Garage claims to have gone out of business

tatli_lokma

Hi Guys,
bought a second hand car in August from a garage. I got it checked prior to buying it, but since I got it a small issue has arisen with it.
When I bought it i was given a 3 mth guarantee by the garage owner. Now the small issue has arisen and my mechanic has advised me that although this wouldn't have been evident on a quick check over it would have be something the garage takes care of as part of that guarantee.

I rang the guy today and he said he is no longer in business! :eek:

now like I say, its not a major problem, it doesn't require parts, just some labour, so for a garage to repair its minimal costs, but if I were to go to a garage it would cost me about €150 perhaps more depending on the garage.:eek:

As I say, its still under the guarantee, but the guy claims he's closed the business. However his website is still active, as are ads on carzone. I asked someone to ring to 'enquire' about a car advertised and he answered the phone and told him he's on a week off, but if he wants to look at the car to ring him next week and give him at least an hours notice before hand and he'll meet him.

Any suggestions on what my next step is? Worst case, I'll just have to go elsewhere and pay myself, but its really annoying when I got a guarantee and although he says he's closed up, he does seem in a way to be operating???

He's SIMI registered - don't know if that makes a difference?

Might just pop out one day unexpectedly and see if he's there. Other than that, any suggestions what I can do?
do I have any recourse on this, or do I just have to suck it up and pay for the repair myself?

thanks in advance!

BillShorey

Tricky situation

What I would recommend doing is:

Contact him enquiring about one of his listings. Ask him about the warranties on the car you're interested in, what it will cover, how long, the procedure for claiming etc. You'd be best off recording the conversation if you could. Then arrange to view the car you're apparently interested in.

When he meets you, explain to him that you have that conversation recorded and are going to contact SIMI, the Consumer Association of Ireland and a solicitor.

You can file a complaint with the Consumer Association of Ireland here:
http://www.consumerassociation.ie/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=5&Itemid=13

And with SIMI here:
http://www.simi.ie/consumer_information/contact_complaints_service.aspx

I would do it regardless of whether he gets your car sorted or not. He's a rogue trader operating with a SIMI membership and his behaviour reflects badly on used car sales companies in general. He deserves to be brought down and stamped out like cigarette, and nothing else.

tatli_lokma

see the thing is, i got a feeling something was up when I was having trouble getting him on the phone, and when I did he would tell me he'd ring me back with a time to bring the car in and he'd have a look, only he'd never ring me back.

so last week i got a mate to ring about a car, pretending he was interested. Even then, although he told him he'd meet him, he didn't seem very pushed at the prospect of a sale!
this got me more convinced something was up, so I basically phoned non-stop this week til i finally got him this morning, at which point he said that the business was closed therefore there is nothing he can do. I pointed out he gave me a guarantee on my car, but he said sorry, nothing I can do, if I could help you I would but I've closed the business. I didn't make any comment about him speaking to my mate, but I did point out that his website was active and ads still on carzone.

So I think if he got another call asking too many details about guarantee's he'd probably be wise to it. I'll give it a try anyway.

I was just wondering, is it as simple as saying, oh we've shut up shop, sorry...or does he have a responsibility to people who still have cars under guarantee? I mean it would be no different if I bought my car in August or yesterday - it would be the same, as far as he's concern he's not selling anymore so its not his problem.

Can he br taken to task on this? can the small claims get involved even though he says he's ceased trading? How do I even find out if he has ceased trading, or if he's just cut back?

As I say, I'll spin out a few times and see if its ever open (its other side of Dublin to where I live).

wmpdd3

As the car was second hand it doesn't come under the sales of gods and services act. The 3 month warranty he offered you is just a verbal contact between you and him. It is not legally enforce able. It sounds like he is trading as a private seller, in which case its buyer beware.

If he is / was a member of simi, they may be able to advise you if he is still trading in a business capacity. If not its not looking good for you, your basically trying to get him to honour a promise.

jor el

wmpdd3 wrote: »

As the car was second hand it doesn't come under the sales of gods and services act.

It most certainly does come under the sale of goods act, though the rights of the consumer are diminished somewhat for pre-owned goods.
http://www.consumerconnect.ie/eng/Hot_Topics/FAQs/Faulty-goods/

Bring the car back to the garage and tell him to fix the problem. If he refuses, get it fixed yourself, and then claim the costs back from him using the small claims court.

tatli_lokma

jor el wrote: »

It most certainly does come under the sale of goods act, though the rights of the consumer are diminished somewhat for pre-owned goods.
http://www.consumerconnect.ie/eng/Hot_Topics/FAQs/Faulty-goods/

thansk for that

jor el wrote: »

Bring the car back to the garage and tell him to fix the problem. If he refuses, get it fixed yourself, and then claim the costs back from him using the small claims court.

problem is, he claims to have closed the business. Other than literally camping outside I have no way of just bringing the car back to him. Don't get me wrong, I will def try calling there as much as possible, however I work on the other side of the city, so its not going to be easy to pin him down like that.

And if I do repair myself, will the SMC be interested if indeed he has gone out of business? if the business is not in existence can I still bring a claim?

tatli_lokma

BillShorey wrote: »

And with SIMI here:
http://www.simi.ie/consumer_information/contact_complaints_service.aspx

have downloaded the form and will post it on Monday regardless of what happens.

jor el

Little Ted wrote: »

And if I do repair myself, will the SMC be interested if indeed he has gone out of business? if the business is not in existence can I still bring a claim?

