The Protest

HavingCrack

papajimsmooth wrote: »

I agree completely with this, if the registration fees are to be increased to 3000e then they should be applied across the board not just for middle class families. My family is putting three of us through college which will result in a 9000e registration fee that will have to be paid. With the new taxs that are planned for the budget your looking at earning 20,000euro before you get 9000 take home pay. Why should I have to get a loan out to pay for college when someone who is on a free ride with grants and free fees just because there families are lower income bracket. College education isnt a right, I have no problem getting a loan to pay for fees I just think that so should everybody else.

I'm honestly not sure is college education a right or a privilege. It's actually quite an interesting debate. If undergraduate education is a right surely shouldn't a masters or doctorate be treated on the same level?? The problem in Ireland is progression to 3rd level is seen as necessary to gain any form of well paid employment. Years ago a Leaving Certificate was seen as a satisfactory qualification applying for a job but these days a college degree is seen as necessary even for entry level jobs in some cases.

Mushy

Just saw a classic image on the 6.1 News. They had been talking about it earlier, then mentioned bout doubling the reg fee. Had a camera scan across a lecture hall, and a student is clearly seen playing Solitaire on it during the lecture:D

rantyface

misslt wrote: »

Aaaaargh this makes my blood boil.

I am not from a wealthy background, I get nothing from my family to go to college.

The grants/support available are not enough for me to live on alone.

I pay €350 per month in rent. That's 3500 over the college period, say ten months. (I have my apt leased for a year but lets talk college only). Campus is something similar, if not more.

The maintenance grant is ~3300. Already I can't afford to pay all my rent and I haven't even got to food, books, travel etc.

I have to work about 22 hours a week on top of college (and I'm doing Actuary so it's not like I have 10 hours class a week) and can just about make ends meet. I leave at 7am, i'm lucky if I'm home before 7pm. I do that Monday - Friday, 9-6 on a Saturday and study on a Sunday.

Credit is damn near impossible for people to get a hold of these days unless daddy can guarantee it or whatever. People like me whose family can't? Forget about it.

You have no idea how hard I, and people like me, work to get a decent education. If someone will give me the loan, I'll pay it back. But what do you do when they won't?

Don't ever tell me ''it's time disadvantaged people started doing something for themselves.''

Rant over.

Not to be rude but your grant covers your rent and then you must be earning about E190 a week on top of that. That's a lot of money for someone with no children. Most students I know are on less than a hundred a week for food and bills. It's a lot more money than my middle class daddy (a teacher) has EVER had to spend just on himself!

Grinds and babysitting are a better way to make money if you can.

misslt

rantyface wrote: »

Not to be rude but your grant covers your rent and then you must be earning about E190 a week on top of that. That's a lot of money for someone with no children. Most students I know are on less than a hundred a week for food and bills. It's a lot more money than my middle class daddy (a teacher) has EVER had to spend just on himself!

Grinds and babysitting are a better way to make money if you can.

OSI wrote: »

What the hell do you spend money on?

I was well able to afford college and rent and living expenses working 22 hours a week when I was in college last year...

22 hours a week at €9/h is €198 a week or nearly €800 a month. That's more than enough to be living on. Even after paying €350 out of my nearly €800 a month wages I was still more than able to support myself. And no, I didn't get the grant.

Sorry, should have been clearer - I'm from the north so I don't qualify for the grant!

I get a small maintenance loan from the SLC in the UK - it's very small, about €1000, because I don't have to pay fees in the Republic.

Should have put that in my first post but I was too mad!

Also the point I was trying to make was more about the fact that I am working hard to see myself through college. I understand that I'm lucky to have a job and there's a lot more worse off than me out there - but I'm still working damn hard to be where I am now - that's what I was trying to emphasise!

El Siglo

misslt wrote: »

Sorry, should have been clearer - I'm from the north so I don't qualify for the grant!

I get a small maintenance loan from the SLC in the UK - it's very small, about €1000, because I don't have to pay fees in the Republic.

Should have put that in my first post but I was too mad!

Also the point I was trying to make was more about the fact that I am working hard to see myself through college. I understand that I'm lucky to have a job and there's a lot more worse off than me out there - but I'm still working damn hard to be where I am now - that's what I was trying to emphasise!

This is funny, because I'm from the South (well midlands, Co. Laois) and I go to Queen's and don't receive a proper grant either, that all the British students on my course (a PhD) all receive to cover their living expenses. Does this imply that their fellow Europeans or indeed Irish counterparts don't need as much to live on? No, but I get on with it as best I can. The world is an unfair place.:rolleyes:

This protest is a joke, get rid of free fees, use the money to subsides better higher education grants. If you want to go to university there is always a way, regardless of background. However, when there's still rat infested classrooms and children being taught in prefabs I would rather forgo the luxury of free fees when even primary education (which is in the constitution) isn't even catered for to appropriate standard.

parker kent

El Siglo wrote: »

This protest is a joke, get rid of free fees, use the money to subsides better higher education grants. If you want to go to university there is always a way, regardless of background. However, when there's still rat infested classrooms and children being taught in prefabs I would rather forgo the luxury of free fees when even primary education (which is in the constitution) isn't even catered for to appropriate standard.

