hand for themselves what is going on, preferably picking an evening that this crap is going on the most, which will probably be a Friday or Saturday night, though it sounds like you're going through it most evenings.

Remember that the Gardaí are only human like yourself, they still have the same fears and all that but they can and do act, you just need to hopefully get a hold of a community Garda and hope that they're nice enough to listen and help you out.

Please do write to Dermot Ahern and ask for his help with the matter and if you want to, you can send me a copy via PM on here and I can take a look and amend or improve what you're intending to write then pass it back to you to send off yourself in an email to him. Or PM me with your email address and I'll send you an email so you can correspond with me that way. I don't mind helping at all, sounds like absolute shít you're having to put up with there and I'd be only too happy to help you out to word an email to request help. Not saying I'm an expert or anything but I know how to word the letters and who to write too and what we could also do is see can we get one (or more) of your local TD's and councillors to meet with you and discuss the matters, if possible also for them to bring it up if needed in the Dáil or just with the county manager meetings in DCC.
Through all of that, even if no direct outcome is forthcoming, what you're doing is making the issue political and putting political influence on the matter, to further the issue and persuade the Gardaí (if even needed) to take further decisive action to deal with the situation, it can actually also help them out as they get a chance to directly request further resources if needed, or at least to point out that they need them urgently to deal with matters like this in your area.

Let me know anyway via PM if I can help at all, only too happy to do so.

Nehaxak

bmaxi wrote: »

Of course, this is the other Ireland, there probably hadn't been a Garda car in Monkstown Farm for a week.

I'm originally from Monkstown Farm, spent a lot of my younger years growing up around the old flats in mounttown there, lovely place, loved the whole area and the people, very fond memories. Gardaí got an awful time there though in fairness, I remember one evening a special branch car was carrying out surveillance of someone or other, complete with armed detectives inside - a large gang of youths proceeded to walk over to the car, rock it back and forth and eventually turn it over on to it's roof, with the Gardaí still inside and who stayed inside, upside down, until support arrived :eek:

bmaxi

Nehaxak wrote: »

Remember that the Gardaí are only human like yourself, they still have the same fears and all that but they can and do act, you just need to hopefully get a hold of a community Garda and hope that they're nice enough to listen and help you out.

The op's point is that they didn't act. Surely, supposedly well educated people who volunteer to become members of AGS are aware of what the job entails. I'm not asking anybody to put their life on the line but it appears to me that too many supposed guardians of the peace are only too happy to cruise around in cars all day long until they draw their pension.
Like most of the public service the Gardaí are ill disciplined and badly governed, I doubt if many of them can even remember their basic training. In my local station one Garda weighs 20 stone if he weighs an ounce, lot of good he's going to be in a confrontation, we'd probably end up protecting him. He didn't get like that by pounding the beat or chasing gurriers.
Before I'm accused of Garda bashing, (it would seem that warranted criticism is "bashing"), probably a lot of Gardaí did have a more idealistic view when they joined and the system has drained that.
One other thing, at a risk of being labelled misogynistic, there are too many women in AGS, this IMO, is a hindrance to the force in dealing with crime.

Sir Oxman

Ahern is looking for the judiciary to not send little scumbags like the ones in the OP down cos there aren't enough jail spaces.
He wants community work orders given instead to the exact little shytes that can terrorise communities.

Zero tolerance, eh?

Nehaxak

bmaxi wrote: »

Like most of the public service the Gardaí are ill disciplined and badly governed

^^ This for sure but it's down to a lack of proper professional leadership shown to the rank and file members on a daily basis and a complete lack of accountability as there is STILL no independent ombudsman for complaints and the Gardaí are still a very secretive and politically influenced group, which they should not be. There are some fantastic Gardaí who go out of their way to help and do their job well, serve the people and all that, but there are bad apples in there that go unpunished and some of them are not rank and file on the beat Gardaí either.
One only has to look at the news today to see evidence of what you've said http://www.rte.ie/news/2010/1019/garda.html maybe the little fecker deserved it, he probably really did, but you can't have our police force going around doing that and others covering up for them along with it.

AlekSmart

One only has to look at the news today to see evidence of what you've said http://www.rte.ie/news/2010/1019/garda.html maybe the little fecker deserved it, he probably really did, but you can't have our police force going around doing that and others covering up for them along with it.

Nehaxak,you`re not far wrong about the somewhat odd "culture" that permeates through the Gardai,and it`s not something that`s improving either.

However,the case outlined is ongoing and remember is also being contested by the Gardai concerned....so perhaps it`s best wait for the verdict ?

Amalgam

pablo_escobar wrote: »

i would move out Utik, Gardai won't do anything until a corpse is put in front of them... even then they'll do very little.

