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Atheists worse than the religious types they despise.

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    #122
    Morlar
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,273 ✭✭✭Morlar


    optogirl wrote: »
    This thread was started with the sole intention of tarring all +++++++ with the one brush and criticising and demeaning them for articulating their opinions. Not cool.

    Is that not what atheist threads on here do ALL THE TIME ?


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    #123
    prinz
    Registered Users Posts: 14,598 ✭✭✭✭prinz


    optogirl wrote: »
    So what? It doesn't make it right.

    It doesn't, but it helps putting a perspective on the issue.
    Shenshen wrote: »
    What's preventing you from just ignoring them?

    A lot of the time, sometimes I post on an interesting point which could be left at a single post, yet which inevitably descends into pages of discussion about whether god exists or not and a load of people champing at the bit to 'prove' how wrong I am (see other thread*)...if I don't answer it's because (a) I have no answer => religion has no answer (b) I am afraid of the question/answer (c) I am stupid etc.. usually ends up with said contributors patting themselves on the back for how intelligent and enlightened they are. Other times I post to correct people when they post something that's plain wrong.

    *I posted an opinion on one matter which could have been left at that. It quickly descended into a number of questions - basically putting me on the dock to defend my beliefs. What I posted could just have been accepted and the thread moved on. There's a number of posters who seem to have a compulsion tohave the same discussion over and over..


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    #124
    liah
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,750 ✭✭✭liah


    Morlar wrote: »
    Is that not what atheist threads on here do ALL THE TIME ?

    Is that not what dickheads in general post on here ALL THE TIME about <women/men/muslims/blacks/immigrants/politicians/students/take your pick>?

    It's NOT about atheism vs theism. It's just dicks. Nobody "owns" them, no one group is made expressly from dicks. Some dicks may be atheist. Some may be christian. They don't define either.

    Can we lock the thread now?


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    #125
    optogirl
    Registered Users Posts: 2,979 ✭✭✭optogirl


    Morlar wrote: »
    Is that not what atheist threads on here do ALL THE TIME ?


    No it isn't and most atheists don't go about declaring their thoughts on god/s unless the conversation is about religion in which case they have every right to tell it how they see it. I think most atheists are getting a little bit sick of being accused of ramming their beliefs down other peoples throats when this is not their modus operandi. If atheism scares you, that's your problem, not mine.


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    #126
    Mrmoe
    Registered Users Posts: 2,213 ✭✭✭Mrmoe


    Where are all these "religious people are morons" threads?, I feel like I'm missing out:p


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    #127
    optogirl
    Registered Users Posts: 2,979 ✭✭✭optogirl


    prinz wrote: »
    There's a number of posters who seem to have a compulsion tohave the same discussion over and over..


    Physician, heal thyself


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    #128
    prinz
    Registered Users Posts: 14,598 ✭✭✭✭prinz


    optogirl wrote: »
    Physician, heal thyself

    Really, how many threads have I started on religion? That would be, eh, none.

    How many times have I seen someone give an opinion as an atheist and rather than just accept their opinion and move on, started throwing questions at them to defend themselves? None that I can recall.

    How often have I said that atheists are inherently stupid.... none.


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    #129
    Morlar
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,273 ✭✭✭Morlar


    liah wrote: »
    Is that not what dickheads in general post on here ALL THE TIME .....

    tarring all +++++++ with the one brush - yes.

    and criticising and demeaning them for articulating their opinions -

    not that part no.
    optogirl wrote: »
    No it isn't and most atheists don't go about declaring their thoughts on god/s unless the conversation is about religion in which case they have every right to tell it how they see it.

    You can tell it how you see it - ie 'give your opinion' without ****ting all over other peoples.


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    #130
    Shenshen
    Registered Users Posts: 9,453 ✭✭✭Shenshen


    prinz wrote: »
    Really, how many threads have I started on religion? How many times have I seen someone give an opinion as an atheist and rather than just accept their opinion and move on, started throwing questions at them to defend themselves?

    Mind you, I have yet to come into ANY thread about religion in which you haven't posted before....


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    #131
    liah
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,750 ✭✭✭liah


    Morlar wrote: »
    tarring all +++++++ with the one brush - yes.

    and criticising and demeaning them for articulating their opinions -

    not that part no.



    You can tell it how you see it - ie 'give your opinion' without ****ting all over other peoples.

    Again, these traits are not exclusive to atheists. Members of all groups, all beliefs, and all ways of life do these things. Why blame exclusively atheists? Not to mention starting threads like this slandering atheists as horrible people only serves to make it more hypocritical. Fighting fire with fire does nothing.

    I mean, come on. Be reasonable and realistic about it.


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    #132
    optogirl
    Registered Users Posts: 2,979 ✭✭✭optogirl


    Morlar wrote: »
    tarring all +++++++ with the one brush - yes.

    and criticising and demeaning them for articulating their opinions -

    not that part no.



    You can tell it how you see it - ie 'give your opinion' without ****ting all over other peoples.

    Not really - I dont believe in god/s. That's pretty much ****ting on somebody's belief without even trying. I'm not going to deny what I believe because it makes somebody uncomfortable - I will not however bring it up or try to change anybody's mind.