This sums up what I think pretty well. There is always a way to go to college, but there are definitely people falling through the cracks, that with some aid earlier in their education would have gone to college.

The current social welfare system is not to my taste (it gives too much to some people and screws over others) and needs major reform. One of the biggest reforms I advocate is increasing the budget given to education and helping everybody achieve their maximum. Increasing funds for ill-suited, inadequate primary and secondary schools should be the first priority. Intervention scheme as under-performing kids should be another scheme. There are examples around the world of how successful such schemes can be. The JCSP programme is pretty good in Ireland too. Only when you see a school like those in the JCSP programme, can you see what a different extra funding can make. Getting people into university and the subsequent lives they will have can only benefit society as a whole.

Then lastly, I think it is extremely important to have a decent grant scheme. It leaves too many people outside the current threshold yet somehow has loopholes that allow some people get grants and help they don't really need. A root and branch relaunch is needed and bringing back fees for those that can truly afford them can fund such schemes.

pseudo_23

full time student working 35 hours a week. Third level college is not a right. Maybe if we hit pockets, you'll weed out the kids looking for a 4 year holiday. If you really want to do your particular degree, then prove it.

Witcher

They're are making a brutal racket outside the library with that fcuking siren, by all means they should have their protest if they want but distracting people actually studying is BS:rolleyes:

Save the fcking siren for the actual protest:pac:

Gi joe!

pseudo_23 wrote: »

full time student working 35 hours a week. Third level college is not a right. Maybe if we hit pockets, you'll weed out the kids looking for a 4 year holiday. If you really want to do your particular degree, then prove it.

How in the hell do you manage to work a full time job while being a full time student?

Ruski

Whatever gobshíte decided to throw bottles and eggs at the Leinster House now owes me nine grand. Fair play, moron.

unknown13

Ruski wrote: »

Whatever gobshíte decided to throw bottles and eggs at the Leinster House now owes me nine grand. Fair play, moron.

Drunk morons for you.

Ruski

unknown13 wrote: »

Drunk morons for you.

Never mind the fact that a crowd of eejits found this a plausible excuse for a pissup and bottling and egging the buildings, as well as people on the streets, is no way to convince the government to keep things the way they are.

Killer Pigeon

To be quite honest, I was abhorred by the sight of rioting at the end of the protest and what's more that members of political youth organisations, like Ógra Sinn Féin and the Socialist Workers party, were involved. I really hope that members of supposedly more civilised left political organisations, like Labour Youth, weren't involved in those moronic acts. If they were than all I can say is that they're making the left and liberals in general out to be nothing more than hooligans.

Conor108

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j2VzwLWvg00

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7pJ1Xy6WfFU

Killer Pigeon

Conor108 wrote: »

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j2VzwLWvg00

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7pJ1Xy6WfFU

If you look at the flags in the background it wouldn't come as a shock to assume that hard line socialists just came out on the day to cause trouble and had no real interest in the subject of the protest. I wouldn't be surprised if the government decided to reintroduce third level fees just for the sake of getting those knackers out of college.

delta_bravo

Congratulations to the Socialist Workers Party, whose entire membership was arrested (3 people) and congratulation to Eirigí and Ogra Sinn Fein. You have single handedly brought fees to the students of Ireland. Well done lads to you and your starry plough






Fair play to the lads

Killer Pigeon

delta_bravo wrote: »

Congratulations to the Socialist Workers Party, whose entire membership was arrested (3 people) and congratulation to Eirigí and Ogra Sinn Fein. You have single handedly brought fees to the students of Ireland. Well done lads to you and your starry plough






Fair play to the lads

Exactly. I think however that the people in the sit down protest (many of whom were not associated with SWP or SF) were peacefully protesting. It was the cowardice SF + SWP scum behind them throwing missiles who caused all the trouble and painted in the sensible students in a negative light. In the end, it was the people who weren't causing trouble who got injured.

RandolphEsq

On the bright side, with fees these thugs won't be able to go to college!

Riamfada

Lol. Protest = Epic Fail.

EduKate

RandolphEsq wrote: »

On the bright side, with fees these thugs won't be able to go to college!

Where you there? Take a look at this and tell me who the thugs are?

http://free-education.info/video-gardai-baton-students-in-sit-down-protest/

Riamfada

EduKate wrote: »

Where you there? Take a look at this and tell me who the thugs are?

http://free-education.info/video-gardai-baton-students-in-sit-down-protest/

Was that filmed at the USI march or the breakaway march? Also in true indymedia fashion it dosnt show any agression towards the Gardai. :rolleyes: Pure cack, should have sent Timmy Mallett in to knock six shades of shite into those middle class over privileged wankers.

Love the beret with the soviet star on it near the end.

