GOD

Cookie_Monster

Chairman Meow wrote: »

Why should anyone with religious beliefs HAVE to explain anything to you as to why the believe in it?

it helps you to find out if they are crazy, naive or just delusional

Scuid Mhór

mikerowsopht wrote: »

What's the difference between God, Jesus Christ, Santa, Easter Bunny & the Tooth Fairy - they are all fairy tales

*similarity.

colinod0806

curlzy wrote: »

Ah come on OP, we get it, we really do. Of course Athesists find believing in god or gods to be absolutely nuts, (I know I do) but at the end of the day can you PROVE there's no god? Like religious people must find athesists nuts. Yeah it's frustrating when people live their lives (or try to get you to) according to a 2 thousand year old book written by an invisable man in the sky, or 1400 year old book or 600 year old book depending on the religion involved but there's no point getting upset about it. Everyone gets to chose what to believe in, while I might think that what they believe in is nuts they still have the right to believe it. As long as no one is shoving it down your throat or making it manditry then you shouldn't let it bug you.

are these nutjobs claiming god himself wrote the bible now:eek:
down with this sort of thing!

keano_afc

Yawn. Cant we have a week on this forum without another angry athiest having a rant?

Pace2008

Chairman Meow wrote: »

This is exactly the kind of militant atheist bull**** that gives atheists a bad name. Why should anyone with religious beliefs HAVE to explain anything to you as to why the believe in it?

I agree with you here to an extent. I dislike the tenor of the original post, which doesn't seem to have much purpose other than to bolster a perceived sense of intellectual superiority or outright insult people. If one genuinely cares about issues like the secularisation of state and relinquishing of organised religion’s influence on society they should avoid counterproductive lines of argument like this, as belittling people only serves to entrench them in their beliefs and polarise the sides.

would you respond if i DEMANDED you explain why the big bang MUST have created the universe?

Like most people, I'm not too well-versed in physics and my knowledge of cosmology is nothing to boast about. 30 seconds into the Wikipedia article on the Big Bang and I'm completely lost. At best,I could only give you a very rudimentary explanation of the subject based on simple popular science literature. However, I'm sure if you actually took the considerable time to familiarise yourself with it you'd find a fairly robust theory in place.

In any case, no one (or no one who knows what they're talking about) is saying with 100% certainty that the Big Bang is the only explanation for the inception of the universe. It is a theory put forth that does a good job explaining the origin of everything as we know it, it not yet been falsified, and further failure to falsify the theory serves to increase its validity. It can never be completely proven, just shown to be very likely. Note that the fact it can never be completely verified does not lend any weight to alternative hypotheses eg. God did it.

Just because the great minds of modern day say that the earth mustve been created by nothing suddenly exploding, doesnt neccesarily mean theyre right.

You can't debunk a theory simply by making it sound ridiculous. The human mind does not even have the capacity to conceive of "nothing," so the notion that everything came from it is completely counterintuitive. Yet there are countless aspects of existence that are counterintuitive, and the evidence suggests this is precisely what happened.

And again, just because they are not necessarily right does mean it isn’t probable they are.

Lets not forget a few hundred years ago the respected minds of the day thought if you sailed too far youd fall off the edge of the world and the sun revolved around the earth.

The latter is a myth; during the middle ages the consensus was not that the earth was flat.

And the fact that the thinkers of yesteryear (who would not have applied the same scientific rigours as of those of today) were wrong does nothing to diminish the mounting evidence that points towards the Big Bang as the event that led to the formation of the universe.

I couldnt count the number of anti god threads ive seen on here, but i can tell you one thing ive never seen, anyone with a religious belief starting a thread crying how stupid atheism is and demanding atheists explain why the believe in nothing.

It’s been done to death at this stage, but the onus is on you to prove God’s existence. The lack of belief in a deity is the default, and if you ask someone to prove God doesn’t exist they’ll inevitably turn your argument back at you by asking you to prove the non-existence of any number of fantastical creatures.

There are numerous arguments for the existence of God, and if you go the Christianity forum there are posters there who’ll familiarise you with them. I don’t accept these arguments, personally, and I don’t agree with starting with a set position and simply building arguments around it, but it would certainly be preferable to the line you’re currently following.