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    #133
    prinz
    Registered Users Posts: 14,598 ✭✭✭✭prinz


    Shenshen wrote: »
    Mind you, I have yet to come into ANY thread about religion in which you haven't posted before....

    ..and? I have an interest in those threads...you know, by being a religious sort myself. I rarely (I can't recall any time) post in threads on atheism over on the A&A forum. You know, because it doesn't interest me all that much.

    In the God thread I posted something which could have been left at one post and which the poster I was replying to thanked and accepted. Before long there were a number of other posters questioning me on entirely different issues.


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    #134
    Morlar
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,273 ✭✭✭Morlar


    optogirl wrote: »
    I dont believe in god/s. That's pretty much ****ting on somebody's belief without even trying.

    I think that's a gross over-estimation of the value of your opinions. & no it does not **** all over other peoples opinions if you simply to not share them.


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    #135
    optogirl
    Registered Users Posts: 2,979 ✭✭✭optogirl


    prinz wrote: »
    ..and? I have an interest in those threads...you know, by being a religious sort myself. I rarely (I can't recall any time) post in threads on atheism over on the A&A forum. You know, because it doesn't interest me all that much.


    bloody hell - if it doesn't interest you why do you spend so much time arguing with atheists on boards?


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    #136
    prinz
    Registered Users Posts: 14,598 ✭✭✭✭prinz


    optogirl wrote: »
    bloody hell - if it doesn't interest you why do you spend so much time arguing with atheists on boards?

    I don't. I respond to idiots, and I explain myself to anyone that asks. There's a difference. Where have I argued with atheists over their atheism?


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    #137
    Gunsfortoys
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,080 ✭✭✭Gunsfortoys


    liah wrote: »
    Is that not what dickheads in general post on here ALL THE TIME about <women/men/muslims/blacks/immigrants/politicians/students/take your pick>?

    It's NOT about atheism vs theism. It's just dicks. Nobody "owns" them, no one group is made expressly from dicks. Some dicks may be atheist. Some may be christian. They don't define either.

    Can we lock the thread now?

    Why do you even come here if you think the views posted, are posted by dicks? Some of the ****e you post could be construed as "being a dick" or "feminist cack".

    If people want to express their opinions as you so freely do, let them.


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    #138
    Morlar
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,273 ✭✭✭Morlar


    liah wrote: »
    Again, these traits are not exclusive to atheists.

    I don't recall saying those traits were exclusive to atheists.
    liah wrote: »
    Members of all groups, all beliefs, and all ways of life do these things. Why blame exclusively atheists?

    Not sure I did 'blame exclusively' atheists - what I said was that atheists did all the time what one particular poster was accusing other people of doing. I never said only they do it. I pointed out that they ALSO do it and quite bloody often (in my opinion).
    liah wrote: »
    Not to mention starting threads like this slandering atheists as horrible people only serves to make it more hypocritical. Fighting fire with fire does nothing.

    I mean, come on. Be reasonable and realistic about it.

    Being realistic about it I happen to think this thread raises a mildly interesting point and one that does not get raised elsewhere too often.


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    #139
    optogirl
    Registered Users Posts: 2,979 ✭✭✭optogirl


    Morlar wrote: »
    I think that's a gross over-estimation of the value of your opinions. & no it does not **** all over other peoples opinions if you simply to not share them.


    but you are accusing me of doing that simply by virtue of being an atheist! I have no notions that my opinions are of interest to other people but I am also allowed to share them in a discussion. Athiests are not a culture or community, they come from all walks of life and are, in my experience, usually fairly well-rounded, morally sound people who wouldn't dream of antagonising religious people. Religious people may become antagonised based on the arguments put forward in a discussion with atheists but again, why shouldn't atheists state what they think.


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    #140
    Snakeblood
    Registered Users Posts: 4,466 ✭✭✭Snakeblood


    Morlar wrote: »
    I think that's a gross over-estimation of the value of your opinions. & no it does not **** all over other peoples opinions if you simply to not share them.

    I've met lots of religious people who get a bee in their bonnet if they express their relgious opinion, and I express mine as nicely as I can. You get questions about how one can possibly believe in nothing, expressions of incredulity, worries about marriage, children, surely in the name of god you'll baptise the children, and assurances that they will pray for you.

    Now that's if I'm being nice about it. If I tell them to **** off, I get a different response but it has the great advantage of being a shorter conversation*

    *I never tell people to **** off, this is for comic effect.


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    #141
    liah
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,750 ✭✭✭liah


    Morlar wrote: »
    I don't recall saying those traits were exclusive to atheists.



    Not sure I did 'blame exclusively' atheists - what I said was that atheists did all the time what one particular poster was accusing other people of doing. I never said only they do it. I pointed out that they ALSO do it and quite bloody often (in my opinion).



    Being realistic about it I happen to think this thread raises a mildly interesting point and one that does not get raised elsewhere too often.


    "atheists did all the time"

    No.

    Some individual dicks who happen to be atheists do it all the time.

