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I was asked for my religion today..

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  • Options
    #332
    Mike 1972
    Closed Accounts Posts: 8,018 ✭✭✭Mike 1972


    Lux23 wrote: »
    Its really weird when they ask, if your getting an x ray on your ankle its likely you will need a blood transfusion or the last rites.

    Perhaps but its not unknown for people to be admitted to hospital for some minor condition/treatment only to deteriorate and anyway it would be too complicated having a list of conditions/treatments where the question is asked/not asked.

    In my experience one only gets asked when being admitted as an in patient (e.g. overnight or longer) or when acting on behalf of a person who is unconscious/under the influence/not mentally competent.


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    #333
    PeterIanStaker
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,072 ✭✭✭PeterIanStaker


    Daft in this day and age really. Shows that the country is still firmly in the dark ages.


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    #334
    MagicSean
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,897 ✭✭✭MagicSean


    Mike 1972 wrote: »
    Hardly a choice if the person is under 18

    :rolleyes:

    Then its the parents choice. Or should we take away parental rights when it comes to medicine?
    Mike 1972 wrote: »
    If a person is admitted to hospital unconscious (or not apparently of sound mind) or is under 18 they are not in a position to make their wishes known to the doctors.

    This is the point of asking on every visit. So the hospital has an up to date record on your views. Because the next time you come in you may not be able to talk to them.
    PeterIanStaker wrote: »
    Daft in this day and age really. Shows that the country is still firmly in the dark ages.

    How exactly? Because some people still have religious beliefs? That kind of intolerance and attitude is no different from the attitudes that led to the crusades.


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    #335
    gurramok
    Closed Accounts Posts: 13,992 ✭✭✭✭gurramok


    partyatmygaff wrote: »
    Sorry but I don't think many will agree that being asked a question such as "What religion are you?" as being intolerant. It's like being asked "What car do you drive?", you don't go crying on boards if you don't have a car. You just say quite simply "I don't have a car". Likewise you could also say "I don't have a religion". No one will make a fuss and no one else seems to find any issue with that solution.
    Unless you've been discriminated against by answering "No Religion" then you cannot claim intolerance.

    I answered that already. I should be asked if i have a religion in the first place instead of been asked what my religion is. You seem to disagree and thats intolerance.

    Question for you, why are you staunchly defending the religious system as it is?
    partyatmygaff wrote: »
    A fundamentalist or a strict atheist is one that sticks to the fundamentals of atheism and that is simply lacking a belief in god. There is no such thing as a fundamental or strict atheist. You either are one or aren't one.

    You do not tolerate other people's beliefs in religion despite what you may think. No one is being intolerant of you either.

    To cater for those of Religious faith. Life and death isn't something to be taken lightly. It may sound harsh but people die in hospitals. Its simply part of hospital life, its often where life begins and ends. Both are two critical points in anyone's life and that is why religious presence in hospitals is necessary. The world doesn't revolve you and your beliefs, oddly enough.

    Jumping to conclusions are we? I do tolerate other people's beliefs, all I ask is that other people tolerate mine, how hard is that?:confused:
    k_mac wrote: »
    Yes you think you get a lower standard of care because you are not religious? That's stupidity of the highest level considering that most staff in hospitals tend to have a variety of religions. If you got a lower level of care at all it's probably because, going by your posts, you seem to be more anoying than Jordan (Katie Price, not the country).

    Staff have no power. Just like the education system is based on religion where the Catholic Church run 90% of the schools, it ain't fair in the 21st Century.


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    #336
    MagicSean
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,897 ✭✭✭MagicSean


    gurramok wrote: »
    Staff have no power.


    Are you suggesting there is some kind of religious conspiracy to kill off atheist patients?.
    gurramok wrote: »
    Just like the education system is based on religion where the Catholic Church run 90% of the schools, it ain't fair in the 21st Century.

    The reason the church ran them is because they set them up. Set up your own school if you dislike it so much. Yeah it would be great if we built loads of new non religious schools over night. Who exactly will pay for it? Or maybe we should annex all church property?


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    #337
    Sofiztikated
    Registered Users Posts: 6,995 ✭✭✭Sofiztikated


    PeterIanStaker wrote: »
    Daft in this day and age really. Shows that the country is still firmly in the dark ages.

    What? How?