If the business is gone, then no, no one can help you then.

BillShorey

Great to hear. You should contact the CAI regardless also. The more of these rogues being brought to attention the better. If he is truly closed down but still trying to flog his stock, it might stop him getting SIMI authorised or otherwise in future when he tries to open up again.

P. Breathnach

jor el wrote: »

If the business is gone, then no, no one can help you then.

If he was in business as a sole trader, then it doesn't matter if the business is closed down; the trader has a personal liability to customers.

If it was a limited company, it could be more complicated, but if the business still has assets, then a claim might succeed.

tatli_lokma

I checked with CRO today - he is a limited company, however he has not filed any annual returns since 08. As a result the CRO are in the process of striking him off. however, they advised me that if I wished to make a claim against him, at the moment he is still technically registered and in effect still exists as a company.

So I am getting the Small Claims form done up today and getting the ball in motion ASAP.

Don't think I can name the garage on here, but if anyone wants to know just PM.

This is a lesson to me to check out a garage whenever buying a car again. TBH I didn't even think of this - I searched online for any reviews about the place, ensured I got a mechanic to look at the car, got a written guarantee, bought from SIMI registered garage...I thought I had covered all the basis - clearly not. lesson learned!

Going to cost me about €250 all in for repairs could be worse I suppose, but its so infuriating!

His website says

XXX has established SNIP

he also claims to be SIMI registered, and he was when I bought although I can't find him on the SIMI site now. I have been trying to get through to SIMI but can't get an answer.

He is still advertising on all the car sites - I have reported him to them, and two of them said they will be checking into it.

Not much else I can do - I might be lucky with SCC, but if not, at least I will get some pleasure in having his ads removed and making it difficult for him to sell his remaining stock. Revenue might get a phone call as well....

P. Breathnach

It looks to me as if you are dealing with somebody who is, to put it mildly, a bit of a messer.

Have you any documentation relating to the purchase of the car? If you have, is it in the name of a company or is it in the guy's own name? He cannot hide behind limited liability if he dealt with you in his personal capacity.

If he is still trading in some way, is it as a company or as an individual? If the company is still trading, then you can go after it.

You seem (wisely, in my opinion) to have accepted that you might not much under the guarantee, and to have settled in your own mind that you might get some therapeutic value from making life uncomfortable for him. I'd do the same thing.

tatli_lokma

The receipt (which also includes a note to state the guarantee) is on branded paper, so I suppose technically I dealt with him as a business. I believe he is still trading as a business, as all the adverts list the cars for the business, not a private number. However I did put his phone number into Google and noticed a car on donedeal which he is selling, so he seems to be acting both as a company and as an individual.

TBH, even if he offered to repair the car at this stage I would have no faith in him, so my only option is to get it repaired myself and then try getting some recourse for the money.

the SCC application went off yesterday, as did the complaint to SIMI. When he gets notification of both of those things he might decide its not worth the hassle and just refund me. Fingers crossed.

Eitherway, it took me all of 10 mins to complete the forms, I have to get the car repaired anyway, so I have nothing to loose and potentially plenty to gain. I have no problem going to court just to annoy him if needs be. Even if I don't win, it's a pain for him and all it cost me was €15 and some of my time. although in fairness, if it does go to court the man who has not submitted AR for 2 years and is about to have his company struck off is going in there with a disadvantage in the first place IMO. Makes my case only stronger.

Anyway, we'll see what happens - nothing ventured, nothing gained. As you say, there is a form of therapy in at least doing something rather than just accepting defeat from someone who is quite clearly not operating honestly.

PS - just to add, he is still listed with SIMI, although the search facility on their site does not find him for some reason, regardless of how many permutations of the name I put in. But on the plus side that is good for me as it gives me somewhere else I can direct a complaint to.

ShatterProof

Little Ted wrote: »

......Don't think I can name the garage on here......anyone wants to know just PM........

His website says

XXX has established SNIP

had to laugh, google what his website says and you get 2 hits , one is a garage and the second is this page.

dudara

OP - I had to remove your quotation as placing it into Google allows identification of the business in question.

dudara

tatli_lokma

ShatterProof wrote: »

had to laugh, google what his website says and you get 2 hits , one is a garage and the second is this page.

I was wondering who would pick up on that! still, I knew it would probably be edited out, but in the meantime a few people know who I was talking about!

Our man in Havana

If the company is in the process of being struck off you are going to be on a loser. As soon as the CRO strike the company off your claim will fall flat on its face. From that point the company will cease to exist.

tatli_lokma

Haddockman wrote: »

If the company is in the process of being struck off you are going to be on a loser. As soon as the CRO strike the company off your claim will fall flat on its face. From that point the company will cease to exist.

that's why I wasted no time in submitting my claim and complaints. CRO said they will probably start proceedings to strike him off in early 2011, so I hope that the case will get a date before the process has completed.

Best case scenario for me would be if the garage in question decides its not worth the hassle and pays my bill or makes me some offer. But if I have to go to court I will, and hopefully that will happen before the CRO take action.