New xbox dashboard detects modified dvd drives

Thor

Just taught i would let every know, That the new dashboard launching later today, Will have the ability to detect firmware changes to your Xbox 360 dvd drive, Having LT doesn't seem to make any difference.

This is 100% and i'm confirming this myself, Its not read anywhere as i think i'm the only one who knows this right now(More people will report the same i'm sure)

Not sure if it can only detect the firmware modifications while its update, Meaning flashing back to stock before had would stop the flagging of your xbox 360 console that results in a ban.

docentore

Christmas is coming! Time to shift some new boxes!

How can you confirm this?

Wez

It's all over the "usual places" but I'm not 100% sure what method of detection they're using and if returning to stock could work.

I'd just use activate.iso to try put off updating if you've a flashed drive, until they release a new firmware.

Are you talking about the reports of backups not booting with the new leaked dash?

Because detecting firmware and stopping backups from booting are two different things.

And from reading trough it, it seems a bit of paranoia is going around, it is leaked after all.

TouchingVirus

Major paranoia at the minute, and it appears some of the latest games (e.g. Fable 3) will not boot on the new dash if they are backups. As cisk said, booting backups and detecting firmware are two different things altogether.

The new Slim has the ability to check firmware directly, none of the previous models do. I would think the problem could be related to the LT firmware not having responses to some new challenges or something along those lines.

Myrddin

TouchingVirus wrote: »

The new Slim has the ability to check firmware directly, none of the previous models do. I would think the problem could be related to the LT firmware not having responses to some new challenges or something along those lines.

I'm inclined to agree, from recent posts it seems the drive authentication is completely independant to Kernel authentication. I reckon there'll be a fix at some stage, although thankfully I've left the world of drive flashing long behind

Thor

I'm not talking about back ups not working.

Here is what happened.

After I updated my xbox earlier to dashboard 12607, Checking my secdata showed i had just been flagged(Meaning i'm about to be banned).

This happened straight after updating the Xbox. Only explanation is that they were able to detect the modified firmware.

My xbox has a lite-on(v7) with LT, It had an original game in it at the time of the update.

Reamer Fanny

Would fable force a system update on a dashboard of 9199?

Myrddin

Thor wrote: »

I'm not talking about back ups not working.

Here is what happened.

After I updated my xbox earlier to dashboard 12607, Checking my secdata showed i had just been flagged(Meaning i'm about to be banned).

This happened straight after updating the Xbox. Only explanation is that they were able to detect the modified firmware.

My xbox has a lite-on(v7) with LT, It had an original game in it at the time of the update.

Could they have included a 'pattern-recognition' check, where the newer firmware can detect signs of 'known' modified firmware only?

Thor

That would be my guess, Definetly the easiet way for them to detect it.

But i do remember C4eva stating that Lt was so close to original firmware they wouldn't be able to. He must of got that wrong.

Looking forward to LT+ for slim xbox 360's its supposed to prevent this from happening.

Myrddin

Thor wrote: »

That would be my guess, Definetly the easiet way for them to detect it.

But i do remember C4eva stating that Lt was so close to original firmware they wouldn't be able to. He must of got that wrong.

Looking forward to LT+ for slim xbox 360's its supposed to prevent this from happening.

Well MS have had time to get their hands on LT, & tear it back to identify how they can spot it against their own. I'd hazard a guess that this is true for all known modified firmwares...the real question is if it will be the case for future ones...

Thor

EnterNow wrote: »

Well MS have had time to get their hands on LT, & tear it back to identify how they can spot it against their own. I'd hazard a guess that this is true for all known modified firmwares...the real question is if it will be the case for future ones...

Well from what i can tell so far, They can only detect the firmware modifications while the xbox is updating. Meaning flashing back to stock firmware before updating may just save you a ban.

Now i do remember C4eve saying that its wise to flash back to stock before any system updates(Not title updates) So this may be something to do with them putting the xbox 360 dvd drive in vendor mode during the update and just scanning the entire firmware.

TouchingVirus

Thor wrote: »

I'm not talking about back ups not working.

Here is what happened.

After I updated my xbox earlier to dashboard 12607, Checking my secdata showed i had just been flagged(Meaning i'm about to be banned).

This happened straight after updating the Xbox. Only explanation is that they were able to detect the modified firmware.

My xbox has a lite-on(v7) with LT, It had an original game in it at the time of the update.

Secdata changes after every dashboard update, as does it's location. Are you sure it's contents explicitly state "Ban this console"? Also, for the newer LiteOn drives you have to pull the chip low to trick it into revealing it's firmware by thinking it's empty. All vendor commands were removed. So how does the update get the LiteOn 9 drives into vendor mode to check?

Myrddin

TouchingVirus wrote: »

Also, for the newer LiteOn drives you have to pull the chip low to trick it into revealing it's firmware

So for those drives, it's purely a hardware change that triggers Vendor mode? Hmm thats interesting alright...I must admit I find these battles between vendor & hacker fascinating to watch :cool:

TouchingVirus

Yep, purely a hardware change. You must solder the drive's PCB to fool the chip into thinking it's empty get into vendor mode. Then you can read & write to the drive and backup your nand. At some point the key is passed over and caught by the probe too.