    Just as some individual dicks who happen to be christian do it all the time.

    Correlation does not equal causation; anyone who's an atheist isn't automatically a dick. But that's what you're implying.

    Also, there was a clone of this thread just last week. Comes up more than you'd think.


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    #142
    optogirl
    Registered Users Posts: 2,979 ✭✭✭optogirl


    prinz wrote: »
    I don't. I respond to idiots, and I explain myself to anyone that asks. There's a difference. Where have I argued with atheists over their atheism?

    ah come off it man! You were in the God thread today doing just that


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    #143
    prinz
    Registered Users Posts: 14,598 ✭✭✭✭prinz


    optogirl wrote: »
    ah come off it man! You were in the God thread today doing just that

    Could you link the post I made in that thread which is me asking someone to defend their atheism? Or questioning why they are atheists? Or referring to them as stupid for same?


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    #144
    Morlar
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,273 ✭✭✭Morlar


    liah wrote: »
    Correlation does not equal causation; anyone who's an atheist isn't automatically a dick. But that's what you're implying.

    No it's not.

    The point originally made was this :
    optogirl wrote: »
    This thread was started with the sole intention of tarring all atheists with the one brush and criticising and demeaning them for articulating their opinions. Not cool.

    My response was this :
    Morlar wrote: »
    Is that not what atheist threads on here do ALL THE TIME ?

    That does not mean that ALL Atheists do this.
    Nor does that mean that ONLY atheists do this.


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    #145
    bnt
    Registered Users Posts: 12,989 ✭✭✭✭bnt


    Someone asked me what "New Atheism" was, and I came up with something like the following formulation:
    [latex]New\,Atheism = (Atheism - Silence)*Internet[/latex]
    It's not so much that we atheists are saying anything different, but since 9/11 there's been a new recognition of the real damage done by fundamentalist beliefs, and thus less of an inclination to keep quiet. Collaboration on the Internet is helping to clarify our positions, and making it easier to spot "straw men" when they appear - such as the OP confusing atheism with nihilism - and the way some types quote archaic dictionary definitions of atheism as if they were "gospel". (Who wrote the dictionaries, eh?)

    There's a basic problem here: if you aren't a member of a group, why the hell do you think you can tell members of that group who they are? If religious types were happy to keep their religions to themselves, and not try to make everyone behave according to their particular beliefs, you wouldn't hear a peep out of atheists, "old" or "new". If you want to know about atheists, drop the assumptions and ask.

    From out there on the moon, international politics look so petty. You want to grab a politician by the scruff of the neck and drag him a quarter of a million miles out and say, ‘Look at that, you son of a bitch’.

    — Edgar Mitchell, Apollo 14 Astronaut



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    #146
    prinz
    Registered Users Posts: 14,598 ✭✭✭✭prinz


    bnt wrote: »
    If religious types were happy to keep their religions to themselves, and not try to make everyone behave according to their particular beliefs, you wouldn't hear a peep out of atheists, "old" or "new".

    If only.


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    #147
    optogirl
    Registered Users Posts: 2,979 ✭✭✭optogirl


    prinz wrote: »
    Could you link the post I made in that thread which is me asking someone to defend their atheism? Or questioning why they are atheists? Or referring to them as stupid for same?


    I didn't say you did any of these things - I said you spend a lot of time arguing with atheists. And you do.


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    #148
    Morlar
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,273 ✭✭✭Morlar


    optogirl wrote: »
    but you are accusing me of doing that simply by virtue of being an atheist! I have no notions that my opinions are of interest to other people but I am also allowed to share them in a discussion. Athiests are not a culture or community, they come from all walks of life and are, in my experience, usually fairly well-rounded, morally sound people who wouldn't dream of antagonising religious people. Religious people may become antagonised based on the arguments put forward in a discussion with atheists but again, why shouldn't atheists state what they think.

    So you still contend that to christians you are viewed as ****ting all over their opinions for not being of the same belief ? That is honestly your contention ? And I don't mean 'in one wacky isolated instance' I mean in general you would describe that as an accurate description ?


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    #149
    Shenshen
    Registered Users Posts: 9,453 ✭✭✭Shenshen


    prinz wrote: »
    If only.

    Well, how many non-stamp collectors do you hear about on a regular basis?


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    #150
    optogirl
    Registered Users Posts: 2,979 ✭✭✭optogirl


    prinz wrote: »
    If only.


    How can you say that you never attack atheists and then make a comment like this? It's actually disgusting - you don't like what atheists think so they should shut up? I could say the same about every religious person but that would make me incredibly closed minded and arrogant.


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    #151
    prinz
    Registered Users Posts: 14,598 ✭✭✭✭prinz


    prinz wrote: »
    I don't. I respond to idiots, and I explain myself to anyone that asks. There's a difference. Where have I argued with atheists over their atheism?
    optogirl wrote: »
    ah come off it man! You were in the God thread today doing just that
    optogirl wrote: »
    I didn't say you did any of these things - I said you spend a lot of time arguing with atheists. And you do.

    Arguing with atheists over my beliefs or theirs? Huge difference.


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