Manchester United V Tottenham ESPN 5:30

flahavaj

BERBA wrote: »

1980

This is either a blatant lie or it makes the overall quality/general tone of your posts all the more difficult to fathom.:eek:

BERBA

flahavaj wrote: »

This is either a blatant lie or it makes the overall quality/general tone of your posts all the more difficult to fathom.:eek:

believe what you want to believe , after all i'm only the pedigree chum as you put it , and you my friend you follow the biggest club in the world!

flahavaj

BERBA wrote: »

believe what you want to believe , after all i'm only the pedigree chum as you put it , and you my friend you follow the biggest club in the world!

You say it like its a bad thing.

BERBA

flahavaj wrote: »

You say it like its a bad thing.

We both made decisions in the 80s as to who we'd support? you - man utd ( who were succesful when you decided to support them? - no? and me Spurs who werent

My point earlier was its an easy choice for majority of supporters around that era to support pool or utd ( succesful teams) - i chose not to.

easy to look down from that pedestal aint it...............

Peyton Manning

BERBA wrote: »

easy to look down from that pedestal aint it...............

Fun too

MagicMarker

BERBA wrote: »

We both made decisions in the 80s as to who we'd support? you - man utd ( who were succesful when you decided to support them? - no? and me Spurs who werent

My point earlier was its an easy choice for majority of supporters around that era to support pool or utd ( succesful teams) - i chose not to.

easy to look down from that pedestal aint it...............

Utd were successful in the 80's?

Drumpot

BERBA wrote: »

We both made decisions in the 80s as to who we'd support? you - man utd ( who were succesful when you decided to support them? - no? and me Spurs who werent

My point earlier was its an easy choice for majority of supporters around that era to support pool or utd ( succesful teams) - i chose not to.

easy to look down from that pedestal aint it...............

Cue league of Ireland fan "Sure you are both glory hunters, why couldnt you be a real fan and support a local team" . .

Most Irish fans of English clubs started supporting their club because of family ties , success of the club or a player they liked . . Its funny, my wifes father has been supporting United since he watched Georgie best and the busby babes, but i wouldnt be calling him a gloryhunter . .

BERBA

MagicMarker wrote: »

Utd were successful in the 80's?

they did finish 2nd when the OP started following em

flahavaj

BERBA wrote: »

We both made decisions in the 80s as to who we'd support? you - man utd ( who were succesful when you decided to support them? - no? and me Spurs who werent

My point earlier was its an easy choice for majority of supporters around that era to support pool or utd ( succesful teams) - i chose not to.

easy to look down from that pedestal aint it...............

I knew nothing of how good or bad United were tbh in 1988, the first game of soccer I ever saw was Ireland/England that Summer. In a predominantly GAA household I, like a lot of people do, chose United because it was who the 'aul lad supported. Its not as if we avidly followed the game in the house at the time it was something to stop us being bored when there was hurling to watch in the winter.

And my point earlier was that that doesn't even matter. You're basically boasting on the internet that you picked a crap team when you were 5 whereas someone else picked one not so crap. What does it matter? LOL at how "honourable" your choice 30 years ago makes you. I suppose sometimes (most of the time in fact) thats all you have.

Drumpot

MagicMarker wrote: »

Utd were successful in the 80's?

Spurs fans consider their last few seasons as successful . . Hope that clears it up . .

MagicMarker

BERBA wrote: »

they did finish 2nd when the OP started following em

Your argument is pretty retarded tbh.

Nailz

BERBA wrote: »

they did finish 2nd when the OP started following em

We were a very hit and miss team under Ron and Fergie had to take time to develope in that time. The odd Cup but that's as far as it went, was never enough in our tank for the league. Maybe successful by a Spurs fan's standard, but not in the modern day United fan's mentality.

Mr. Guappa

Really disappointed not to get something out of this game. I thought we played really well in what was a highly entertaining first half - our final ball let us down on 5/6 occasions. Keane did ok, but with him and van der Vaart dropping off we had no one to get on the end of things. Jenas was annonymous, Modric was top drawer despite playing in CM on his own. We were poorer in the 2nd half but still created a couple of decent chances.

As for the Nani goal. He dived, didn't get his penalty, and didn't just handle the ball - he stopped it with his hand then rested his hand on top of it - all right in front of Gomes. Gomes' mistake was assuming that such a blatantly straightforward decision would be given by this ref at that ground. Fair play to Nani - he showed good awareness and took full advantage to put the game to bed. I think he is a top player but I just can't like the guy - his first half penalty appeal after tripping over his own leg was embarrassing.

