Beginner with a 450d looking for help please??

Diabalo

Hey people

Havent been on this for a while but I have been using my camera a lot and even carry it around with me fairly often when going for a spin in the car for example.

What I basically have is a 450d (box, manuals, VGC), Kit lens (18-55), Hama UV filter, 3 batteries and a Canon 400d leatherette protective case. I also have a backpack I stuck a load of scarves into it for carrying it around with me which seems to do the job until I get into better funds for a proper camera bag.

Anyways, I only have the kit 18-55 IS lens. Found it very good but has let me done on some pictures due to 'zoomability' limits.

There are main 3 lens that I know a 'bit of stuff' about and am a bit interested in:
- 17-85mm lens (I heard a lot of people use it as an all rounder lens, so would do me grand)
- 50mm fish eye lens (a lot of people have it and can produce some cool pics, especially nice cars, people..)
- Canon EF 90-300mm F4.5-5.6 Zoom Lens (thinking this is good for long shots? Could be wrong?)

What basically interests me are pictures of city life. Capturing all the grittiness or beauty of a moment in inner city life. I love good graffiti as well. Im fond of black and white pictures. Love artists like Banksy including a Dublin artist Maser.

I am thinking of going for the 17-85mm lens as a 'walk around lens' as people say. Theres also a Canon 90-300 (spec listed above) I have my eye on but I want that more so to capture long distance shots (like what the paparazzi have). Sorry not very good at explaining. Finally I will buy the fish eye lens later on.

Ive been looking at lenses on the normal places like Ebay and Adverts.ie, Argos catalog..... I have found out that there is a good bit to know about lenses and prices vary!! A lot of terminology to learn.

Finally my last couple of questions, very important ones!
I have after getting my hands on CS3 Photoshop Is there any other software people on here always use and couldnt live without it?? Dont mind paying a few quid for something very useful. I know photoshop elements is good.
I am also thinking about books and DVDs to teach my self the basics. Anyone recommend anything?

Thanking you in advance for any help. I'll update with any progress I get. This photography thing is more a lifestyle than a hobby thing

Ricky91t

50mm isn't a fish eye lens, It's known as a nifty fifty or canon 50mm f/1.8 so searching may find you some threads.

I'd recommend that first, It's great for low light photography, Portraits and is very sharp.

The 90-300 and 17-85 aren't really great. You should probably save for something like a 17-55 f/2.8 and a 70-200 f/2.8

Much better glass but a lot more expensive.

Diabalo

Ah okay. So guess that put me straight. Looks like I know feck all :eek:

A nifty fifty haha, i like that. I'll look into it. I noticed they are quit popular alright.

Thanks very much for the help Ricky91t. Any other advice about books or software? You sound like you know your stuff.

Whats the difference between th 90- 300 and a 70-200 f/2.8??

Ricky91t

Diabalo wrote: »

Ah okay. So guess that put me straight. Looks like I know feck all :eek:

A nifty fifty haha, i like that. I'll look into it. I noticed they are quit popular alright.

Thanks very much for the help Ricky91t. Any other advice about books or software? You sound like you know your stuff.

Whats the difference between th 90- 300 and a 70-200 f/2.8??

I really, really hate reading books, It's just something I don't like doing.

If I ever was going to cover a certain event or subject, I'd search flickr and the likes and see what is accepted. Usually the first 4-5 pages on flickr are pretty popular pictures and it's pretty easy to tell if they're popular for their quality or for how many "post one comment five groups" they're in.

The 70-200 is a better lens because A) it's f/2.8 aperture right the way through. Giving a better DOF (depth of field) and letting more light in for the gloomier days, It's also got a better AF system compared to the 90-300 f/4.5-5.6

I've owned both and the Sigma 70-200 f/2.8 is much better and not a whole lot more expensive! If you didn't spend as much on software you could pick up a used sigma for €400 if you're lucky.

Sigma 70-200:


Canon 90-300:


Munster's Tony Buckley charges up the pitch and Lifeimi Mafi follows by ®ich, on Flickr

This just shows the DOF difference, You can't really compare anything else due to the poor lighting and high noise in one.

The F/2.8 aperture distorts the background alot more and this may be handy in street photography, If there's a distracting background or something.

What I would recommend though, Is when you get a 50mm (cheap too! ) is try a few shots at f/5.6 and some at f/2.8 and see if you really need f/2.8.

Your style of photography could vary greatly to mine, And something I hate you might love, So you're better off seeing for yourself.

I may be blabbering a bit, But I'm in a hurry. I'll probably come back later and tidy this post up a bit. :pac:

dinneenp

Before buying a 50mm stick your lens to that and see if you like the focal length. I bought one but fond I have to step back a lot indoors as it's too close. But it's a great lens for low light and blurring the background. And you say you don't mind spending...
constant apertaue lens (f2.8) can maintain that aperture at amy length so goof for low light and if you want blurred background.

A lot if people say Lightroom is easier than Photoshop

The Snipe

One thing to note about the 50mm, it can be quite restrictive on a crop sensor like the 450D, which is 1.6 making the lens a 80mm f1.8 prime.