..and even then, it'll quite likely be a charge of manslaughter. Very fashionable at the moment.

_DMac_

bmaxi wrote: »

The op's point is that they didn't act. Surely, supposedly well educated people who volunteer to become members of AGS are aware of what the job entails. I'm not asking anybody to put their life on the line but it appears to me that too many supposed guardians of the peace are only too happy to cruise around in cars all day long until they draw their pension.
Like most of the public service the Gardaí are ill disciplined and badly governed, I doubt if many of them can even remember their basic training. In my local station one Garda weighs 20 stone if he weighs an ounce, lot of good he's going to be in a confrontation, we'd probably end up protecting him. He didn't get like that by pounding the beat or chasing gurriers.
Before I'm accused of Garda bashing, (it would seem that warranted criticism is "bashing"), probably a lot of Gardaí did have a more idealistic view when they joined and the system has drained that.
One other thing, at a risk of being labelled misogynistic, there are too many women in AGS, this IMO, is a hindrance to the force in dealing with crime.

the garda set up in this country is a joke. they are over policed by the ombudsman despite people thinking that they get away with murder all day everyday. the gardai are under resourced and under paid and with the set up in the guards they get into more hassle for doing work than not doing work. everyone thinks they make a fortune for doing nothing but that is far from the truth. the average guard is barely making ends meat if they are trying to pay off a mortgage, loans, bills etc. there is no incentive for guards to break their backs to help people and put themselves in harms way dealing with little sh!ts that know all they have to do is make uop some stupid complaint to the ombudsman and thats 1 guard screwed from doing anything productive until the complaint is dealt with. and this happens everyday. within the guards your GUILTY UNTIL PROVEN INNOCENT. how does that help with the averave scummer on the street gets every chance under to sun to get away with what ever he has done thanks to the irish legal system. i am kinda gone off point here but the guards aren't the ones who are totally responsible for this... (and no im not a guard before ye all start harping on about it )

the parents of all these little toe rags have the most to answer for. some of you may be on this, most likely your not but who lets there kids out all nite, not knowing where they are or what they are doing and when they do something wrong the parents will automatically believe that little johnny had nothing to do with it.

as for the OP its a horrible situation to be in. but all the big cities are like this in Ireland. little rats getting away with murder because the courts are too lenient, there are too few guards and most importantly the parents don't give a sh!t anymore what their kids are up to... if i was at that craic when i was a young lad my dad would have knocked my block off and that would be the end of it. unfortunately if you live in an area with high crime things like gangs of kids hanging around are not going to be the most important calls to be dealt with despite that fact that it drives everyone mad having a load of trouble makes hanging around your house.your only advice is keep going to the guards and keep making the complaints. it will be followed up eventaully and make sure you produce the picture's and point out the people that are threatening you .. there has to be some law somewhere that threatening to kill someone is illegal. don't let your husband do the hammer thing anymore either. he could end up in court for injuring one of them or worse still it could be taken off him and he could be the one on the receiving end of it. keep going to the police and try your best to avoid confrontation with the scummers is your best course of action for the time being i reckon. best of luck with it.

deelite

I wonder could the army not come and help the gardai out - if they can keep the peace in Chad surely Ireland would be a picnic for them....

Nehaxak

opcowner2007 wrote: »

the garda set up in this country is a joke. they are over policed by the ombudsman despite people thinking that they get away with murder all day everyday.

Not true.

Can the Ombudsman examine all public bodies that deal with justice and equality?
No. The Ombudsman cannot examine complaints relating to:

the Equality Authority
the Equality Tribunal
the Garda Síochána
judges
the courts (including the courts service) and the public tribunals
the prison service
the probation service and
legal aid centres.

Taken from http://www.ombudsman.gov.ie/en/InformationLeaflets/TheOmbudsmanandtheDepartmentofJusticeEqualityandLawReform/Name,11080,en.htm

_DMac_

Nehaxak wrote: »

Not true.



Taken from http://www.ombudsman.gov.ie/en/InformationLeaflets/TheOmbudsmanandtheDepartmentofJusticeEqualityandLawReform/Name,11080,en.htm

wrong ombudsman

What we do

The Garda Síochána Ombudsman Commission is an independent statutory body.
It was established under the Garda Síochána Act 2005 which involved very significant legislative changes for policing in Ireland.
The Ombudsman Commission, under the Act, is required and empowered to:

• Directly and independently investigate complaints against members of the Garda Síochána;
• Investigate any matter, even where no complaint has been made, where it appears that a Garda may have committed an offence or behaved in a way that would justify disciplinary proceedings;
• Investigate any practice, policy or procedure of the Garda Síochána with a view to reducing the incidence of related complaints.

http://www.gardaombudsman.ie/gsoc-garda-ombudsman-about-us.htm

starviewadams

We had this type of trouble in our old house which was on a corner where the youths would congregate.I used to hate coming home at the end of every day.Our windows were regularly bricked,stolen cars were burned out next to the house,and bloody syringes were forever being thrown over our garden wall.We were also shouted at and intimidated nearly every day for no reason.