It is a cat & mouse game and it is interesting to watch. I only wish users weren't at the mercy of c4eva. He's still the top dog and much of the future of the firmware scene depends on him which is a bad idea in case he quits or gets caught. Sharing the knowledge would be cool

Thor

EnterNow wrote: »

So for those drives, it's purely a hardware change that triggers Vendor mode? Hmm thats interesting alright...I must admit I find these battles between vendor & hacker fascinating to watch :cool:

HACKERS UNITE!!

I was thinking to myself this might not be a flag and just some change in the x value that xval cannot understand, That is why it fails checking.

I get a response from xval, Failed AP25 challenge.

Stylesclash07

i have two xboxes a modded one and one not modded but i swap my harddrive between the two does this effect me in anyway as i never have the modded xbox connected to the internet just have my gamertag swap between the two

TouchingVirus

You should be all right, but if something does happen you've only yourself to blame

Jimbobjoeyman

If you don't want to get banned dont update untill a new version of Lt is released simple as
And if you do get bannned well thats the chance you take modding your console.

Thor

Jimbobjoeyman wrote: »

If you don't want to get banned dont update untill a new version of Lt is released simple as
And if you do get bannned well thats the chance you take modding your console.

There won't be a new version of LT for old dvd drives, Just Lt+ for Xbox 360 slim lite-on drives.

Its possible they just flagged me now for the sake of it. Im now on dashboard 12609, Same X value, Although i wasn't able to use my profile on a different xbox there and it just said corrupt(I know, Sound like a ban) The xbox can still go online.

Jimbobjoeyman

Thor wrote: »

There won't be a new version of LT for old dvd drives, Just Lt+ for Xbox 360 slim lite-on drives.

Its possible they just flagged me now for the sake of it. Im now on dashboard 12609, Same X value, Although i wasn't able to use my profile on a different xbox there and it just said corrupt(I know, Sound like a ban) The xbox can still go online.

Are you sure about that ?
I know they dropped the hitachi drives but the rest of them ?
I highly doubt it, lt + is for slim consoles only because they have built in on the fly firmware checks according to c4 and team jungle so lt + is not needed for the other drives.
see says it here http://team-xecuter.com/

Thor

Jimbobjoeyman wrote: »

Are you sure about that ?
I know they dropped the hitachi drives but the rest of them ?
I highly doubt it, lt + is for slim consoles only because they have built in on the fly firmware checks according to c4 and team jungle so lt + is not needed for the other drives.
see says it here http://team-xecuter.com/

He also says that LT is doing its job so far and there is no need for any new firmware, Although they make make some changes to the code and we will see small updates over time. The real thing is the new protection being added to the games.

People are having trouble booting fable 3 on new dashboards.

Jimbobjoeyman

Thor wrote: »

He also says that LT is doing its job so far and there is no need for any new firmware, Although they make make some changes to the code and we will see small updates over time. The real thing is the new protection being added to the games.

People are having trouble booting fable 3 on new dashboards.

Ya thats what they have been doing so far Lt 1.1,1.2 etc
But I see lt 2.0 in the near future microsoft will find a way to detect lt 1. and start banning

Thor

Jimbobjoeyman wrote: »

Ya thats what they have been doing so far Lt 1.1,1.2 etc
But I see lt 2.0 in the near future microsoft will find a way to detect lt 1. and start banning

Thats the thing though, Before they were working on the premise that Microsoft were detecting unsafe burned back ups. Meaning if you play an unstealth game then you are likely to be banned.

Now if they really can detect firmware on old dvd drives, Nothing short of lt+ is going to help it, if that. All MS have to do is compare any LT firmware released to there own and then check every Xbox, That will tell them straight of the bat if its modified at all.

The thing is, Well assumption, They can only detect the firmware during the Xbox's actual system update, C4Eva stated 'You should always flash back to stock firmware before doing system updates' to ensure that modified firmware cannot be detected.

Lets see what happens in the next few days, Its normally a few days after call of duty gets leaked on the net, Meaning people will rush out to buy a new Xbox so they can play the game.

Jimbobjoeyman

Thor wrote: »

Thats the thing though, Before they were working on the premise that Microsoft were detecting unsafe burned back ups. Meaning if you play an unstealth game then you are likely to be banned.

Now if they really can detect firmware on old dvd drives, Nothing short of lt+ is going to help it, if that. All MS have to do is compare any LT firmware released to there own and then check every Xbox, That will tell them straight of the bat if its modified at all.

The thing is, Well assumption, They can only detect the firmware during the Xbox's actual system update, C4Eva stated 'You should always flash back to stock firmware before doing system updates' to ensure that modified firmware cannot be detected.

Lets see what happens in the next few days, Its normally a few days after call of duty gets leaked on the net, Meaning people will rush out to buy a new Xbox so they can play the game.

far as I can gather about how microsoft detect modded firmware and this is complete speculation.
nobody really knows bar microsoft and maybe C4eva, is that while you are on xbox live at some stage maybe when you first go into the multi player menu there are certain firmware checks that must be passed for you not to be banned.
Lt is so close to the original firmware it passes these checks.
But the slim introduced new checks on the actual hardware that lt didnt pass hence the need for lt+ on slim consoles only.
spose we will find out in a while anyway