    Is it me, or is the pong of outrage getting overpowering in AH? Theres always a outrage over religion in here. Yeah, right, you're athiest/agnostic/catholic/protestant/muslim/jedi. We get it. Give it a ****ing rest. Other people have a different belief to you.

    The religion question in hospitals is easily explained. And has been many times on this thread. If thats what gets you riled up, then **** me, you're easily annoyed.


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    #338
    Sofiztikated
    Registered Users Posts: 6,995 ✭✭✭Sofiztikated


    Oh, and gurramok, is your outrage over being asked or the way it was asked?


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    #339
    gurramok
    Closed Accounts Posts: 13,992 ✭✭✭✭gurramok


    k_mac wrote: »
    Are you suggesting there is some kind of religious conspiracy to kill off atheist patients?.

    No, not kill, don't be silly.

    Discrimination possibly. Why is there religious staff on the boards of hospitals anyway?
    k_mac wrote: »
    The reason the church ran them is because they set them up. Set up your own school if you dislike it so much. Yeah it would be great if we built loads of new non religious schools over night. Who exactly will pay for it? Or maybe we should annex all church property?

    You're been silly again. But your last suggestion is quite a good one. Why should my child be forced to go to a Catholic school?:mad:


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    #340
    gurramok
    Closed Accounts Posts: 13,992 ✭✭✭✭gurramok


    Sofiztikated wrote: »
    Oh, and gurramok, is your outrage over being asked or the way it was asked?

    Welcome Sofiztikated ;) Its over the way its asked and its legality.


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    #341
    MagicSean
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,897 ✭✭✭MagicSean


    gurramok wrote: »
    No, not kill, don't be silly. Discrimination possibly. Why is there religious staff on the boards of hospitals anyway?

    I'm being silly? Are you serious? Discriminate in what way? Why shouldn't there be religious staff on the boards? You think they should be discriminated agains because they are religious? Do you know what a hypocrite is? Just because someone has spent time to become a priest it does not mean they are uneducated or don't have a good business mind.
    gurramok wrote: »
    You're been silly again. But your last suggestion is quite a good one. Why should my child be forced to go to a Catholic school?:mad:

    Noone is forcing you to send your child to a Catholic school. It's your choice.


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    #342
    gurramok
    Closed Accounts Posts: 13,992 ✭✭✭✭gurramok


    k_mac wrote: »
    I'm being silly? Are you serious? Discriminate in what way? Why shouldn't there be religious staff on the boards? You think they should be discriminated agains because they are religious? Do you know what a hypocrite is? Just because someone has spent time to become a priest it does not mean they are uneducated or don't have a good business mind.

    So you cannot answer why religious staff are on hospitals. Why not answer the question?
    k_mac wrote: »
    Noone is forcing you to send your child to a Catholic school. It's your choice.

    Yeh try and find the <10% who cater for non-Catholic children. I wouldn't have to do that if the religious were removed from running the schools.


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    #343
    drkpower
    Registered Users Posts: 5,475 ✭✭✭drkpower


    k_mac wrote: »
    Then its the parents choice. Or should we take away parental rights when it comes to medicine?.

    No, its not the parent's choice when it comes to life-saving/serious health-preserving issues.

    And a declaration of someone's religon is NOT an answer to what medical treatment they wish to receive.


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    #344
    drkpower
    Registered Users Posts: 5,475 ✭✭✭drkpower


    gurramok wrote: »
    So you cannot answer why religious staff are on hospitals. Why not answer the question?

    Generally historical reasons such as them founding the Hospital in the first place. But their influence has waned considerably, thankfully.


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    #345
    Sofiztikated
    Registered Users Posts: 6,995 ✭✭✭Sofiztikated


    gurramok wrote: »
    Discrimination possibly. Why is there religious staff on the boards of hospitals anyway?
    That seems like an odd question. What would you prefer them to be? As long as it doesn't affect any judgements that they make as a board, they can be hippo worshipping tribalists, for what I care.

    You're been silly again. But your last suggestion is quite a good one. Why should my child be forced to go to a Catholic school?:mad:

    This I do agree with though. I don't see why my children should HAVE to go to a Catholic school. I disagree with the teaching of religion in school. Well, actually, I disagree with the teaching of a single religion in schools. I would prefer all world religions got a fair go, or none at all.
    gurramok wrote: »
    Welcome Sofiztikated ;) Its over the way its asked and its legality.