BERBA

MagicMarker wrote: »

Your argument is pretty retarded tbh.

no point arguing with the united monopoly

Dempsey

George Hamilton clearly wasnt watching the linesman, his flag didnt go up until the ball was in the net. Dope!!

jacool

3 points related to the incident.
1. It confirms Nani as a diver. There was one after 3 minutes but look at his histrionics on the ground. Looked like a cry baby.
2. Paul Scholes grabbed the referee - should have been booked.
3. Clattenburg also missed the goal that Pedro Mendes scored in 2005.

Perhaps we should say that the rules are rules, but may not necessarily be applied at Old Trafford when Tottenham Hotspur are the visitors. You have to "play to the whistle" and clearly not expect it when Spurs might benefit!

Drumpot

Dempsey wrote: »

George Hamilton clearly wasnt watching the linesman, his flag didnt go up until the ball was in the net. Dope!!

If you read through some of the posts here, he wasnt alone . .

MagicMarker

jacool wrote: »

3 points related to the incident.
1. It confirms Nani as a diver. There was one after 3 minutes but look at his histrionics on the ground. Looked like a cry baby.
2. Paul Scholes grabbed the referee - should have been booked.
3. Clattenburg also missed the goal that Pedro Mendes scored in 2005.

Perhaps we should say that the rules are rules, but may not necessarily be applied at Old Trafford when Tottenham Hotspur are the visitors. You have to "play to the whistle" and clearly not expect it when Spurs might benefit!

flahavaj

jacool wrote: »

3 points related to the incident.
1. It confirms Nani as a diver. There was one after 3 minutes but look at his histrionics on the ground. Looked like a cry baby.
2. Paul Scholes grabbed the referee - should have been booked.
3. Clattenburg also missed the goal that Pedro Mendes scored in 2005.

4. Gomes isn't very clever.

Boskowski

Archimedes wrote: »

Rafael was the best player out there. Even Michael Carrick shít all over your midfield.

Yes, Michael Carrick, the same man Spuds like to claim that they fleeced a ton of money off United for in return for Carrick and a load of domestic and European medals.

What a strange assessment. You don't watch much football do you? Spurs were toothless and united defense was pretty strong but nani, modric and vdv were the best players on the pitch. Pretty much any midfield is better than uniteds these days.

eagle eye

flahavaj wrote: »

Challenging for titles, while undoubtedly an alien concept to a Tottenham fan, is nonetheless the bare minimum expected at Manchester United, yes.

No United fan was happy last season with second place. Every single Spurs fan wet themselves with excitement at making fourth.

Therein lies the difference my pedigree chum, between those that consistently achieve and those content to sometimes achieve.

Easy know how young you are. I remember when Manchester United beat Liverpool in the FA Cup final and for United fans it was the biggest thing in the world at the time. They hadn't won anything for years. Its amazing how a fan who only came along while the team was winning thinks that they are going to stay there forever. Lol.

Of course Tottenham fans were elated when they broke into the top four last year. Just like the United fans in 1977 when they won that FA Cup.

Things change over time in football.

Remember all United's success came because of an FA Cup win in 1990. If they had lost that Ferguson would have been sacked and the club would never have progressed as it did. Its only been 17 years since that first Premier League title. It took United a long time to get back there. And they can fall away pretty quickly too when Ferguson goes.

United could be out of the Champion's league picture in five years time. I'm not saying its going to happen but things change all the time in football.

flahavaj

eagle eye wrote: »

Easy know how young you are. I remember when Manchester United beat Liverpool in the FA Cup final and for United fans it was the biggest thing in the world at the time. They hadn't won anything for years. Its amazing how a fan who only came along while the team was winning thinks that they are going to stay there forever. Lol.

Of course Tottenham fans were elated when they broke into the top four last year. Just like the United fans in 1977 when they won that FA Cup.

Things change over time in football.

Remember all United's success came because of an FA Cup win in 1990. If they had lost that Ferguson would have been sacked and the club would never have progressed as it did. Its only been 17 years since that first Premier League title. It took United a long time to get back there. And they can fall away pretty quickly too when Ferguson goes.

United could be out of the Champion's league picture in five years time. I'm not saying its going to happen but things change all the time in football.

