Time to Reduce Retired Civil Servants Pensions

NewHillel

tails_naf wrote: »

Don't know if this has already been posted, but it's a great graphic from the irish times:

http://www.irishtimes.com/focus/2010/public_service_pension/index.pdf

Long story short, both PS pay and pensions have grown way faster than expected, but more importantly, the pensions side of things is getting way out of hand, the bill for it has grown by 1/2 a billion in the last 2 years alone. To say it it out of control at the current rates is an understatement!

you can argue the toss about benchmarking and whatnot, but hard to argue with cold hard figures.

Thanks for posting that, I hadn't seen it.
One would think that its hard to argue with "cold hard figures", doesn't stop posters on boards doing it every day.

Its very simple, really, either the government does the cutting, or the IMF does.

NewHillel

NewHillel wrote: »

Thanks for posting that, I hadn't seen it.
One would think that its hard to argue with "cold hard figures", doesn't stop posters on boards doing it every day.

Its very simple, really, either the government does the cutting, or the IMF does.

Well time has caught up with this post, the government is doing the pension cuts - monitored by the EU and IMF. The good news is that the biggest cuts are for the higher earners and, according to Brian Linehan on the 6pm RTE News, Dermot Ahern will see a very substantial reduction in his pension.
The cuts will be easier for us all to stomach if it is clear that the pension issue is being properly tackled. Mind you, without sustained public pressure there will be strong political pressure to scale these cuts back.

Sand

Its fairly shameful that the IMF are required to enact sensible and necessary reform in this country because the government are too gutless to do so. Its even more shameful that Labour ride high in the polls because they promise not to enact sensible and necessary reform in this country.

NewHillel

Sand wrote: »

Its fairly shameful that the IMF are required to enact sensible and necessary reform in this country because the government are too gutless to do so. Its even more shameful that Labour ride high in the polls because they promise not to enact sensible and necessary reform in this country.

I agree entirely. It sticks in my gullet that, even allowing for the haircut to come, Dermot Ahern is due a package worth over €308k over the next year. Both FG and Labour should make a public commitment to claw back anything over €100k, immediately on gaining power. That can be via tax, special levies on retiring politicians, whatever. If it requires constitutional change then so be it - I doubt there would be any difficulty getting it passed!

canttakeajoke

thebullkf wrote: »

hi hewhillel....ironically enough i disagree


where does it end if introduced? .... weshould look forward,not backward.

look @ the biggest expenditures inthe state-then cutthose first.

1-Dole.
2-medical card/DV card
3-all convicted criminals,incarcerated prisoners should be made pay their way. via their income,possessions,or future dole payments.

this is possibly the best solution-reduce the crime rate and reduce money wasted.

4-generate income by making people who received their driving licence under the amnesty initiative sit an actual driving test.
if they pass first time-test is free,fail and they pay for that and subsequent tests.


and controversial one.....


5-require that dole recipients undergo random drug testing, incl. forsmoking and drinking(though i don't know how the latter would work)
also people on long term dole should be the first cut.

6-Means test the state pension. -eg, gay byrne et al ,
whilst entitled to it- don't need it.

7-Put dole receipients on volunteer duty in their own neighbourhoods
eg litter picking,painting school railings,old folks flats etc.



.....


i have more but i'm sure i'll be lambasted for these.:rolleyes:

I don't think you'll be lambasted for your ideas but the problem i have with it is 97% of people on the dole were working when jobs were available, so they are genuine don't you think? A great many people on the dole at the moment already do volunteer work? I do agree that all state pensions should be means tested, It certainly is immoral that any 'state made millionaire' should be given any pension at all considering if the man on the street has €10k in the bank he wont get any state pension?

Sand

NewHillel wrote: »

I agree entirely. It sticks in my gullet that, even allowing for the haircut to come, Dermot Ahern is due a package worth over €308k over the next year. Both FG and Labour should make a public commitment to claw back anything over €100k, immediately on gaining power. That can be via tax, special levies on retiring politicians, whatever. If it requires constitutional change then so be it - I doubt there would be any difficulty getting it passed!

Even more, they should cap all pensions at 40K per year, and bar anyone from drawing down a pension from the state before reaching the state pensionable age.

Pensions should be at best assistance for day to day living for someone who has already worked and earned a lifetimes wealth, paid off their mortgage and is probably quite well off given the typical Irish public sector workers markup over reality/Irish private sector workers. If an ex-minister cant get by on 40K a year, then how do other people manage it?

The self-serving idea that we need to pay incredibly high wages to get poor-average service in the public sphere needs to be confronted and purged from the Irish public sector.

Japer

Sand wrote: »

Even more, they should cap all pensions at 40K per year, and bar anyone from drawing down a pension from the state before reaching the state pensionable age.

+1. They should slash all public service pensions by 40% at least. The average Garda retiring now aften only 30 years service has a pension pot worth 1.2 million, its crazy. Why should a retired policeman aged 50 get more for doing nothing than the average industrial wage in the country ?