I think it’s worth pointing out that accepting theories such as the Big Bang and Evolution does not necessarily conflict with a belief in God. I can see why people will express doubt as to their validity. Aggressive atheists are attacking people of faith and using science as a bludgeon with which to quash their beliefs. Theists detest this abrasive assault on their comforting values and view science as the enemy by proxy. In an attempt to fight back they look to find any perceived flaws with the magesterium of science and inevitably latch onto Evolution and/or The Big Bang. This is because fundamentalists who espouse a literal interpretation of their sacred texts have engineered the notion that the Big Bang and Evolution, which completely contradict their doctrine, are simply “theories” in the colloquial sense and are hotly contested amongst the scientific community, when in reality the former is widely accepted and the latter regarded as fact. These same fundamentalists will also tell you the earth is 5,000 old years and is orbited by the sun, and that people used to ride around on dinosaurs.

For the sake of credibility, do not side with these people. The enemy of your enemy is not your friend.

Nevyn

mikerowsopht wrote: »

How Can ANYONE still believe this crap these days.

What's the difference between God, Jesus Christ, Santa, Easter Bunny & the Tooth Fairy - they are all fairy tales

Can I have a religious fanatic explain how to why they believe as I simply can't fanthom this at all.

Do you think with our generation having more brains than the last that the church will still be here in say 100 - 200 yrs times within Europe of course.

Less & less people go to church every year apparently and I know of no one from my age / generation that goes to church

I respect the fact that people believe this and am not interfering but just need somone to explain it to me why or how they believe

Oh look it's another christian athiest, still brainwashed and denying only the one god cos they're is only one :rolleyes:

Seaneh

See OP, you've even managed to annoy the Pagans.

Duggy747

Religious Debate #2856791267

Non-Believer: There's no God!
Beliver: There is a God.

Cue something to this extent:

Non-Believer: No there isn't.
Believer: Yes there is.
Non-Believer: No there isn't.
Believer: Yes there is.
Non-Believer: No there isn't.
Believer: Yes there is.
Non-Believer: No there isn't.
Believer: Yes there is.
Non-Believer: No there isn't.
Believer: Yes there is.
Non-Believer: No there isn't.
Believer: Yes there is.
Non-Believer: No there isn't.
Believer: Yes there is.
Non-Believer: No there isn't.
Believer: Yes there is.


.................


Fast-forward a bit:

Non-Believer: No there isn't.
Believer: Yes there is.
Non-Believer: No there isn't.
Believer: Yes there is.
Non-Believer: No there isn't.
Believer: Yes there is.
Non-Believer: No there isn't.
Believer: Yes there is.

Non-Believer: ......
Believer: .........

Non-Believer: Did you see The Inbetweeners last night?
Believer: Yea, shìt wasn't it?
Non-Believer: Yea, it was a bit, lol

ClutchIt

Karl Marx: "Religion is the Opiate of the Masses"

Now that was written about a 100 yrs ago and it ends all these threads beautifully. The opiate is not real but it can bring a happy delusion to people. Not necassarily a bad thing (for those who want to believe).

Cookie_Monster

Thaedydal wrote: »

Oh look it's another christian athiest, still brainwashed and denying only the one god cos they're is only one :rolleyes:

wait, wait I thought there were 3. or are there 3 3rds or are they 3 sides of the one or do different days and rotate Sunday's or something like that.

TheZohanS

Paging Jakkass to After Hours, Jakkass to After Hours.....

thebigbiffo

can somone please lock this thread? i feel another ban coming on...

newmug

Believe it or not OP, there are people out there who think that science just might not have discovered everything there is yet. They believe that, although science is at the most advanced stage its ever been at, there is still a gap in what we know, and what we have.

For example, how did the big bang start? Where did all this matter originate from, the stuff that makes up you and me? How were the laws of physics defined for this space we live in, which we call the Universe, how come the Universe was just there for all this matter to explode into?

These people have a feeling that there's more to be discovered, more than meets the eye when it comes to the natural world around us. Hence, this as yet undiscovered knowledge/plane of existence/place is collectively called the SUPERNATURAL by these people.

Now, the supernatural doesnt mean ghosts and ghoulies like we see on TV. Sure, there are some religious zealots and nutjobs who see it that way, but most dont. It just means "above and beyond" the natural. Everything that exists will all be discovered by science someday, maybe we'll find out that God is an alien, and we're just a huge experiment, or maybe we'll find out that we're all alone in the Universe, or that God exists as Catholics see him, or Buddhists, or whatever. But until that time, these people just go with what they have.

As a Catholic myself, I know that it is historical fact that a man called Jesus existed, and said some pretty strange things. This was recorded by indepandant sources at the time. He claimed that a "God" exists, and that he was him, in human form, metaphorically, the "son" of God. He said that, indeed, there is more out there than meets the eye, and that when your physical body dies, your personality, or "soul" continues to exist, but outside the laws of physics as we know them. He gave some parables as examples of how science works, greatly simplifying them for the level of education of the people he spoke to. One classic example is the Adam and Eve story. The point of it is that God created mankind, but he leaves out planetary formation, evolution etc. as its complicated enough to people even now, nevermind trying to explain it two thousand years ago!