Promac

The 50mm on the 450D is lovely, I have that same setup. It'll do justice to your grafiti shots giving you a nice DOF for shots from the side, etc.

Borderfox

50mm is a bit long, something like a Sigma 30mm f1.4 will give you the same viewpoint as a 50mm on your camera. Costs more but worth it. You can probably find some books in the library (might be more film orientated but still relevant) Most people seem to find Understanding Exposure by Bryan Peterson a good read.

Diabalo

@ Ricky91t

Thats a lot of advice. A wealth of info! Thanks very much Ricky! I signed up to Flickr tonight as I wouldnt be mad into books myself. I like the way you use Flickr to gain knowledge like that. A nifty fifty will be my next purchase as you recommended . Its great that they are cheap too. I think my style is ‘Street Photography’. I am going to put my heart and soul into this as I think I could do some cool stuff once I put my mind to it and keep at it. I also installed CS3 earlier.
@ dinneenp
I will have to look into lightroom as I don’t know what it is yet but thanks for the info. Im guessing the (f2.8) lens are quit expensive so will look into them aswell. But you have thought me something there about the constant apertaue lens which sounds very interesting. Will have to price them.

@ xiledsniper

Don’t really understand to be 100% honest. A bit too advance for me at the moment.

@promac

Sounds exactly what Im aiming for Promac. Cheers.



@ borderfox

Thats the second time ive heard of that book Borderfox! I’ll have a look in Easons tomorrow and see do they have it and whats it like.

The sigma thing is confusing me a bit but will keep my eye out for one second hand maybe. I might just stick with the nifty fifty ???

Freddie59

From my own experience in the last two years:

I started out purchasing a 450D (kit lens); a Tokina 12-24, a 1.4 50mm, and a Speedlite 430EX.

I was terribly disappointed with the quality of pictures from the camera at the start, but (after receiving advice on this forum) I bought Understanding Exposure. It's not an instructive book in the very traditional sense. Very hands on, with lots of practical advice, and very simple, light reading. A few pages in he prompts you to shoot in M mode, and it is a revelation! You'll very rarely use any other mode again.

I sold the 1.4 50mm, as there were huge problems with it (from a composition perspective). Waaaay too restrictive on a crop body. Tremendous quality, but limited you greatly with that camera.

I still have the 12-24 and Speedlite.

I did have the 17-85 for a while, and, while Ricky wasn't impressed, I thought it was an excellent lens, and very sharp. If you look at my Flickr page and go to the Europe/USA collection, you will see two sets: London Jan 09 and Portugal May 09. All of the photos there are taken with the 17-85 lens.

I now use the 17-55 f/2.8 lens mainly, and the most recent shots on my Flickr page are taken with that.

But as Ricky also says, there is a wealth of information on Flickr, for example the exif data on the shots, which can prove invaluable.

Best of luck with your camera!:)

Diabalo

@ Freddie59
Right, if Easons have 'Understanding Exposure' I'll defo get it today. What does the term crop body mean Freddie? Do you think I should avoid buying a 50mm f1/8 then? I was thinking of getting one brand new if they weren't too dear today in Conns. :rolleyes:

Thanks for sharing your Flickr page with me. Some great shots.... even stuck a comment or two down, you're talented! I will start putting a few random pics up as well on Flickr later.

The pics you took with both the 17-55 and the 17-55 f/2.8 are good but dont know for certain if its what I want right now. Im still going to see on adverts.ie if there are any 2nd hand though.

dinneenp

I'd recommend doing a beginners course to photography. I did one in Galway, one night a week for 5 weeks. It was good, interesting and allowed for me to ask lots of questions.

If you have Picasa 3 you can upload your photos to Flickr directly from it (and resize automatically when uploading). I find it handy and saves time.

Diabalo

Cheers dineenp. Yeah have asked a few mates around was there courses and ive been told theres one locally but will look maybe at doing one further afield if it is any better. Time is a bit of an issue at the moment so hard to commit to anything really. But one night for 5 weeks would be good.

I dont have Picasa 3 but my younger brother does so will check out his laptop. Thanks for that.

Promac

Picasa is a free download from google.

The 50mm is worth getting, even on a cropped body. Since you'll be shooting outdoors you just need to take a few steps backwards.

The "crop" thing refers to the size of the sensor in the camera. Film cameras had a 35mm film behind the lens that captured the light let in by the shutter. Digital cameras replace the film with a digital sensor that saves the light information as data. On the 450D, the ratio of the sensor size to a 35mm negative is 1 to 1.6, so we say the 450D is a 1.6 crop factor camera. Basically, the sensor is smaller than the film.

What it means in practice is that your images are cropped in comparison with images from a 35mm "full frame" camera so you have to step back a bit to get the same field of view or get a shorter lens to make up the difference. This means that the 50mm on a 1.6 is more like an 80mm on a full frame camera. It also means that you get a bit of tele for free. Just depends on how you look at it.