I don't disagree with anything you've said here. Also you're the second person tonight to question my age.:pac:

But you have to take my post in the context of the poster to whom I was replying and what he said - some kind of a lame jeer about 2nd being just as bad as 4th or something equally ridiculous. I wouldn't normally be so triumphalist, but sometimes its nice to let rip when someone's quite blatantly on a wind up and talking sh*t.

miralize

jacool wrote: »

3. Clattenburg also missed the goal that Pedro Mendes scored in 2005.

well its a bit late now... honestly would that goal have changed much for you that season?

OPENROAD

jacool wrote: »

3 points related to the incident.
1. It confirms Nani as a diver. There was one after 3 minutes but look at his histrionics on the ground. Looked like a cry baby.
2. Paul Scholes grabbed the referee - should have been booked.
3. Clattenburg also missed the goal that Pedro Mendes scored in 2005.

Perhaps we should say that the rules are rules, but may not necessarily be applied at Old Trafford when Tottenham Hotspur are the visitors. You have to "play to the whistle" and clearly not expect it when Spurs might benefit!

Is that not a sending off?

FA to take action?

niallo27

Just seen the goal there, how many points are these refs worth to utd during the season, shocking but I'd love if it was my club

jacool

MagicMarker wrote: »

Sorry for upsetting you.
I merely wanted to point out what I thought of the game.
If you can come back here and state that you wouldn't care if United were denied in the same way, by poor refereeing, then fair play.
(Even if "fair play" is just a bad choice of words by me here).
I think that's what happened here is an acceptance that as long as the referee doesn't take any action then the actual event doesn't matter.

I prefer the NFL rules where each sides gets three challenges - extends the gametime by 5 minutes or so, but fair play seems to dominate. I know video evidence isn't always the solution (Leinster v Edinburgh today a case in point) The reality is that with the technology the better teams should in theory come out on top more often, but bookies mightn't like that.

#15

niallo27 wrote: »

Just seen the goal there, how many points are these refs worth to utd during the season, shocking but I'd love if it was my club

Another one from RAWK. Who let them out?

eagle eye

Just seen all them angles on match of the day and its clearly all on Gomes.

Liam O

niallo27 wrote: »

Just seen the goal there, how many points are these refs worth to utd during the season, shocking but I'd love if it was my club

eh, do you not remember Torres a few weeks ago? Similar, probably more in the wrong situation? I'd love to see the penalty stats at Anfield the way Liverpool fans always go on about Old Trafford, and on that subject, Nani was pulled back blatantly before the goal so karma is a bitch etc.

karma_

Just watched the incident on MOTD, crazy decision by the ref and linesman, and just why was Ferdinand allowed to participate in the linesman/ref discussion?

Liam O

karma_ wrote: »

Just watched the incident on MOTD, crazy decision by the ref and linesman, and just why was Ferdinand allowed to participate in the linesman/ref discussion?

Yeah, Clattenberg was clearly taking on board everything Rio said :rolleyes: and aren't captains supposed to be the ones allowed to approach the referee anyway? Maybe learn the rules before you question them?

karma_

Liam O wrote: »

Yeah, Clattenberg was clearly taking on board everything Rio said :rolleyes: and aren't captains supposed to be the ones allowed to approach the referee anyway? Maybe learn the rules before you question them?

It was a disgraceful incident, but I cannot say I'm surprised by the rag fans closing ranks to defend the incident.

Liam O

karma_ wrote: »

It was a disgraceful incident, but I cannot say I'm surprised by the rag fans closing ranks to defend the incident.

good counter argument. Make a broad statement with no reference to the incident and why it was wrong. There are so many ways you could have made a decent point that would have made me question my views but no, you went for petty jibes, well done.

Dolph Starbeam

karma_ wrote: »

Just watched the incident on MOTD, crazy decision by the ref and linesman, and just why was Ferdinand allowed to participate in the linesman/ref discussion?

I thought that was stupid too, i also thought it was even more stupid thet Van Der Sar ran all the way up nearly to the linesman to give his opinion, he must have great eye sight.

karma_

Liam O wrote: »

good counter argument. Make a broad statement with no reference to the incident and why it was wrong. There are so many ways you could have made a decent point that would have made me question my views but no, you went for petty jibes, well done.

It should not be necessary for me to explain to you just why a free should have been awarded when a player deliberately handles the ball and stops play.

d22ontour

karma_ wrote: »

It was a disgraceful incident, but I cannot say I'm surprised by the rag fans closing ranks to defend the incident.