Either way, the people of the day treated Jesus the same way you are treating people like me. They said he was an idiot, how could he honestly swallow crap like that, he must be mental etc. In the end, they lynched him and killed him. A bit harsh just for someone having a different point of view, whether he was God or not!

So, to me OP, the idiots are people who think they know it all, who dont leave room for other possibilities, who narrowmindedly scoff at ideas that they dont agree with. If someone was to tell you in the late 1980's that by 2010, practically everybody in Ireland would be communicating by mobile phones and email, would you have called them an idiot? You can be an atheist and still believe the supernatural is possible, you dont have to go around praying the angelus at 6 o'clock, but to write off others who are traditionally religious and believe in a Jesus-style God just because YOU dont, now thats idiotic. Who knows, they may be right?

lmaopml

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Seaneh

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TheZohanS

lmaopml wrote: »

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TheZohanS

As Jesus one said:

האם יש האלופות כדורגל ליגת על הערב?

Pherekydes

TheZohan wrote: »

Paging Jakkass to After Hours, Jakkass to After Hours.....

STFU. That's all we need...

Deus Ex Machina

The god debate: nothing makes me want to find out exactly what happens after death more urgently.

Jamiekelly

Another thread on God in AH? Can some people please learn that there is a DIFFERENT FORUM for this.

Cookie_Monster

newmug wrote: »

Believe it or not OP, there are people out there who think that science just might not have discovered everything there is yet. They believe that, although science is at the most advanced stage its ever been at, there is still a gap in what we know, and what we have.

or course it hasn't but you can't fill in the gaps with magic and unicorns just cos you feel like it:D

KeithAFC

Another god thread with a thousand year question... been solved yet?

Sisko

What amuses me when religious people get all defensive when they're accused of being stupid for believing all that stuff, is that the same people would then go on and call those who lets say, believe in the jedi order, or follow a religion from one of the lord of the rings books stupid.

When they are one in the same.

Its equally stupid however to 100% believe nothing exists. Because we don't know that, just as much as we DO know that the "God" that all these religions talk about, is a MAN MADE FICTIONAL CHARACTER from a book.

This is why I don't describe myself as any one word when it comes to all this talk, Agnostic, Atheist etc etc I just say I'm not religious.


The thing is the universe or at least our existence in it could very well have some form of intelligence, or meaning to it beyond that of which we can, at least currently, comprehend.

All life itself may very well be connected or part of its own type of consciousness.

The fact of the matter is, WE DON'T KNOW THE ANSWERS to any of this yet, neither science and for damn sure nor some eejits writing books thousands of years ago.

To believe man has the answers is ridiculously arrogant and yes, also stupid.


So no I don't think its stupid to believe there is more to all 'this' then we can currently comprehend but I do think its horribly stupid to believe we do know all this, or rather to believe what someone else , invented and wrote down in a book.

newmug wrote: »

Believe it or not OP, there are people out there who think that science just might not have discovered everything there is yet. They believe that, although science is at the most advanced stage its ever been at, there is still a gap in what we know, and what we have.

How is the OP saying that? Are you saying that while science has not discovered everything, people that wrote books 2000 years ago have?

IT-Guy

TheZohan wrote: »

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Aswerty

Some people say the greatest trick the Devil ever pulled was convincing man that he didn't exist.

I say the greatest trick the Devil ever pulled was convincing the world that he was God.

dvpower

506c6561736520476f642e204c657420746869732074687265616420646965

strobe

Chairman Meow wrote: »

I couldnt count the number of anti god threads ive seen on here, but i can tell you one thing ive never seen, anyone with a religious belief starting a thread crying how stupid atheism is and demanding atheists explain why the believe in nothing.

They start them all in the Atheist and Agnosticism forum, I think about one a fourth-night is the average rate.

kumate_champ07

Mindkiller wrote: »

Am I the only one who finds the notion of eternal nothingness more comforting than eternal bliss?

The latter would get awful boring after a while.

the latter does not exist if you think hard about what it entails. nothingness also does not exist!

there is something in between..

Agricola

Pherekydes wrote: »

Pffft, Science is a development of man.

So the laws of the universe, physics etc are a development of man!

Wouldnt it make more sense to say that man has evolved to a point where he is discovering science and that the entity that was created was actually God?

lmaopml

dvpower wrote: »

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