The short version is that you won't get big wide shots up close with a 50mm prime but you will get lovely close ups.

The price of these lenses is so low it's worth buying them anyway.

Diabalo

Cheers promac

I thought this one would be a good buy? :
http://adverts.ie/259088

Ok, brilliant thats what I wanted to hear lol Where is the cheapest place to pickup one? Conns in Dublin or online?

I must save this thread. Ive learned heaps. Will be in Dublin later so will pickup the magazine & book. I now understand the crop thing referred to by Xiledsniper! Very well explained! Thanks Promac

dinneenp

One more suggestion:
try to go on a Photowalk in the near future, some listings here.
You could talk to people on the walk, try their lenses, ask questions etc.
There's one in Wicklow next month.

Diabalo

Cheers. i'll signup there. Im already on photography ireland. Looks pretty cool. Wicklows a beautiful place aswell. Im a bit unwell and the fresh air would do me good.

Where do you buy your lenses from Dineenp? Is there an Ebay shop you would trust to buy from? It looks like I'd save a lot by buying online.

leche solara

Online is usually cheaper than any bricks and mortar shop. Be careful though that your online choice ships from within the EU otehrwise you risk customs charges which might wipe out any savings you are hoping for. On the other hand you can always bring something back to a "real" shop. Pixmania.ie, while not the absolute cheapest, is a good place to get an idea of the difference between online and high street.

As well as Flickr, you should also join pix.ie, an Irish company, with a great community, free to join, and more space given than Flickr.

dinneenp

I have a friend living in the USA so anything I buy from there he can bring home without me a. having to pay large postage and b. worrying about customs.
I have bought from

• amazon.com
• pentaxforums.com marketplace (just for Pentax obviously but it's very extensive; presume similar exists for Canon),
• Ebay.

I keep an eye on Adverts but it's mainly Nikon & Canon lenses.
Do some google searches; there's loads of places in the UK that sell 2nd hand.

I'm going to get a Sigma 18-50 f2.8 macro lens (or similar0 before Xmas hopefully and will look online.
I'd always look online, I don't worry about not having a warrenty as it's very rare that something would go wrong (a small risk I think, others might think otherwise). If I was paying >€500 then maybe I'd go for one with a warrenty.

To wet your appetite here's some photo sites I like:
Digital Photography School- good overall site with a lot of tips, lessons

The Big Picture- best photo stories

Peta Pixel- interesting photo related articles etc

photography news

TinyExplosions

dinneenp wrote: »

I'm going to get a Sigma 18-50 f2.8 macro lens (or similar0 before Xmas hopefully and will look online.
I'd always look online, I don't worry about not having a warrenty as it's very rare that something would go wrong (a small risk I think, others might think otherwise). If I was paying >€500 then maybe I'd go for one with a warrenty.

If you're looking for the sigma in Nikon mount, check out here -200 sterling including 7 year MACK Warranty

dinneenp

TinyExplosions wrote: »

If you're looking for the sigma in Nikon mount, check out here -200 sterling including 7 year MACK Warranty

Cheers, but I have a Pentax.
Every now and then I think would I be better off selling it and getting a Nikon D3000/5000 (or other model) as lenses tend to be cheaper than for Pentax.
In the long run I'd like at least to have:

• 50mm f1.4 or 1.8
• 70-200mm f2.8 (or similar for sports etc)
• 17-50mm f2.8 or similar
• probably others- 10-20mm, macro maybe

Currnelty I have (only):
18-250mm
50mm f1.7 (selling to buy 18-50mm f2.8 macro)
kit lens (gathering dust).

Diabalo

Ive been very sick lately folks and only getting the chance to update this now :mad:
So I finally bought a Nifty Fifty ( 50mm f/1.8 II) in Conns. Bought a couple of books as well:

• Understanding Exposure by Bryan Peterson (recommended to me on this thread)

• Digital Photography 'Just the Steps' For Dummies

I bought and have been bought a few magazines by family:

• Practical Photography (November)
• PhotoPlus (November)
• Photography Monthly (December)

So plenty of reading to do! Havent read too much as im still sick and vision is blurred but have taken some pictures and tried getting to know the camera better. I might buy another book later about the 450d. I remember seeing a book called: 450d for dummies... i think. Need to nuy a proper bag aswell!

I want to thank everyone for their help on this thread. Have learnt so much!













@leche solara:
I’ve had a good nose around Pixmania. It is a really good site to get an idea of prices. Ive read an English guy saying that this is a good site aswell, thought I’d share it:
http://www.camerapricebuster.co.uk/index.html
I’ll join up to Pix.ie today sounds good! Good to have homegrown stuff


@dinneenp:
Aint you a lucky duck having a friend in the US acting as your ‘mule’

It seems like there is a big photography community on Adverts.ie! Loads of stuff to buy. I have bought stuff with Ebay and Amazon.com before and was pleased to deal with them. No bad experiences.
So can your Pentax use all different types of lenses??
Thanks for those photo sites. Will check them all. This is the best info thread ever lol