We just tried to make as much noise as possible to the local TD's,councillors and Garda station and to the the local echo newspaper on a few ocassions due to the inaction of the local Gardai.We gave up ringing the local station aswell because the car would never come and just always rang 999 instead.Eventually ramps and CCTV which is monitored in the Garda station were installed and the area has calmed down a lot.

Nehaxak

opcowner2007 wrote: »

wrong ombudsman

What we do

The Garda Síochána Ombudsman Commission is an independent statutory body.
It was established under the Garda Síochána Act 2005 which involved very significant legislative changes for policing in Ireland.
The Ombudsman Commission, under the Act, is required and empowered to:

• Directly and independently investigate complaints against members of the Garda Síochána;
• Investigate any matter, even where no complaint has been made, where it appears that a Garda may have committed an offence or behaved in a way that would justify disciplinary proceedings;
• Investigate any practice, policy or procedure of the Garda Síochána with a view to reducing the incidence of related complaints.

http://www.gardaombudsman.ie/gsoc-garda-ombudsman-about-us.htm

Ah that one, right well that's not independent or transparent at all and not to be taken seriously in any way whatsoever. It's run by Gardaí, managed by Gardaí and everything investigated is done by Gardaí - cringe worthy stuff.
It would be like the bankers and developers who destroyed our economy coming together with the government and inventing some new body to help take over their bad debts and calling it something mad like NAMA

_DMac_

Nehaxak wrote: »

Ah that one, right well that's not independent or transparent at all and not to be taken seriously in any way whatsoever. It's run by Gardaí, managed by Gardaí and everything investigated is done by Gardaí - cringe worthy stuff.
It would be like the bankers and developers who destroyed our economy coming together with the government and inventing some new body to help take over their bad debts and calling it something mad like NAMA

it has some involventment by higher ups in the gardai i think but from what i remember their head man is from south africa or somewhere. and most of the heads in the garda ombudsman are from outside ireland....

good call on the NAMA thing though

Nehaxak

opcowner2007 wrote: »

it has some involventment by higher ups in the gardai i think but from what i remember their head man is from south africa or somewhere. and most of the heads in the garda ombudsman are from outside ireland....

good call on the NAMA thing though

We'd be better off with a fully, totally independent ombudsman with no Garda or political influence whatsoever in any way, shape or form. We as in the ordinary person and the Gardaí themselves. An open, transparent, disciplined and professional police force - which for the most part the rank and file Gardaí are, unfortunately political influence dictates they as a police force, remain secretive and immune to fully independent oversights and transparencies. For a neutral country as Ireland is, I find that worrying to say the least.

JonathanAnon

I dont see much point in staying in that area just because civil rights should dictate that you could live wherever you want".... civil rights only work for scumbags being arrested/defended in court... never for the people who need them...

You need to protect yourself and your husband... By staying where you are, you are keeping yourself in the firing line as things continue to escalate... You have seen from first hand experience that the Gardaí are of no use to you, but if you're husband had hit one of the lads (with the hammer) they would be down on him like a ton of bricks... And this would be a worry, considering that he already (probably legitimately at this stage) lost it at least once.. The last thing you would want to happen is for him to get banged up for hitting one of them...

It may not be seen as the bravest thing to do, or what's morally "the right thing" that should happen, but the safest thing to do is to move.

galwaystudent

JonathanAnon wrote: »

I dont see much point in staying in that area just because civil rights should dictate that you could live wherever you want".... civil rights only work for scumbags being arrested/defended in court... never for the people who need them...

You need to protect yourself and your husband... By staying where you are, you are keeping yourself in the firing line as things continue to escalate... You have seen from first hand experience that the Gardaí are of no use to you, but if you're husband had hit one of the lads (with the hammer) they would be down on him like a ton of bricks... And this would be a worry, considering that he already (probably legitimately at this stage) lost it at least once.. The last thing you would want to happen is for him to get banged up for hitting one of them...

It may not be seen as the bravest thing to do, or what's morally "the right thing" that should happen, but the safest thing to do is to move.

She said they own their house there. In this economic climate and with all the scumbags in the estate it will be nigh on impossible for them to sell so they are stuck there. The gardai would like nothing more than to see these knacks doing time but they know there is no chance of that with the ultra lenient court system in this country.