Also can I ask why FEE isnt rioting for free fourth level education?? That would get my attention.

EduKate

Grimes wrote: »

Was that filmed at the USI march or the breakaway march?

Breakaway march

Also in true indymedia fashion it dosnt show any agression towards the Gardai.

Correct, it doesn't show any aggression towards the Gardai, yet they still batoned the crap out of people.

RandolphEsq

EduKate wrote: »

Where you there? Take a look at this and tell me who the thugs are?

http://free-education.info/video-gardai-baton-students-in-sit-down-protest/

There was a ginger lad there with his head bleeding. Fair enough, he was ginger.

Also, why do those knackers Eirigí show up and tarnish the valid protest of the USI?

Riamfada

EduKate wrote: »

Breakaway march

Why didnt they take part in the USI march?

EduKate wrote: »

Correct, it doesn't show any aggression towards the Gardai, yet they still batoned the crap out of people.

My point was the video obviously omits to show the violent nature of the protestors towards the gardai which warrented the response. Unfortunate that these people took away from the point of the march organised by USI which was fees.

Lets put it this way, if a gang of lower class unemployed drug addicted scobies congregated outside the department of finance and began to attack gardai by throwing bricks, cans and mars bars would we batt o'keeffe an eyelid over the riot squad beating six shades of red into them no matter how noble and socially progressive their motivations were. Or if it was say a gang of English football hooligans in Lansdowne Road in 1995.

How dare they treat the edukated middle class like this?!

Breakingnews wrote:

One Garda suffered a suspected broken nose

Must have been hit by one of the other Garda for a laugh and used it as an excuse to attack students?

Riamfada

To illustrate my point skip to 1:45 and watch until 2:00 of this video and you will see the Gardai beating the ****e out of some innocent protestors.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YOhQp8ENmzs

ya-ba-da-ba-doo

I saw a garda polax a girl with his shield because she 'wasn't walking fast enough'...
When I tried to help the girl up I was hit in the ribs with a baton.

Bunch of professional scumbags is all they showed they were today.

I stumbled along the after protest after i got grub on grafton street and the gardaí were an embarrassment.

As well as the gardaí being a disgrace, so were the USI.

Let me explain:
They're supposed to be arguing against the introduction of excess fees because students cant afford it - yet it was clear to see that on the bus where the speeches were made, half the people were pissed out of their minds looking to be a legend for the camera and the passers by - Not something students struggling to get by would be at.

How do they expect the protest to be taken seriously when this craic is goin' on?

And then they have the cheek to say they are 'saddened' by the 'riot' cause by students after the march?

From what i saw - Some of the guards were on complete power trips, ready to hit any man woman or child that got in their way. Nowhere does the USI mention anything about the guards inappropriate actions against what was practically all non-violent protesters.

The USI needs a leader with a pair of balls unlike the joke we have now that's just there to have it on his CV.


The protest was a bloody joke in all fairness.

EduKate

Grimes wrote: »

My point was the video obviously omits to show the violent nature of the protestors towards the gardai which warrented the response.

As you've stated, the people in the video did not show "any agression towards the Gardai", yet were beaten. Thanks for clearing that up.

http://free-education.info/photos-gardai-leave-students-bloody-and-bruised-at-national-student-protest-in-dublin/

Riamfada

EduKate wrote: »

As you've stated, the people in the video did not show "any agression towards the Gardai", yet were beaten. Thanks for clearing that up.

http://free-education.info/photos-gardai-leave-students-bloody-and-bruised-at-national-student-protest-in-dublin/

Your video is misleading, out of context and should be taken down along with links to your page which are also misinformation and extremely bias.This whole thing will fade into obscurity in the next few days so Im not sure what your expecting,the proles to follow your lead and take down the government based on the bruseys of some over privalaged celtic tiger spawn?

Speaking of the opressed masses here there are looking so horribly beaten,bruised and dispondent. All those smiling faces. THE HORROR!!

http://www.flickr.com/photos/gfox/5143977118/

Perhaps the baton wheelin bogballs did hit you a little too hard? Go to a brain doctor.

Riamfada

ya-ba-da-ba-doo wrote: »

From what i saw - Some of the guards were on complete power trips, ready to hit any man woman or child that got in their way..

Now if thats not sensationalist shiteim not sure what is. Was there really women and children getting the **** beaten out of them?

EduKate

Grimes wrote: »

Your video is misleading, out of context

Ah, the old 'out of context' get out clause.

The reason the links are there is so that people don't have to rely on a single clip, there's multiple clips and photos. Most of the footage is from 'ordinary' students that they've uploaded to youtube or Flickr, and have no involvement in FEE.

The people in the video, in your words, did not show "any agression towards the Gardai" but were still beaten. Is that misleading? Are you misleading yourself now?

Speaking of the opressed masses here there are looking so horribly beaten,bruised and dispondent. All those smiling faces. THE HORROR!!

Your image is misleading and out of context. It should be taken down because I don't agree with it. :P