    Gotcha. Well, honestly, I think you've caught the wrong end of the stick on it. If you felt discriminated against, and felt that you received poor treatment because of your being athiest, then I'd agree with you, and fight your corner. But if not, then I don't see the issue.

    She asked your religion, you replied none, she filled in the box on your file, she went on to the next person.

    If you wanted it changed to "Do you have a religion?" followed by "And that...?" you're looking at increasing waiting times as well, as that couple of seconds, many times a day, could really add up. (If you want to get pedantic about it)


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    #346
    gurramok
    Closed Accounts Posts: 13,992 ✭✭✭✭gurramok


    Why haven't they been removed from hospital boards then?

    Ireland is a secular country and no need for religion to interfere in medicine or education.


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    #347
    drkpower
    Registered Users Posts: 5,475 ✭✭✭drkpower


    gurramok wrote: »
    Why haven't they been removed from hospital boards then?

    Ireland is a secular country and no need for religion to interfere in medicine or education.

    The actual reasons are far too complicated for this thread! But simple answer is politics with a small & a big "p".

    And while Ireland should be a secular country, unfortunatley it isnt yet.


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    #348
    Sofiztikated
    Registered Users Posts: 6,995 ✭✭✭Sofiztikated


    gurramok wrote: »
    Why haven't they been removed from hospital boards then?

    Ireland is a secular country and no need for religion to interfere in medicine or education.

    While I agree with the education, I don't see what (negative) impact that religion would have on hospitals.


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    #349
    Chinasea
    Registered Users Posts: 1,568 ✭✭✭Chinasea


    I was asked while being admitted to Holles Street when they were filling in my details what my Christian name was?????


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    #350
    MagicSean
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,897 ✭✭✭MagicSean


    gurramok wrote: »
    So you cannot answer why religious staff are on hospitals. Why not answer the question?

    Because they founded them.
    gurramok wrote: »
    Yeh try and find the <10% who cater for non-Catholic children. I wouldn't have to do that if the religious were removed from running the schools.

    Thats the unfortunate thing with living in a Catholic country were the hospitals and schools were built by the Catholic church. What percentage of the population is Catholic?

    EDIT: How would you identify the religious ones in your world where people can't ask about your religion?
    drkpower wrote: »
    No, its not the parent's choice when it comes to life-saving/serious health-preserving issues.

    And a declaration of someone's religon is NOT an answer to what medical treatment they wish to receive.

    Why not? Because doctors are always right? You cannot take away that choice from parents.


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    #351
    philologos
    Closed Accounts Posts: 22,479 ✭✭✭✭philologos


    gurramok wrote: »
    So you cannot answer why religious staff are on hospitals. Why not answer the question?

    To cater for the spiritual needs of patients. I would have thought this obvious. I'd like to know if I was in hospital that I would be able to receive pastoral care should I need it.
    gurramok wrote: »
    Yeh try and find the <10% who cater for non-Catholic children. I wouldn't have to do that if the religious were removed from running the schools.

    Speak for non-believers and that group alone. From my non-Catholic perspective, I think it is perfectly reasonable why this question is asked.
    drkpower wrote: »
    And a declaration of someone's religion is NOT an answer to what medical treatment they wish to receive.

    It is however, an answer to what pastoral care they will require, and an answer if in the unfortunate event of death if it will be required to have the last rites, or other such procedures that come with their belief system.

    Just because you do not have such spiritual needs doesn't mean that they shouldn't be provided for in hospitals. As I see it, the OP is getting pent up for having to answer a fairly typical, normal, and reasonable question.


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    #352
    partyatmygaff
    Registered Users Posts: 10,992 ✭✭✭✭partyatmygaff


    gurramok wrote: »
    Why haven't they been removed from hospital boards then?

    Ireland is a secular country and no need for religion to interfere in medicine or education.
    What difference does it make if they are Religious or not? If they are making competent choices in the running of the hospital then I do not see why anyone would have any objection to them being on the hospital board barring people who seethe with rage at the sight or mention of religion in a public setting.


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    #353
    Seaneh
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 18,300 ✭✭✭✭Seaneh


    gurramok wrote: »

    Staff have no power. Just like the education system is based on religion where the Catholic Church run 90% of the schools, it ain't fair in the 21st Century.