Anyway, I know you are pissed at the gardai OP but in fairness the system is rotten from the top down and the gardai take the least blame imo. If the gardai thought they could get these scumbags locked up they would be arresting them left, right and centre. The problem is, for the kind of harrassment and abuse they are causing they will get zero punishment from the courts (until they kill or cause serious injury) - they know it and the cops know it. There is no deterrent out there to stop these knackers from engaging in this behaviour.

Lets see, you call the cops, they arrive down 10 mins later and tell the scum to piss of...the gardai will get serious verbal abuse off these knacks and as soon as the gardai leave the knacks will be back in the area doing the same crap again....so from the gardai's point of view, whats the point? Its the judges, politicians and the justice that are the root of this problem. The gardai would like nothing more than to see these knacks doing time but they know there is zero chance of that happening with the ultra lenient 'justice' system in this country.

AlekSmart

I remember reading some newspaper article of former Minister for Justice,Michael McDowell,in which he mused that the Irish people would not be happy with a French Style paramilitarized Gendarmerie.

The plain people of Ireland, said Mr Mc D,admired and supported their Civic Guards and would be slow to support a "tougher approach to law enforcement".

I`d be prepared to debate that point with Mick McD,particularly if the debate was held on board a Luas Red Line tram between James`s and Kylemore or at any of the stops in between after dark.

Right now I would not have a Garda`s job for all the tea in China,as even the committed ones now see it as little more than finger-in-the dyke policing.

The current arrangements regarding juvenile criminality,even serious stuff,relies on the JLS as a magic-pill which will ensure the young reprobate is gently put-right without a stain on his/her character etc etc....:rolleyes:

I`m not so sure that this approach has worked/is working in any genuinely preventative way.
From what I can glean,It`s rather more widely seen as a means of facilitating a silly young twit into becoming a really dangerous older twit without having to worry about learning how to spell the word Punishment..or the definition of it.

Punishment is a word,in modern Irish parlance,which is universally regarded as dirty..a throwback to the dreadful days of Colonial Rule etc.

bmaxi

opcowner2007 wrote: »

the garda set up in this country is a joke. they are over policed by the ombudsman despite people thinking that they get away with murder all day everyday. the gardai are under resourced and under paid and with the set up in the guards they get into more hassle for doing work than not doing work. everyone thinks they make a fortune for doing nothing but that is far from the truth. the average guard is barely making ends meat if they are trying to pay off a mortgage, loans, bills etc. there is no incentive for guards to break their backs to help people and put themselves in harms way dealing with little sh!ts that know all they have to do is make uop some stupid complaint to the ombudsman and thats 1 guard screwed from doing anything productive until the complaint is dealt with. and this happens everyday. within the guards your GUILTY UNTIL PROVEN INNOCENT. how does that help with the averave scummer on the street gets every chance under to sun to get away with what ever he has done thanks to the irish legal system. i am kinda gone off point here but the guards aren't the ones who are totally responsible for this... (and no im not a guard before ye all start harping on about it )

the parents of all these little toe rags have the most to answer for. some of you may be on this, most likely your not but who lets there kids out all nite, not knowing where they are or what they are doing and when they do something wrong the parents will automatically believe that little johnny had nothing to do with it.

as for the OP its a horrible situation to be in. but all the big cities are like this in Ireland. little rats getting away with murder because the courts are too lenient, there are too few guards and most importantly the parents don't give a sh!t anymore what their kids are up to... if i was at that craic when i was a young lad my dad would have knocked my block off and that would be the end of it. unfortunately if you live in an area with high crime things like gangs of kids hanging around are not going to be the most important calls to be dealt with despite that fact that it drives everyone mad having a load of trouble makes hanging around your house.your only advice is keep going to the guards and keep making the complaints. it will be followed up eventaully and make sure you produce the picture's and point out the people that are threatening you .. there has to be some law somewhere that threatening to kill someone is illegal. don't let your husband do the hammer thing anymore either. he could end up in court for injuring one of them or worse still it could be taken off him and he could be the one on the receiving end of it. keep going to the police and try your best to avoid confrontation with the scummers is your best course of action for the time being i reckon. best of luck with it.

You'll get no argument from me on what punishment should be meted out to the gougers who are causing so much hardship to the OP and many others in the country.
The argument you will get is that the Gardaí are selective in which areas, geographical and otherwise, they enforce the law. I can guarantee there are no aresholes congregating around Dermot Ahern's house throwing stones and hurling abuse, the same will apply to the homes of the superintendents in charge of Kilmainham and Crumlin Garda stations, one of which, I would assume, covers the OP's area.
The captains of industry and the bank executives who have spent the last ten tears bleeding the country dry will, you'll be pleased to know, sleep snugly and safely in their beds protected by the police force they do everything in the power of their accountants to avoid paying for, but Joe Soap, fcuk him.