Preplanning meeting

MTH

I'd be really grateful to be enlightened on the exact purpose of a preplanning meeting !!

We have a small site (1/3 acre) in County Cork and ideally would like to build 2 houses on it, one for our daughter and one for ourselves.
Before approaching an architect, we wanted to know if this was feasible from a planning point of view so we organised a pre-planning meeting with the local area planner.

However when we mentioned this meeting to 2 architects at the Self -Build Show, one advised against this and the other thought it would be OK.

We are now at a loss as to what to do.
Would it be appropriate to phone the planning office and ask them if this is OK
We dont want to prejudice any future application.

We'd appreciate any advice all you experts out there could give us.

sydthebeat

a pre planning meeting will not "prejudice" any decision, if anything in my opinion it is beneficial.

my first thoughts are that 1/3 is way too small to put two houses on IF both are being served by individual septic tanks / treatment systems.

if both are connection to public sewers then it MAY be more feasible.

the Cork 'county development plan' contains the individual requirements for one off rural houses. Read it.

then i would advise meeting a local architect / architectural technician and having a 1/2 hr meeting to discuss possiblities.

If this turns out favourable, get your arch / tech to put together a rough proposal and then go have your pre-planning meeting.

the purpose of a preplanning meeting is to find out what issues may arise during the application, you will NOT be told if its a certain failure or certain pass, but you need to be able to read between the lines.

Bullseye1

Pre planning meetings could be beneficial in some instances. However the majority of the ones I have been involved in have been handled by junior planners who may give you very positive feedback, but since it's Without Predjudice they are often over ruled by their seniors. Then you have the feeling well that was a waste of time.

But I would still seek PP to get some feedback.

who what when

Dont worry so much about it.
The very worst that will happen is they might waste your time.
In fact very often they are a waste of time as an experienced architect will know.

mickdw

who what when wrote: »

Dont worry so much about it.
The very worst that will happen is they might waste your time.
In fact very often they are a waste of time as an experienced architect will know.

They are useful if you are not clear on site requirements etc however if you were to have an architect on board, they would be able to advise on these requirements as the planner would. I find it can be useful to take a final house design into a preplanning meeting. You can sometimes get revisions agreed that would otherwise have required further information during planning process. You can pretty much decide which planner looks after your application by deciding who to visit for the pre planning meeting(in some counties)

newhouse

We had a preplanning meeting before submitting plans for permission to build and found it hugely beneficial - we brought a drawing along and explained the reasons for our chosen house design to the planner. we were worrried that we may not be allowed to build a twostorey on our high elevation and very visible site so we also brought photos of two storey houses in the area and highlighted tall trees nearby - we also mentioned the possible future care of elderly relatives living nearby - the planner didn't (and couldn't ) give us an indication of whether the plans would be approved but it gave us an opportunity to discuss our concerns and of course everything was logged and put in the file - permission was granted on the first application.

harry21

Don't worry about the application, a pre-planning meeting wont affect the outcome of a planning application.

Two houses on a 1/3 acre site will not be permitted unless there is main water and main foul sewer.

Also look at what other people in the area have built and that will give you the best idea of what you will be able to build on the site.

No6

I would suspect that one house on 1/3 of an acre will not be allowed either, the minimum in Mayo is 3/4 of an acre except for a few circumstances where you can go to 1/2 an acre. for unserviced sites of course. If its fully serviced there should be no problem with site size for two houses.

rayjdav

My 2 cents,
bar you dont have an architect or AT working on your behalf:eek: and you just want to know the local technical requirments only for planning, then fair enough, go to it. If on the other hand you plan lodging the application design on foot of what is said in the meeting, despite receiving signed minutes of what is discussed/agreed, no point imho. As said above you usually get some Junior Planner who is giving their own personal opinion:eek:, not council policy. It must be passed by their senior SEP's after official submission and they usually/always differ from the pre-planning discussions.. This has being my personal experience of these over the years and very few pre-plannings are what is finally agreed.

muffler

rayjdav wrote: »

If on the other hand you plan lodging the application design on foot of what is said in the meeting, despite receiving signed minutes of what is discussed/agreed, no point imho. As said above you usually get some Junior Planner who is giving their own personal opinion:eek:, not council policy. It must be passed by their senior SEP's after official submission and they usually/always differ from the pre-planning discussions.. This has being my personal experience of these over the years and very few pre-plannings are what is finally agreed.

Based on my own personal experiences I'd have to disagree. I have attended numerous pre planning meetings and have never encountered a case of the planner being overruled by his senior.

In Donegal the planner you meet will more often than not be the planner who will be dealing with the application when submitted. Yes, there have been a few little issues that have had to be changed later such as windows, chimney stacks etc but as you know some planners are more relaxed on these issues that others.

But the proposal that is generally agreed upon at a pre planning meeting will be accepted and approved at official submission stage. As I said I can only speak about my local planning authority and Im sure it can and does vary around the country.

Bitten & Hisses

muffler wrote: »

In Donegal the planner you meet will more often than not be the planner who will be dealing with the application when submitted. Yes, there have been a few little issues that have had to be changed later such as windows, chimney stacks etc but as you know some planners are more relaxed on these issues that others.

But the proposal that is generally agreed upon at a pre planning meeting will be accepted and approved at official submission stage. As I said I can only speak about my local planning authority and Im sure it can and does vary around the country.

Except of course where the area planner you're dealing with gets transferred in this month's game of musical chairs. This happened in my case and the new planner displayed amazing arrogance, stubbornness and effectively tore up what was agreed with the original planner. A frustrating, slow, expensive experience.

muffler

Bitten & Hisses wrote: »

Except of course where the area planner you're dealing with gets transferred in this month's game of musical chairs. This happened in my case and the new planner displayed amazing arrogance, stubbornness and effectively tore up what was agreed with the original planner. A frustrating, slow, expensive experience.

Thats a pity and something that shouldnt happen. Depending on how you feel about it you do have the option of contacting the director of services for planning expressing your displeasure at the attitude being adopted by the second planner and request that this planner refers back to the minutes/notes of the pre planning meeting and adhere to same.

Pre planning meetings serve to outline official council and government policy and if a representative of a PA meets with you and outlines those policies then another planner may not alter those policies as he would be failing in his duties.

JuniorB

Bitten & Hisses wrote: »

Except of course where the area planner you're dealing with gets transferred in this month's game of musical chairs. This happened in my case and the new planner displayed amazing arrogance, stubbornness and effectively tore up what was agreed with the original planner. A frustrating, slow, expensive experience.

It can work the opposite way as well ...Luckily for us