So you agree the goal should have stood seeing as no foul was actually called up by the officials ?
It must be hard to be a bitter with a 500m+ investment and still being found out to be ****e, eh ?

Tevez threw another tantrum and fooked off to Argentina ?
Injured i take it ? :pac:

niallo27

Liam O wrote: »

eh, do you not remember Torres a few weeks ago? Similar, probably more in the wrong situation? I'd love to see the penalty stats at Anfield the way Liverpool fans always go on about Old Trafford, and on that subject, Nani was pulled back blatantly before the goal so karma is a bitch etc.

Is it lonely up there

Liam O

karma_ wrote: »

It should not be necessary for me to explain to you just why a free should have been awarded when a player deliberately handles the ball and stops play.

a foul was called, advantage was played, Gomes messed up. Your turn.

karma_

d22ontour wrote: »

So you agree the goal should have stood seeing as no foul was actually called up by the officials ?
It must be hard to be a bitter with a 500m+ investment and still being found out to be ****e, eh ?

Tevez threw another tantrum and fooked off to Argentina ?
Injured i take it ? :pac:

Now now D22 don't be jealous. We don;t have long to wait now and I personally cannot wait to revel in the MU decline when Fergie retires and the club implodes in a mountain of debt!

Boskowski

Technically it was a legit goal but of course the ref and linesman made a meal of this one. First of all it wasn't as weak a penalty claim as the Spurs people make it out to be. It certainly wasn't a dive. Now if they don't give the pen they obviously have to give a free out since Nani handled the ball.

Once Nani handled the ball it seemed so obvious a free out to Gomes that that's what he was going to do. Only he failed to realize the ref hadn't given anything which the ref clearly signaled to him at that stage. Nani was quicker in the head than Gomes - clearly not quite sure himself but probably thought the worst that could happen was a booking so I better tap it in and see what happens. Applause there for quick thinking. The reverse for Mr. Gomes I'm afraid.

However, it should never have come to that situation and that's certainly the fault of the referee and his assistants. I'm looking forward to hear their version of it but if the linesman saw the handball from Nani then there is no way the ref should have let the goal stand.

Anyway, wouldn't have made a difference since Spurs could have played for another 90 minutes and they still wouldn't have scored. Uniteds defense was far too strong today and once Van Der Vaart was off the pitch Spurs biggest threat was gone.

So now that a neutral like myself has it wrapped so nicely we can all calm down again ;-)

Liam O

Boskowski wrote: »

Technically it was a legit goal but of course the ref and linesman made a meal of this one. First of all it wasn't as weak a penalty claim as the Spurs people make it out to be. It certainly wasn't a dive. Now if they don't give the pen they obviously have to give a free out since Nani handled the ball.

Once Nani handled the ball it seemed so obvious a free out to Gomes that that's what he was going to do. Only he failed to realize the ref hadn't given anything which the ref clearly signaled to him at that stage. Nani was quicker in the head than Gomes - clearly not quite sure himself but probably thought the worst that could happen was a booking so I better tap it in and see what happens. Applause there for quick thinking. The reverse for Mr. Gomes I'm afraid.

However, it should never have come to that situation and that's certainly the fault of the referee and his assistants. I'm looking forward to hear their version of it but if the linesman saw the handball from Nani then there is no way the ref should have let the goal stand.

Anyway, wouldn't have made a difference since Spurs could have played for another 90 minutes and they still wouldn't have scored. Uniteds defense was far too strong today and once Van Der Vaart was off the pitch Spurs biggest threat was gone.

So now that a neutral like myself has it wrapped so nicely we can all calm down again ;-)

good account I suppose but the ref was kind of in the right, he played advantage while Gomes had it and a chance for Spurs to launch a counter attack but he clearly didn't understand. I'd call it more of a miscommunication and a silly play from Gomes, but your account is fair.

K-9

Tbh, I don't think you can blame anybody in a case like this, or Liverpool's goal against Sunderland. Just one of those things that suck, like the balloon goal for Sunderland last season, so in that case, these things even out!

Boskowski

Liam O wrote: »

good account I suppose but the ref was kind of in the right, he played advantage while Gomes had it and a chance for Spurs to launch a counter attack but he clearly didn't understand. I'd call it more of a miscommunication and a silly play from Gomes, but your account is fair.

I never looked at it that way. I have my doubts over the advantage but I wouldn't rule it out, certainly a possibility albeit a strange one.