    People piss and moad about Catholic run schools all the time and it's ****ing idiocy of the highest order, if you're really that bothered, form an organisation of like minded people and build your own hospitals ans schools.
    The reason the Catholic church runs most of the schools and hospitals in the country is becuase nobody else was going to build them and there were services people needed. They should be commended not berated for it. They have, time and time again, supported the idea that non-religious schools should be built, thye support the Educate Together movement. But the fact is, if the catholic church closed the schools and hospitals in the morning the country would be ****ed.


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    #354
    hotmail.com
    Registered Users Posts: 13,295 ✭✭✭✭hotmail.com


    Seaneh wrote: »
    People piss and moad about Catholic run schools all the time and it's ****ing idiocy of the highest order, if you're really that bothered, form an organisation of like minded people and build your own hospitals ans schools.
    The reason the Catholic church runs most of the schools and hospitals in the country is becuase nobody else was going to build them and there were services people needed. They should be commended not berated for it. They have, time and time again, supported the idea that non-religious schools should be built, thye support the Educate Together movement. But the fact is, if the catholic church closed the schools and hospitals in the morning the country would be ****ed.


    They have been given a lot of thanks for setting up the schools and hospitals.

    But, now they are funded by the state, so we have a right to judge them in that context.

    Do people still believe in this last rites rubbish?


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    #355
    MagicSean
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,897 ✭✭✭MagicSean


    hotmail.com wrote: »
    They have been given a lot of thanks for setting up the schools and hospitals.

    But, now they are funded by the state, so we have a right to judge them in that context.

    Do people still believe in this last rites rubbish?

    Most Catholics do.


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    #356
    Mike 1972
    Closed Accounts Posts: 8,018 ✭✭✭Mike 1972


    k_mac wrote: »
    Then its the parents choice. Or should we take away parental rights when it comes to medicine?.

    When parental rights = recklessly endangering the lives/health/wellbeing of children to this extent well er yes we should actually
    k_mac wrote: »
    Most Catholics do.
    Its hardly confined to Roman catholics or even Christians.

    On the other hand these arguments about religious control of hospitals/schools are pretty O/T to this thread. In the UK people get asked their religion on admission to NHS (state run/funded) hospitals and these hospitals have Chaplins (various religions) prayer rooms and the like. Ive never heard of anyone (atheist or otherwise) having an issue with this.
    Chinasea wrote: »
    I was asked while being admitted to Holles Street when they were filling in my details what my Christian name was?????
    That does get on my t1ts alright.


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    #357
    Seaneh
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 18,300 ✭✭✭✭Seaneh


    hotmail.com wrote: »
    They have been given a lot of thanks for setting up the schools and hospitals.

    But, now they are funded by the state, so we have a right to judge them in that context.

    What context? yes they are funded by the state but they are often subsidised by the church and are still on church lands.

    hotmail.com wrote: »
    Do people still believe in this last rites rubbish?

    So now Catholics are idiots?


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    #358
    partyatmygaff
    Registered Users Posts: 10,992 ✭✭✭✭partyatmygaff


    Seaneh wrote: »

    So now Catholics are idiots?

    Apparently anyone that disagrees with you is now an idiot.


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    #359
    MagicSean
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,897 ✭✭✭MagicSean


    Mike 1972 wrote: »
    When parental rights = recklessly endangering the lives/health/wellbeing of children to this extent well er yes we should actually

    So where do you draw the line? Force parents to feed certain foods to their children. Force them to go by certain house rules? You say it is reckless endangerment. Obviously you assume doctors are always right. So why should anyone be able to refuse treatment? Some people don't believe in extending life by medical intervention. Where do you stand on heroic measures for premature babies? Should parents be forced to have their child go through operation after operation despite the fact that the child will have no quality of life just so the life can be extended a few months?


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    #360
    drkpower
    Registered Users Posts: 5,475 ✭✭✭drkpower


    k_mac wrote: »
    Why not? Because doctors are always right? You cannot take away that choice from parents.
    Im afraid they already have taken that choice from parents!


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    #361
    Seaneh
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 18,300 ✭✭✭✭Seaneh


    partyatmygaff wrote: »
    Apparently anyone that disagrees with you is now an idiot.

    The only person I said was an idiot was the OP. I said it's idiocy to piss and moan about Catholic run schools which were founded and built buy the church rather than get off your hole and do something about it.

    My kids won't be going to a catholic school but at the same time I won't piss and moan about catholic schools. If there is no non-denominational or educate together in the area I live in I would consider moving closer to one, if that's not an option I would have them opted-out of the R.E. classes like every other non-catholic child in a catholic school.


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