Iago

haven't read the thread yet as I'm only back from the game and feeling wrecked so I'm off to bed, but my 4 point synopsis is below. I look forward to reading the counter arguments in the morning

Probably should have been a penalty, ref played advantage for the handball, gomes fúcked up. In a perfect world maybe it would have been called back once Nani scored, but the world ain't perfect and Gomes was given plenty of indication that the game was still alive. Always play to the whistle children.

Rafael had a good game, would have been a better game if Nani actually sped up the game a bit and played the early ball once in a while. Defensively he was good today which is an improvement from his general play in the past where he was caught out of positon far too often. Park had a great game imo and was probably our MOM for me.

VDV is class, there's no other word for it. The amount of times he got the ball in space and the range of his passing and vision were incredible to watch. £8m for him but no value in the market what I'd give to have him at United right now.

Overall I think we were just about value for the win, we created the better chances and although we drifted out of it from around the 60/65 minute mark I think we would have held on at 1-0. There wasn't a lot in it for me, and the second goal has probably caused more controversy than it should have as I think we'd have won in the end regardless.

Iang87

spurs never looked like gettin anything today but why cant united fans realise its another blatantly wrong decision at old trafford. I personally dont think it would have mattered to the game had it been disallowed i still think united would have won.

But the attitude of it didn't matter it wouldn't have changed the game **** is just ridiculous. Its that attitude that means the refs in england wont improve they're constantly protected by the FA for massive **** ups.

As for nani and his display today on that field its little pricks like him that are ruining the game, I think he goes down more often in a half of a game than ronaldo did in his career. He is an utter disgrace to the game and players like him should be fined or suspended.

one more thing will the FA look into scholes grabbing the ref today and ban him or fine him or will this be a case of its scholes sure he never knew how to tackle which every united fan throws out when scholes does anything wrong on a field

Iang87

K-9 wrote: »

Tbh, I don't think you can blame anybody in a case like this, or Liverpool's goal against Sunderland. Just one of those things that suck, like the balloon goal for Sunderland last season, so in that case, these things even out!

or not. Baloon goal shouldn't have stood given if the ball touches a foreign object on the field play is stopped immediately. Goal this season should have stood. whistle went, defender kicks dead ball, play continues.

Things never even out when its united involved also ask any non united fan they'll tell you

niallo27

Iago wrote: »

haven't read the thread yet as I'm only back from the game and feeling wrecked so I'm off to bed, but my 4 point synopsis is below. I look forward to reading the counter arguments in the morning

Probably should have been a penalty, ref played advantage for the handball, gomes fúcked up. In a perfect world maybe it would have been called back once Nani scored, but the world ain't perfect and Gomes was given plenty of indication that the game was still alive. Always play to the whistle children.

Rafael had a good game, would have been a better game if Nani actually sped up the game a bit and played the early ball once in a while. Defensively he was good today which is an improvement from his general play in the past where he was caught out of positon far too often. Park had a great game imo and was probably our MOM for me.

VDV is class, there's no other word for it. The amount of times he got the ball in space and the range of his passing and vision were incredible to watch. £8m for him but no value in the market what I'd give to have him at United right now.

Overall I think we were just about value for the win, we created the better chances and although we drifted out of it from around the 60/65 minute mark I think we would have held on at 1-0. There wasn't a lot in it for me, and the second goal has probably caused more controversy than it should have as I think we'd have won in the end regardless.

Ah your a manc, it all makes sense now

K-9

Iang87 wrote: »

or not. Baloon goal shouldn't have stood given if the ball touches a foreign object on the field play is stopped immediately. Goal this season should have stood. whistle went, defender kicks dead ball, play continues.

Things never even out when its united involved also ask any non united fan they'll tell you

Fair enough on the balloon goal, what did the Ref do wrong today?

Ordinary man

I love the way rival fans throw tantrums about nani's behaviour when there's usually at least one like that in every team. At least most united supporters admit he has his cringe moments but Torres at liverpool is as bad but no pool supporter can admit that

niallo27

Ordinary man wrote: »

I love the way rival fans throw tantrums about nani's behaviour when there's usually at least one like that in every team. At least most united supporters admit he has his cringe moments but Torres at liverpool is as bad but no pool supporter can admit that

Show me clips of torres diving so, you do realise not everything mr Ferguson is true, do you back the glaziers too as Ferguson does too